Budding Alcoholic - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

mayaj · 03-27-2006, 03:49 AM

I am 26 years old and have been a moderately heavy drinker since high school. My parents and siblings are heavy drinkers, in fact, most people in my family are. I think my parents could be described as functional alcoholics in that I've seen them sloppy drunk more than a few times but it doesn't affect their work at all or their relationships (all that much). I have always been a bit of a party girl and even took pride in my ability to drink colossal amounts of alchohol and outlast the rest of the guys. However, now that I want to start curbing my drinking I am realizing that I may have less control over it than I previously thought. In relationships I've usually taken a lot of flack from my boyfriends for drinking but never took them very seriously because I didn't care. I enjoyed partying very much and thought they were a little prusdish and controlling. However, now that I am in a serious relationship with someone I love I find that I can't stop drinking even for him. If we go out with our friends I reach a point where I can't be persuaded to go home. After finishing a bottle of wine, beer or drink I always want "just one more." I didn't used to black out but now parts of the evenings are starting to become hazy and I have started remembering things incorrectly or even making stuff up that didn't happen. I don't drink much alone and I certainly don't get drunk alone but this is starting to affect my health. I have hangovers for 2 days and sometimes even get rashes from going on benders. After a particulary sauced Saturday night my boyfriend was so mad at me that I was shocked. Shocked because I've done stupid drunk things in the past (nothing too terrible) but as far as I was concerned I thought I had behaved relatively normally. He told me I couldn't even walk and I realized I couldn't remember coming home.

I don't want to quit drinking. I really really enjoy it. I would hate to become a full blown alcoholic, if only because it would mean that I would have to quit cold turkey. However, I need to find a way to cut down. My health is suffering as well as my career and relationship. It seems like after 1 drink I'm OK but after 3 or 4 drinks I lose the ability to say no to alcohol and want to drink till I explode. Does anyone have practical tips on how to cut down? My body and life can't keep up with my drinking any more . . .

tecoyah · 03-27-2006, 04:09 AM

Chances are....you already are an alcoholic. Time to face reality dear.

Nisses · 03-27-2006, 04:26 AM

"now that I am in a serious relationship with someone I love I find that I can't stop drinking even for him"

"I didn't used to black out but now parts of the evenings are starting to become hazy and I have started remembering things incorrectly or even making stuff up that didn't happen"

"I always want 'just one more.'"

"I have hangovers for 2 days and sometimes even get rashes from going on benders."

Vote for reality check here as well... Sorry, but I'd say there's no "chances are that..." in this post. It just tells me you're already there.

maleficent · 03-27-2006, 05:35 AM

"My health is suffering as well as my career and relationship. "

You need to do more than cut down... you recognize that you've got a problem... Only you can get yourself to do something about it... You have to decide what's more important to you - the booze? or your health/career/relationships. It doesn't appear that you can have both.

Run, don't walk, to your physician and tell her/him everything you wrote above... heck print out the thread so you don't forget... You need help...

mayaj · 03-27-2006, 11:50 PM

Whoa. My life isn't in shambles. I don't wake up naked in strange places. I have never missed work because of a hangover. I don't drink when I walk in the door home from work. I am a binge drinker. I don't deny that this could get out of hand, however I don't think that it has yet. I have seen people change themselves without checking into rehab (which in my case would be very extreme). I was wondering if any reformed "partyers" had any practical advice that helped them. People who have managed to set limits for themselves which have worked.

Plummie · 03-28-2006, 03:04 AM

I would try to get down to the root cause of why you like drinking so much - it obviously isn't for emotionally healthy reasons. Are you drinking to deal with sadness or depression? To relieve yourself from boredom? Why? It's good that you are reaching out because it means you recognize that you have a problem.

If you are borderline alcoholic, now is the time to act. The longer you wait, the deeper it will grow and you could seriously hurt yourself or the ones you love in the end. Look into attending your local AA meetings, the program really works for a lot of people. You'll probably have to quit drinking cold turkey, or at least until you are able to regulate your drinking better (which could be months, or years from now, or never). Definitely make an appointment with your doctor and tell them everything. You'll need a support system to kick the habit, no matter how much you try and convince yourself you can do it alone. Best of luck to you, I know you can do it.

jwoody · 03-28-2006, 03:11 AM

To some this may seem like terrible advice - I'm just telling you what works for me.

Pick your day when you're going to get smashed and prepare for it.

Stay sober the night before, wake up early and have a hearty breakfast (the full English is my meal of choice).

Drink lots of liquids leading up to lunch time when you're going to have your second hearty meal of the day:

Lunch - You're looking for something stodgy which is going to fill you up. Mince and dumplings, pie and peas, mashed potato and something... any of those served with vegetables.

Some days I'll have a pint with lunch and continue the drinking from there. If I don't intend to continue drinking then it's strictly soft drinks only. Drinking - stopping drinking for a few hours - then drinking again is a recipe for disaster.

If it's an evening session, I'll probably have some sort of pasta meal before I go out, washed down with a bottle or two of imported Continental European lager.

When I'm out, I feel it's important to stick with the same drink all night (unless that drink happens to be vodka, in which case I'll limit myself to couple just before I go home).

If I feel myself getting too drunk too soon, I'll take a break and have couple of glasses of Coke to sort myself out.

You're welcome.

Cheers.

nezmot · 03-28-2006, 04:16 AM

Have you ever stuck around and watched someone else get drunk? It's disgusting. I've had friends and relationships with people who felt comfortable enough with me to drink themselves into a drunken state - and yes, that always wanting one more was exactly what they were like. I hated them when they were like that. I really did. Obnoxious, self-centred assholes the lot of them. And yet, when they were sober, they were perfectly normal, lovable human beings.

