Cardio every day? - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Antagony · 08-04-2003, 12:42 PM

Is it safe to do cardio-intensive workouts on an almost daily basis?

I know that with strength training you need to allow muscles time to heal or your muscles can't bulk up.

Is there some sort of similar rule with cardio, or am I safe to continue with my frequent martial arts practice?

xshadowx · 08-04-2003, 05:53 PM

I too would like to know the answer to this

athleticsfan615 · 08-04-2003, 06:01 PM

It depends on the type of workout but I think an hour or half hour of cardio done 3-5 times a week is good. I took a jogging class in college and was told that any more than 5 days a week of extensive cardio was just wasting your time and didn't do anything.

Rodney · 08-04-2003, 07:13 PM

Whether you're talking cardio, strength training, or both, it's always best to give the body days 1-2 days off a week to rest and heal. Avoids injuries, gives the body time to build itself up.

cetacean · 08-04-2003, 08:02 PM

Rest is my favorite part of the workout. I really enjoy the muscle ache after a good workout, it lets you know you've done something. I try to do cardio 3-4 times a week and I haven't had any problems, but I do feel like their is room for more. When I was younger, I wrestled. Our practices were six days a week and very intense. I don't think I have ever been in such good shape.

Mael · 08-04-2003, 10:57 PM

you can do cardio every day. just don't have them always be "intense." that can lead to overtraining (increased heartbeat, irritability, trouble sleeping) which isn't good. so best thing to do if you want to do non-strength training exercise every day is to not go all out every day, maybe hard one day, easy the next (intense short run/easy long jog) and having one or two days where you do a different type of activity such as play basketball or tennis.

cliche · 08-04-2003, 11:35 PM

take a day off, or at least an extremely light day, every week - otherwise you end up overtraining (I did) and it's not pretty!

Sleepyjack · 08-05-2003, 12:28 AM

just vary the intensitites. Try to get 30 mins of excercise a day.

Loup · 08-05-2003, 03:55 AM

You can do cardio every day (as Mael said).
But it is suggested that change it up each day. From a 45 minute jog one day to a 15 minute sprint another day to a slow off-trail run on another, etc. As for your Martial Arts practice, there should be no trouble.

The_Jazz · 08-07-2003, 12:32 PM

You can do cardio as much as you want. It really depends on what you're doing, what your goals are, etc. If you're trying to build muscle mass, then going for a 9 mile run every day is not for you. If you're trying to tone, then a 9 miler may not be so bad.

WAAAAY back in the day, I ran cross country and track in college. Since we had an indoor season, it was a year round sport for me. I went through my logs about 6 months ago and saw that between May (end of track) and the end of November (the end of XC), I took off a total of 3 days and averaged 68 miles per week. I would have only missed 1 day and averaged closer to 77 miles if I hadn't tapered for the end of the season. I say this to prove my point - do as much cardio as you think is good for you. Just listen to your body.

skysooner · 08-08-2003, 08:28 AM

Two questions here:

I've started a heavy weight loss program (Weight Watchers) combined with cardio 5 or 6 days a week. I also do some ab and weight work but not intensively as we are waiting for a gym near our house to open their doors. I'm doing an hour on a recumbant bike on those days I do cardio. I know the recommendation is to do roughly 30 minutes of cardio at your target heart rate daily. Is it better to step up the resistance on the bike or to go for speed and distance or does it really matter? I'm burning roughly 720 calories in an hour at my current rate.

My wife is in pretty decent shape but gained about 4 lbs over our Mexican vacation about a month ago. She has been trying to lose it ever since. She also does Weight Watchers and runs 4 to 5 miles 7 days a week. The weight is just not coming off, and she wasn't sure whether she needed to vary her exercise a bit or take a day off now and then. We had read some things that seem to suggest that your body can get used to a certain type of workout and not lose weight unless you vary the intensities on different days.

Any advice?

human · 08-08-2003, 12:29 PM

Skysooner: I don't think it really matters all that much, especially for weight loss as long as you are doing something. If you don't mind doing it for an hour, keep doing that and slowly over the weeks increase the speed/resistance. As far as I know, building cardio ability centers mostly on keeping your heart rate up for an extended period of time, the heart is a muscle, working it out is good!

Best advice I have for your wife, again, this is just personal experience, so everybody is different etc.... If the weight is stable, that generally means caloric intake=energy burned over the course of a day. By having a slight caloric deficit, you will lose weight. So, seeing as the current regime is good, if she can work out a touch longer or go on a slight (drop maybe 100-200 calories a day tops from normal) diet for a week or two, she should be able to drop the four lbs, then go back to normal and stay there.

Good luck all around!

skysooner · 08-08-2003, 01:15 PM

Thanks human.

I'm really liking working out (7 weeks now), and I certainly like the results (down 22 lbs as of today with about 40 to go). Part of the problem with my wife might be muscle building. She is 5'6", 120 lbs and hardly has any fat on her. I tell her she looks better now than she did before we went on vacation. I think it is possible some of it turned into muscle as she appears to be more toned to me. However I will pass on your advice and see how it works.

blackdas · 08-08-2003, 01:38 PM

I'm trying to put on mass and I heard that in my case doing cardio is a bad idea (low body fat), but some people say it might be worth doign some low intensity cardio once or twice a week.

cliv · 08-08-2003, 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by djp
You can do cardio every day (as Mael said).
But it is suggested that change it up each day. From a 45 minute jog one day to a 15 minute sprint another day to a slow off-trail run on another, etc.

That's basically the same thing my trainer told me.

Antagony · 08-08-2003, 02:26 PM

Hmmmm, change it up, eh?

