ruggerp11

Once a cheater always a cheater.

This is simply not true. How many times in your life have you made a mistake and never repeated it again? I make many mistakes daily that I will not ever make again.

I will say that some people will always be cheaters but not all. I regret to say that I cheated on an ex once but since I made that mistake I have not made it again. I have had opportunities and what not, but I have not taken up on them.

Now it is easy to be cynical about these things, but is it really that hard to see someone learn from their mistakes? I don't think so.

__________________
Patriotism means being loyal to your country all the time and to its government when it deserves it.
--Mark Twain
Do What makes you happy
--Me
BUT!
"Happiness is the absence of the striving for happiness" - Chuang-Tzu

Bamrak

To me, yes it is. If someone cheats, to me they will most likely do it again. My ideals are if you are unhappy in a relationship to the point that you would cheat, you shouldn't be there.

That being said, you are correct in that some people do not do it again, but I would suspect that the majority of people that are willing to cheat once, would be willing to cheat again. It's not something that I'd be easily willing to forgive and forget over.

Nitrox

ruggerp11, I agree wholeheartedly. I cheated on my ex, but after looking back on it I realized it was because I never really loved her. The woman I am currently with I am truly in love with and I could never conceive of cheating on her. I have had many opportunities to do so, if I was so inclined, but I don't. And I realize the predominant reason is out of respect for her and our relationship.

So, I second, death to "once a cheater, always a cheater"

ratbastid

I can't talk about this mythical "most people". Though I suspect that any one individual's estimation of what "most people" would do is way, way off...

I cheated on lurkette in the first year we were together. I was home from college for the summer, it was our first summer apart. I was 18 years old. There was this girl at work who was fun and not bad looking and who liked me. And one night my lonliness and horniness overcame any memory of the promises and commitments I'd made.

Here's the thing: I suffered about that. I thought about it and agonized about it and felt stupid and horrible about it literally every few days for twelve years. And then a few weeks ago, in a course called The Landmark Forum (PM me for more info if you want), I finally saw what that was doing to me and to our relationship, and I came clean to lurkette about it. She forgave me, of course, and in that moment about a thousand pounds of weight came off my shoulders.

Yes, I cheated once. I did. And knowing what I now know about that, there's no way I'd ever do it again.

Averett

Does that make it okay though?

I think this should be a case by case basis. But Twice-Three-Four times a cheater... Well, fuck that bastard/bitch. They're just assholes.

__________________
Absence is to love what wind is to fire. It extinguishes the small, it enkindles the great.

dabossy2k

Man being that I haven't ever cheated and am prone not to. I just can't back you guys up. But I don't think anyone is saying that if you cheat once you are automatically going to do it again. They are saying once you cheat it gets easier and more likely that you'll do it again. Learning your leason is great and its part of gaining knowleadge. However cheating is just like anything else. The first time is always the hardest, and then it gets easier and easier to do. Granted you may learn you lesson and not do it again, but the likely hood is small.

__________________
Recovering nice guy

dirtyrascal7

i dislike almost any saying with all-inclusive words like "always" or "never" because there are exceptions to everything.

you cannot automatically judge someone who's cheated without knowing why they cheated. it's true, there are some people who cheat on their significant other's because they get a thrill out of trying to get away with it.. and these people are more probable to cheat no matter who they're with.

however, i'd like to give the benefit of the doubt to most cheaters and believe they cheated because, like nitrox said, they weren't truly into the relationship or as ratbastid said, they were young and didn't possess the will-power to resist temptation. of course, this doesn't give those people an excuse to cheat... but the point is that they realized it was wrong and know the consequences and pain it caused to them and their loved one, which actually makes them less likely to cheat ever again.

__________________
"Tie yourself to your limitless potential, rather than your limiting past."

"Every man I meet is my superior in some way. In that, I learn of him."

Nitrox

"They are saying once you cheat it gets easier and more likely that you'll do it again"

who the hell is "they", because I'll tell you what, having done it before sure as hell doesn't mean it would be easier. It has actually made me more scared and repulsed by it.

water_boy1999

"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me."

Sorry, but I have been burnt too many timesa by women who said they have cheated in the past, then say they would never do it to me, then end up doing it to me anyway. Sure, not all cheaters are going to do it again, but I have learned that there is a large portion of people who will.

__________________
Doh!!!!


-Homer Simpson

Spanxxx

I've haven't tried to make a U-Turn on the highway without slowing down all the way again..... only made THAT mistake once.

So, who's to say. Some people DO only make certain mistakes once.

However, I think it depends on the type of situation. Rarely do I think "cheating" is done from what could be called an accident. I think it takes the form of someone making a conscious decision to do so.