Change now - because what you're not aware of (or at least only now becoming aware of) is exactly how contemptable people are when they've had too many drinks. Yes it will ruin your relationships. After enough relationships have been thrown away, and age starts taking away your looks, you will have nothing except the drink to comfort you - THAT's the stage that we normally label people as alcoholics - the no-hopers for whom it's too late.

Want to find a limt? Find a place where you have had enough? The answer is to either measure yourself physically or mentally. I used to say that if I wasn't able to stand at a bar without wobbling - then I had drunk too much and it was time to go home. That was still probably too much. I'm sure you can think of a point where you believe you've had enough - and stick to it. Remember, most people hate a drunk. Most people will hate you, when you are drunk. That's loved ones, friends, aquaintances - anyone you're likely to meet.

I'm not holding back on these words, because they are the truth. If you don't like the truth, then consider finding your own limit.

maleficent · 03-28-2006, 04:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mayaj

Whoa. My life isn't in shambles. I don't wake up naked in strange places. I have never missed work because of a hangover. I don't drink when I walk in the door home from work. I am a binge drinker. I don't deny that this could get out of hand, however I don't think that it has yet. I have seen people change themselves without checking into rehab (which in my case would be very extreme). I was wondering if any reformed "partyers" had any practical advice that helped them. People who have managed to set limits for themselves which have worked.

Read back thru your original post and ask yourself honestly if you do not have a problem. You don't need to go into rehab, but when you are drinking the quantities that you are, to go cold turkey, might cause you some health problems and a doctor can help you.

Try not drinking for two weeks and see how you do...

jwoody · 03-28-2006, 05:00 AM

My final word: Move to England.

ratbastid · 03-28-2006, 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mayaj

Whoa. My life isn't in shambles. I don't wake up naked in strange places. I have never missed work because of a hangover. I don't drink when I walk in the door home from work. I am a binge drinker. I don't deny that this could get out of hand, however I don't think that it has yet. I have seen people change themselves without checking into rehab (which in my case would be very extreme). I was wondering if any reformed "partyers" had any practical advice that helped them. People who have managed to set limits for themselves which have worked.

Do you drink? Has your drinking become a problem?

That, my dear, is why they call it "a drinking problem".

You say you want to cut back? So cut back. If you can't, you've got to bite the bullet and admit you're an addict and then do whatever there is for you to do about that.

Cynthetiq · 03-28-2006, 06:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mayaj

Whoa. My life isn't in shambles. I don't wake up naked in strange places. I have never missed work because of a hangover. I don't drink when I walk in the door home from work. I am a binge drinker. I don't deny that this could get out of hand, however I don't think that it has yet. I have seen people change themselves without checking into rehab (which in my case would be very extreme). I was wondering if any reformed "partyers" had any practical advice that helped them. People who have managed to set limits for themselves which have worked.

I recently have come to terms with the fact that I am an alcoholic. I'm a binge drinker. I don't drink daily. I don't drink because I like the taste, sure, sometimes, but mostly it's because of the effect it brings. I stopped drinking on a daily basis because it took too long to get drunk so I started doing drugs.

I did not wake up naked elsewhere, I didn't lose my house, my job, my wife. But to those people that I've been speaking and spending time with, those are called YETS. I haven't lost them YET.

I decided I was an alcoholic, because when I wanted to stop, I couldn't. Yes, I could stop for a day, for a few weeks, maybe a few months, even a year. But once I started again, it was like I never stopped.

As I look back on my life I see that my alcoholism was as progressive as people stated. I didn't wake up and want to drink immediately, but I can say that I couldn't wait to get to my home bar and eventually when I started to isolate I couldn't wait to get home.

edit: Without trying to sound like I'm a bible banger for alcholic recovery I offer what I discovered from my own readings.

from Chapter 3 of the Big Book: Alcholics Anonymous:

Quote:

Here are some of the methods we have tried: Drinking beer only, limiting the number of drinks, never drinking alone, never drinking in the morning, drinking only at home, never having it in the house, never drinking during business hours, drinking only at parties, switching from scotch to brandy, drinking only natural wines, agreeing to resign if ever drunk on the job, taking a trip, not taking a trip, swearing off forever (with and without a solemn oath), taking more physical exercise, reading inspirational books, going to health farms and sanitariums, accepting voluntary commitment to asylums we could increase the list ad infinitum.

If you'd like to discuss this more please feel free to PM me or read my journal entries about my self-discovery.

jwoody · 03-28-2006, 06:42 AM

There's a huge difference between an alcoholic and someone who gets too drunk.

They aren't even comparable.

mayaj's problem is that she gets too drunk.

It is my belief that the only thing your average binge drinker would learn from checking into the clinic is that their problems are miniscule in comparison to some.

I realise there may be some cultural differences between my opinions and all of yours but seriously, telling someone they are an alcoholic when they probably aren't isn't something you should enter into lightly.

By some of your definition's, I am an alcoholic, my entire family are alcoholics, 90% of my (vast) circle of friends are alcoholics, approximately 200,000 people who enjoy a Saturday night out in Newcastle - all alcoholics.

ratbastid · 03-28-2006, 06:50 AM

No, jwoody, it's not that simple.

The difference between you and mayaj is: she and the people around her have a problem with her drinking, and she says she's unable to control it on her own. And she's coming to us looking for opinions and advice about that.

You and the people around you have no problem with your or their drinking, and you don't give a damn what we think about it (nor should you). If you enjoy what you're doing and don't want to stop, keep at it. Hell, have one for me next time you go out. But if and when you decide to quit, and if at that point you find you can't, then it's time to face some facts.

