abaya

Have you ever had to force yourself to become accustomed to something that you found wholly unacceptable, in your daily life? Something that would destroy your spirit, if you let it take over your thoughts--and so you have to find a way to make it okay somehow, without losing your mind?

My last living grandparent lives here in Iceland, and during my most recent visit with her on Tuesday, a few thoughts came to mind. She had mentioned how hard it must be for ktsp's parents to deal with having their only son so far away from home (they have a daughter as well, who lives at home)--and I said to her, "Well, you understand how they feel." She nodded.

My grandmother watched 4 of her 10 children migrate away from Iceland: 3 to the US (triplets, of which my father was one), and 1 to Norway. None have ever moved back to Iceland, and my father died while he was away. This was perhaps the biggest "unacceptable" thing to deal with--how does one reconcile that kind of loss with one's daily reality?

It occurred to me that my grandmother has had to accept the unacceptable throughout her life, from her twin sister dying of TB when they were 16, to her son and then her husband dying, all very suddenly. And I assume that no parent wants their child to be so far away from them (across international borders and oceans), that they cannot quickly come to their aid, if the child is in need--even if the child is an adult.

Of course, many children do go that far away from their parents, and the parents have to accept this reality. Ktsp's parents are well on their way to accepting his absence--I am not sure if my mother has accepted mine, but I have been gone for 5 years now, and could possibly be gone for 2 more--and she has no choice but to go on living as if my absence didn't matter to her. How does the human mind cope with such things?

I don't know what it's like to have to accept something that feels so unacceptable, on a gut level. I had a taste of it during the 2 years of long distance with ktspktsp, but even that was not as horrible as losing him in an accident, or watching him die slowly. I am not sure how I would cope, in such a case. What if I had to deal with taking care of one (or both) of my parents for a long-term illness? What if I had no choice, even if it was a lifestyle that was totally unacceptable to me? What if one of our children is born with a debilitating disease or birth defect? It all sounds very selfish, I know--but I'm being honest here.

I am used to being able to make the changes that reduce this kind of "adjustment"--which makes me privileged, and probably naive. I have never been truly "stuck" with a reality that made me uncomfortable on a daily basis. I know that my grandmother has had to face that kind of reality, and so do ktsp's parents, and so does my mother--and they go on living as best they can, despite the sense of loss in their hearts. I wonder what kinds of unacceptable realities I will have to face in my lifetime.

So, how have you coped with these kinds of situations? I'd be very interested in hearing other people's stories.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

shakran

I watched my dad die slowly this past May, after watching his muscles slowly degrade over twelve years thanks to a nasty neuromuscular disease called inclusion body myositis. It's been wholly unacceptable to me for over a decade. I'm honestly still working to adjust to the latest unacceptable fact that he died, at only 62.

When unacceptable and unchangeable things happen to you you just.. .Live with it. There's obviously nothing you can do about it, and so you either eventually adjust or you do not. At the risk of sounding overly zen, I think that setting a GOAL to deal with the unacceptable situation actually makes it harder, because you're going to feel about it, what you're going to feel about it, and your emotions really don't give a crap about any timetable you might set as a goal to have your feelings worked through by.

For me, to sound like a bad cliche, it's one day at a time, and when I no longer feel crappy about Dad being gone, then I'll no longer feel crappy. That may never happen, and it may happen tomorrow. I don't know, and dwelling on the question of "when" would, I think, make dealing with this, far worse.

jorgelito

Sheer determination and tenacity. That's how I survived. There is a disparity between groups: some generations cope better than others and in different ways. There are also diffeent expectations. The Greatest Generation (your grandparents) was incredible. They endured without complaint and made our world better. The Boomers just suck (barring the 1st generation immigrants). They are a bunch of weak whiners that can't cope. I think Gen Xers are sort of the new Lost Generation - overshadowed by the Boomers and badly parented. Our predecessors were tough cookies. They could cope and had heart. I think the present generations have been coddled and pussified too much. We need to pull ourselves up by the bootstraps and endure. Dust ourselves off and try again.

Give your grandma a hug. Tell her how much she means to you and how much you appreciate her. Ditto to all your elders.

When the time comes for you, you will know and then you will have choices to make.

__________________
"The race is not always to the swift, nor battle to the strong, but
to the one that endures to the end."

"Demand more from yourself, more than anyone else could ever ask!"

