The Definative Matrix Revolutions Speculation Thread - Spoilers definately inside - Page 5 - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Moskie · 11-05-2003, 05:12 PM

http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...threadid=34561

dragon2fire · 11-05-2003, 05:40 PM

please do a serch b4 posting

Solitude · 11-05-2003, 06:48 PM

I WANT MY MONEY BACK!
My advice to everyone who hasn't seen it: Wait for it to come to video. If you loved Lost In Space, then you'll love this movie, too. It's all eye candy. Someone was saying on the way out of the theatre, "So wait.. you're telling me that Darth Vader was Neo's father!?" Two of the other guys I watched it with asked for their money back. I should have done the same.

This movie was all the crap they pulled out of the Recycle Bin after being cut out of the the first two movies. Then they added a lot of splashing around in the rain, threw in some scenes from The Adventures of Superman and viola! Another box office smash.

Two hours of my life I'll never get back. I say two hours, because the movie was 2:09 long. Yeah, there were a couple good scenes, but ... far overshadowed by the garbage.

ShadowWraith · 11-05-2003, 06:52 PM

*SPOILERS*

I felt totally let down. First, trinity and neo both die, what the hell?! trinity's death was totally pointless because its not like neo went on a revenge-inspired rampage and he made no references to her during his fight with smith, and in fact after a few minutes of crying he seemed to get over it pretty quickly.

Second, there was little of the small-scale combat the original two had. After the gun battle in the club and the last kung fu scene the rest of it was all large scale tracers flying, tentacles stabbing, kinda thing.

Third, there were so many inconsistencies and unfinished subplots, some of which can be listed here .

Finally, the whole philosophical build-up the 1st and 2nd built up was wasted.

Bleh, i give it a 6/10

Solitude · 11-05-2003, 06:54 PM

I'm so upset that I have to post again.

If you have any inclination to see this movie, just pull out a dvd of the first Matrix and watch that again. If you already bought tickets, get your money back. If someone else is buying your ticket, ... well... I'd make a polite excuse such as "I have to hang up Christmas lights tonight."

Good luck. I know you can escape from watching The Matrix. I BELIEVE IN YOU!

Marburg · 11-05-2003, 06:55 PM

Wait...

How is the war over?

They didn't free ANYONE in the 3rd movie...

Solitude · 11-05-2003, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by THE MAC GOD
WELL... I just got back from the REVOLUTION... and all I have to say is that reviewers have no fucking idea what the hell they like or want in a movie. It is truely the perfect ending to this trilogy. That's all that can be said.

If that means "Thank GOD they won't be making any more crappy sequels.", I completely agree.
The movie made a really good attempt to finish the trilogy. Then about halfway through, someone lost the script and said, "Screw it. We don't need to tie up any loose ends. Just put some more special effects in and steal some stuff from The Adventures of Superman. We'll make millions anyway."

Save your money. Wait for it to come out on video. If you need to see some Matrix action to get a fix, just watch the first one.

supersix2 · 11-05-2003, 07:06 PM

I'm sad because of my speculation about the deeper meanings and all the cool things that "are going to happen in Revolutions," were lost thoughts and energy. I really think that the Wachowski brothers are laughing at everyone who thought the Matrix was about something more than people fighting machines. Really, thats all it was. Humans vs Machines. Just like any other sci-fi movie ever made. I still enjoyed the movie because I quickly realized that it was just another sci-fi movie about a future human race battling machines. The action was good, the special effects were crazy, and finally it ended the war. The story-line of the war is over and therefore the story is over.
Oh well the Matrix really wasn't about anything. I'm over it.

Marburg · 11-05-2003, 07:11 PM

Wah!
I was so set on buying all three dvds when they came out in a set.
But, I don't know now. It'll just remind me of how disappointed I was...

Sparhawk · 11-05-2003, 07:13 PM

Underwhelmed seems to be the prevalent feeling here, and I unfortunately join them. I didn't have that "Star Wars Episode I" optimism going into it, so I'm not totally pissed off. I just feel like they spent WAY the fuck too much time on that battle scene that could have been better spent seeing people we actually CARED about, like morpheus, trinity, neo doing shit, instead of watching the kid tripping, the general frothing at the mouth, and the black chick LOADING AMMO for crying out loud... *yawn*

supersix2 · 11-05-2003, 07:17 PM

Its only disappointing if you try to search for a deeper meaning. When in reality there is none. Just remember, its only a movie. I mean in all three movies the special effects were groundbreaking, the fight scenese were suspensful and the plot had some interesting twists.

Lasereth · 11-05-2003, 08:13 PM

*SPOILERS*

This movie is absolutely amazing. I have to say that it wasn't as good as Reloaded (easily the best of the trilogy) but it was on-par with the first one. If you liked Reloaded (understood it and was willing to accept a change in the series) then you'll LOVE Revolutions. If you hated Reloaded, you'll hate Revolutions. It's as simple as that.

The ending was the best possible ending for the trilogy. New Matrix, but this time it's different -- if you want out, then you come out without the machines killing you. In other words, you can be freed without restriction. Of course Neo dies...what's the whole trilogy been setting up? Neo had to die else the Christ imagery from the first two wouldn't fit in right.

The battle for Zion scene was incredible. I've never seen CG that good, not even in Reloaded. As Ebert said, directors have finally breached the wall of "that looks good, but it still looks fake." The Hammer flying through the tunnels with Niobe piloting was amazing as well. Damn, damn damn.

The only gripe I have about the movie is the Neo vs Smith fight...it wasn't as good as I hoped it to be. But ya know, after seeing such a perfect ending to the trilogy, I can't complain too much. Everything that I wanted to happen happened. I think the acting in this one might have been the best out of the trilogy as well. It was great when Morpheus said "No, the honor is still mine" when Neo and Trinity were leaving to go to the machine city.

Now that the trilogy is over, I'm proud to say that it's my favorite sci-fi trilogy ever, even moreso than the first Star Wars movies. This is cinematic film-making at its best...and the only people that can disagree are just looking for reasons to say this movie sucks.

It seems that the new fad in Hollywood is to diss the Matrix movies as much as possible. Go ahead, say they suck, but the true fans who had hope and were willing to accept a change in the series will always be proud of what the Wachowski Brothers have accomplished. I honestly don't think I'll see anything as mindbreaking and revolutionary as this trilogy.

-Lasereth

Atomsk · 11-05-2003, 08:49 PM

i wasn't amazed as i would have hoped i would be. mostly i felt like they toned down neo's powers since the first one. remember how fast he was when he came back to life at the end of part 1? so naturally he would have gotten better as time went on right? he seemed to have gotten slower in reloaded.

ultimately i seemed to me that they didn't quite keep the flow of the series. the opening scene with the two programs and their daughter is completely useless. i mean what the fuk is that? what a waste of my life. if they actually went somewhere with it like i was hoping they would. basically all they did was "look we're both programs and we had a baby!" that was it. if they said something good like "the one is a program that is created and put in a human" that would have blowen my fukin mind!!! like neo was a baby program just like like all the other ones and he was put in that body?!?! but no just "check it out we had a baby!" crap. what was the point of that? LOL. anyway i didn't really dig how they had to go greek tragidy in the end and kill off neo and trinity. or is neo really dead? i mean smith took him over and then went to the source where neo was jacked in? i'm thinking thats what killed smith.... not sure about that one. but in the end smith ate the oracle and she was back again. so neo?......
it was kind of a letdown in the end i guess. did anyone else notice the little the crap like the child program that really doesn't have any purpose to the plot? i did read some speculation about how the child would be the oracles successor. which seems odd since she wouldn't need one being a program and all. unless the original wanted a different type of oracle for the peacetime that was upon them. anyway just puttin gin my 2 cents

fuhrerhat · 11-05-2003, 08:56 PM

See, I agree that it was a really entertaining movie, and that it wrapped up the series beautifully.