Edit: Just so you're clear where I stand about this--I enjoy drinking as much as anybody. I have zero problem with people partying and having a good time. That's not the issue. The issue is, she wants to cut back, and is finding she can't.

Cynthetiq · 03-28-2006, 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwoody

I realise there may be some cultural differences between my opinions and all of yours but seriously, telling someone they are an alcoholic when they probably aren't isn't something you should enter into lightly.

By some of your definition's, I am an alcoholic, my entire family are alcoholics, 90% of my (vast) circle of friends are alcoholics, approximately 200,000 people who enjoy a Saturday night out in Newcastle - all alcoholics.

I'm not telling anyone they are an alcoholic. It's something they discover for themselves. I thought I was just an addict. But upon alot of reflection and examination I discovered that I was also an alcoholic. It's the self that determines if they are alcoholic, no one else, no doctor, no friend, no spouse, no child. It is up to the individual.

Quote:

Alcoholism:
While there is no formal 'AA definition' of alcoholism, most of us agree that, for us, it could be described as a physical compulsion, coupled with a mental obsession. We mean that we had a distinct physical desire to consume alcohol beyond our capacity to control it, and in defiance of all the rules of common sense. We not only had an abnormal craving for alcohol, but we frequently yielded to it at the worst possible times. We did not know when (or how) to stop drinking.

The American Medical Association formally recognized alcoholism as a disease in 1972. In 1956, it had classified alcoholism as a 'treatable illness.' Alcoholism results from a genetic predisposition working in combination with psychological and environmental factors. There is no cure. Abstinence is the only treatment.

Definition of Alcoholism
Approved by the Boards of Directors of the National Council on Alcoholism and Drug Dependence, Inc. (February 3, 1990) and the American Society of Addiction Medicine (February 25, 1990).

Alcoholism is a primary, chronic disease with genetic, psychosocial, and environmental factors influencing its development and manifestations. The disease is often progressive and fatal. It is characterized by continuous or periodic: impaired control over drinking, preoccupation with the drug alcohol, use of alcohol despite adverse consequences, and distortions in thinking, most notably denial.

Primary refers to the nature of alcoholism as a disease entity in addition to and separate from other path physiologic states which may be associated with it. Primary suggests that alcoholism, as an addiction, is not a symptom of an underlying disease state.

Disease means an involuntary disability. It represents the sum of the abnormal phenomena displayed by a group of individuals. These phenomena are associated with a specified common set of characteristics by which these individuals differ from the norm, and which places them at a disadvantage.

Often progressive and fatal means that the disease persists over time and that physical, emotional, and social changes are often cumulative and may progress as drinking continues.

Alcoholism causes premature death through overdose, organic complications involving the brain, liver, heart and many other organs, and by contributing to suicide, homicide, motor vehicle crashes, and other traumatic events.

Impaired control means the inability to limit alcohol use or to consistently limit on any drinking occasion the duration of the episode, the quantity consumed, and/or the behavioral consequences of drinking.

Preoccupation in association with alcohol use indicates excessive, focused attention given to the drug alcohol, its effects, and/or its use. The relative value thus assigned to alcohol by the individual often leads to a diversion of energies away from important life concerns.

Adverse consequences are alcohol-related problems or impairments in such areas as: physical health (e.g., alcohol withdrawal syndromes, liver disease, gastritis, anemia, neurological disorders); psychological functioning (e.g., impairments in cognition, changes in mood and behavior); interpersonal functioning (e.g., marital problems and child abuse, impaired social relationships); occupational functioning (e.g., scholastic or job problems); and legal, financial, or spiritual problems.

Denial is used here not only in the psychoanalytic sense of a single psychological defense mechanism disavowing the significance of events, but more broadly to include a range of psychological maneuvers designed to reduce awareness of the fact that alcohol use is the cause of an individual's problems rather than a solution to those problems. Denial becomes an integral part of the disease and a major obstacle to recovery.

jwoody · 03-28-2006, 07:04 AM

I'm not looking for an argument here. I just felt compelled to add some balance to the (very one-sided) advice already given.

nezmot · 03-28-2006, 07:08 AM

Just to put my comments into context - I live in England, I've lived in other places too (where people, including me drank far more) and I've had my fair share of nights out in Newcastle too - but right now I live in England, and I don't mind admitting that I still tend to drink more than the next person - as and when I feel like it. I know my limits, and most of the time, I stick to them.

But I have friends, and I have had friends who always wanted more. One of them now is unable to steady his hands without having a drink 1st thing in the morning - he's 32 years old. He, like me, always enjoyed a good night out. We must have gotten drunk together thousands of times. But often, he'd want to stay for 'just one more drink' - when it was obvious we'd all had quite enough. We all used to say that he 'just liked a drink' as did we all. But he's in real trouble now. Real trouble. Another friend couldn't get into work until he'd drunk a half bottle of vodka. He was a really great guy, until he had too much to drink - which he nearly always did - at which point he turned into an asshole.

Everyone likes a drink - we all enjoy the liberating effects of alcohol in the system. But if you're one of those people who is putting the drink first, and getting <b>too</b> drunk, then you <b>are</b> on the first steps of alcoholism. Tread very, very, carefully.

Getting too drunk is either a problem of not knowing your own limits, or not sticking to them. Either way it is a problem. It doesn't matter what name you attach to it. It is still a serious, health-threatening and life-damaging problem.

mayaj needs to realise that this is serious - and decide for herself that she is going to set her own limits - and stick to them.

