bubonico

Hi TFP. I enjoy reading here and have respect for the community as a whole, but I don't post often 'cause I guess I don't feel like I have much to contribute. Ummmmm I'm wanting some advice at this point though.

My girlfriend and I are usually very happy and love one another immensely. The problem we have is that she has a tendency to withdraw from me under certain circumstances. If I have an emotional day or am ever just depressed for a couple days she recoils from me. I don't get like that often, but it hurts me because I feel like when I need her most she isn't there for me. I know she loves me but it's easy to get insecure when she withdraws from me suddenly.

She also withdraws pretty heavily if or when we have any sort of relationship issues or have heavy things to discuss. She seems entirely unwilling to deal with things of that nature. She knows that when she avoids things they only get worse, but it's almost as though she can't help it. It's frustrating and hard, but I love her very much and am fully willing to deal with it.

It's like one week she's enamored with me and can't wait to get married, have kids and all that jazz, then we hit a speed bump of some sort and she wants nothin to do with me. (not really that bad, but it's how I feel sometimes) She's well aware of the problem and hates it as much or more than I do. The thing is what can we do about it? Do I have to just cope with it and ride it out, or are their ways to treat/help this sort of thing.

She was in a relationship with a guy twice her age who was very controlling and just not very nice from the ages of 12-16 and I think that may be the cause of her behavior. It's like she's developed a defense mechanism. I feel like such a piece of crap when I have a defense mechanism sprung on me. It makes me wonder if I act like the dickhead from her past. It makes me search inside for what I'm doing wrong and makes me want to try harder, but those things just seem to push her further away.

I can always tell when she's about to recoil. It starts in a minor way from something small. If just totally avoid that small thing and we don't discuss problems it never really becomes an issue. The thing is I can't really let things like that fester. It has gotten to the point though that I am scared to share my feelings with her sometimes. I always do but it always causes a withrdrawal which always causes me to have more things to discuss and more shitty feelings which always causes a further withdrawal. It's a ruthless cycle.

Sometimes I wonder if my fear of the withdrawal causes the withdrawal. Is that a possiblity? I've noticed that I usually feel it coming on, but I don't know if it's something I sense in her, or if it's the situation, or if perhaps the way I act when I become scared that she's gonna withdraw from me causes it. I don't think I consciously act different, but we know eachother very well and can pick up on things like that. I'm sure it's more complex than any one of those things.

Okay well if anybody has any experience with this sort of thing or any general advice it would be greatly appreciated. There's a good chance that I just need to deal with this sort of thing on my own, but if nothing else it's good to write things out to organize my thoughts. If you need specific details I'm fully willing to provide insight into the specifics of my relationship but for the sake of clarity I've omitted those for now.

PS I'm in a relationship of the long distance variety, if that matters. I think it plays a role. She has said that in past relationships it wasn't as big of a deal because she was unable to avoid the person she was with. With me she can just not write me back or not answer the phone. God damn that hurts by the way.

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randomness

I have a tendency to do this as well. For me, at least, it has nothing to do with anything the boy is doing. It's my own random hangups/issues. I would suggest being kind and supportive during the withdrawls (and always). When she is being normal, I would also suggest telling her that you like the way she is acting. She's most likely not secure in the fact that you like her and randomly gets worried about it. At least that's my issues and I tend to act the same way as her. Hope that helps?

Nisses

I agree with randomness on the part that you might wanna give some feedback when she is acting normally.

But to me this does not sound like a defense-mechanism, more like a lack of maturity in that she can't step up to the parts that might require some effort or aren't the most comfortable.

If you can't talk, then the relationship is seriously impaired, and if you're long-distance, it's even a bigger problem.

If she knows it's a problem, then it's up to her to do something about it. I can't see you talking her into this.

(and I can imagine it must hurt, especially when you hit a bit of a down in your own mood)


One thing I don't understand though... her previous was twice her age, and you talk of ages 12-16... Are you telling me she was dating a 30yo at the age of 14-15??