However, the subplots and philosophy were just sort of thrown out the window.

For example, what happened to 'Merv'?
Mr. French was easily the most deep character in the entire series, and the second movie alluded to him being either the essence of the Matrix, or a previous 'one'.

Lasereth · 11-05-2003, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fuhrerhat
See, I agree that it was a really entertaining movie, and that it wrapped up the series beautifully.

However, the subplots and philosophy were just sort of thrown out the window.

For example, what happened to 'Merv'?
Mr. French was easily the most deep character in the entire series, and the second movie alluded to him being either the essence of the Matrix, or a previous 'one'.

From what I've gained, I see him as simply the person that controls what goes into the Matrix and what isn't "uploaded." He controlled the Indian family going in as programs with the Trainman. I guess that's why he's so imporant -- he's the key to maintaining the Matrix.

-Lasereth

gwr_gwir · 11-05-2003, 09:02 PM

after watching it... a few things come to mind.
DUNE - the first one, and Dune Messiah.
Dragonball Z.
End of Evangelion.
Ozymandias.

That is all for now, as most other people have gone over and rehashed their opinions enough for me.

Journeyman · 11-05-2003, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ShadowWraith
Third, there were so many inconsistencies and unfinished subplots, some of which can be listed here .

Sorry to be harsh, but the bullet points of "inconsistencies" in that article reveals the author to be a mental midget with the imaginative capacity of a Snickers bar.

But I loved Revolutions, feel very satisfied by the ending (ps: Free will vs Determinism as a follow up to the Matrix' DesCartes/Plato undertones, so I felt it was meaningful in a philosophical sense), and wasn't disappointed by anything other than Keanu Reeves trying to play "punch drunk."

Kurant · 11-05-2003, 10:37 PM

The Matrix = uber

Reloaded = Semi booty

Revolutions = complete and utter ass

GakFace · 11-05-2003, 11:16 PM

You guys put too much detailed expectations into the movie that no wonder it seems like a downfall. I don't campare movies to movies.. especially when they are all in a series!!

I for one will stand up and say... GO SEE THIS MOVIE. Screw seeing it on DVD, I plan on going BACK to the theaters to see it again. I found nothing that wasn't answered Either. again I say to those who haven't seen it..

GO SEE IT!!!

GakFace · 11-05-2003, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ShadowWraith
Third, there were so many inconsistencies and unfinished subplots, some of which can be listed here .

Sorry, I find all those "inconsistencies" to be utter horseshit, none of them make complete sense. I honestly don't think this guy put much thought into it before he wrote it. As I see it, the only inconsistancy that that article proved was that the writer didn't have a clue what the fuck he was talking about.. even though he 'thought' he did.

Atomsk · 11-06-2003, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Lasereth
From what I've gained, I see him as simply the person that controls what goes into the Matrix and what isn't "uploaded." He controlled the Indian family going in as programs with the Trainman. I guess that's why he's so imporant -- he's the key to maintaining the Matrix.

-Lasereth

I'm not sure if that is exactly what he is. i think he is part of the control system for "the one" he talks in reloaded about surviving neo's predicessors so obviously he deals with each incarnation of "the one" i think the trainman just works for him and stores "unwanted" or "exiled" programs where the agents can't find them and delete them. i don't see much evidence to support that he controls the "upload" to the matrix. i would think that would have to do with the architech. anyway just my 2 cents on that one. why he's left out is no big surprise to me since they dropped so much shit in this movie that was never dealt with it amazes me.

Kyp · 11-06-2003, 12:31 AM

I thought the movie rocked. People who say that there aren't answers are just blind and apparently need a bright flashing neon sign infront of their eyes that say it. The plotholes people are mentioning aren't plotholes, they would have to be seperate plots on their own, they're just mentioned in the movie. What is everyones problem with this movie? The ending was fine, just because it wasn't what you wanted you complain and bitch? If it was what you were wanting and expecting then you'd complain and bitch that it was so guessable and all that. Just watch the movie for what it is, entertainment. I was very entertained.

In the great words of Maximus - Are you not entertained?!!?!

Nikilidstrom · 11-06-2003, 12:55 AM

But i wasn't entertained. I wanted to see the characters that the Wachowski Bros spent 4 years and two movies trying to make us care about, not the few bit players introduced a few months ago. While the visuals were amazing, the end fight seen was just week compared to just about any in the previous 2 films. I thought I was watching an episode of Dragonball Z. And since everything that made The Matrix and Reloaded more entertaining than your standard sci-fi flik occured in the matrix, they probably should have spent more than a few fleeting moments there in the finally. I have to admit, while i sit and think about this, I'm not quite as disappointed as I was immediately after watching Revolutions. The majority of my questions were answered, and the plot points were tied up, however weakly, except for a few minor inconsistencies which shouldn't show up between 2 movies shot at the same time. But to have a hero who has been built up over the 2 movies like Neo has take an ass whipping from his arch nemesis in the final battle, especially after he has lost the woman he loves, and the fate of humanity is in his hands, just doesn't sit well with me, even if he does technically win in the end and complete his purpose. When he rose the last time and told Smith it was because he chose to, I though for sure that he was about to open the family size can of woopass, but no, it was not to be. The entire film just felt very anti-climactic.

Mr.Deflok · 11-06-2003, 01:19 AM

I was completely amazed by this film! Reloaded for me was ok, but it was all over the place and took style over substance, Revolutions is quite frankly an epic. Baring a few lines of cheesey humour this film stands up extremely well. Agent Smith vs. Neo in the rain was not only a feat of remarkable special effects and choreography but it was perhaps one of the most Epic battles I have ever seen put on film. I absolutely loved it, I'll be going to watch the film again on Saturday, can't wait!

BTW, to the person who said Neo got over Trin's death too quick, you'd have noticed that Neo was in a state of "I don't give a fuck about anything, let me fulfill my purpose so I can die already".

Lasereth · 11-06-2003, 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr.Deflok
BTW, to the person who said Neo got over Trin's death too quick, you'd have noticed that Neo was in a state of "I don't give a fuck about anything, let me fulfill my purpose so I can die already".

Yep.

Quote:

Originally posted by Kyp
I thought the movie rocked. People who say that there aren't answers are just blind and apparently need a bright flashing neon sign infront of their eyes that say it. The plotholes people are mentioning aren't plotholes, they would have to be seperate plots on their own, they're just mentioned in the movie. What is everyones problem with this movie? The ending was fine, just because it wasn't what you wanted you complain and bitch? If it was what you were wanting and expecting then you'd complain and bitch that it was so guessable and all that. Just watch the movie for what it is, entertainment. I was very entertained.