From the point of view of holding down a relationship, it is really embarrasing being romantically involved with someone who can't hold their drink. It hurts when your partner turns into someone else over the course of an evening. It really hurts. It puts a strain on a relationship when one person is forced to look after the other one all the time - and never recieve any acknowledgement because the other person is always too drunk to know what they put their partner through. Again that hurts. It's a lonely life when you get home after a night out with friends and your partner is too drunk to know what they are doing. In short, it hurts to be with someone like this. And you end up sitting in your armchair at 1am, looking with contempt at the comatose sack of flesh you've dragged home once more after the nth time of drama and embarrasment and abuse and you start to wonder whether it's really worth the effort. You really do.

ngdawg · 03-28-2006, 07:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mayaj

I am 26 years old and have been a moderately heavy drinker since high school. My parents and siblings are heavy drinkers, in fact, most people in my family are. I think my parents could be described as functional alcoholics in that I've seen them sloppy drunk more than a few times but it doesn't affect their work at all or their relationships (all that much).

What is 'all that much'? A few fights where punches are thrown? Or spouses going home angry after their SO's made fools of themselves? Think about how drinking has affected anyone you know, long term or short term, in their personal health and lives. Anyone die of esophagal cancer? bladder cancer or liver disease? Any divorces? DUI's?

Quote:

Originally Posted by mayaj

I have always been a bit of a party girl and even took pride in my ability to drink colossal amounts of alchohol and outlast the rest of the guys. However, now that I want to start curbing my drinking I am realizing that I may have less control over it than I previously thought. In relationships I've usually taken a lot of flack from my boyfriends for drinking but never took them very seriously because I didn't care. I enjoyed partying very much and thought they were a little prusdish and controlling. However, now that I am in a serious relationship with someone I love I find that I can't stop drinking even for him.

How many times do we hear that one of the questions to decide if you are on your way to being an alcoholic is when the buzz is more important than love?

Quote:

Originally Posted by mayaj

If we go out with our friends I reach a point where I can't be persuaded to go home. After finishing a bottle of wine, beer or drink I always want "just one more." I didn't used to black out but now parts of the evenings are starting to become hazy and I have started remembering things incorrectly or even making stuff up that didn't happen. I don't drink much alone and I certainly don't get drunk alone but this is starting to affect my health. I have hangovers for 2 days and sometimes even get rashes from going on benders.

That myth again about alkies being raging drunk 24/7, not able to function without a shot in their morning coffee and it's all downhill....Read Cyn's post a second and third time, please. Many alcoholics are binge drinkers and social drinkers. Don't drink much alone? Define 'much'.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mayaj

After a particulary sauced Saturday night my boyfriend was so mad at me that I was shocked. Shocked because I've done stupid drunk things in the past (nothing too terrible) but as far as I was concerned I thought I had behaved relatively normally. He told me I couldn't even walk and I realized I couldn't remember coming home.

We've all done that. But he's been verbal before, yet you're 'shocked'?

I

Quote:

Originally Posted by mayaj

don't want to quit drinking. I really really enjoy it. I would hate to become a full blown alcoholic, if only because it would mean that I would have to quit cold turkey. However, I need to find a way to cut down. My health is suffering as well as my career and relationship. It seems like after 1 drink I'm OK but after 3 or 4 drinks I lose the ability to say no to alcohol and want to drink till I explode. Does anyone have practical tips on how to cut down? My body and life can't keep up with my drinking any more . . .

You are more than a social drinker and in denial about it.
Now that I have put away the soapbox....
I drank a LOT in my 20's. Falling down drunk was not really frequent, but stupidity was. My last act of stupidity had me swearing off all booze for years-not being able to find my car in an empty parking lot, under the lamppost, then handing the keys to my equally drunk friend.
As stated, only you can decide or realize when you want or need the change-you're at the door, you just don't have the desire to open it and do what you know in your heart you have to do.
Check this out and do some contemplating: http://www.a-1associates.com/AA/20%20questions.htm
Your post alone answers more than 3; 2 or more and you are an alcoholic.

Sultana · 03-28-2006, 07:48 AM

It's not how much you drink that defines an alcohol addiction, it's the dependancy on it, and the inability to stop if desired. This is obviously negatively affecting your life, and you don't appear to be *IN CONTROL*.

And I mean absolutely NO disrespect Jwoody, not at all, please understand. But if someone is wounded, and they walk around asking, "Hey, am I bleeding?" and everyone says "Yep, buckets! You should see a doctor!", is that an over-reaction? No, it's several people evaluating the condition independantly and coming to the same conclusion.

jwoody · 03-28-2006, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sultana

And I mean absolutely NO disrespect Jwoody, not at all, please understand.

None taken. We're all entitled to an opinion.

I offered practical binge drinking tips, fully aware that to many people there is no such thing as practical binge drinking.

Sultana · 03-28-2006, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwoody

I offered practical binge drinking tips, fully aware that to many people there is no such thing as practical binge drinking.

If only you had been there with this advice years ago for me!

Jinn · 03-28-2006, 09:26 AM

Addictions are when the action interferes with something MORE important to you, and you are unable to control it. If a relationship is more important to me than alcohol, and I cannot stop drinking alcohol to save the relationship -- then I'm an alcoholic. Same thing with gambling addictions, workaholics, etc. If you enjoy gambling, more power to you. If you can't stop gambling in order to avoid going in debt, then you're addicted. It's as simple as that. Just because you think "alcoholic" has stigmas about waking up in gutters with cuts and strange bruises doesn't make this the reality.

If there are things more important to you than alcohol, and you cannot abstain from drinking in order to perserve those things, THEN YOU ARE AN ALCOHOLIC, no question about it.

Before you tell me I don't know the difference between alcoholism, I did (and do) binge drink. However, when it interfered with my relationship, I stopped.