Now, the reason someone might do so could be one of thousands and that reasoning once addressed might resolve why they cheated in the first place and prevent them from doing so again.

__________________
I think that's what they mean by "nickels a day can feed a child." I thought, "How could food be so cheap over there?" It's not, they just eat nickels. - (supposedly) Peter Nguyen, internet hero

Fallon

I am what many call a cheater. My fiancee and I were in a horrible situation, we were fighting all the time and things weren't going well in our relationship. Not to soon before, her and I had a foursome with another couple who were our good friends. I think there was some resentment on my part for my actions, because I couldn't believe that she'd actually gone through with it. Also at that stage in my life, I wasn't totally ok with myself. So anyway, I took part in threesome with said couple without her. From the moment after it happened I felt like complete and utter shit. I completely hated myself because I thought that I would have just thrown away the best thing that had happened to me. So I kept that inside myself for over a year in which I hated myself so eventually I tell her to which I feel better for telling her, but I still felt horrible about it. Thankfully she forgave me, but I had much to do afterwards to regain the trust that I had broken. To this day, I still regret that whole incident and if a thought ever enters my mind about cheating on her, I remember what happened and how I felt about it with myself and after telling her how about it how I felt then also. So in my opinion, you can't paint a picture of every "cheater" as a person who will do it again. And yes, I do get sick of hearing that saying. I also think it's interesting how "cheaters" seem to understand that they won't do it again but not many other people seem willing to accept that. Before you judge me, walk a mile in my shoes to see how it feels to be me and I bet it could change your perception.

Edit: Fixed a grammatical error

Nitrox

fallon, well said

maleficent

I have a good friend right now, who I'm having a hard time with. She's been in a relationship with another really good friend (a person I would give a kidney to in a heartbeat) for several years. This couple was happy. But they've also been on an emotional roller coaster for the past two years, she's been his major source of support and always has been there for him.

However, she's also had a tough time being honest with him, and how she's been feeling thru this roller coaster. She's kept up the happy face for him, but inside she was being ripped apart. So, she made, what she calls a huge mistake. I think it's worse than that, but she's a friend, so I'm supportive as I can be. She cheated on him and got caught.

He is absolutely devestated, this was the final straw in a few years of hell that he didn't need. The one person who he expected would always be there for him, went and did that to him? Yes, she's sorry. Yes, she'll never cheat again. I seriously doubt he'll ever trust her again, and in that one act, brought on by her not being honest with her feelings, she destroyed a great relationship, that is dying a slow death.

I hate her for the devestation that she has caused my friend. I don't hate her completely because I can understand the place that she was in when she cheated, it just kind of happened, it wasn't intentional and she is still a friend. I feel bad for the situation that they are in, and knowing that these two good people are just over.

Once a cheater always a cheater? Depends on the person. Once cheated on, can that trust ever come back like it was before the cheating? You'd have to be pretty naive to think it would. I doubt I could trust that person again.

Edited because I can no longer get out complete thoughts...

__________________

jaco

Hell, at least a person who admits they cheat *but wont again?* is semi honest. i am more wary of those who said they would never for any reason cheat on the person they are with.

Is it just me who was confused?

edit: fixing quotes

__________________
"How soft your fields so green, Can whisper tales of gore"
"Thou art god"

maleficent

I confuse myself a lot too... my head is a frightening... But basic gist, hate the sin, not the sinner is where I was going....

__________________

dabossy2k

I found this comment interesting because this is on both sides if your the one who cheated on someone else why should we walk in your shoes. It seems to me that most of the time the one who was cheated on is the victim. Imagine how that person felt when he/she found out that the person they put a lof of trust in broke that trust, and pretty much took you for granted. So this saying probably started out of spite, but for all you cheaters out there, can you walk a mile in our shoes and expect nothing less then a lot of anger and mistrust. To be honest I really hope I never have to walk in your shoes, and I hope you never have to walk in mine. The pain that it causes is way worse then the guilt that you guys feel. Plus once you are honest and truthful you get to let all that guilt go. But the person cheated on still has to live with it and possibly start felling the jealousy and doubt, that offten occurs after someone is cheats on you. So really what I am saying is take your own advice and walk in my shoes see how it feels to be me and I bet your perception will change.

__________________
Recovering nice guy

yournamehere

Speaking for myself - Ummm . . .yes, I can.

__________________
If you want to avoid 95% of internet spelling errors:
"If your ridiculous pants are too loose, you're definitely going to lose them. Tell your two loser friends over there that they're going to lose theirs, too."
It won't hurt your fashion sense, either.

ruggerp11

I'll tell you what, I apprecaiate every response that has been written. you all contributed very very well. Thank you.