In the great words of Maximus - Are you not entertained?!!?!

That's exactly how I feel. I'll say the following, and it may seem too general, but it is the truth: the media are now in a fad of dissing the Matrix no matter what it takes. With the release of Revolutions, I've lost all hope in the movie critic world (Except for Ebert, still the only movie critic I trust...he loved all three Matrix movies giving them at least 3 stars out of 4). Critics are simply trying their damned hardest to find something wrong with this movie, just as they did with Reloaded.

I figured most adults were mature enough to accept that some movies change with sequels...I guess I overestimated their intelligence. If you hated Reloaded, then that's it, just stop -- you're watching these movies for the wrong reasons. The first movie was written and directed WITHOUT KNOWING if there would be sequels! That's why it was different from the last two, everyone. They had to make it suffice on its own without sequels, yet make it sequel-ready just in case. The first Matrix is not the best of the series...it is the least best. Don't get me wrong, I understand that it started this wonderful trilogy, but as for literary analysis of cinema go, it's not the best. Reloaded takes that honor, followed by Revolutions.

We're sorry that there were no miniguns attached to helicopters in the last two. We're sorry that there were no dojo fighting scenes, and we're sorry that there wasn't another lobby shootout. That's the difference between real moviegoers and people who just want to be entertained -- moviegoers can see the first one and enjoy it as well as those who simply want to be entertained. That's not true of the last two, however. If you want entertainment only, then go somewhere else. Go see a Tom Green movie or the horrid Terminator 3. That'll entertain you, but nothing else. The last two Matrix movies aren't out to entertain, there out to deliver a story with the best visual stimulation possible. That's what they do, and they do it very, very well. If you don't like the last two, then you're watching them for the wrong reasons. Stop trying to blind these excellent movies from the people who would enjoy them...the people who enjoyed Reloaded.

The Matrix Revolutions is incredible. If you enjoyed Reloaded, then you'll love this one. There's no doubt in my mind.

-Lasereth

TheKak · 11-06-2003, 06:51 AM

People are complaining about the questions not being answered, even though you can come up with your own answers that should fit nicely all on your own if you take a few minutes to sit and think about it. The Matrix trilogy didnt bring up any new philisophical questions, it just re-asked a few and left it at that, its up to you to find your own answers.

phyzix525 · 11-06-2003, 06:52 AM

I am not real sure what to think about the movie. First of all I wanted it to be a total mindfuck. But it ended up being easy to understand for all the dumb masses. I wanted a better explination for Neo having powers in the real world. I would have liked to see a different reason for the matrix. Batteries just don't seem to work well enough for me when machines have fusion power. Or even solar power. It did not seem like it was really all that hard to go above the clouds. I wanted a better reason as to why Agent smith was able to exist in a human in the real world if he was just a program. I didn't get how Neo had these great powers now in the real world to kill machines but gets his ass kicked by bane. Trinity dieing was ok, but I wanted to see Neo get some revenge for it. get all gladiator on their ass. I wanted to see more of the matrix world, more kung fu, more of the MERV. Especially his wife. YOW!! Anyone notice the nipple tweeker in the S&M club?
It was a good movie, I just had so much more anticipated for it.

Stare At The Sun · 11-06-2003, 06:57 AM

The whole dragon ball Z fight scene seriously pissed me off, and the fact that they focused so much on other people than Neo/trin and morph...

The club fight scene BLEW. For one big reason in my book, the music, was gawd awful. Think about the first one, how the lobby fight scene, the music, everytime still gets me into that scene, but in that club scene, it was so damn dry, didnt get me into it at all. However, the outfits were quite fitting of a goth/industrial club.

Also, I like Reloaded a lot, however, Revolutions left me feeling empty, and dissapointed. Just my .02, but i think this movie was awful, 1.5/5 stars...

dragonhawk · 11-06-2003, 08:31 AM

SPOILERS

Okay here are my thoughts on this guys take and questions:::

Even though "Revolutions" takes place only in the span of a few hours immediately following "Reloaded," some of our characters have taken, quite suddenly, to using informal nicknames with one another, such as "Merv" and "Trin."
***Gotta give him this one*****

In "The Matrix" we were told that agents must obey the physical laws inherent in the matrix. Morpheus says, "Men have emptied entire clips at them and hit nothing but air, yet their strength and their speed are still based in a world that is built on rules. Because of that, they will never be as strong or as fast as you can be." Not anymore. In "Revolutions," Agent Smith can do everything Neo can.
*****We find out that Smith takes on part of anyone he absorbs, (The Oracle eyes for instance) He and Neo had joined code before. Since Smith had taken over the WHOLE Matrix by the last fight, he had taken on all of the weird stuff too (Vampires, Merv, etc.) He just grew new powers.*****

In "Revolutions" we meet computer programs who feel love and appreciate karma, but later we're assured that machines always keep their word, since betrayal is a human trait.
*****Nope, the Arcitect said that. The Oracle had already said he only sees things as code, variables, etc. He wouldn't have "human traits" *****

Neo survives being driven into concrete so forcefully that he creates a 30-foot crater. (The wonderful site Insultingly Stupid Movie Physics will have a field day with "Revolutions.") Yet what finally fells him is a punch to the gut. There may still be some rules in the matrix governing Neo, but they appear and disappear arbitrarily.
*****Duh, they are in a video game where they can change the rules. Deal with it. They punch wasn't a punch either. Smith was interfacing with Neo at that point.*****

When confronted with a single sentinel in "The Matrix," a frightened Trinity tells Neo that the electromagnetic pulse is mankind's only weapon against these devilish devices. In "Revolutions," simple machine guns prove quite effective and all ships seem to be equipped with them. Is this a small inconsistency? Yes, except that it makes the tension of the closing minutes in "The Matrix" a complete contrivance.
*****Gotta give them this one too... I would have built EMPs in every freaking tunnel between me and the machines*****

The same can be said for the process of jacking in and out of the matrix. In the first movie, much of the drama concerns finding safe lines to jump into and out of the matrix. This process has become such an afterthought in "Revolutions" that jacking in is done smoothly, quickly, and always off-screen.
*****It was cool at one point. Been there, done that, move one*****

The list of glaring inconsistencies goes on.
*****Let's hear them*****

Worse still, is the way "Revolutions" abandons the larger thematic issues. The climactic moment in "Reloaded" comes when Neo meets the Architect and learns that Morpheus has his chronology wrong, that there have been several matrixes and Zions. The Architect then gives a long mathematical explanation of what Neo is:

Your life is the sum of a remainder of an unbalanced equation inherent to the programming of the matrix. You are the eventuality of an anomaly, which despite my sincerest efforts I have been unable to eliminate from what is otherwise a harmony of mathematical precision. While it remains a burden assiduously avoided, it is not unexpected, and thus not beyond a measure of control. Which has led you, inexorably, here. …

The function of the One is now to return to the source, allowing a temporary dissemination of the code you carry, reinserting the prime program. After which you will be required to select from the matrix 23 individuals, 16 female, 7 male, to rebuild Zion. Failure to comply with this process will result in a cataclysmic system crash killing everyone connected to the matrix, which coupled with the extermination of Zion will ultimately result in the extinction of the entire human race.