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shesus

A few things stick out about your story. First, she dated a guy twice her age when she was a teenager and on top of that he was controlling. That is a major issue playing in this relationship. The age thing isn't the major problem, but the controlling is. I was in a very contrrolling relationship once and it did a number of things to me including lowering self-esteem and making me withdraw from situations. You need to be patient and talk to her, which considering your situation is difficult. This brings me to the other issue. Long-distance relationships are tough. I was in one of those too and it ended badly. It is difficult being left back home not knowing what is going on with the other person. I'm sure, taken her past, that she has trust issues because of low self-esteem. Unfortunately, there is really nothing you can do but keep telling her how much you love her. She will either come to terms with this or she will not. She really needs to make an honest effort to change and she has to make the decision to change on her own. I do not envy your situation. I wish you the best of luck!

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lurkette

Chances are she learned avoidance as a relationship coping mechanism with the controlling older man - much easier to avoid confrontation than to face his wrath and displeasure. Chances are the seeds of this tendency were already there long before she met him, but that just solidified it, and as uncomfortable as this pattern is, it's familiar and she seeks it out and repeats it. Was she abused in any way? What is her relationship with her parents like?

It might be helpful if you could point out that by avoiding things in your relationship she's not reacting to your current situation but to a situation in the past. And while that reaction might have been protective back then, it's hurting your relationship now.

The other thing that would be helpful is for you to not take it personally. She just has a pattern of relating that is pretty set, and you just walked in to be plugged into the script. If you can deal with this without getting upset, it'll give her a lot more freedom to change how she relates to you. The "searching inside and trying harder" maybe just put more pressure on her, or make her feel bad for hurting you. The less emotional you can make the situation, the better. I can't remember where I heard this but someone told me about a couple that had been married for 50 years, and they argued all the time, but their ground rules were that no matter how they fought, they both understood that the relationship was never at stake in the argument - neither of them was going to leave if things didn't turn out their way. It might be helpful for her if you told her gently, when you need to discuss something that she's avoiding, that this is not a relationship-breaker, it's just something that you need to discuss because it's making you uncomfortable.

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MEAD

If you are bummed and she can't be there for you, that's enough said. You shouldn't be expected to be supportive of her inablity to support you when you need it! That's BS to say that you should be understanding of her when you are at a low moment, you have enough to worry about.

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cptgreedle

My brother has been in many long-distance relationships. Enough to show me that I should avoid them at all costs. They can be confusing, emotionally difficult, and usually end in one or both members finding someone local. I am not saying this is the case with you, but it is not going to be easy if you want to keep this relationship going.
Often I've seen that my brother's "LDR"s (long distance relationships) have more bumps and turbulence than a local relationship. It may be because it is so difficult for the couple to meet and get attached physically as well. I say you should plan to meet with her often and find out if it is possible for one to move near the other.
However, it appears there are other issues as well, involving her past relationships. You can not compare your current relationship with her old relationship.
It is possible that she is not sure she wants to commit to a relationship due to the controlling one she had before. It is also possible she isn't ready yet.
Good luck with it. Just keep communicatoin open with her.

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motdakasha

When you "confront" her about the withdrawing, are you doing it after it has occurred or during?
It might help to call her on it when it's happening, but not accuse her of withdrawing or put her in a defensive mood, but say something like "I could use your support right now." "I need you to be here for me now."

I think when you try to "discuss" the issue with her, you might just be scaring her away even more in your approach. Sometimes people need to be directly called on their actions, other times, people need to work on the issue at hand before they can work on the underlying one. It depends on the person and the situation and I think you should pay more attention to what her feelings are when you present yours to her. Your way of expressing your feelings may not be what she's comfortable with. Try different approaches.

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bubonico

Thanks everybody for the advice. Lurkette I think you hit the nail on the head as far as your statement goes. Everybody else had helpful things to say as well of course. I think I do take it personally when she gets like that. Then she gets scared to hurt me worse so she withdraws even more, effectively hurting me worse. I also tend to always put a lot more effort into the relationship during hard times as well. I think I try to show her all the good things our relationship has to offer or something. It's not like I do it intentionally, but when we have problems I do try very hard. Intentionally or not I do end up putting undue pressure on her when she begins to withdraw. I’ll have to work on that.

I don’t believe she’s ever been abused really.

Her relationship with her parents is not the best. Her mom was pretty fucked up for a long time, and I think her relationship with her dad suffered during her teenage years due to her relationship with the older controlling guy.

Just FYI about the guy who may or may not have brought about this behavior in her, she was 12 and he was 26 when they first got together. Not that the age really matters, but some of you seemed curious and in my opinion somebody who has a sexual relationship with a 12 year old has got some issues.