- My recruiter

girldetective

I can tell you exactly what I do when something hits me so hard I almost fall down, and actually did on one occasion. I stop. Maybe for just a moment or maybe much longer. Its like I absorb it. Then, I learn. I start to think, and research if need be. I am action oriented if the occasion warrants it. While actioneering, I continue to think. That is just what I do. I turn things around, sort of like Rubik's cube or a math puzzle. I just do this until I figure it out. Even if it might not be what someone else figures out, it is my answer. I know this because I begin to feel peaceful or I change for the better or Im happier or someone else is happy or things fall into some sort of place.

The good news is that it always happens, and it continues to get better.

Also, remember our chemicals/hormones change and adjust with various situational stressors.

*

Edit: There are certainly times though when I go a little tweaky.

__________________
As far as possible, without surrender, be on good terms with all persons...be cheerful; strive for happiness - Desiderata

Cynthetiq

I chant. I read. I read things that remind me that it's just for today and that tomorrow is a different day and a different opportunity.

I often read this:

or even this little Icelandic saying:

It hangs on my door in my office to remind me each and every day that acceptance is the answer...

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

abaya

I appreciate all of your very thoughtful replies to this rather vague and rambling question. It is something that has been on my mind all this week, so I have a lot of thoughts tumbling around about it...I agree with you--and yet why is it that some people can never adjust to unacceptable things, even after decades? And some do adjust, and while they never forget how radically different their lives were as a result of that event, they maintain their momentum and go on to live a successful life. Is it a matter of genetics, personality, learned coping skills... or some combination thereof?
Well, now this is interesting--would you say that "The Greatest Generation" is a term that only applies to the US? Because in Iceland, I don't necessarily see my grandmother as part of that generation--WWII did affect Iceland, but mostly only to boost their country economically, seeing as it was on the fringes of Europe. Also, both of my parents were 1st generation immigrants to the US, so by your definition she should not be like the American Boomer generation. And yet, my mother possesses very few coping skills, particularly with confrontation or "accepting the unacceptable" in her life--I don't think she was ever taught to handle stress in a productive manner, if such a thing can be taught to one's children. Maybe that is a "Boomer" characteristic? This is how I would imagine myself getting through some kind of unacceptable situation--to analyze it to death, think it through, find some kind of logical/rational path to explain it or get through it, and then continue walking on. I would like to think that I would not dwell and dwell and dwell on negativity and how things aren't measuring up to how I would like them to be--but sometimes I feel an irresistible urge to think this way, and it's quite difficult to stop that process. We are all a little bit afraid of becoming like the worst part of our parents, I suppose.
I thought of you when I was writing the OP--your constant reminders to accept that which you find unacceptable. It is a zen-type state, I suppose... to just put one's head down and march onward, one step at a time, not allowing oneself to be overwhelmed by all the temptations and stressors around.

Hiking the Laugavegurinn trail in Iceland 2 weeks ago was a small exercise in this: by the 3rd day, facing the last 10 miles of a 35 mile trail with 30 pounds on my back, and 10 blisters covering my feet, some of them already popped and re-blistering, I could not think about stopping. There was nothing for it--even if I stopped, who would pick me up? Everyone in my group was in the same condition, and they were continuing. No airlift would come for me, no bus to trundle us away... there was no escape. We simply had to keep walking, through the pain in our feet and backs, and see this damn thing through to the end. I don't think I ever could have done something like that by myself, without that group of people. But there was no other solution than to keep walking--even if I were by myself. That was our reality. Eventually, it ended, and we got on the bus home, and our feet healed.

I keep thinking about my grandparents, on both sides... and how it must have broken their hearts to watch their children leave to live on the other side of the ocean, and to raise their own children there, so far away. And how my grandparents had to accept this--themselves never having imagined living so far away from their social network, never having imagined having so many grandchildren so far away. And yet here they were, in that very situation. They coped. They had other children and grandchildren to distract them.

But my mother, and ktsp's parents... there are no other grandchildren. For my mother, there are not even other children--just me. What will distract them, when they are too old to work or do anything for themselves, and their children and grandchildren are thousands of miles away? Will they be able to cope? This is something that ktsp and I thought about before we got married, and we know that we will have to face it and deal with it. I think about it often, even though everyone is mostly in good health. It bothers me.

I suppose I have a hard time letting other people down, forcing them to cope with an unacceptable situation that I am responsible for creating. It is a great source of guilt for me--that I should have to force people to accept the unacceptable, even if I know that it won't kill them. I like for people around me to be happy--I am a pleaser. And yet I go forward and do all the things I want to do, but people's reactions stay with me--their displeasure, their sadness, their regrets--and I suppose that tempers my enjoyment of what I'm doing.