Pretty big news. In "Revolutions" barely a word is spoken about any of this. In the end, "Revolutions" settles down to a fairly explicit Christian allegory, but even here the Wachowski brothers are confused: Neo is a warrior and if you strip out the symbols, he resembles Muhammad as much as Christ.
*****Not completely Christian. These movies take a lot from Gnostic Christianity, Budisim, etc. He didn't do all of his research*****

UnlikedOne, the audio in our theater was strange too. Some parts were NOT LOUD ENOUGH, and others (like the Machine Head) I could barley understand

I liked the movie. 3.5 / 5 stars.

diergray · 11-06-2003, 08:36 AM

This series reminds me of Highlander. It started with a brilliant premise and then just lost its way.
I disagree with people who say the answers are there. There were too many interesting ideas setup in the second movie for me to understand how they could have taken the third movie in the direction that they did.
Oh well, just like with Highlander you watch the first one and ignore the rest. And then hope that they will make a cool TV series based on the original.

punx1325 · 11-06-2003, 10:34 AM

I thought it was very well done. I like the way it ended, the fight scenes were awesome. And the toned down use of CGNeo made me happy.

MSD · 11-06-2003, 10:54 AM

I loved the battle scenes, and the Neo/Smith fight was great. The ending, however, sucked.

BIT OF A SPOILER AHEAD:
Here's the way I thought it should have ended:

I would have ended shortly after the machines dragged Neo's body away by showing the beginning of the first movie (him waking up in front of the computer,) but with the little girl waking up in front of the computer instead of him.

Nikilidstrom · 11-06-2003, 10:59 AM

Now that I have slept on it, I guess I feel that together, Relaoded and Revolutions make one hell of a movie. But it just seems that they stuffed everything I loved about this series into Reloaded, leaving nothing much but leftovers for Revolutions once they were split up. I do still disagree with anyone that believes the questions presented from Reloaded were not answered. And I don't mind the actual answers either, even though they were pretty much given to you in Reloaded by the Architect, with the only difference being Zion didnt have to be destroyed this time around. I just didn't like the method used to answer those questions. To me it just seemed like such a build up in Reloaded, that the entire Revolutions was downhill. And the final fight looked good, but just lacked substance and a climactic ending. Anywho, this looks like one of those fliks that you either love it or you hate it, so love or hate on people

Jack Ruby · 11-06-2003, 11:05 AM

I am appalled at some of the comments I've heard. Everyone seems to think that all the pre-release hype (which really wasn't that bad, all things considered) about a movie justifies completely driving it into the ground after its release. The Wachowski brothers cannot make a movie that caters to everyone's expectations. So they have made a series of movies that explore different things (philosophy, combat, action, allegory) while providing some of the most adrenaline-filled cinematic effects and action scenes in the genre.

Revolutions is no different. Granted, there are a few annoyances that struck me during the viewing. Mainly, one factor that was out of the hands of the directors : a different actress taking over the role of the Oracle, previously played by Gloria Foster, who died during production. I get the feeling most of the Oracle scenes, including the ending, would have had a far greater impact had the character been played by the original actress. But hey.

The small technical inconcistencies and details don't interest me that much. The fact that Neo can now survive plummeting to the ground (creating a 30 ft. hole in the process) does bother me, though, as it poses the question - why do Smith and Neo bother fighting as seemingly neither one of them can be killed by physical force ?

I was left kind of confused about certain aspects of the film, though maybe a second or third viewing will take care of that. Specifically, the whole reason why Neo can control Machines in the real word is still a mystery to me. Also, I'm not entirely sure just how Neo succeeded in destroying all the Smiths. Which is odd, since I usually have an eye for the unstated in movies... but maybe I was just overwhelmed by all the good things in this movie.

The battle scenes, for example. The fight at the Dock was quite possibly the most amazingly cool battle sequence I've seen in a science fiction setting. It seems to be very politically correct these days to say special effects are just eye candy that can't cover up a badly produced movie, and I guess that's true, but FUCK ME. The special effects are half of what makes this movie (and the entire series) great, but that's not a bad thing. So much hype was created around the highway chase scene in Reloaded, but the scene at the docks is definetely the most impressive one in the trilogy, IMO.

I actually enjoyed the allegorical and semi-philosophical aspect. I can't tell you why, I just did. For some reason I had immediate sympathy for the Indian program guy. The confrontation between Neo and the 'sentinel face' in the machine city (and the whole scene leading up to it, culminating in the first time Trinity sees the sun outside of simulation) was pretty farking cool as well.

Ultimately, without trying to be an apologist for the Matrix (because I never really got excited about the first movie and was disappointed with the second), I think what matters is this :

When the credits rolled and the lights went on, I was overwhelmed at how good this movie was, and immediately wanted to see it again. I'd give it 85 out of 100 now, though that may chance after a few more viewings. I love it, and though the ending did leave something to be desired, I think it's a great conclusion to the series.

Conclusion : Matrix Revolutions > Jesus.

Destrox · 11-06-2003, 11:10 AM

Without going into some massive post, I'll just keep it simple.

If you can manage to have a damn mind of your own, you will like this movie.

This trilogy was a excellent set of movies, that did some U-turns midway thru. If you cant deal with this, you should stick to PG movies where everything is spelled out.

4/5 Revolutions

4/5 Overall

Nikilidstrom · 11-06-2003, 11:15 AM

I guess my question is, whether you liked this movie or not, why do you have to be insulting while expressing your opinion? Most of the people here, for or against the film, seem to "get it." So what is the point of questioning their maturity or mental compacity just because their opinion varies from yours?

phyzix525 · 11-06-2003, 12:20 PM

I can't see how anyone who liked the matrix for its mind blowing plot could enjoy of dumbed down and simple this movie was. It should have left half of the people leaving the seats and saying what the hell just happened. It had the potental to being one of the most creative movies since the original matrix. Instead it was CGs battle scenes, and pointless talking that had you taken it out would not have changed the movie. Yes it was all cool and it was a good movie, but by what standards? It was great compared to what else has been released this season but not compared to the first or second movies.

phyzix525 · 11-06-2003, 12:26 PM

I don't care if you all liked it or hated it, its not one of those threads, I am just curious what people have come up with as to why Smith is able to live in Bane when Smith is only a program. Does Neo only have powers against the Machines, cause he was getting his ass handed to him by Bane. Can't he remember any of that kung fu shit when hes not plugged in? Was this answered in the movie and I was just asleep or something?

Jack Ruby · 11-06-2003, 12:48 PM

Well apparently the series assumes that the human mind and the Machines' computer systems are cross-compatible. The Matrix can upload information to someone's brain (all the people who are plugged in), so who is to say a brain, when connected to the Matrix (as Bane was when he got 'infected'), can't be altered so severely that someone's personality stays changed, even when he or she is unplugged ? I think this is what happened.

Neo can't do the cool Kung Fu because everything he does in the Matrix is based on mental capacity, not physical capacity. In the Matrix, you are bound by the rules of the Matrix and your own mind. In the real world, you are bound by physics and the limitations of your own body.