Organize your priorities and find OTHER things to do. If one things helps you break the addiction (or binge, whatever you want it call it) its doing other things. Instead of going out to drink with your friends, tell them you're going to stay in and watch TV with your SO. I think 90% of binge drinking is having friends that want to do it.. remove them or you might find yourself removed from the earth prematurely, if you catch my drift.

Toaster126 · 03-28-2006, 03:55 PM

If you can't tone down the drinking for a significant other that you love, perhaps you should examine your life and figure out why that is. Lots of people have already told you why that is, but until you realize it for yourself, nothing will change.

VirFighter · 03-30-2006, 07:32 PM

I know you said you don't want to stop, but can you stop?

I found my drinking getting a little out of control this past fall and I promised my girlfriend I would take a month off from drinking (including staying sober for the big halloween party). It was a challenge but it really helped to put things in perspective and give me a better sense of control over myself.

See if you can go a month or maybe more without drinking. Make sure you observe your drinking friends or just strangers at the bar, it really helps, at least it did for me.

jth · 03-30-2006, 08:56 PM

my 2 cents.

There is no such thing as a part time alcoholic. You either are not an alcoholic or you are.

Alcoholics have a sickness which causes them to drink. They can't 'cut back'. I have a friend who is in denial of his alcoholism and thinks that he has it under control... he does not. There might be different types of it, dependent, co-dependent etc. But if when you start drinking you cannot stop, don't want to stop, don't care about stopping then you have a drinking problem and need to address it.

If you are concerned about your drinking then now is the time sto cut it out of your life. The health risks greatly outweigh any fun you have drinking. You might not be waking up naked in strange beds now, but who can tell if you won't if you continue to drink.

I used to be a heavy drinker as well considering where I spent most of my time. My Grandfathers were both re-occuring alcoholics (would drink heavily, stop but then always return to it) and I have close relatives who drink heavily and have problems with substance abuse. So I decided that I didn't want to run the risk of letting myself get out of control and now hardly ever drink at all. If you're family is filled with heavy drinkers then it probably means they're all alcholics as well but just not really openly saying it to you. You can't really know how it's effected their relationships in the privacy of their lives or work.

I think a good thing to try is to stop drinking all together for a long period of time, like a few months and see if you can do it. If you find yourself breaking your little, no booze for 30 days then it seems to me clearly that you have a problem with booze.

Then I would see a doctor or specialist about ways to beat it for a long healthy life

Nisses · 03-31-2006, 03:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jwoody

To some this may seem like terrible advice - I'm just telling you what works for me.

Pick your day when you're going to get smashed and prepare for it.

Stay sober the night before, wake up early and have a hearty breakfast (the full English is my meal of choice).

Drink lots of liquids leading up to lunch time when you're going to have your second hearty meal of the day:

Lunch - You're looking for something stodgy which is going to fill you up. Mince and dumplings, pie and peas, mashed potato and something... any of those served with vegetables.

Some days I'll have a pint with lunch and continue the drinking from there. If I don't intend to continue drinking then it's strictly soft drinks only. Drinking - stopping drinking for a few hours - then drinking again is a recipe for disaster.

If it's an evening session, I'll probably have some sort of pasta meal before I go out, washed down with a bottle or two of imported Continental European lager.

When I'm out, I feel it's important to stick with the same drink all night (unless that drink happens to be vodka, in which case I'll limit myself to couple just before I go home).

If I feel myself getting too drunk too soon, I'll take a break and have couple of glasses of Coke to sort myself out.

You're welcome.

Cheers.

These are all pretty good, I came to the same conclusion as you a couple of years ago, when I needed it

Unfortunately, these are ways to be able to drink *more* with less of the unpleasant after-effects. I don't think that should be the solution here.

----
To Mayaj: you don't need to be drunk 24/7 to be an alcoholic, it's the self-control problem that determines this... I personally know a few severe alcoholics, 1 in my own family, who also never miss a day of work... It doesn't make them any less what they are.

Rodney · 03-31-2006, 07:15 AM

Listen to what these fine people have said. You may not be ready to hear it yet, but keep it in mind, because things are not going to get better on their own. To sum:

1) You can't control your drinking
2) You can't control your behavior when you're drinking; your judgment is impaired.
3) You're alienating your boyfriend.
4) You're making yourself physically ill on a regular basis.
5) You're starting to have blackouts

and the worst:

6) You want to go on drinking.

You have a drinking problem. You can't control it. It controls you.

Let me make this very clear:

You can either drink -- or keep your boyfriend.
You can either drink -- or be in good health.
You can either drink -- or have a safe, long, fulfilling life.

Drinking on the one side. A lifelong partner, good health and happiness on the other.

You can't have both.

Choose.

peterbilt1 · 03-31-2006, 07:56 PM

In all my experience with this, which is extensive, two things come to mind: 1. If you are asking yourself if you have an alcohol problem, chances are, you do. 2. The truest way to determine if you have a problem is to ask yourself, What have the negative consequences been? The negative can outweigh the positive for a long time before the pain of staying the same leads us to change. I stopped drinking years ago--I hate to vomit, and I hate hangovers. My wife continued until it nearly killed her. Led to rehab in '02. All are well now. Believe it or not, it's a spiritual journey you're on.