That's actually kind of difficult in my case. I want to do martial arts every day. Even though I'm doing different forms and what-not, my body feels about the same at the end of each workout. What I mean is that I get about the same amount of intensity every day.

I guess I'll have to supplement that with bodyweight exercises like push-ups and such.

Thanks guys, this thread has been helpful.

debiljim · 07-31-2005, 06:38 AM

tom venuto's BFFM says theres nothing wrong with cardio 6-7 days a week. he even suggests double cardio if you really want to burn the fat. i have been running 40 min every morning on an empty stomach, and 30 min in the afternoon after i workout one body part for the past 4 weeks. i have dropped so many lbs it's ridiculous. my only concern is that i've been totally satisfied with 6 hours of sleep everynight, and everytime i wake up i HAVE to run... it's almost like a drug. my appetite hasnt changed, i still eat 5-6 times a day, and my concentration is up to par. so i'm not sure if it's my circadian rhythm that is causing me to wake up at the same time everyday regardless of how many hours of sleep i get, or if it's a sign of overtraining. suggestions?

jhkayakr · 07-31-2005, 07:09 AM

if your healthy, why not? always smart to ask a doctor. My doc says ok, just stay hydrated.

thingstodo · 07-31-2005, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skysooner

Two questions here:

I've started a heavy weight loss program (Weight Watchers) combined with cardio 5 or 6 days a week. I also do some ab and weight work but not intensively as we are waiting for a gym near our house to open their doors. I'm doing an hour on a recumbant bike on those days I do cardio. I know the recommendation is to do roughly 30 minutes of cardio at your target heart rate daily. Is it better to step up the resistance on the bike or to go for speed and distance or does it really matter? I'm burning roughly 720 calories in an hour at my current rate.

My wife is in pretty decent shape but gained about 4 lbs over our Mexican vacation about a month ago. She has been trying to lose it ever since. She also does Weight Watchers and runs 4 to 5 miles 7 days a week. The weight is just not coming off, and she wasn't sure whether she needed to vary her exercise a bit or take a day off now and then. We had read some things that seem to suggest that your body can get used to a certain type of workout and not lose weight unless you vary the intensities on different days.

Any advice?

Heart monitor. Get one. Use it. Then change things up. One day high intensity, the next, recovery at a lower heart rate.

And forget the old target rate crap. There is new science out now. Zone training.

Monitoring your heart rate while you exercise provides a constant measure of your exercise intensity. Exercising at the right intensity for the right amount of time is the key to getting the most out of your workouts and meeting your fitness goals.

Heart Rate Training helps you exercise smarter-not harder. It can help you lose weight, increase your metabolism, increase your speed and help you avoid overtraining.

I'll include a link here to a place where you get download an Adobe file that shows how to figure your "anaerobic threshold" or AT. It also gives training zones around your AT. You need to spend a certain amount of time working your heart, which usually called "intense" cardio. This burns sugar and carbs but when they're gone, you burn muscle. Kind of counter-productive, right?

You also need to train your body how to use stored fat for fuel. To do that you work out in much lower zones for a longer period of time. It is almost too easy but very effective.

I read about a runner who used to work in one fast mile at about 5:30 in each workout. His trainer had him stay at a lower heart rate for three months. IN the beginning he ran an 8:20 mile at the lower heart rate. By the end of the three months he could run a 5:20 mile at the same heart rate. Even better, he wasn't starving after a workout because his body was using its own fuel. Sure, he needed a recovery meal of some sort but wasn't screaming for food.

The point here is that many people work their asses off and accomplish much less than they could if they just understood how the body really works.

And nutrition is another whole topic, especially post workout. There is a 30-45 minute "window of opportunity" to get in the right stuff - like protein - so it hits your muscles. Later than that and it isn't used the same way.

Good luck!

stevie667 · 07-31-2005, 02:17 PM

At the moment, i'm doing a half hour of cycling every morning when i get up on an empty stomach for fat loss purposes. It damn well works, but combined with the calorie reduced diet, and my general lack of lean edible meats, it does make me very hungry.
When i'm trying to gain weight, i do cardio 2-4 days a week, depending on how lazy i'm feeling.

If weightlifting, leave 6 hours after cardio (or preferably do it afterwards) until you lift weights for the body to get out of it's catabolic state.

If your not weightlifting, do loads of cardio whenever, it's great for you!

thingstodo · 08-01-2005, 03:11 AM

[QUOTE=stevie667]At the moment, i'm doing a half hour of cycling every morning when i get up on an empty stomach for fat loss purposes. It damn well works, but combined with the calorie reduced diet, and my general lack of lean edible meats, it does make me very hungry.
When i'm trying to gain weight, i do cardio 2-4 days a week, depending on how lazy i'm feeling.
QUOTE]
Two curiousities:

1. Wouldn't you naturally be more hungry working out more? Unless you haven't trainined your body to process fat for fuel.
2. I don't see how you gain weight by doing cardio.

Sorry, a third: your body needs fuel to operate, just not too much or the wrong kind. Seems unusual to excercise with no fuel of any kind.

stevie667 · 08-01-2005, 05:51 AM

[QUOTE=thingstodo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevie667

At the moment, i'm doing a half hour of cycling every morning when i get up on an empty stomach for fat loss purposes. It damn well works, but combined with the calorie reduced diet, and my general lack of lean edible meats, it does make me very hungry.
When i'm trying to gain weight, i do cardio 2-4 days a week, depending on how lazy i'm feeling.
QUOTE]
Two curiousities:

1. Wouldn't you naturally be more hungry working out more? Unless you haven't trainined your body to process fat for fuel.
2. I don't see how you gain weight by doing cardio.