Lasereth · 11-06-2003, 01:12 PM

Well, it seems that maybe I got a little too patronising about Revolutions. Sorry if I insulted anyone...I seem to get my own opinions confused with facts about the movie that are wrong.

So, after this initial apology, on to the second half of my previous statement: some people are saying Revolutions sucks because of plot events that don't actually happen in the movie. Someone mentioned that Agents are based on rules like in the first one. Why is Smith able to combat Neo and not get his ass kicked then? Because Smith isn't an Agent anymore. This was firmly established in Reloaded. Smith is a virus now who is beyond the rules of agents.

Quote:

The function of the One is now to return to the source, allowing a temporary dissemination of the code you carry, reinserting the prime program. After which you will be required to select from the matrix 23 individuals, 16 female, 7 male, to rebuild Zion. Failure to comply with this process will result in a cataclysmic system crash killing everyone connected to the matrix, which coupled with the extermination of Zion will ultimately result in the extinction of the entire human race.

Pretty big news. In "Revolutions" barely a word is spoken about any of this. In the end, "Revolutions" settles down to a fairly explicit Christian allegory, but even here the Wachowski brothers are confused: Neo is a warrior and if you strip out the symbols, he resembles Muhammad as much as Christ.

The Architect did explain this in Reloaded, and it is how the past Matrices have worked. But at the end of Reloaded, Neo made the decision that no other anomaly has made: the right hand door that saved Trinity. Taking the left door is what leads to the 23 individuals rebuilding Zion. This was explained in Reloaded as well...taking the right hand door makes things different. Trinity was saved and Zion has only one option: to defend. No individuals will be chosen to rebuild Zion. At the end of Revolutions, the Matrix is built again, but things are different: the machines enlisted Neo's help to stop Smith from taking over both worlds. That's why it ended different than the rest of the previous Matrices.

Like I said earlier, sorry if I degraded anyone else's opinion...I tend to get caught up in things that I believe in.

Your opinion matters as much as mine does. I simply feel obligated to correct information that is presented falsely, especially when it's the basis of why someone says a movie sucks.

-Lasereth

11-05-2003, 05:12 PM	#161 (permalink)
Moskie Pure Chewing Satisfaction Location: can i use bbcode [i]here[/i]?	http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...threadid=34561 __________________ Greetings and salutations.

11-05-2003, 06:48 PM	#163 (permalink)
Solitude Tilted Location: LA and Orange Counties	I WANT MY MONEY BACK! My advice to everyone who hasn't seen it: Wait for it to come to video. If you loved Lost In Space, then you'll love this movie, too. It's all eye candy. Someone was saying on the way out of the theatre, "So wait.. you're telling me that Darth Vader was Neo's father!?" Two of the other guys I watched it with asked for their money back. I should have done the same. This movie was all the crap they pulled out of the Recycle Bin after being cut out of the the first two movies. Then they added a lot of splashing around in the rain, threw in some scenes from The Adventures of Superman and viola! Another box office smash. Two hours of my life I'll never get back. I say two hours, because the movie was 2:09 long. Yeah, there were a couple good scenes, but ... far overshadowed by the garbage. __________________ Champagne for my real friends... and real pain for my sham friends.

11-05-2003, 06:54 PM	#165 (permalink)
Solitude Tilted Location: LA and Orange Counties	I'm so upset that I have to post again. If you have any inclination to see this movie, just pull out a dvd of the first Matrix and watch that again. If you already bought tickets, get your money back. If someone else is buying your ticket, ... well... I'd make a polite excuse such as "I have to hang up Christmas lights tonight." Good luck. I know you can escape from watching The Matrix. I BELIEVE IN YOU! __________________ Champagne for my real friends... and real pain for my sham friends.

11-05-2003, 06:55 PM	#166 (permalink)
Marburg Crazy Location: Nova Scotia, Canada	Wait... How is the war over? They didn't free ANYONE in the 3rd movie... __________________ Ask a simple question... get pain.

11-05-2003, 07:11 PM	#169 (permalink)
Marburg Crazy Location: Nova Scotia, Canada	Wah! I was so set on buying all three dvds when they came out in a set. But, I don't know now. It'll just remind me of how disappointed I was... __________________ Ask a simple question... get pain.

11-05-2003, 05:40 PM	#162 (permalink)
dragon2fire Junkie	please do a serch b4 posting

11-05-2003, 06:52 PM	#164 (permalink)
ShadowWraith Crazy	SPOILERS I felt totally let down. First, trinity and neo both die, what the hell?! trinity's death was totally pointless because its not like neo went on a revenge-inspired rampage and he made no references to her during his fight with smith, and in fact after a few minutes of crying he seemed to get over it pretty quickly. Second, there was little of the small-scale combat the original two had. After the gun battle in the club and the last kung fu scene the rest of it was all large scale tracers flying, tentacles stabbing, kinda thing. Third, there were so many inconsistencies and unfinished subplots, some of which can be listed here . Finally, the whole philosophical build-up the 1st and 2nd built up was wasted. Bleh, i give it a 6/10

11-05-2003, 07:06 PM	#168 (permalink)
supersix2 Insane Location: Houston	I'm sad because of my speculation about the deeper meanings and all the cool things that "are going to happen in Revolutions," were lost thoughts and energy. I really think that the Wachowski brothers are laughing at everyone who thought the Matrix was about something more than people fighting machines. Really, thats all it was. Humans vs Machines. Just like any other sci-fi movie ever made. I still enjoyed the movie because I quickly realized that it was just another sci-fi movie about a future human race battling machines. The action was good, the special effects were crazy, and finally it ended the war. The story-line of the war is over and therefore the story is over. Oh well the Matrix really wasn't about anything. I'm over it.

11-05-2003, 07:13 PM	#170 (permalink)
Sparhawk Dubya Location: VA	Underwhelmed seems to be the prevalent feeling here, and I unfortunately join them. I didn't have that "Star Wars Episode I" optimism going into it, so I'm not totally pissed off. I just feel like they spent WAY the fuck too much time on that battle scene that could have been better spent seeing people we actually CARED about, like morpheus, trinity, neo doing shit, instead of watching the kid tripping, the general frothing at the mouth, and the black chick LOADING AMMO for crying out loud... yawn __________________ "In Iraq, no doubt about it, it's tough. It's hard work. It's incredibly hard. It's - and it's hard work. I understand how hard it is. I get the casualty reports every day. I see on the TV screens how hard it is. But it's necessary work. We're making progress. It is hard work."

11-05-2003, 07:17 PM	#171 (permalink)
supersix2 Insane Location: Houston	Its only disappointing if you try to search for a deeper meaning. When in reality there is none. Just remember, its only a movie. I mean in all three movies the special effects were groundbreaking, the fight scenese were suspensful and the plot had some interesting twists.