03-27-2006, 03:49 AM	#1 (permalink)
mayaj Upright	Budding Alcoholic I am 26 years old and have been a moderately heavy drinker since high school. My parents and siblings are heavy drinkers, in fact, most people in my family are. I think my parents could be described as functional alcoholics in that I've seen them sloppy drunk more than a few times but it doesn't affect their work at all or their relationships (all that much). I have always been a bit of a party girl and even took pride in my ability to drink colossal amounts of alchohol and outlast the rest of the guys. However, now that I want to start curbing my drinking I am realizing that I may have less control over it than I previously thought. In relationships I've usually taken a lot of flack from my boyfriends for drinking but never took them very seriously because I didn't care. I enjoyed partying very much and thought they were a little prusdish and controlling. However, now that I am in a serious relationship with someone I love I find that I can't stop drinking even for him. If we go out with our friends I reach a point where I can't be persuaded to go home. After finishing a bottle of wine, beer or drink I always want "just one more." I didn't used to black out but now parts of the evenings are starting to become hazy and I have started remembering things incorrectly or even making stuff up that didn't happen. I don't drink much alone and I certainly don't get drunk alone but this is starting to affect my health. I have hangovers for 2 days and sometimes even get rashes from going on benders. After a particulary sauced Saturday night my boyfriend was so mad at me that I was shocked. Shocked because I've done stupid drunk things in the past (nothing too terrible) but as far as I was concerned I thought I had behaved relatively normally. He told me I couldn't even walk and I realized I couldn't remember coming home. I don't want to quit drinking. I really really enjoy it. I would hate to become a full blown alcoholic, if only because it would mean that I would have to quit cold turkey. However, I need to find a way to cut down. My health is suffering as well as my career and relationship. It seems like after 1 drink I'm OK but after 3 or 4 drinks I lose the ability to say no to alcohol and want to drink till I explode. Does anyone have practical tips on how to cut down? My body and life can't keep up with my drinking any more . . .

03-27-2006, 04:09 AM	#2 (permalink)
tecoyah Illusionary	Chances are....you already are an alcoholic. Time to face reality dear. __________________ Holding onto anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned. - Buddha

03-27-2006, 04:26 AM	#3 (permalink)
Nisses Shade Location: Belgium	"now that I am in a serious relationship with someone I love I find that I can't stop drinking even for him" "I didn't used to black out but now parts of the evenings are starting to become hazy and I have started remembering things incorrectly or even making stuff up that didn't happen" "I always want 'just one more.'" "I have hangovers for 2 days and sometimes even get rashes from going on benders." Vote for reality check here as well... Sorry, but I'd say there's no "chances are that..." in this post. It just tells me you're already there. __________________ Moderation should be moderately moderated.

03-27-2006, 05:35 AM	#4 (permalink)
maleficent Junkie Moderator Emeritus Location: Chicago	"My health is suffering as well as my career and relationship. " You need to do more than cut down... you recognize that you've got a problem... Only you can get yourself to do something about it... You have to decide what's more important to you - the booze? or your health/career/relationships. It doesn't appear that you can have both. Run, don't walk, to your physician and tell her/him everything you wrote above... heck print out the thread so you don't forget... You need help... __________________ Free your heart from hatred. Free your mind from worries. Live simply. Give more. Expect less.

03-28-2006, 03:04 AM	#6 (permalink)
Plummie Liquid Diamonds Location: Lexington, KY	I would try to get down to the root cause of why you like drinking so much - it obviously isn't for emotionally healthy reasons. Are you drinking to deal with sadness or depression? To relieve yourself from boredom? Why? It's good that you are reaching out because it means you recognize that you have a problem. If you are borderline alcoholic, now is the time to act. The longer you wait, the deeper it will grow and you could seriously hurt yourself or the ones you love in the end. Look into attending your local AA meetings, the program really works for a lot of people. You'll probably have to quit drinking cold turkey, or at least until you are able to regulate your drinking better (which could be months, or years from now, or never). Definitely make an appointment with your doctor and tell them everything. You'll need a support system to kick the habit, no matter how much you try and convince yourself you can do it alone. Best of luck to you, I know you can do it. __________________ Kim

03-27-2006, 11:50 PM	#5 (permalink)
mayaj Upright	Whoa. My life isn't in shambles. I don't wake up naked in strange places. I have never missed work because of a hangover. I don't drink when I walk in the door home from work. I am a binge drinker. I don't deny that this could get out of hand, however I don't think that it has yet. I have seen people change themselves without checking into rehab (which in my case would be very extreme). I was wondering if any reformed "partyers" had any practical advice that helped them. People who have managed to set limits for themselves which have worked.

03-28-2006, 03:11 AM	#7 (permalink)
jwoody Shackle Me Not Location: Newcastle - England.	To some this may seem like terrible advice - I'm just telling you what works for me. Pick your day when you're going to get smashed and prepare for it. Stay sober the night before, wake up early and have a hearty breakfast (the full English is my meal of choice). Drink lots of liquids leading up to lunch time when you're going to have your second hearty meal of the day: Lunch - You're looking for something stodgy which is going to fill you up. Mince and dumplings, pie and peas, mashed potato and something... any of those served with vegetables. Some days I'll have a pint with lunch and continue the drinking from there. If I don't intend to continue drinking then it's strictly soft drinks only. Drinking - stopping drinking for a few hours - then drinking again is a recipe for disaster. If it's an evening session, I'll probably have some sort of pasta meal before I go out, washed down with a bottle or two of imported Continental European lager. When I'm out, I feel it's important to stick with the same drink all night (unless that drink happens to be vodka, in which case I'll limit myself to couple just before I go home). If I feel myself getting too drunk too soon, I'll take a break and have couple of glasses of Coke to sort myself out. You're welcome. Cheers. __________________ .