Sorry, a third: your body needs fuel to operate, just not too much or the wrong kind. Seems unusual to excercise with no fuel of any kind.

Firstly, my mistake with wording, i'm always hungry, cardio makes me hungry-er.

Secondly, also my mistake with wording, i meant to say that i only do cardio 2-4 days a week to keep lean whilst eating loads and working out, the cardio itself doesn't make me gain weight. It does make me hungry though, so refer to point one

Thirdly, cardio on an empty stomach does make you lose fat, along with some muscle if your not careful. It's all to do with insulin and going from a sedentary to active state rather quickly, and the metabolic boost the rest of the day. I'll see if i can find the exact reason today.
For some it doesn't work, for me it does.

My wording was slightly off in most of those, so i see how it could be slightly confusing at times.

thingstodo · 08-02-2005, 03:28 PM

I'll be interested to learn what you find out regarding burning fat on an empty stomach and how it works differently.

stevie667 · 08-03-2005, 02:35 AM

the reason morning cardio is efficient is bc your body has very little insulin if any release going on and therefore, fat loss in not impeded - Pulled that off a bodybuilding forum.

Morning cardio isn't for everyone, but i like it, gives me loads of energy the rest of the day.

thingstodo · 08-06-2005, 04:22 AM

I see what you mean. One word of caution: if you do any high intensity cardio, your body will use fuel from your muscles as it will look for sugar, won't find it and then look for protein sources.

The morning cardio should be very low intensity. Most people don't understand what low is and don't measure it with a heart monitor.

I refer you to the chart mentioned in a previous post on this thread. If your max heart rate is, say ~170, your threshold moving from fat/sugar burning to mainly sugar is about ~155. You would need to stay closer to 140-145 (or even lower) to be safe as far as a fuel source is concerned. Also, the more you train your body to process fat in these ranges, the more it will do so when you jump to higher ranges.

I can't say enough about heart monitors and understanding your personal training zones. Most people work out WAY too hard and get little benefit.

Stompy · 08-10-2005, 07:55 AM

You can do high intensity cardio in the morning - it doesn't really matter.

One thing I learned about losing weight is that everyone is generally wrong when it comes to things like "don't workout in the AM on an empty stomach". There's so much conflicting info... some say it's bad, some say it's good, blah blah. Eh, too much and gives me a headache - to be honest, it doesn't really matter.

Try them both out. If one doesn't work, switch it up.

There's no such thing as "too much" cardio unless you're going beyond what your body can handle. Just compensate foodwise and make sure you get the right amount of calories your body needs to maintain itself so it doesn't lose muscle.. and of course, cut back if you wanna lose fat - that simple.

I lost 45 lbs in 2 months by doing high intensity interval training (HIIT) each morning... 45 lbs of fat, not muscle.

I usually walk for 2 mins at 65% max heart rate, then go all out running till I reach 90%.. then walk until it goes back down to 65%... repeat for 20 mins.

Very good way to lose fat - I did it for 30 mins each morning (sometimes 20 if I was really tired). Every other day I went to the gym and lifted. I didn't lose any muscle because I had consistent gains in my lifting.

If you run in the AM on an empty stomach, as long as you eat somethin shortly after, you'll be fine. If there is any muscle loss, it's so miniscule that it's not really important. A few days in the gym during the week will MORE than make up for any supposed muscle loss.

I mean, 30 mins a day cardio in the AM on an empty stomach, it's not like your muscles are just gonna shrivel up and disappear.

thingstodo · 08-13-2005, 04:30 AM

Stompy:

I really scares me when someone says they lost "45 pounds in two months." You apparently are/were a very unusual situation. What was your weight when you began this program? Fast weight loss like this usually results in rebound gains later. Rome was one of the few places not built in a day but destroyed in a day.

I really think you would benefit from understanding the biological fundamentals behind training your body to process fat vs. sugar. What worked for you may be different for others. It is documented that you can train your body to be more effective. And it is also a fact that, when working at high entisity levels, your body will look to protein for fuel when it runs out of sugar to process and doesn't know how to effectively process stored fat.

Heck, there are guys out there that can run back-to-back marathons, and it's all genetics - their body mechanics and how they process fuel.

You really have no idea how much muscle you lost and where you might be now had you trained smarter. Plus, age has a huge role in the process.

So my point is to teach your body to process fat so morning high intensity cardio is really effective. Here are a few interesting links:

http://www.drlenkravitz.com/Articles...threshold.html
http://www.drlenkravitz.com/Articles...rformance.html
http://www.drlenkravitz.com/Articles/genderdiffer.html

Why not work out smarter if you can and enjoy even better benefits?

Stompy · 08-15-2005, 12:27 PM

I went from 255-260 down to 210-215. That's about 5 lbs a week, which isn't bad at all considering I went from "drinking Mt Dew, eating bullshit" to "100% healthy foods, no soda, lots of water."

This was about 3 years ago when I was 21 and I kept it off (and even more) until earlier this year when I was sick for months on end w/ my throat infections/sleep apnea. I didn't gain it ALL back, but some because I stopped working out while maintaining my 'active' BMR caloric intake when I wasn't doing a whole lot.

Trust me, I didn't lose muscle. I lost tons of fat and had amazing definition in most areas afterwards. Like I said, I had consistent (although slow) gains in my lifting - which can't happen if you're losing muscle.

I know all about the low level workings of nutrition and working out (ie lipolysis and lipogenesis vs how it's stored/burned, etc) - still, mixing cardio 5 days a week (the HIIT in the AM) as well as weight lifting 3 days a week made me shed the lbs like nothing.