And now I'm really rambling, I suppose--but I appreciate, again, any further thoughts on this kind of thing.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

Cynthetiq

See, that's the crux of what you are talking about, you feel responsible for something and thus you feel YOU need to change it. It's not your responsibility how someone acts or responds to a situation. It is a losing bet always if you tie your own self to that.

A business axiom that was passed to me, "If your responsibility exceeds your authority you will always fail."

It applies here too. You don't have the authority to change how someone feels for your actions. You aren't responsible for their behavior.

Looking at how some societies deal with death is interesting. Jews, Chinese, and Italians have a finite mourning period. It is exacting and deliberate. It helps create acceptance. It demarks rituals, milestones, and situations in order to facilitate acceptance of the passing of another.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

abaya

Right... and that's a lesson that was passed on to me via counseling, and I've intellectualized it pretty well, but still have a hard time internalizing it emotionally. I can give other people great advice about this kind of thing, of course--but for myself, not so much. I notice it so much more in Iceland than anywhere else--and I do think that's the major reason why I don't have a real drive to stay here. That sense of failure from my (perceived) responsibility exceeding my (perceived) authority.I am indeed a big fan of rituals, even religious ones, for this reason--I think it's wise to allow the human spirit to grieve for a set time period, and then to decidedly move on, even if you aren't quite feeling healed up yet. How to create these kinds of rituals in a secular setting, where no single culture dominates? I think that it is for reasons like these that organized religion isn't going out of style anytime soon.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

Cynthetiq

Do you mean you notice it more in Iceland because you see it more in society or yourself? Is this because there is more "down time" than when you were in the US? Personally, I found myself weakest in suburbia because I was confronted more with myself for more hours of the day than any other place. When we moved into the city, it was gone for along time, but eventually winter set in and we spent more time at home. Boom! It came up again because I had to sit with myself.

With regards to rituals, I also agree that organized religion rationale. I'll even extrapolate it a little further and say that people are so desperate for something and for rituals they look to self-help books which some co-opt other religions and belief structures and repackage them with fancy glossy new names. The lessons are the same, the authors different.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

abaya

Certainly, since I'm basically on my own for most of the day--and have been for the last 12+ months. I'm also a pretty intense navel-gazer, even in my busiest times--I journal like mad, always trying to figure out the next puzzle about who I am.

And it's not because of Icelandic society, in itself--even if I were very busy here, I still think I would be thinking about these kinds of things. It comes down to the fact that in Iceland, my family (who are everywhere around me) sees me as an orphan of some kind--the defining fact of my life happened before I was born, which was that their son/brother/my father died. And I perceive that they can't help but view me through that lens--all the things that could have been, all the things that they had envisioned for their son/brother, all cut short. And the pressure that I put on myself (and often hear in their comments) is immense, to deal with that shit.

The Icelandic society part is that no one ever wants to discuss these kinds of things (unless they're shit-faced drunk, which with my family is once a year--not enough for me to communicate with them)--they don't want to talk about accepting the unacceptable, about how or whether they coped or not, about what they went through when this event happened to them. And so all the questions float about in my head, during all this unstructured time on my hands, and yes, I am tired of it. I would like to be away from it--to no longer be seen as an orphan, but as someone with a mom, dad (even if he is my stepdad--but they rarely acknowledge him here), a life wholly apart from who my father was in Iceland. I feel that I can never really get away from it, as long as I am living in Iceland.

(This is turning into more of an extended journal entry than a thread, yikes!)

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

Cynthetiq

yes there's no move to blog ability.... maybe future versions.

I don't think that it is endemic to Icelandic society. Asian society puts alot of emphasis on saving face and not talking about uncomfortable things and situations. I recall my mom actually telling me that I should talk to my sister about the birds and the bees. I told her flat out, "No, not my job."

Even when they caught my sister with a young man, they couldn't accept the fact the young man was in the room, it was all put upon my sister as sole responsibility and fault. The poor guy sat naked in the living room while his parents were enroute to pick him up. That day has never been spoken about again by my parents, but some of the extended family joke about it because it is a testament to the head buried in the sand mentality.

My parents did similar things for and to me with regards to situations I found myself in hiding them and keeping them from other family members. To what purpose? Saving face and not having to accept unacceptable things which would be pressed upon by outside family members. But so what... you get through it, time passes, and move on.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

abaya

Now, this is interesting--perhaps we can pull people back into the thread here. How many have *not* accepted unacceptable things, because of the pressure to "save face" in front of others, and appear as if everything is fine?

I hadn't thought of that in my own situation--I just assumed that most people do try and accept the shit that's going down in their lives, even if it takes time, as shakran said earlier.