03-28-2006, 04:16 AM	#8 (permalink)
nezmot Registered User	Have you ever stuck around and watched someone else get drunk? It's disgusting. I've had friends and relationships with people who felt comfortable enough with me to drink themselves into a drunken state - and yes, that always wanting one more was exactly what they were like. I hated them when they were like that. I really did. Obnoxious, self-centred assholes the lot of them. And yet, when they were sober, they were perfectly normal, lovable human beings. Change now - because what you're not aware of (or at least only now becoming aware of) is exactly how contemptable people are when they've had too many drinks. Yes it will ruin your relationships. After enough relationships have been thrown away, and age starts taking away your looks, you will have nothing except the drink to comfort you - THAT's the stage that we normally label people as alcoholics - the no-hopers for whom it's too late. Want to find a limt? Find a place where you have had enough? The answer is to either measure yourself physically or mentally. I used to say that if I wasn't able to stand at a bar without wobbling - then I had drunk too much and it was time to go home. That was still probably too much. I'm sure you can think of a point where you believe you've had enough - and stick to it. Remember, most people hate a drunk. Most people will hate you, when you are drunk. That's loved ones, friends, aquaintances - anyone you're likely to meet. I'm not holding back on these words, because they are the truth. If you don't like the truth, then consider finding your own limit.

03-28-2006, 05:00 AM	#10 (permalink)
jwoody Shackle Me Not Location: Newcastle - England.	My final word: Move to England. __________________ .

03-28-2006, 06:42 AM	#13 (permalink)
jwoody Shackle Me Not Location: Newcastle - England.	There's a huge difference between an alcoholic and someone who gets too drunk. They aren't even comparable. mayaj's problem is that she gets too drunk. It is my belief that the only thing your average binge drinker would learn from checking into the clinic is that their problems are miniscule in comparison to some. I realise there may be some cultural differences between my opinions and all of yours but seriously, telling someone they are an alcoholic when they probably aren't isn't something you should enter into lightly. By some of your definition's, I am an alcoholic, my entire family are alcoholics, 90% of my (vast) circle of friends are alcoholics, approximately 200,000 people who enjoy a Saturday night out in Newcastle - all alcoholics. __________________ .

03-28-2006, 06:50 AM	#14 (permalink)
ratbastid Darth Papa Location: Yonder	No, jwoody, it's not that simple. The difference between you and mayaj is: she and the people around her have a problem with her drinking, and she says she's unable to control it on her own. And she's coming to us looking for opinions and advice about that. You and the people around you have no problem with your or their drinking, and you don't give a damn what we think about it (nor should you). If you enjoy what you're doing and don't want to stop, keep at it. Hell, have one for me next time you go out. But if and when you decide to quit, and if at that point you find you can't, then it's time to face some facts. Edit: Just so you're clear where I stand about this--I enjoy drinking as much as anybody. I have zero problem with people partying and having a good time. That's not the issue. The issue is, she wants to cut back, and is finding she can't. Last edited by ratbastid; 03-28-2006 at 06:55 AM..

03-28-2006, 07:04 AM	#16 (permalink)
jwoody Shackle Me Not Location: Newcastle - England.	I'm not looking for an argument here. I just felt compelled to add some balance to the (very one-sided) advice already given. __________________ .

03-28-2006, 07:08 AM	#17 (permalink)
nezmot Registered User	Just to put my comments into context - I live in England, I've lived in other places too (where people, including me drank far more) and I've had my fair share of nights out in Newcastle too - but right now I live in England, and I don't mind admitting that I still tend to drink more than the next person - as and when I feel like it. I know my limits, and most of the time, I stick to them. But I have friends, and I have had friends who always wanted more. One of them now is unable to steady his hands without having a drink 1st thing in the morning - he's 32 years old. He, like me, always enjoyed a good night out. We must have gotten drunk together thousands of times. But often, he'd want to stay for 'just one more drink' - when it was obvious we'd all had quite enough. We all used to say that he 'just liked a drink' as did we all. But he's in real trouble now. Real trouble. Another friend couldn't get into work until he'd drunk a half bottle of vodka. He was a really great guy, until he had too much to drink - which he nearly always did - at which point he turned into an asshole. Everyone likes a drink - we all enjoy the liberating effects of alcohol in the system. But if you're one of those people who is putting the drink first, and getting <b>too</b> drunk, then you <b>are</b> on the first steps of alcoholism. Tread very, very, carefully. Getting too drunk is either a problem of not knowing your own limits, or not sticking to them. Either way it is a problem. It doesn't matter what name you attach to it. It is still a serious, health-threatening and life-damaging problem. mayaj needs to realise that this is serious - and decide for herself that she is going to set her own limits - and stick to them. From the point of view of holding down a relationship, it is really embarrasing being romantically involved with someone who can't hold their drink. It hurts when your partner turns into someone else over the course of an evening. It really hurts. It puts a strain on a relationship when one person is forced to look after the other one all the time - and never recieve any acknowledgement because the other person is always too drunk to know what they put their partner through. Again that hurts. It's a lonely life when you get home after a night out with friends and your partner is too drunk to know what they are doing. In short, it hurts to be with someone like this. And you end up sitting in your armchair at 1am, looking with contempt at the comatose sack of flesh you've dragged home once more after the nth time of drama and embarrasment and abuse and you start to wonder whether it's really worth the effort. You really do.

03-28-2006, 07:48 AM	#19 (permalink)
Sultana Falling Angel Location: L.A. L.A. land	It's not how much you drink that defines an alcohol addiction, it's the dependancy on it, and the inability to stop if desired. This is obviously negatively affecting your life, and you don't appear to be IN CONTROL. And I mean absolutely NO disrespect Jwoody, not at all, please understand. But if someone is wounded, and they walk around asking, "Hey, am I bleeding?" and everyone says "Yep, buckets! You should see a doctor!", is that an over-reaction? No, it's several people evaluating the condition independantly and coming to the same conclusion. __________________ "Love is a snowmobile racing across the tundra and then suddenly it flips over, pinning you underneath. At night, the ice weasels come." - Matt Groening My goal? To fulfill my potential.