It really doesn't take long to lose lots of body fat if you're eating properly. Check out http://www.johnstonefitness.com. I found out my routine was pretty much identical to his - but if you look at his progress pics, he too lost decent amounts of body fat in just 3 months.

I personally didn't lose AS much because I was also gaining in my lifts, but the results were still great.

I've been back on my routine for 3 weeks now and have lost over 10 lbs. I'm not focusing as much on gains in lifting since I'm cutting, but I keep the lifting weights consistent and don't have any problems whatsoever in performting the actions.

Maybe it's what I eat, but I calculate my BMR and right off the bat cut 500 cals off, so that alone will make me lost 1 lb of fat a week - 20% of what I eat are EFA's (olive oil, salmon), 40% is carbs, all low GI (oatmeal, 100% whole what bread, brown rice, etc) with the occasional apple/banana/strawberry, and 40% in protein (chicken, tuna, shrimp, etc). I eat 6 small meals a day (every 2 hrs).

One day a week I eat whatever I want.

That's really it - and 5 days a week, Mon - Fri I do the HIIT for 30 mins in the AM. Right after I drink whey protein and eat a banana. Every other day do lifting at the gym (which I actually haven't been doin as much). Even still, I get very good results.

Guess you'd have to have seen it for yourself to believe - but I heard the same types of things all along "you'll be losing muscle" or "you shouldn't work out that much".. and none of it was true.

It was nothing but beneficial and I'm amazed and happy w/ the results.

[edit]
And I think some portions of those articles you linked to even support HIIT - the majority of the time you're walking at low intensity levels (65%).. then you kick it up to 90%, but before your body gets used to that level, you stop and lower the intensity till you get back to 65%. Your body doesn't stay in the anaerobic state for very long at all.

thingstodo · 08-16-2005, 03:26 AM

Please understand, I am all for high intensity. I just rode yesterday for two hours and did a total of an hour of that at 90%. But I also spent months training my body at lower levels to process fat and not sugar at high levels. And I still do recovery rides and aerobic endurance rides in between the high training days. It is balance. I am also for taking care of my body, especially for the long term, also balance.

It obviously works for you! I suppose 30 minutes of cardio - leaving you perhaps 15 qctual minutes of that when you factor in the warm up and cool down time - with no fuel isn't a big deal. I also suspect there are other factors at play. Sound like you eat just a little veggie/fruit. You do need the 5-9 servings of that stuff. Heck, Atkins worked for some but all the meat and lard will have a long-term impact.

Stompy · 08-16-2005, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thingstodo

I suppose 30 minutes of cardio - leaving you perhaps 15 qctual minutes of that when you factor in the warm up and cool down time - with no fuel isn't a big deal.

That's the entire point of HIIT in the AM. Your body DOES have fuel - fat stores. Because of the high intensity, your metabolism is kicked into high gear for the remainder of the day.

When you wake up, there's less glycogen since you haven't eaten for 8+ hours. When there's low glycogen, you burn more fat.

When you eat, insulin comes into play. Lack of insulin in the AM - more fat loss!

Next up - less glucose. Same deal here. Less glucose, more fat burning.

Just like I said above, for every study there's a study to counter it. Each thing you list out I could EASILY counter, as I've had this debate many times before. Likewise on your part - each thing I list to counter what you said could be just as easily countered, etc.

The cycle of proving points when it comes to fitness doesn't end and that's why people reading this are going to be confused when they shouldn't be. Is what I'm saying wrong? No. Is what you're saying wrong? No. They need to know and understand flat out that here is NO definitive method for anything.

They need to just try various techniques for a month or two and see how it fits them.

All it boils down to for fat loss - eat healthy, exercise.

Leo · 08-17-2005, 05:05 AM

Like alot of the others, I find cardio is OK every day so long as you vary the intensity. I have reduced my training recently but used to exercise 6 days a week and loved it. I think varying the type of cardio exercise helps keep the intest up as well as avoiding over doing it on a particular part of the body (eg knees for runners) - so run, walk, bike, swim, etc...

Stompy · 08-17-2005, 03:45 PM

Here's a good article on the AM cardio that gets into detail as to what exactly is going on: http://www.leehayward.com/am_cardio.htm

thingstodo · 08-18-2005, 03:23 AM

From your article:

"A common concern about doing cardio in the fasted state, especially if it’s done with high intensity, is the possibility of losing muscle. After an overnight fast, glycogen, blood glucose and insulin are all low. As we’ve already concluded, this is an optimum environment for burning fat. Unfortunately, it may also be an optimum environment for burning muscle because carbohydrate fuel sources are low and levels of the catabolic stress hormone cortisol are high. It sounds like morning cardio might be a double-edged sword, but there are ways to avert muscle loss."

Notice the last sentence. I think yo are so focused on defending your point (and I appreciate you saying we could both be right) that you haven't heard my KEY point.

I agree with wwhat you are saying, as long as you understand this caveat. You need to train your body to process fat at higher intensity levels so your body doesn't rob muscles as much for fuel. That's what can make the difference and make you the most effective.

So understand, I don't disagree with morning HIIT with no food - you just need to train to be effective there by building a base. And perhaps you've done that with all your lisfting. I used to think the same way until I spent the time training at lower levels so I could be the most effective at higher levels - food or no food. Like my 2 hour workout the other day Normally I would have used a gel pack half way through but now I can do the 2 hours with no food and not be starving at the end. Even though I do hit a shake and fruit for immediate recovery after.