11-05-2003, 08:13 PM	#172 (permalink)
Lasereth Knight of the Old Republic Location: Winston-Salem, NC	SPOILERS This movie is absolutely amazing. I have to say that it wasn't as good as Reloaded (easily the best of the trilogy) but it was on-par with the first one. If you liked Reloaded (understood it and was willing to accept a change in the series) then you'll LOVE Revolutions. If you hated Reloaded, you'll hate Revolutions. It's as simple as that. The ending was the best possible ending for the trilogy. New Matrix, but this time it's different -- if you want out, then you come out without the machines killing you. In other words, you can be freed without restriction. Of course Neo dies...what's the whole trilogy been setting up? Neo had to die else the Christ imagery from the first two wouldn't fit in right. The battle for Zion scene was incredible. I've never seen CG that good, not even in Reloaded. As Ebert said, directors have finally breached the wall of "that looks good, but it still looks fake." The Hammer flying through the tunnels with Niobe piloting was amazing as well. Damn, damn damn. The only gripe I have about the movie is the Neo vs Smith fight...it wasn't as good as I hoped it to be. But ya know, after seeing such a perfect ending to the trilogy, I can't complain too much. Everything that I wanted to happen happened. I think the acting in this one might have been the best out of the trilogy as well. It was great when Morpheus said "No, the honor is still mine" when Neo and Trinity were leaving to go to the machine city. Now that the trilogy is over, I'm proud to say that it's my favorite sci-fi trilogy ever, even moreso than the first Star Wars movies. This is cinematic film-making at its best...and the only people that can disagree are just looking for reasons to say this movie sucks. It seems that the new fad in Hollywood is to diss the Matrix movies as much as possible. Go ahead, say they suck, but the true fans who had hope and were willing to accept a change in the series will always be proud of what the Wachowski Brothers have accomplished. I honestly don't think I'll see anything as mindbreaking and revolutionary as this trilogy. -Lasereth __________________ "A Darwinian attacks his theory, seeking to find flaws. An ID believer defends his theory, seeking to conceal flaws." -Roger Ebert

11-05-2003, 08:49 PM	#173 (permalink)
Atomsk Crazy	i wasn't amazed as i would have hoped i would be. mostly i felt like they toned down neo's powers since the first one. remember how fast he was when he came back to life at the end of part 1? so naturally he would have gotten better as time went on right? he seemed to have gotten slower in reloaded. ultimately i seemed to me that they didn't quite keep the flow of the series. the opening scene with the two programs and their daughter is completely useless. i mean what the fuk is that? what a waste of my life. if they actually went somewhere with it like i was hoping they would. basically all they did was "look we're both programs and we had a baby!" that was it. if they said something good like "the one is a program that is created and put in a human" that would have blowen my fukin mind!!! like neo was a baby program just like like all the other ones and he was put in that body?!?! but no just "check it out we had a baby!" crap. what was the point of that? LOL. anyway i didn't really dig how they had to go greek tragidy in the end and kill off neo and trinity. or is neo really dead? i mean smith took him over and then went to the source where neo was jacked in? i'm thinking thats what killed smith.... not sure about that one. but in the end smith ate the oracle and she was back again. so neo?...... it was kind of a letdown in the end i guess. did anyone else notice the little the crap like the child program that really doesn't have any purpose to the plot? i did read some speculation about how the child would be the oracles successor. which seems odd since she wouldn't need one being a program and all. unless the original wanted a different type of oracle for the peacetime that was upon them. anyway just puttin gin my 2 cents

11-05-2003, 08:56 PM	#174 (permalink)
fuhrerhat Tilted	See, I agree that it was a really entertaining movie, and that it wrapped up the series beautifully. However, the subplots and philosophy were just sort of thrown out the window. For example, what happened to 'Merv'? Mr. French was easily the most deep character in the entire series, and the second movie alluded to him being either the essence of the Matrix, or a previous 'one'. __________________ Shazbot

11-05-2003, 09:02 PM	#176 (permalink)
gwr_gwir Crazy	after watching it... a few things come to mind. DUNE - the first one, and Dune Messiah. Dragonball Z. End of Evangelion. Ozymandias. That is all for now, as most other people have gone over and rehashed their opinions enough for me. __________________ Being intelligent is not a felony. But most societies evaluate it as at least a misdemeanor. -- Robert Heinlein

11-05-2003, 10:37 PM	#178 (permalink)
Kurant Junkie Location: Don't worry about it.	The Matrix = uber Reloaded = Semi booty Revolutions = complete and utter ass

11-05-2003, 11:16 PM	#179 (permalink)
GakFace Go Ninja, Go Ninja Go!! Location: IN, USA	You guys put too much detailed expectations into the movie that no wonder it seems like a downfall. I don't campare movies to movies.. especially when they are all in a series!! I for one will stand up and say... GO SEE THIS MOVIE. Screw seeing it on DVD, I plan on going BACK to the theaters to see it again. I found nothing that wasn't answered Either. again I say to those who haven't seen it.. GO SEE IT!!! __________________ RoboBlaster: Welcome to the club! Not that I'm in the club. And there really isn'a a club in the first place. But if there was a club and if I was in it, I would definitely welcome you to it.

11-06-2003, 12:31 AM	#182 (permalink)
Kyp Insane Location: Oregon	I thought the movie rocked. People who say that there aren't answers are just blind and apparently need a bright flashing neon sign infront of their eyes that say it. The plotholes people are mentioning aren't plotholes, they would have to be seperate plots on their own, they're just mentioned in the movie. What is everyones problem with this movie? The ending was fine, just because it wasn't what you wanted you complain and bitch? If it was what you were wanting and expecting then you'd complain and bitch that it was so guessable and all that. Just watch the movie for what it is, entertainment. I was very entertained. In the great words of Maximus - Are you not entertained?!!?! __________________ When life gives you lemons, sqeeze the juice into a squirt gun and shoot people in the eyes

11-06-2003, 12:55 AM	#183 (permalink)
Nikilidstrom Stick it in your five hole! Location: Michigan, USA	But i wasn't entertained. I wanted to see the characters that the Wachowski Bros spent 4 years and two movies trying to make us care about, not the few bit players introduced a few months ago. While the visuals were amazing, the end fight seen was just week compared to just about any in the previous 2 films. I thought I was watching an episode of Dragonball Z. And since everything that made The Matrix and Reloaded more entertaining than your standard sci-fi flik occured in the matrix, they probably should have spent more than a few fleeting moments there in the finally. I have to admit, while i sit and think about this, I'm not quite as disappointed as I was immediately after watching Revolutions. The majority of my questions were answered, and the plot points were tied up, however weakly, except for a few minor inconsistencies which shouldn't show up between 2 movies shot at the same time. But to have a hero who has been built up over the 2 movies like Neo has take an ass whipping from his arch nemesis in the final battle, especially after he has lost the woman he loves, and the fate of humanity is in his hands, just doesn't sit well with me, even if he does technically win in the end and complete his purpose. When he rose the last time and told Smith it was because he chose to, I though for sure that he was about to open the family size can of woopass, but no, it was not to be. The entire film just felt very anti-climactic.

11-06-2003, 01:19 AM	#184 (permalink)
Mr.Deflok Blood + Fire Location: New Zealand	I was completely amazed by this film! Reloaded for me was ok, but it was all over the place and took style over substance, Revolutions is quite frankly an epic. Baring a few lines of cheesey humour this film stands up extremely well. Agent Smith vs. Neo in the rain was not only a feat of remarkable special effects and choreography but it was perhaps one of the most Epic battles I have ever seen put on film. I absolutely loved it, I'll be going to watch the film again on Saturday, can't wait! BTW, to the person who said Neo got over Trin's death too quick, you'd have noticed that Neo was in a state of "I don't give a fuck about anything, let me fulfill my purpose so I can die already".