As for the subject, I would say that after cheating once It makes it harder to do again. I would have an evern harder time cheating after the internal torrment that I put my self through. Though I would agree that it is a case by case basis. All points are valid because they come from our own experience.

Cheers people.

Can we get the perspective from some of the people cheated on? I have never been cheated on so I don't know but I feel that its an important perspective to bring in.

__________________
Patriotism means being loyal to your country all the time and to its government when it deserves it.
--Mark Twain
Do What makes you happy
--Me
BUT!
"Happiness is the absence of the striving for happiness" - Chuang-Tzu

wilbjammin

This is the stigma that is attached with cheating... Everyone has the potential to cheat, and once you've stepped over the line the potential to do it again seems much greater.

If you don't want that stigma, then you should either not cheat or make amends with yourself. None of this has anything to do with convincing others... if you truly don't like being labelled a cheater, then do everything you possibly can to never cheat again (which is something that everyone can do with determination).

I don't think you need our support or faith in this matter. This is a disadvantage that you've built for yourself.

I won't say that there is no hope for people to stop cheating once they start, but it is indicative of being able to cross over an ethical/moral boundary. Cheating is usually rationalized in some manner to make it easier to cope with without feeling excessive guilt. I think cheating is the perfect situation for someone to feel guilt from. Hiding from that feeling makes the behavior more likely to occur again.

In any event, once you have cheated that will always stay with you, and in that sense you truly will always be a cheater whether you ever cheat again or not. It is up to you to then, after the fact, determine for yourself what that event means for you.

__________________
Innominate.

jerimya

Interesting topic....

I am pretty new here, but I think I could add to this discussion. I am currently in a relationship where my girlfriend cheated on me. It puts the cheated person in a huge dilema. Do you forgive this person that cheated on you? Now knowing they are capable of it. I personally do not know that answer as of yet. I see forgiveness as an ongoing process. One which I have decided to follow. However, I highly doubt that I will be nieve enough to think she could not do it to me again.

I think one thing that is missed here... The cheated did not cause the act. Only the cheater did. It boils down to something inside the person to run off on their significant other.

My 2 cents that are a wreck because of infidelity.

doncalypso

Maybe they won't cheat on the next person they get with if they've learned their lesson and actually experienced some guilt... but if they cheat on you and you forgive them it is likely they will cheat on you again because you have tacitly told them it's okay if they disrespect you because you'll always forgive and forget.

__________________
Doncalypso... the one and only Haitian Sensation

timalkin

Your integrity is something that nobody can take away from you. Once you lose it, it is gone, usually forever.

Cheaters should drown themselves.

There are many people who would love the opportunity to have a faithful relationship with the person you're cheating on, but will never get that chance, for one reason or another. Stop being so fucking selfish and treat people the way you want to be treated.

asudevil83

i can see what you are saying here...but i will have to say that if you have cheated on someone who you are TRUELY in love with, well you will most likely do it again. it takes a weak mind to cheat....and if you are that weak to cheat on someone you honestly love, then you are that weak to do it again.

i can say though that if you are not in love with the person and you cheat on them, you will probably cheat on that person again.....or if you are with another person that you dont love, you'll probably do it to them too.

Fallon

So, we apparently get over the guilt? Rriigghhtt...reread my post, I do believe that I said i still feel remorse and guilt from the act even though it's been almost two years since I told her. I'll try to reword it so that it doesn't appear that I'm the victim, which I doubt will work, but I accept all the punishment I have recieved from my S.O. for my stupid and disgusting behavior but not everyone is the same. Due to this negative event in my life, I would say it has changed me for the positive because I now am commited to her more then ever because she accepts me as a human being, who makes REALLY bad mistakes which I won't make again.

I've stood on the line of watching friends cheat on S.O.'s before, I was actually a person before this whole act that I commited so I do know what you are talking about and I have walked in shoes that I believe are similiar to your own.

Timalkin, I'm going to disregard parts of your post because I find them disrespectful to myself and others who have decided to let you in on something that we didn't have to. As for your other part of your message. You don't think that went through my mind after it? I constantly have thoughts about she deserves someone better because of my past.

asudevil, so once a weak mind, always a weak mind? Or once stupid, always stupid?
I've built myself up from what I used to be with help from her and learning more to respect myself. This still doesn't get rid of some of the self-loathing but it helps a great deal and it helps me to keep myself in line.

doncalypso, My fiancee forgave me not to shortly after I admitted what I had done to her. There were still other issues that had to be worked out, and bridges to rebuild, trust to be remade, but she forgave me. Was this a green flag to me that I could go out and do it again? No.
From the day I told her, I've been completely faithful to her.