As far as metabolism after working out, lifting cranks it for 48 hours where cardio only last up to 8 hours.

We're both on the same team here.

thingstodo · 09-01-2005, 04:34 PM

Here the link to an article I have been trying to locate. I think you'll find it explains base training from a pretty reputable source.

http://www.duathlon.com/articles/1460

dman2 · 09-10-2005, 12:48 PM

Every day is fine. However, as has been stated, you will need to mix it up a little bit. My brother has been running every day for as long as I can remember. The problem is, he has not been doing much of anything else. He just started riding his mountain bike twice a week for 8 hours (on duty as police officer) and working out. This is where he is showing a change. His body was not used to this and now the changes have begun.

thingstodo · 09-29-2005, 01:10 PM

I just ran across an article in the newest Lifetime Fitness Magazine. It is based on data from a person that manages the site www.powereating.com. This person says that you shouldn't do cardio on an empty stomach. Might be worth looking through the site.

08-04-2003, 12:42 PM	#1 (permalink)
Antagony Psychopathic Akimbo Action Pirate Location: ...between Christ and Belial.	Cardio every day? Is it safe to do cardio-intensive workouts on an almost daily basis? I know that with strength training you need to allow muscles time to heal or your muscles can't bulk up. Is there some sort of similar rule with cardio, or am I safe to continue with my frequent martial arts practice? __________________ On the outside I'm jazz, but my soul is rock and roll. Sleep is a waste of time. Join the Insomniac Club. "GYOH GWAH-DAH GREH BLAAA! SROH WIH DIH FLIH RYOHH!!" - The Locust

08-04-2003, 11:35 PM	#7 (permalink)
cliche Rookie Location: Oxford, UK	take a day off, or at least an extremely light day, every week - otherwise you end up overtraining (I did) and it's not pretty! __________________ I can't understand why people are frightened of new ideas. I'm frightened of the old ones. -- John Cage (1912 - 1992)

08-05-2003, 03:55 AM	#9 (permalink)
Loup Pup no More Location: Voted the Best	You can do cardio every day (as Mael said). But it is suggested that change it up each day. From a 45 minute jog one day to a 15 minute sprint another day to a slow off-trail run on another, etc. As for your Martial Arts practice, there should be no trouble. __________________ "If you cannot lift the load off another's back, do not walk away. Try to lighten it." ~ Frank Tyger

08-07-2003, 12:32 PM	#10 (permalink)
The_Jazz Asshole Administrator Location: Chicago	You can do cardio as much as you want. It really depends on what you're doing, what your goals are, etc. If you're trying to build muscle mass, then going for a 9 mile run every day is not for you. If you're trying to tone, then a 9 miler may not be so bad. WAAAAY back in the day, I ran cross country and track in college. Since we had an indoor season, it was a year round sport for me. I went through my logs about 6 months ago and saw that between May (end of track) and the end of November (the end of XC), I took off a total of 3 days and averaged 68 miles per week. I would have only missed 1 day and averaged closer to 77 miles if I hadn't tapered for the end of the season. I say this to prove my point - do as much cardio as you think is good for you. Just listen to your body. __________________ "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - B. Franklin "There ought to be limits to freedom." - George W. Bush "We have met the enemy and he is us." - Pogo

08-08-2003, 02:26 PM	#16 (permalink)
Antagony Psychopathic Akimbo Action Pirate Location: ...between Christ and Belial.	Hmmmm, change it up, eh? That's actually kind of difficult in my case. I want to do martial arts every day. Even though I'm doing different forms and what-not, my body feels about the same at the end of each workout. What I mean is that I get about the same amount of intensity every day. I guess I'll have to supplement that with bodyweight exercises like push-ups and such. Thanks guys, this thread has been helpful. __________________ On the outside I'm jazz, but my soul is rock and roll. Sleep is a waste of time. Join the Insomniac Club. "GYOH GWAH-DAH GREH BLAAA! SROH WIH DIH FLIH RYOHH!!" - The Locust

08-04-2003, 05:53 PM	#2 (permalink)
xshadowx Crazy	I too would like to know the answer to this

08-04-2003, 06:01 PM	#3 (permalink)
athleticsfan615 Upright Location: Boone, NC	It depends on the type of workout but I think an hour or half hour of cardio done 3-5 times a week is good. I took a jogging class in college and was told that any more than 5 days a week of extensive cardio was just wasting your time and didn't do anything.

08-04-2003, 07:13 PM	#4 (permalink)
Rodney Observant Ruminant Location: Rich Wannabe Hippie Town	Whether you're talking cardio, strength training, or both, it's always best to give the body days 1-2 days off a week to rest and heal. Avoids injuries, gives the body time to build itself up.

08-04-2003, 08:02 PM	#5 (permalink)
cetacean Insane Location: New York, NY	Rest is my favorite part of the workout. I really enjoy the muscle ache after a good workout, it lets you know you've done something. I try to do cardio 3-4 times a week and I haven't had any problems, but I do feel like their is room for more. When I was younger, I wrestled. Our practices were six days a week and very intense. I don't think I have ever been in such good shape.

08-04-2003, 10:57 PM	#6 (permalink)
Mael Banned Location: The Hell I Created.	you can do cardio every day. just don't have them always be "intense." that can lead to overtraining (increased heartbeat, irritability, trouble sleeping) which isn't good. so best thing to do if you want to do non-strength training exercise every day is to not go all out every day, maybe hard one day, easy the next (intense short run/easy long jog) and having one or two days where you do a different type of activity such as play basketball or tennis.