03-28-2006, 09:26 AM	#22 (permalink)
Jinn Lover - Protector - Teacher Location: Seattle, WA	Addictions are when the action interferes with something MORE important to you, and you are unable to control it. If a relationship is more important to me than alcohol, and I cannot stop drinking alcohol to save the relationship -- then I'm an alcoholic. Same thing with gambling addictions, workaholics, etc. If you enjoy gambling, more power to you. If you can't stop gambling in order to avoid going in debt, then you're addicted. It's as simple as that. Just because you think "alcoholic" has stigmas about waking up in gutters with cuts and strange bruises doesn't make this the reality. If there are things more important to you than alcohol, and you cannot abstain from drinking in order to perserve those things, THEN YOU ARE AN ALCOHOLIC, no question about it. Before you tell me I don't know the difference between alcoholism, I did (and do) binge drink. However, when it interfered with my relationship, I stopped. Organize your priorities and find OTHER things to do. If one things helps you break the addiction (or binge, whatever you want it call it) its doing other things. Instead of going out to drink with your friends, tell them you're going to stay in and watch TV with your SO. I think 90% of binge drinking is having friends that want to do it.. remove them or you might find yourself removed from the earth prematurely, if you catch my drift. __________________ "I'm typing on a computer of science, which is being sent by science wires to a little science server where you can access it. I'm not typing on a computer of philosophy or religion or whatever other thing you think can be used to understand the universe because they're a poor substitute in the role of understanding the universe which exists independent from ourselves." - Willravel

03-28-2006, 03:55 PM	#23 (permalink)
Toaster126 Extreme moderation Location: Kansas City, yo.	If you can't tone down the drinking for a significant other that you love, perhaps you should examine your life and figure out why that is. Lots of people have already told you why that is, but until you realize it for yourself, nothing will change. __________________ "The question isn't who is going to let me, it's who is going to stop me." (Ayn Rand) "The truth is that our finest moments are most likely to occur when we are feeling deeply uncomfortable, unhappy, or unfulfilled. For it is only in such moments, propelled by our discomfort, that we are likely to step out of our ruts and start searching for different ways or truer answers." (M. Scott Peck)

03-30-2006, 07:32 PM	#24 (permalink)
VirFighter Insane Location: Raleigh, NC / Atlanta, GA	I know you said you don't want to stop, but can you stop? I found my drinking getting a little out of control this past fall and I promised my girlfriend I would take a month off from drinking (including staying sober for the big halloween party). It was a challenge but it really helped to put things in perspective and give me a better sense of control over myself. See if you can go a month or maybe more without drinking. Make sure you observe your drinking friends or just strangers at the bar, it really helps, at least it did for me. __________________ "The South is gonna boogie again" - Disco Stu

03-30-2006, 08:56 PM	#25 (permalink)
jth Insane Location: HRM	my 2 cents. There is no such thing as a part time alcoholic. You either are not an alcoholic or you are. Alcoholics have a sickness which causes them to drink. They can't 'cut back'. I have a friend who is in denial of his alcoholism and thinks that he has it under control... he does not. There might be different types of it, dependent, co-dependent etc. But if when you start drinking you cannot stop, don't want to stop, don't care about stopping then you have a drinking problem and need to address it. If you are concerned about your drinking then now is the time sto cut it out of your life. The health risks greatly outweigh any fun you have drinking. You might not be waking up naked in strange beds now, but who can tell if you won't if you continue to drink. I used to be a heavy drinker as well considering where I spent most of my time. My Grandfathers were both re-occuring alcoholics (would drink heavily, stop but then always return to it) and I have close relatives who drink heavily and have problems with substance abuse. So I decided that I didn't want to run the risk of letting myself get out of control and now hardly ever drink at all. If you're family is filled with heavy drinkers then it probably means they're all alcholics as well but just not really openly saying it to you. You can't really know how it's effected their relationships in the privacy of their lives or work. I think a good thing to try is to stop drinking all together for a long period of time, like a few months and see if you can do it. If you find yourself breaking your little, no booze for 30 days then it seems to me clearly that you have a problem with booze. Then I would see a doctor or specialist about ways to beat it for a long healthy life __________________ "A real leader faces the music, even if he doesn't like the tune." - unknown quote

03-31-2006, 07:15 AM	#27 (permalink)
Rodney Observant Ruminant Location: Rich Wannabe Hippie Town	Listen to what these fine people have said. You may not be ready to hear it yet, but keep it in mind, because things are not going to get better on their own. To sum: 1) You can't control your drinking 2) You can't control your behavior when you're drinking; your judgment is impaired. 3) You're alienating your boyfriend. 4) You're making yourself physically ill on a regular basis. 5) You're starting to have blackouts and the worst: 6) You want to go on drinking. You have a drinking problem. You can't control it. It controls you. Let me make this very clear: You can either drink -- or keep your boyfriend. You can either drink -- or be in good health. You can either drink -- or have a safe, long, fulfilling life. Drinking on the one side. A lifelong partner, good health and happiness on the other. You can't have both. Choose.

03-31-2006, 07:56 PM	#28 (permalink)
peterbilt1 Upright Location: Nashville	In all my experience with this, which is extensive, two things come to mind: 1. If you are asking yourself if you have an alcohol problem, chances are, you do. 2. The truest way to determine if you have a problem is to ask yourself, What have the negative consequences been? The negative can outweigh the positive for a long time before the pain of staying the same leads us to change. I stopped drinking years ago--I hate to vomit, and I hate hangovers. My wife continued until it nearly killed her. Led to rehab in '02. All are well now. Believe it or not, it's a spiritual journey you're on. __________________ "God is not dead, nor does He sleep."-Henry W. Longfellow