So again, as much as some want to claim otherwise, walk in my shoes before you decide to make a judgement against or for me.

I also would just like to point out to others that we didn't have to say a damn word, and I knew I shouldn't have opened my mouth when I hit the submit button the first time, so please respect that we pulled back a little bit of the internet veil on ourselves. And no insult you can say to me will compare to the self-degradation I have put upon myself. Even though I have done all that to myself, keep in mind that some people who tell their stories though are actual people who do actually have an emotion or two. Even though you may not like what I've done, please respect me and others enough to at least not be an ass and claim we should be shot/killed/butchered/maimed/kill ourselves/etc, because I try to not be a total ass to you.

jerimya

Fallon,

Thank you for putting your words out there. I can only hope that my girlfriend feels the same way and wishes to be what you have stated.

Again thank you.

jaco

My personal experience with someone who cheated on me makes me severely biased against anyone who cheats. After repeatedly cheating on me and getting caught we played the make up game where i whole-heartedly forgave her. With promises and "love" she felled my walls of hate/fear/insecurities. This lasted a good while, or so i thought. In my particular case, once a cheater always a cheater was true. I find people later who tell me the reasons of why she did it; because she was high/drunk and i wasnt around. Consider this as my first love, and most likely the last time i will ever tell someone "i love you"

__________________
"How soft your fields so green, Can whisper tales of gore"
"Thou art god"

BooRadley

You know, as inflammatory of a post as this is, I agree with him. Quit being selfish and trying to get it all. You people make me sick. You same cheating fuckers are more responsible for emotionally scarring people than any other group in existance. But... before you report my post to moderators, read my next paragraph.

Fallon, I am not directing this towards you, or anyone else in this thread. I have strong feelings against cheaters... but I say these things with the greateast amount of sensitivity possible... my own brother was a cheater. In the worst way possible, and his life was ruined when he was found out. His guilt consumed him.

But even the serial cheaters will agree that it is better to not cheat and not have remorse than cheat and have remorse. This should be self explanatory. If one person, somewhere, reads a post like timalkins , or yours Fallon, and says "Damn. Maybe I should think this over before calling him/her up.... ", then it is all worthwhile.

But not everyone responds to the same style of writing. Fallon can talk about regret , and someone might counter "Well, at least you've tried it, I'll go ahead" and timalkin could talk about being a piece of shit for cheating, and someone could dismiss his argument as being "pathetic and bitter". But someone could also agree with one of you... I've seen no pro-cheating posts in this thread so far...

Nitrox

Not to kick the proverbial dead horse, but I have to weigh back in on this. Everything here is directed at the motivation of the cheater, yet makes the presumption that the one cheated on was at home living a saintly life. While this may be true in certain instances, it was far from this in mine. Sexuality has always been a very big part of my life, and the sex life I enjoyed with my ex stopped (please let me repeat this, stopped) when we got married. I was in the marriage for over four years, trying to make it work, before I strayed. Let me give you an idea of the relationship at that point:

We slept in separate bedrooms, she spent every available moment at her mom's house, she wouldn't go on vacation because she didn't want to be away from her mom (hell, I went as far as planning a surprise trip to Vegas for an extended weekend, and she refused to go).

In short, we were living two separate lives. Was all of this an excuse to cheat. No it wasn't. Did it create a scenario where someone was dying for human affection and interaction, yes it did. And I slipped and fell for it.

So BooRadley, before you lump me into the group of

"You same cheating fuckers are more responsible for emotionally scarring people than any other group in existance"

I would throw it back at you and ask you if four years of emotionless union can not in and of itself also be somewhat emotionally scarring?

seretogis

I had a few paragraphs all typed up about this but decided to replace it with just this to prevent an echo effect:

To cheat signifies a fault of personal character on the cheater's behalf, one that takes much work and learning to correct. To blame your cheating on your SO or the person you cheated with is the highest form of cowardice.

__________________
seretogis - sieg heil
perfect little dream the kind that hurts the most, forgot how it feels well almost
no one to blame always the same, open my eyes wake up in flames

Nitrox

"To cheat signifies a fault of personal character on the cheater's behalf, one that takes much work and learning to correct. To blame your cheating on your SO or the person you cheated with is the highest form of cowardice.

Ah, we are having problems with our short term memory I see.

If one goes back to my original post, I never pushed blame on anyone but myself. I merely got sick and tired of everyone on their high horses attacking those of us that stepped forward and admitted that we had cheated. If I was a coward, I never would have posted.