08-05-2003, 12:28 AM	#8 (permalink)
Sleepyjack Fast'n'Bulbous Location: Australia, Perth	just vary the intensitites. Try to get 30 mins of excercise a day.

08-08-2003, 08:28 AM	#11 (permalink)
skysooner Registered User Location: Oklahoma	Two questions here: I've started a heavy weight loss program (Weight Watchers) combined with cardio 5 or 6 days a week. I also do some ab and weight work but not intensively as we are waiting for a gym near our house to open their doors. I'm doing an hour on a recumbant bike on those days I do cardio. I know the recommendation is to do roughly 30 minutes of cardio at your target heart rate daily. Is it better to step up the resistance on the bike or to go for speed and distance or does it really matter? I'm burning roughly 720 calories in an hour at my current rate. My wife is in pretty decent shape but gained about 4 lbs over our Mexican vacation about a month ago. She has been trying to lose it ever since. She also does Weight Watchers and runs 4 to 5 miles 7 days a week. The weight is just not coming off, and she wasn't sure whether she needed to vary her exercise a bit or take a day off now and then. We had read some things that seem to suggest that your body can get used to a certain type of workout and not lose weight unless you vary the intensities on different days. Any advice?

08-08-2003, 12:29 PM	#12 (permalink)
human Tilted Location: Ottawa, ON, Canada	Skysooner: I don't think it really matters all that much, especially for weight loss as long as you are doing something. If you don't mind doing it for an hour, keep doing that and slowly over the weeks increase the speed/resistance. As far as I know, building cardio ability centers mostly on keeping your heart rate up for an extended period of time, the heart is a muscle, working it out is good! Best advice I have for your wife, again, this is just personal experience, so everybody is different etc.... If the weight is stable, that generally means caloric intake=energy burned over the course of a day. By having a slight caloric deficit, you will lose weight. So, seeing as the current regime is good, if she can work out a touch longer or go on a slight (drop maybe 100-200 calories a day tops from normal) diet for a week or two, she should be able to drop the four lbs, then go back to normal and stay there. Good luck all around!

08-08-2003, 01:15 PM	#13 (permalink)
skysooner Registered User Location: Oklahoma	Thanks human. I'm really liking working out (7 weeks now), and I certainly like the results (down 22 lbs as of today with about 40 to go). Part of the problem with my wife might be muscle building. She is 5'6", 120 lbs and hardly has any fat on her. I tell her she looks better now than she did before we went on vacation. I think it is possible some of it turned into muscle as she appears to be more toned to me. However I will pass on your advice and see how it works.

08-08-2003, 01:38 PM	#14 (permalink)
blackdas Crazy	I'm trying to put on mass and I heard that in my case doing cardio is a bad idea (low body fat), but some people say it might be worth doign some low intensity cardio once or twice a week.

07-31-2005, 06:38 AM	#17 (permalink)
debiljim Upright	BFFM tom venuto's BFFM says theres nothing wrong with cardio 6-7 days a week. he even suggests double cardio if you really want to burn the fat. i have been running 40 min every morning on an empty stomach, and 30 min in the afternoon after i workout one body part for the past 4 weeks. i have dropped so many lbs it's ridiculous. my only concern is that i've been totally satisfied with 6 hours of sleep everynight, and everytime i wake up i HAVE to run... it's almost like a drug. my appetite hasnt changed, i still eat 5-6 times a day, and my concentration is up to par. so i'm not sure if it's my circadian rhythm that is causing me to wake up at the same time everyday regardless of how many hours of sleep i get, or if it's a sign of overtraining. suggestions? Last edited by debiljim; 08-01-2005 at 04:22 AM..

07-31-2005, 07:09 AM	#18 (permalink)
jhkayakr Insane Location: under the skirt	if your healthy, why not? always smart to ask a doctor. My doc says ok, just stay hydrated. __________________ ........gotta need for speed....

07-31-2005, 02:17 PM	#20 (permalink)
stevie667 Too Awesome for Aardvarks Location: Angloland	At the moment, i'm doing a half hour of cycling every morning when i get up on an empty stomach for fat loss purposes. It damn well works, but combined with the calorie reduced diet, and my general lack of lean edible meats, it does make me very hungry. When i'm trying to gain weight, i do cardio 2-4 days a week, depending on how lazy i'm feeling. If weightlifting, leave 6 hours after cardio (or preferably do it afterwards) until you lift weights for the body to get out of it's catabolic state. If your not weightlifting, do loads of cardio whenever, it's great for you! __________________ Office hours have changed. Please call during office hours for more information.

08-01-2005, 03:11 AM	#21 (permalink)
thingstodo A Storm Is Coming Location: The Great White North	[QUOTE=stevie667]At the moment, i'm doing a half hour of cycling every morning when i get up on an empty stomach for fat loss purposes. It damn well works, but combined with the calorie reduced diet, and my general lack of lean edible meats, it does make me very hungry. When i'm trying to gain weight, i do cardio 2-4 days a week, depending on how lazy i'm feeling. QUOTE] Two curiousities: 1. Wouldn't you naturally be more hungry working out more? Unless you haven't trainined your body to process fat for fuel. 2. I don't see how you gain weight by doing cardio. Sorry, a third: your body needs fuel to operate, just not too much or the wrong kind. Seems unusual to excercise with no fuel of any kind. __________________ If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves. Stangers have the best candy.

08-02-2005, 03:28 PM	#23 (permalink)
thingstodo A Storm Is Coming Location: The Great White North	I'll be interested to learn what you find out regarding burning fat on an empty stomach and how it works differently. __________________ If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves. Stangers have the best candy.