It may be true that she’s just immature and needs to grow out of this or whatever. That would actually be fine in my opinion, I’d be more than happy to wait it out and have the problem resolve itself.

I don’t believe either of us fear the other will leave for someone else. We were friends for 7 years before ever starting a relationship. There’s a fair amount of trust between us. Besides that I’m in Iraq and not around many girls. But even when I’m in Germany she doesn’t ever really show signs that she’s afraid I’d ever cheat on her or anything.

I don’t think I ever really “confront” her about withdrawing. I more just get hurt, and she gets scared to hurt me. When we are getting along though we have talked about it of course. I do tend to have a hard time telling her if I think she’s doing something wrong. That’s probably something I need to work on as well. She does come to the conclusion on her own that withdrawal is no way to deal with problems. She seems willing to work on it, or try not to do it. She’s always very sorry once she manages to get through it, but it tends to just happen again. My main reason for starting the thread I guess was to just try to get some insight into how I should behave to help avoid it or help her grow out of it.

I’ve gotten some good insight thank you all. I think I already knew that when I get depressed/hurt when she gets like this it only exacerbates the situation.

By the way this isn’t an entirely common problem just a shitty one. It only happens every 2-3 months or so.

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"People sleep peacably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf" -George Orwell

Cimarron29414

Got some issues?!?! If pedophilia is an "issue", then yes, he has issues! You can't imagine the damage that could have been done by this predator. You should resist minimizing its effect on her.

Clearly, your girl has poor communication skills and you need to encourage her to climb out of her shell. Although not married, I would recommend the two of you reading this book:

<i>The Seven Principles for Making Marriage Work : A Practical Guide from the Country's Foremost Relationship Expert by John M. Gottman </i>

As you work through the exercises, you will begin to understand each other much better and realize why she is wired the way she is. The only rule is to be completely honest with one another and to concentrate on listening more than talking.

Best of luck.

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uptown

Some people intensely dislike conflict and all the drama that goes with it .Others have a history of being too impulsive with words that hurt and have been burned enough times to learn that it's prudent to hold your tongue till you've mulled the situation over.Still others are fairly calm, introverted types by nature but find that certain conflicts really put them into an inner turmoil.

I find typical relationship conflicts to be intently drama filled and far too draining to be indulged in on anywhere near a regular basis.I tend to be quiet and prefer my own company over going out/socializing Inevitably, I tend to attract men who seem hypersensitive to this and who interpert this as withdrawal/rejection or some sign that's something's wrong.

I dislike having every word/action/facial expression or voice tone/inflection examined under a magnifying glass and totally hate very small/minor issues being discussed to death, when these things happen it just makes me wish to actively shrink from the person doing it.

You want the cap put back on the toothpaste ? you'd prefer I not use your favorite bath towel, just say it straight out and I'll comply.

"We need to talk" is a phrase that some women cringe from too, save this only for bigger issues, for small things, short, sweet and to the point is far better !

bubonico

I can appreciate what you're saying uptown. A lot of times I probably do make bigger issues out of things than they need to be. I've never used the phrase "We need to talk" though. If I did I would probably not here from her for a week. This probably goes in line with what lurkette was saying. Which is that I just need to make situations less emotional in order for communication to be easier for her.

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"People sleep peacably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf" -George Orwell

Dragonknight

Man, this sounds familiar. My last relationship has a very large amount of similarities with this one. My girl at the time had a sexual relationship with an older man, and withdrew from any problem as well. Only in my case this happened any time we were angry, or when had a conversation that concerned us in depth (if more details are needed please let me know).

You see she was pulling away from any intense emotion she was experiencing. It was in part because of her fear of saying/doing something wrong to hurt the relationship, and in part because she was afraid to trust her feelings concerning the subject. No matter how I approached the subject she would pull away, because she knew it was concerning a subject that hurt/bothered me and one that hurt/bothered her.

We split up and stopped talking for about two years. She finally went to counseling and realized what she was doing, and now we both regret the decisions we made in the past. I say regret because I'm now married to a woman that I truly love and cherish, but I know that I will always love my ex as well.