I merely wanted to point out that those of you who feel worthy of dishing out judgement from your thrones might do well to realize that there are always two parties in a relationship when this happens.

Would your morality play suffer a set back for me to tell you that my ex-wife posed naked for an old artist friend of hers, after which, from what I know, only making out and a little groping took place. And yes this happened before anything happened with me, and after she had decided that sex between us was no longer a priority.

I could have said, yay, now I'm justified. But I didn't, I accepted full blame, and said due to the destructive force of that event, I would never do that again.

Also, what university did you get your degree in that allows you to point out that I have (or had) a fault in my personal character that needs to be dealt with. It is a comment like that that leads me to believe that you yourself have a personal fault that you can so easily pass judgement on those you don't know.

Just some random thoughts.

Good day

SixEdxMia

A shitty way to say it,but I couldn't say it better myself.

Once you hold someones heart in your hands and you smash it,even on accident,it is assumed that you will do it again.

__________________
Honey,We're home.

Nitrox

Boy, good thing you people weren't around when Hawthorne was pitching his novel:

"Hester walked outside, emblazoned with the scarlet A, and was immediately stoned to death by the crowd"

I wouldn't have even needed the Cliff Notes version for that one.

BooRadley

Just because in your case it was justified ( I believe that it was a clear-cut case for you... ) doesn't mean that infidelity is somehow not the worst problem facing couples today....

jerimya

I do not believe doing anything in a relationship that is hurtful can be justified. However I can understand what might lead up to an affair.

As for something wrong with the person who does cheat, I totally agree with. Especially when they see it as justified. You are only brining yourself and your spouse down. It may be painful to end a relationship but to continue on and then cheat is uncalled for.

water_boy1999

If it is about passing judgement onto others for their infidelity, then I gladly claim to have a degree in relationships.

Besides what you have told us, I don't know the extenuating circumstances that would lead you to cheat. If the marraige was that bad, why not get out of it? IMO, the institution of marraige is sacred between two people. If that institution is no longer valid, then move on to greener pastures. I know you accept full responsibility for your actions which is not cowardly, but the fact remains, you still cheated.


Good day.

__________________
Doh!!!!


-Homer Simpson

Nitrox

"but the fact remains, you still cheated. "

No shit Sherlock, I admitted it

***shaking head back and forth***

dabossy2k

That is the truth right there. We all have choices and you cheaters made your choice. You could have done the right thing which would have been to end your relationships and move on. Then you can sleep with or do whatever with who ever you want. But to cheat is just wrong. You made that choice. No one made it for you it wasn't forced on you, you made a choice. I honestly think that in order to not cheat you have to have been cheated on. Once you experience that there is no way you would want to put another person though that. But I still don't think these people should be shot or anything I think thats wrong to they are still people and most people do deserve a second shot, but I do think that if it happened to them. Not to a friend a brother or someone close to them, but to them, then they would understand why people are saying the things they are saying.

__________________
Recovering nice guy

Nitrox

"but I do think that if it happened to them. Not to a friend a brother or someone close to them, but to them, then they would understand why people are saying the things they are saying."

sigh, by the way, just for the record, it did happen to me.....

"you cheaters"

Anyone want to start a club? We might as well since it appears that we now represent a subset of society

dabossy2k

Lol Nitrox you sound like a good guy and I think a lot of people on here are. So you say you been cheated on before so you know the pain from both sides. I think you are one of the few that this saying doesn't apply to. The only reason I say this is because you know the pain it is to be cheated on and to cheat. So you honestly probably won't do it again. Now there are a lot of other people out there who don't know the flip side of the coin and to them I do say once a cheater always a cheater. However, there isn't a general statement out there that doesn't have its execptions. So you gotta give people the benefit of the doubt but thats life I guess.

Hey the club thing is a good idea but would probably be to big.

__________________
Recovering nice guy

Fallon

You the president Nitrox or am I?

And I do think that I can easily say now that I won't cheat again because I know the pain it caused myself. Thoughts of suicide(much to many peoples apparent approval thus far) were daily occurances for me. Thankfully that's not the case anymore.
I think the pain that I felt taught me to not let it happen again because of the pain I put myself through and added pain that I put her through. So in my case, my pain was two-fold that was brought on by my own actions which in itself added even more pain to the fold.

It's interesting how some though are saying marriage is sacred, yet you're saying if it's not there, break that sacred bond. I had always thought divorce in Nitrox's case was maybe a little bit less worse then cheating. Case in point, catholics are no longer allowed to recieve communion if they get a divorce.