08-03-2005, 02:35 AM	#24 (permalink)
stevie667 Too Awesome for Aardvarks Location: Angloland	the reason morning cardio is efficient is bc your body has very little insulin if any release going on and therefore, fat loss in not impeded - Pulled that off a bodybuilding forum. Morning cardio isn't for everyone, but i like it, gives me loads of energy the rest of the day. __________________ Office hours have changed. Please call during office hours for more information.

08-06-2005, 04:22 AM	#25 (permalink)
thingstodo A Storm Is Coming Location: The Great White North	I see what you mean. One word of caution: if you do any high intensity cardio, your body will use fuel from your muscles as it will look for sugar, won't find it and then look for protein sources. The morning cardio should be very low intensity. Most people don't understand what low is and don't measure it with a heart monitor. I refer you to the chart mentioned in a previous post on this thread. If your max heart rate is, say ~170, your threshold moving from fat/sugar burning to mainly sugar is about ~155. You would need to stay closer to 140-145 (or even lower) to be safe as far as a fuel source is concerned. Also, the more you train your body to process fat in these ranges, the more it will do so when you jump to higher ranges. I can't say enough about heart monitors and understanding your personal training zones. Most people work out WAY too hard and get little benefit. __________________ If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves. Stangers have the best candy.

08-10-2005, 07:55 AM	#26 (permalink)
Stompy Banned from being Banned Location: Donkey	You can do high intensity cardio in the morning - it doesn't really matter. One thing I learned about losing weight is that everyone is generally wrong when it comes to things like "don't workout in the AM on an empty stomach". There's so much conflicting info... some say it's bad, some say it's good, blah blah. Eh, too much and gives me a headache - to be honest, it doesn't really matter. Try them both out. If one doesn't work, switch it up. There's no such thing as "too much" cardio unless you're going beyond what your body can handle. Just compensate foodwise and make sure you get the right amount of calories your body needs to maintain itself so it doesn't lose muscle.. and of course, cut back if you wanna lose fat - that simple. I lost 45 lbs in 2 months by doing high intensity interval training (HIIT) each morning... 45 lbs of fat, not muscle. I usually walk for 2 mins at 65% max heart rate, then go all out running till I reach 90%.. then walk until it goes back down to 65%... repeat for 20 mins. Very good way to lose fat - I did it for 30 mins each morning (sometimes 20 if I was really tired). Every other day I went to the gym and lifted. I didn't lose any muscle because I had consistent gains in my lifting. If you run in the AM on an empty stomach, as long as you eat somethin shortly after, you'll be fine. If there is any muscle loss, it's so miniscule that it's not really important. A few days in the gym during the week will MORE than make up for any supposed muscle loss. I mean, 30 mins a day cardio in the AM on an empty stomach, it's not like your muscles are just gonna shrivel up and disappear. __________________ I love lamp. Last edited by Stompy; 08-10-2005 at 07:58 AM..

08-13-2005, 04:30 AM	#27 (permalink)
thingstodo A Storm Is Coming Location: The Great White North	Stompy: I really scares me when someone says they lost "45 pounds in two months." You apparently are/were a very unusual situation. What was your weight when you began this program? Fast weight loss like this usually results in rebound gains later. Rome was one of the few places not built in a day but destroyed in a day. I really think you would benefit from understanding the biological fundamentals behind training your body to process fat vs. sugar. What worked for you may be different for others. It is documented that you can train your body to be more effective. And it is also a fact that, when working at high entisity levels, your body will look to protein for fuel when it runs out of sugar to process and doesn't know how to effectively process stored fat. Heck, there are guys out there that can run back-to-back marathons, and it's all genetics - their body mechanics and how they process fuel. You really have no idea how much muscle you lost and where you might be now had you trained smarter. Plus, age has a huge role in the process. So my point is to teach your body to process fat so morning high intensity cardio is really effective. Here are a few interesting links: http://www.drlenkravitz.com/Articles...threshold.html http://www.drlenkravitz.com/Articles...rformance.html http://www.drlenkravitz.com/Articles/genderdiffer.html Why not work out smarter if you can and enjoy even better benefits? __________________ If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves. Stangers have the best candy. Last edited by thingstodo; 08-13-2005 at 04:35 AM..

08-15-2005, 12:27 PM	#28 (permalink)
Stompy Banned from being Banned Location: Donkey	I went from 255-260 down to 210-215. That's about 5 lbs a week, which isn't bad at all considering I went from "drinking Mt Dew, eating bullshit" to "100% healthy foods, no soda, lots of water." This was about 3 years ago when I was 21 and I kept it off (and even more) until earlier this year when I was sick for months on end w/ my throat infections/sleep apnea. I didn't gain it ALL back, but some because I stopped working out while maintaining my 'active' BMR caloric intake when I wasn't doing a whole lot. Trust me, I didn't lose muscle. I lost tons of fat and had amazing definition in most areas afterwards. Like I said, I had consistent (although slow) gains in my lifting - which can't happen if you're losing muscle. I know all about the low level workings of nutrition and working out (ie lipolysis and lipogenesis vs how it's stored/burned, etc) - still, mixing cardio 5 days a week (the HIIT in the AM) as well as weight lifting 3 days a week made me shed the lbs like nothing. It really doesn't take long to lose lots of body fat if you're eating properly. Check out http://www.johnstonefitness.com. I found out my routine was pretty much identical to his - but if you look at his progress pics, he too lost decent amounts of body fat in just 3 months. I personally didn't lose AS much because I was also gaining in my lifts, but the results were still great. I've been back on my routine for 3 weeks now and have lost over 10 lbs. I'm not focusing as much on gains in lifting since I'm cutting, but I keep the lifting weights consistent and don't have any problems whatsoever in performting the actions. Maybe it's what I eat, but I calculate my BMR and right off the bat cut 500 cals off, so that alone will make me lost 1 lb of fat a week - 20% of what I eat are EFA's (olive oil, salmon), 40% is carbs, all low GI (oatmeal, 100% whole what bread, brown rice, etc) with the occasional apple/banana/strawberry, and 40% in protein (chicken, tuna, shrimp, etc). I eat 6 small meals a day (every 2 hrs). One day a week I eat whatever I want. That's really it - and 5 days a week, Mon - Fri I do the HIIT for 30 mins in the AM. Right after I drink whey protein and eat a banana. Every other day do lifting at the gym (which I actually haven't been doin as much). Even still, I get very good results. Guess you'd have to have seen it for yourself to believe - but I heard the same types of things all along "you'll be losing muscle" or "you shouldn't work out that much".. and none of it was true. It was nothing but beneficial and I'm amazed and happy w/ the results. [edit] And I think some portions of those articles you linked to even support HIIT - the majority of the time you're walking at low intensity levels (65%).. then you kick it up to 90%, but before your body gets used to that level, you stop and lower the intensity till you get back to 65%. Your body doesn't stay in the anaerobic state for very long at all. __________________ I love lamp. Last edited by Stompy; 08-15-2005 at 12:50 PM..