But saving face is something else altogether--that attitude is certainly prominent in my own Asian family, though my mother has put a lot of effort into being able to communicate about these things instead of staying reserved (not that it's helped her to move on that much, but at least she can talk about it). I never thought about Icelandic society as having a "saving face" mentality, but it makes more sense, the more I think about it.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

snowy

I think this needs a seconding here, especially given what you've discussed, abaya. Above all else, you are not responsible for how others view the situation. You are not responsible for your mother's inability to let you go despite the fact that you are in your late 20s. Your mother and your mother alone is responsible for that. Yes, she will get older, but she has a responsibility to herself to seek a social circle beyond you--and if she fails to do that, that's her own failing, not yours.

Generally, the normal behavior in trying to accept the unacceptable is just coping until a person reaches acceptance. If a person is unable to do that, it's not your responsibility to adjust your life situation so that they don't have to--in fact, quite frankly I think it's worse. Life is not a bed of roses, and things do not go the way we would like them to, period. We just have to do our best to muddle through it.

__________________
If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

thespian86

I find myself starting a lot of posts with this sentence now (but it's one of the things I've accepted):

At this point in my life I find I'm teetering between being a "man" and actually being one. My actions still don't completely match what I preach, or at least what I set before myself, but I try my best. But this subject, the idea of dealing with, and not holding onto things that are overwhelmingly hard to deal with, has become something of a problem lately.

My dad had a stroke in the fall which was a kick in the guts (it was also the first time I had cried in a long time), I left school to pursue a passion, I left my first really substantial relationship (others seemed important but in hindsight they weren't close to this one), and I'm moving to a large city filled with big scary people.

I'll throw this out there. Accepting the Unacceptable doesn't always have to be negative does it?

In my case I dealt with the bad much better then dealing with the overwhelmingly good. My father and I have grown closer, I moved on from my relationship with grace, and I'm becoming a better person which is something I can see everyday. On the other hand I find the things that I'm presented with, like opportunities, far more daunting. I can't understand how I am in this position, I don't understand why I was given the chance, etc. And even though the more I try to force my mind around the fact that I might be succeeding, and the more I own it, there is still a little voice in the back of my head. I don't know if that voice is a good thing; perhaps it'll propel me further.

Those are just the things I've worked through. There are several fairly petty but very large problems that bother me on a daily basis. I can't get over them; I do try. That's where my age comes in, it's just a level of immaturity; it'll pass.

That was scattered and lacked cohesion. hahaha sorry.

__________________
EX: Whats new?
ME: I officially love coffee more then you now.
EX: uh...
ME: So, not much.

Cynthetiq

I think that humans have a save face mentality. It just isn't something that has been given any kind of label in western society.

We all try to cover up our shit thinking that it doesn't stink.
-----Added 1/8/2008 at 12 : 32 : 20-----
no it doesn't have to be negative at all PMF, sometimes fear of success is an unacceptable for some.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

jewels

Although it may be more prevalent in the Asian culture, I think most average folks go through the same turmoil. It's a matter of survival. As parents, we must prepare for the day our children grow up. We do, after all, raise them to thrive on their own. Some of us still aren't prepared and may have a minor breakdown or two (yes, I did) and difficulty dealing with it at first, but we have other responsibilities, i.e. family and children, and we do have to "save face", possibly for different reasons (?) than in the Asian culture. Sometimes that's where the strength comes from that allows us to persevere. We have to show our other children that we can be strong and competent anyway.

As you stated earlier, in time you do adapt. Hopefully, you have a life outside of your children so your heart won't ache quite so much.

__________________
We are always more anxious to be distinguished for a talent which we do not possess, than to be praised for the fifteen which we do possess.
Mark Twain