Finally, my advice to you would be to get her into some kind of counseling. I approached our problem from every conceivable angle. I tried the patient thing. I'd tell her how much she meant to me, I'd tell her when I felt a "pulling away" moment coming and that we could get through it together. Hell I even tried to get angry with her and force her to talk to me ( not physically) , but with words and emotions. Nothing worked because you see her feelings toward me and about the situation were the very problem. I don't think this is something that just you and her can get through, I feel that you will need a third person i.e. a counselors help.

For your sake I hope that I'm wrong, and everything gets worked out. Hell I hope that at least one of the other's suggestions help, but if not then you have my advice. I've been in this situation before and know how it feels, just try and be patient. Also (I believe someone else mentioned this) remember that this is not an attack on your feelings or you, this is her own hang up she has to work through with your help.

Good luck with this.

photosoul

Ok,wow, this thread is about a year old, but I just came across it on google. I can totally relate to your girlfriend. I am in counseling right now and I chose to go b/c of this SAME EXACT ISSUE I had with my boyfriend. I always felt weird b/c usually the women in relationship are the ones who like to talk through everything and solve problems, whereas the men are the ones who withdraw into their "cave." So I've been in counseling for a few months now. It was really taking a toll on our relationship, and my situation goes back to my relationship with my dad. I feel like it's getting better for my boyfriend and I (he has been very patient and encouraging, but I know it's very frustrating for him as well). He's been supportive and I've been reading a few books about bonding and communication styles (bonding is a HUGE thing....she needs to feel at ease and secure to open up and when you "force" her to talk, she withdraws...I do the same thing). It's kinda like the whole "fight or flight" idea too. When conflict arises, she probably uses a defense mechanism that is deep-rooted.....and chooses "flight" or withdrawing instead of dealing with it. It's been a struggle for me/us but I'm learning more and trying to be more open and put my boyfriend's best interests ABOVE my choice to just shut off. I know it hurts him when I don't open up and don't choose to put the effort forth, but it's very hard when you come from a place where it's "natural" for you to react that way. So it's going to take a lot of work and a DEEP DESIRE to change and really hate what it does to your relationship...and it's going to take support and sensitivity and patience on your part. In my situation, my "emotional development" stopped maturing at around 19 or so (due to some family hardships) so I never really learned to open up and realize there is an in between ground.....in between withdrawing or fighting, there is conflict resolution. She may need some time to regain her thoughts if/when she's in a situation where she may withdraw. I know that for ME, I get that scared look and it's tough for me to think on the spot. I researched some symptoms of the fight or flight thing and a whole chemical reaction occurs in which we cannot think as well. I'd recommend just saying "i don't want us to fight but let's take a few minutes to calm down and we can talk about this again in 10 or 15 minutes." This MAY help b/c then she'd be more calm and have some TIME to regain her thoughts and not feel so on the spot. Anyways, not sure if this post is even gonna mean anything at this point....a year later..haha. Just thought I'd write it!

Sultana

Photosoul, I sincerely hope things work out for you. I'm glad to hear you are going to counseling for help.

I see more than a bit of myself in this type of situation. Like Uptown posted:
emphasis mine.

I know I tend to react this way under strong pressure. Part of it is a self-control issue. It's a way I can exhibit to myself and to others that they are not in control of the situation--I am. You can't argue with a person who won't talk back to you Unfortunately, you can still be yelled at.

Another part of it is feeling like no matter what you say short of an immediate, abject, 'prostrating yourself on the ground' apology every time, it's not going to satisfiy the other party. Which I can't help but see as a form of control--someone stomps their foot, imagines some slight, and it has to turn into a freaking drama-queen emotional bitch-slapping show before I can go on with my day, if there's any left afterwards.

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Shauk

ditch her. I'll tell you right now, after spending 4 1/2 years with someone like what you are describing, (yes, she loved me, and I loved her) (heck, might not even need to use that in past tense) but the relationship just gets poisonous when they wont even administer the simple cure of COMMUNICATION, and it has to be open communication, not forced.

pinning me ex in the bedroom with me at night and cornering into talking about things didn't really work out well, and I was often viewed as the bad guy for it..

but meh, what do I know?

photosoul

Thanks Sultana....things are looking up and I'm growing in an area where I never new I needed to grow (we were together a year before we realized what the problem really was). And no, forced communication does not work Shauk...I agree.