08-16-2005, 03:26 AM	#29 (permalink)
thingstodo A Storm Is Coming Location: The Great White North	Please understand, I am all for high intensity. I just rode yesterday for two hours and did a total of an hour of that at 90%. But I also spent months training my body at lower levels to process fat and not sugar at high levels. And I still do recovery rides and aerobic endurance rides in between the high training days. It is balance. I am also for taking care of my body, especially for the long term, also balance. It obviously works for you! I suppose 30 minutes of cardio - leaving you perhaps 15 qctual minutes of that when you factor in the warm up and cool down time - with no fuel isn't a big deal. I also suspect there are other factors at play. Sound like you eat just a little veggie/fruit. You do need the 5-9 servings of that stuff. Heck, Atkins worked for some but all the meat and lard will have a long-term impact. __________________ If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves. Stangers have the best candy.

08-17-2005, 05:05 AM	#31 (permalink)
Leo Tilted	Like alot of the others, I find cardio is OK every day so long as you vary the intensity. I have reduced my training recently but used to exercise 6 days a week and loved it. I think varying the type of cardio exercise helps keep the intest up as well as avoiding over doing it on a particular part of the body (eg knees for runners) - so run, walk, bike, swim, etc...

08-17-2005, 03:45 PM	#32 (permalink)
Stompy Banned from being Banned Location: Donkey	Here's a good article on the AM cardio that gets into detail as to what exactly is going on: http://www.leehayward.com/am_cardio.htm __________________ I love lamp.

08-18-2005, 03:23 AM	#33 (permalink)
thingstodo A Storm Is Coming Location: The Great White North	From your article: "A common concern about doing cardio in the fasted state, especially if it’s done with high intensity, is the possibility of losing muscle. After an overnight fast, glycogen, blood glucose and insulin are all low. As we’ve already concluded, this is an optimum environment for burning fat. Unfortunately, it may also be an optimum environment for burning muscle because carbohydrate fuel sources are low and levels of the catabolic stress hormone cortisol are high. It sounds like morning cardio might be a double-edged sword, but there are ways to avert muscle loss." Notice the last sentence. I think yo are so focused on defending your point (and I appreciate you saying we could both be right) that you haven't heard my KEY point. I agree with wwhat you are saying, as long as you understand this caveat. You need to train your body to process fat at higher intensity levels so your body doesn't rob muscles as much for fuel. That's what can make the difference and make you the most effective. So understand, I don't disagree with morning HIIT with no food - you just need to train to be effective there by building a base. And perhaps you've done that with all your lisfting. I used to think the same way until I spent the time training at lower levels so I could be the most effective at higher levels - food or no food. Like my 2 hour workout the other day Normally I would have used a gel pack half way through but now I can do the 2 hours with no food and not be starving at the end. Even though I do hit a shake and fruit for immediate recovery after. As far as metabolism after working out, lifting cranks it for 48 hours where cardio only last up to 8 hours. We're both on the same team here. __________________ If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves. Stangers have the best candy.

09-01-2005, 04:34 PM	#34 (permalink)
thingstodo A Storm Is Coming Location: The Great White North	Here the link to an article I have been trying to locate. I think you'll find it explains base training from a pretty reputable source. http://www.duathlon.com/articles/1460 __________________ If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves. Stangers have the best candy.

09-10-2005, 12:48 PM	#35 (permalink)
dman2 Insane Location: Georgia	Every day is fine. However, as has been stated, you will need to mix it up a little bit. My brother has been running every day for as long as I can remember. The problem is, he has not been doing much of anything else. He just started riding his mountain bike twice a week for 8 hours (on duty as police officer) and working out. This is where he is showing a change. His body was not used to this and now the changes have begun. __________________ I have to exercise in the morning before my brain figures out what I'm doing. ~Marsha Doble

09-29-2005, 01:10 PM	#36 (permalink)
thingstodo A Storm Is Coming Location: The Great White North	I just ran across an article in the newest Lifetime Fitness Magazine. It is based on data from a person that manages the site www.powereating.com. This person says that you shouldn't do cardio on an empty stomach. Might be worth looking through the site. __________________ If you're wringing your hands you can't roll up your shirt sleeves. Stangers have the best candy.