abaya

Thank you, Snowy. You're right, of course--and I am more aware of the situation with my mother, and setting boundaries there, due to my time in counseling. The problem here in Iceland, though, has less to do with my mother and more to do with my Icelandic family not accepting my father's death almost 30 years ago... or at least, my perception of them being that way, from various comments they make to me about him and myself. And yes, I know that it's still the same answer: it's not my problem. If they cannot accept that accidents happen, and that people die every day--good people, people like their son/brother/my father--even after 3 decades--well, what the hell can I do about it, right? It's just annoying. I don't like being around people who believe so strongly in these things (almost like reincarnation), to the point where they can't let themselves accept events for what they are, and to embrace the new reality.
Dude, we seem to have a lot in common. Fear of success--something that Cyn could tell us more about, too (he's good at this stuff). I've talked a lot about this before on TFP (not sure where--journals or some thread)--about not accepting the fact that I am privileged for whatever reasons, and that I have so many choices in front of me--I can never let myself believe that I deserve it. I just let myself feel "lucky," and that's as far as I can go. Because I sincerely don't believe that the billions of other less-fortunate people in this world are less deserving than I am--they were simply born into different circumstances, and for those reasons, they received less opportunities than I did. And that is the little voice in the back of MY head, and it's often what does propel me, so that I don't let the opportunities go to waste. Join the club, lol. I think it's just one of those kinds of threads.
-----Added 1/8/2008 at 12 : 47 : 09-----
Strange thing is, I have seen all too many parents (once again the stereotype, but it is often with my Asian family) who raise their children to be dependent on them as parents--far into their 20s and 30s, even. At some level, these parents want their children (or at least one child--typically female, and younger than the others) to always remain at home, particularly attached to the parents as they age and need more care, and the emotional bonds are tight enough that the child can be expected to never declare its independence.

Surprisingly, this is not the case for my mother, mostly due to the influence of my American stepfather raising me to be independent--and my immersion in American mainstream culture--I WANTED to be on my own, as soon as possible. She has never liked it, but she has begun to accept it (mostly after I got married, since in her cultural mindset, a female can never be independent of a man--go figure!).

But I have seen it in my own family, somewhat in my in-laws' family, and in many of my friends' families. It's less strong among the children of immigrants in the US, for obvious reasons... but with my relatives in Thailand, yeah, it's nuts. There is a very strong culture of codependence, and no expectation for children to ever be truly independent of their parents.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

thespian86

I think everyone feels this way; some are more vocal about their problems accepting success. I think that comes with an acceptance that everyone needs help which is why we are both advocates of therapy and are both so analytical. I accept that I'm going to have problems, and I'd rather face them in public, let others know they aren't alone, then try to deal with my demons behind closed doors. There is no shame in feeling fucked up; everyone does.

The problem isn't that the opportunities I have in front of me just fell into my lap, because I worked really hard for them and pushed my way through a lot of shit for it to happen. But the idea of accepting that you're being recognized for the work you've put in, the talent and work ethic you can offer, after being conditioned to be "propelled" forward by rejection, is almost strangely inverse for me; it makes me doubt myself more then the opposite. It's part of my job though. But you kind of get into the arts with the impression that you'll never make it anywhere.

But yeah; you, me, and some chai. We can discuss how we hate our mothers, or something.

__________________
EX: Whats new?
ME: I officially love coffee more then you now.
EX: uh...
ME: So, not much.

abaya

YES. And that is exactly why living in Iceland tends to drive me nuts. Nice.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

Cynthetiq

fear of success and fear of failure. They are really powerful hindrences, but they aren't rooted in success or failure. They are rooted in acceptance when you get down to brass tacks.

I'm with abaya. I can't fathom how I'm privilidged enough for many things. I tell you that I try my best to make the most of them and that still doesn't stop me from having anxiety about success/failure. I think it to be more of the reason of not wanting to have kids as I learn more about who I am as an idividual and exlpore the real meanings to my behaviors as opposed to the reasons and lies that I rationalize and tell myself.

I also flat out reject things from my parents as part of that privilige sometimes making it inifitely harder than it needs to be to achieve something. I don't fully understand why, but I believe it has something to do with birth order and trying to achieve on my own in comparison to my younger sister who has always gotten help from my parents in some fashion.

I used to believe that when I was a youth in school, that I was not getting A's because I didn't care about grades. I wanted to be able to do it all, playing with friends, going out, watching TV, etc. so getting B's and C's were acceptable to me. The reality of it is much different, I was afraid that if I got A's this time, I'd have to get A's another time. If I hit the mark once I'd have to hit the mark again, and again, and again. So by keeping the bar low, I was able to do what I wanted, but the reality was I couldn't accept an unacceptable possibility of having to perform well consistently.

There are lots of books written up on the Fear of Success and the Fear of Failure. Sometimes it's as simple as self sabatoge which maskes the two, obfusicating the situation because you create a situation to setup the endeavor from happening in a positive result.

This is why I always suggest forgiving yourself as a starting point. Two elements to allowing acceptance for me is forgiveness and permission. For some reason I pick forgiveness first to give me a pause and moment. At times I almost feel like Silas from Da Vinci Code because I believe that the actions past and future have some sort of "sin" connotation to me.

The next is permission. For some reason unknown to me, I have to sometimes actually whisper the words, "It's okay you have permission to do this..." or "I give you permission..."

Oddly enough, one of my simplest mottos is "It is easier to beg for forgiveness than ask for permission."

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.