11-06-2003, 06:51 AM	#186 (permalink)
TheKak Insane Location: Virginia	People are complaining about the questions not being answered, even though you can come up with your own answers that should fit nicely all on your own if you take a few minutes to sit and think about it. The Matrix trilogy didnt bring up any new philisophical questions, it just re-asked a few and left it at that, its up to you to find your own answers. __________________ Roses are red, violets are blue, I'm a schizophrenic and so am I.

11-06-2003, 06:52 AM	#187 (permalink)
phyzix525 Psycho Location: Broken Arrow, OK	I am not real sure what to think about the movie. First of all I wanted it to be a total mindfuck. But it ended up being easy to understand for all the dumb masses. I wanted a better explination for Neo having powers in the real world. I would have liked to see a different reason for the matrix. Batteries just don't seem to work well enough for me when machines have fusion power. Or even solar power. It did not seem like it was really all that hard to go above the clouds. I wanted a better reason as to why Agent smith was able to exist in a human in the real world if he was just a program. I didn't get how Neo had these great powers now in the real world to kill machines but gets his ass kicked by bane. Trinity dieing was ok, but I wanted to see Neo get some revenge for it. get all gladiator on their ass. I wanted to see more of the matrix world, more kung fu, more of the MERV. Especially his wife. YOW!! Anyone notice the nipple tweeker in the S&M club? It was a good movie, I just had so much more anticipated for it. __________________ It's hard to remember we're alive for the first time It's hard to remember we're alive for the last time It's hard to remember to live before you die It's hard to remember that our lives are such a short time It's hard to remember when it takes such a long time

11-06-2003, 06:57 AM	#188 (permalink)
Stare At The Sun Eh? Location: Somewhere over the rainbow	The whole dragon ball Z fight scene seriously pissed me off, and the fact that they focused so much on other people than Neo/trin and morph... The club fight scene BLEW. For one big reason in my book, the music, was gawd awful. Think about the first one, how the lobby fight scene, the music, everytime still gets me into that scene, but in that club scene, it was so damn dry, didnt get me into it at all. However, the outfits were quite fitting of a goth/industrial club. Also, I like Reloaded a lot, however, Revolutions left me feeling empty, and dissapointed. Just my .02, but i think this movie was awful, 1.5/5 stars...

11-06-2003, 08:31 AM	#189 (permalink)
dragonhawk Psycho Location: In Games.	SPOILERS Okay here are my thoughts on this guys take and questions::: Even though "Revolutions" takes place only in the span of a few hours immediately following "Reloaded," some of our characters have taken, quite suddenly, to using informal nicknames with one another, such as "Merv" and "Trin." *Gotta give him this one* In "The Matrix" we were told that agents must obey the physical laws inherent in the matrix. Morpheus says, "Men have emptied entire clips at them and hit nothing but air, yet their strength and their speed are still based in a world that is built on rules. Because of that, they will never be as strong or as fast as you can be." Not anymore. In "Revolutions," Agent Smith can do everything Neo can. *We find out that Smith takes on part of anyone he absorbs, (The Oracle eyes for instance) He and Neo had joined code before. Since Smith had taken over the WHOLE Matrix by the last fight, he had taken on all of the weird stuff too (Vampires, Merv, etc.) He just grew new powers.* In "Revolutions" we meet computer programs who feel love and appreciate karma, but later we're assured that machines always keep their word, since betrayal is a human trait. *Nope, the Arcitect said that. The Oracle had already said he only sees things as code, variables, etc. He wouldn't have "human traits" * Neo survives being driven into concrete so forcefully that he creates a 30-foot crater. (The wonderful site Insultingly Stupid Movie Physics will have a field day with "Revolutions.") Yet what finally fells him is a punch to the gut. There may still be some rules in the matrix governing Neo, but they appear and disappear arbitrarily. *Duh, they are in a video game where they can change the rules. Deal with it. They punch wasn't a punch either. Smith was interfacing with Neo at that point.* When confronted with a single sentinel in "The Matrix," a frightened Trinity tells Neo that the electromagnetic pulse is mankind's only weapon against these devilish devices. In "Revolutions," simple machine guns prove quite effective and all ships seem to be equipped with them. Is this a small inconsistency? Yes, except that it makes the tension of the closing minutes in "The Matrix" a complete contrivance. *Gotta give them this one too... I would have built EMPs in every freaking tunnel between me and the machines* The same can be said for the process of jacking in and out of the matrix. In the first movie, much of the drama concerns finding safe lines to jump into and out of the matrix. This process has become such an afterthought in "Revolutions" that jacking in is done smoothly, quickly, and always off-screen. *It was cool at one point. Been there, done that, move one* The list of glaring inconsistencies goes on. *Let's hear them* Worse still, is the way "Revolutions" abandons the larger thematic issues. The climactic moment in "Reloaded" comes when Neo meets the Architect and learns that Morpheus has his chronology wrong, that there have been several matrixes and Zions. The Architect then gives a long mathematical explanation of what Neo is: Your life is the sum of a remainder of an unbalanced equation inherent to the programming of the matrix. You are the eventuality of an anomaly, which despite my sincerest efforts I have been unable to eliminate from what is otherwise a harmony of mathematical precision. While it remains a burden assiduously avoided, it is not unexpected, and thus not beyond a measure of control. Which has led you, inexorably, here. … The function of the One is now to return to the source, allowing a temporary dissemination of the code you carry, reinserting the prime program. After which you will be required to select from the matrix 23 individuals, 16 female, 7 male, to rebuild Zion. Failure to comply with this process will result in a cataclysmic system crash killing everyone connected to the matrix, which coupled with the extermination of Zion will ultimately result in the extinction of the entire human race. Pretty big news. In "Revolutions" barely a word is spoken about any of this. In the end, "Revolutions" settles down to a fairly explicit Christian allegory, but even here the Wachowski brothers are confused: Neo is a warrior and if you strip out the symbols, he resembles Muhammad as much as Christ. *Not completely Christian. These movies take a lot from Gnostic Christianity, Budisim, etc. He didn't do all of his research*** UnlikedOne, the audio in our theater was strange too. Some parts were NOT LOUD ENOUGH, and others (like the Machine Head) I could barley understand I liked the movie. 3.5 / 5 stars. __________________ ---------------------------------------------- "Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter." Rev. Martin Luther King, Jr.

11-06-2003, 08:36 AM	#190 (permalink)
diergray Psycho	This series reminds me of Highlander. It started with a brilliant premise and then just lost its way. I disagree with people who say the answers are there. There were too many interesting ideas setup in the second movie for me to understand how they could have taken the third movie in the direction that they did. Oh well, just like with Highlander you watch the first one and ignore the rest. And then hope that they will make a cool TV series based on the original. __________________ "Behold the turtle. He makes progress only when he sticks his neck out.” ~ James Bryant Conant

11-06-2003, 10:34 AM	#191 (permalink)
punx1325 Junkie Location: San Diego	I thought it was very well done. I like the way it ended, the fight scenes were awesome. And the toned down use of CGNeo made me happy. __________________ If something seems too good to be true, then it probably is....

11-06-2003, 10:54 AM	#192 (permalink)
MSD The sky calls to us ... Super Moderator Location: CT	I loved the battle scenes, and the Neo/Smith fight was great. The ending, however, sucked. BIT OF A SPOILER AHEAD: Here's the way I thought it should have ended: I would have ended shortly after the machines dragged Neo's body away by showing the beginning of the first movie (him waking up in front of the computer,) but with the little girl waking up in front of the computer instead of him.

11-06-2003, 10:59 AM	#193 (permalink)
Nikilidstrom Stick it in your five hole! Location: Michigan, USA	Now that I have slept on it, I guess I feel that together, Relaoded and Revolutions make one hell of a movie. But it just seems that they stuffed everything I loved about this series into Reloaded, leaving nothing much but leftovers for Revolutions once they were split up. I do still disagree with anyone that believes the questions presented from Reloaded were not answered. And I don't mind the actual answers either, even though they were pretty much given to you in Reloaded by the Architect, with the only difference being Zion didnt have to be destroyed this time around. I just didn't like the method used to answer those questions. To me it just seemed like such a build up in Reloaded, that the entire Revolutions was downhill. And the final fight looked good, but just lacked substance and a climactic ending. Anywho, this looks like one of those fliks that you either love it or you hate it, so love or hate on people

11-06-2003, 11:05 AM	#194 (permalink)
Jack Ruby Psycho Location: Belgium	I am appalled at some of the comments I've heard. Everyone seems to think that all the pre-release hype (which really wasn't that bad, all things considered) about a movie justifies completely driving it into the ground after its release. The Wachowski brothers cannot make a movie that caters to everyone's expectations. So they have made a series of movies that explore different things (philosophy, combat, action, allegory) while providing some of the most adrenaline-filled cinematic effects and action scenes in the genre. Revolutions is no different. Granted, there are a few annoyances that struck me during the viewing. Mainly, one factor that was out of the hands of the directors : a different actress taking over the role of the Oracle, previously played by Gloria Foster, who died during production. I get the feeling most of the Oracle scenes, including the ending, would have had a far greater impact had the character been played by the original actress. But hey. The small technical inconcistencies and details don't interest me that much. The fact that Neo can now survive plummeting to the ground (creating a 30 ft. hole in the process) does bother me, though, as it poses the question - why do Smith and Neo bother fighting as seemingly neither one of them can be killed by physical force ? I was left kind of confused about certain aspects of the film, though maybe a second or third viewing will take care of that. Specifically, the whole reason why Neo can control Machines in the real word is still a mystery to me. Also, I'm not entirely sure just how Neo succeeded in destroying all the Smiths. Which is odd, since I usually have an eye for the unstated in movies... but maybe I was just overwhelmed by all the good things in this movie. The battle scenes, for example. The fight at the Dock was quite possibly the most amazingly cool battle sequence I've seen in a science fiction setting. It seems to be very politically correct these days to say special effects are just eye candy that can't cover up a badly produced movie, and I guess that's true, but FUCK ME. The special effects are half of what makes this movie (and the entire series) great, but that's not a bad thing. So much hype was created around the highway chase scene in Reloaded, but the scene at the docks is definetely the most impressive one in the trilogy, IMO. I actually enjoyed the allegorical and semi-philosophical aspect. I can't tell you why, I just did. For some reason I had immediate sympathy for the Indian program guy. The confrontation between Neo and the 'sentinel face' in the machine city (and the whole scene leading up to it, culminating in the first time Trinity sees the sun outside of simulation) was pretty farking cool as well. Ultimately, without trying to be an apologist for the Matrix (because I never really got excited about the first movie and was disappointed with the second), I think what matters is this : When the credits rolled and the lights went on, I was overwhelmed at how good this movie was, and immediately wanted to see it again. I'd give it 85 out of 100 now, though that may chance after a few more viewings. I love it, and though the ending did leave something to be desired, I think it's a great conclusion to the series. Conclusion : Matrix Revolutions > Jesus. __________________ You don't know what you don't know. Last edited by Jack Ruby; 11-06-2003 at 11:08 AM..

11-06-2003, 11:10 AM	#195 (permalink)
Destrox Metal and Rock 4 Life Location: Phoenix	Without going into some massive post, I'll just keep it simple. If you can manage to have a damn mind of your own, you will like this movie. This trilogy was a excellent set of movies, that did some U-turns midway thru. If you cant deal with this, you should stick to PG movies where everything is spelled out. 4/5 Revolutions 4/5 Overall __________________ You bore me.... next.

11-06-2003, 11:15 AM	#196 (permalink)
Nikilidstrom Stick it in your five hole! Location: Michigan, USA	I guess my question is, whether you liked this movie or not, why do you have to be insulting while expressing your opinion? Most of the people here, for or against the film, seem to "get it." So what is the point of questioning their maturity or mental compacity just because their opinion varies from yours?

11-06-2003, 12:20 PM	#197 (permalink)
phyzix525 Psycho Location: Broken Arrow, OK	I can't see how anyone who liked the matrix for its mind blowing plot could enjoy of dumbed down and simple this movie was. It should have left half of the people leaving the seats and saying what the hell just happened. It had the potental to being one of the most creative movies since the original matrix. Instead it was CGs battle scenes, and pointless talking that had you taken it out would not have changed the movie. Yes it was all cool and it was a good movie, but by what standards? It was great compared to what else has been released this season but not compared to the first or second movies. __________________ It's hard to remember we're alive for the first time It's hard to remember we're alive for the last time It's hard to remember to live before you die It's hard to remember that our lives are such a short time It's hard to remember when it takes such a long time

11-06-2003, 12:26 PM	#198 (permalink)
phyzix525 Psycho Location: Broken Arrow, OK	Matrix revolutions. Bane/smith questions. I don't care if you all liked it or hated it, its not one of those threads, I am just curious what people have come up with as to why Smith is able to live in Bane when Smith is only a program. Does Neo only have powers against the Machines, cause he was getting his ass handed to him by Bane. Can't he remember any of that kung fu shit when hes not plugged in? Was this answered in the movie and I was just asleep or something? __________________ It's hard to remember we're alive for the first time It's hard to remember we're alive for the last time It's hard to remember to live before you die It's hard to remember that our lives are such a short time It's hard to remember when it takes such a long time

11-06-2003, 12:48 PM	#199 (permalink)
Jack Ruby Psycho Location: Belgium	Well apparently the series assumes that the human mind and the Machines' computer systems are cross-compatible. The Matrix can upload information to someone's brain (all the people who are plugged in), so who is to say a brain, when connected to the Matrix (as Bane was when he got 'infected'), can't be altered so severely that someone's personality stays changed, even when he or she is unplugged ? I think this is what happened. Neo can't do the cool Kung Fu because everything he does in the Matrix is based on mental capacity, not physical capacity. In the Matrix, you are bound by the rules of the Matrix and your own mind. In the real world, you are bound by physics and the limitations of your own body. __________________ You don't know what you don't know.