ophelia783

Majik_6 and I got engaged 3 months ago, and ever since then, all I ever hear is, "So when's the big day?" When people find out it's 3 years from now, they look absolutly shocked, and don't understand why.

Keep in mind, we're both 21, students, and we've been together a relatively short time (almost 5 months). Also, we're a long-distance couple (he's from West Virginia, I live in Montreal), and we want to live together for a couple of years and get our finances in order before we tie the knot.

How many of you have/had long engagements? What were the reasons behind your decision? How did those around you react?

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Redlemon

Our official engagement period was about 1.25 years; however, I had made it clear to Hotdish two years before my actual proposal that we would be getting married someday; we were only 6 months out of college at that time, similar to your position. The only difference was that we didn't tell anybody.

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superredhead

long engagements arent a bad thing. you've definitely got your head on straight thinking about finances, feasiblity, and living together. rushing into marriage without giving thought to important issues is a very detrimental thing to a relationship, and three years is a good time period to work out all the kinks and get to know each other before getting married especially since you have been together for a relatively short time. i say good luck to ya and forget those people who have a problem with the 3 year engagement.

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cellophanedeity

My love and I have been together for three years, and we talk about getting married all the time, but we're not engaged. To be honest, I think a lot of the reason for this is because I don't have the money to buy him a ring yet, but there are other reasons for us to not be engaged as well. Mind you, that's just for us.

But I've noticed that long engagements are becoming more popular now that I'm in University. One of the couples I know has been engaged for a year and a half now, and I don't think they'll get married until next August. Another of my friends has been engaged for a year now, and they won't tie the knot for a couple more years.

Don't worry what people say. You're in love, and that's wonderful!

Meditrina

If a long engagment is what you want, then there is absolutely nothing wrong with it. Some people really should mind their own business. These will be the same people that, once married, will keep asking when you are having children. It sounds like you have both thought this through and are doing the right thing. I would try not to worry about what others think.

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BadNick

Now that I'm on the older side of the fence so to speak, I'm 56 in a month, I think that most people would do better in life by waiting to marry until they're into their upper 20's. I know that's very general and does not apply to all. For what it's worth, I got married when I was almost 28 after living together with lovey dovey for a little over a year and knowing her for a couple years before that. Don't rush into it, take your time and see and feel out how the relationship works for both of you. Good luck and best wishes.

f6twister

My engagement to my wife lasted three years and we were dating for three years before that. We probably would have gotten married sooner but my wife was in college and we wanted to wait until she was done. I, for one, am glad that the total process took six years. By that time, we had experienced each others best and worst moods and knew nearly everything there was to know about each other. We had also moved in together and had know how it was going to be once we got married.

We started getting asked when we were getting married a year into our relationship. We just told them it would be when we are ready. Don't let the nosy people get to you. Just live your life the way you want and get married on your terms.

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Ustwo

An engagement is a public deceleration of sorts. I dated my wife for 6 years prior, but we got married about a year after we were engaged.

There are no rules here, but being engaged for 3 years does seem a bit odd. Its basically dating with a promise ring :P

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flamingdog

I don't understand why no-one has even raised this, but who the hell is to decide how long 'long' is anyway? You're engaged for as long as you want to be engaged, and the rest of em can go to hell, you ask me.

balderdash111

[Edit: never mind. I'll keep my opinions to myself.]

Oh, and to answer your question, I dated my wife for 3 years long distance, then we moved to the same city and lived together for a year before I proposed. We got married a year after that. People were fine with it, since we got married in a popular place where you need to book WAY in advance to get a church, reception place, etc

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Fallon

My fiancee and I have been engaged for 2 years in June. We're waiting till we finish school and save up a bit of money for our wedding. In reality, if we got married now, financially we'd be better off, but we want to wait till we're finished with school and such just because we know we can't afford it now. We'd prefer our wedding is nice and such instead of a hodge-podge of cheap things.

abaya

I'm curious, what does this mean? Does getting married in a popular place influence how people will see the wedding? I'd like to know, as I've been a bridesmaid 4 times in various settings... HUGE churches booked a year in advance, to someone's backyard. Heh, engagements were always short since they were all evangelicals who were waiting to have sex!!

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streak_56

I have a long engagement coming up. Though I don't think my girlfriend and I would be living together, it's going to be about 4 or so years before we decide to get married. I know I am going to start saving my ass off to make sure I can pay for it, a car, and a house. I'm sure that we will both make it. But just have fun while you're doing it. That's what I am keeping in mind.

balderdash111

I don't think the popularity of the place was why people were ok with it. Among our friends and family, a year is about normal.

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Ustwo

One doesn't need to be engaged to have an exclusive relationship.

I started to date my wife when she was 18 and we stayed together, even through a long distance phase, without any issues. The engagement was more of a formality and telling everyone else we are getting married 'soon'. While there is nothing wrong with a long engagement, don't be surprised if people raise an eyebrow when you tell them 3 years.

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billege

I chuckle at people with long engaugements.

There's always that couple who gets engauged, and for a whole bucket of reasons, puts the date years out.

I'm still waiting to see a pair of them actually get married. In my personal experiance (and I'm sure you could write a page why this doesn't apply to you) couples with the really long engaugements (anything over 18 months is "long" in my book) don't end up actually getting married. Mostly, it's because they're not serious about it in the first place.

They're never actually doing any wedding planning, just talking about it, and sometimes I swear it's just for attention. Most times, the couple thinks they're all serious about it though.
When I say wedding planning, I mean deciding what you're going to do and writing checks. Once the money starts flowing, it's a pretty reliable sign they're going to do it.

While there's nothing "wrong" with a long enguagement, I'm saying I've never actually met anyone whose long enguagement resulted in a marriage. Not once. I'm sure, with the wider audiance of the TFP (which is more people than I've met) someone did it.

While I'm at it, I'd like to express an opinion on your plan to live together and get your finances together.

Now, there's nothing wrong with getting $$ figured out. However, you can do that as a married couple just as well as a couple shacking up and pretending to be married, but without the actual responsibilies that come with being married.

If you're serious about getting married, do it. You could get hit by a bus tommorow and die. Life is too short to dick around.

I'm not suggesting you run off and get married tonight, unless you want to. But, I am saying that I think wanting to live together (unmarried) for years, when you've made (supposedly) the choice to get married is lame.

It's lame because you're saying to teh world "we've made the choice to get married" and you're asking everyone to take that seriously, then you're failing to step up to the plate.

I understand the distance factor, and the money factor, and all that stuff. If you're ready to get married, MAKE IT HAPPEN, don't dick around wasting everyone's time.

When you get out of school, whatnot, and you can make the marriage happen, you should.

Everything else is just stalling.

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billege

I wanted to respond to this seperately.

My opinion wouldn't normally count for anything, but, she asked. Thus, it matters as much as she wants it to. I don't take myself too seriously, although I occasinally say something worth seriously considering.

To answer your question: Anyone who you expect to take your engaugement seriously has the right to decide if they feel it's overly long.

If you expect your parents to care about it, they have the right to an opinion. If you don't give a shat if they participate in any way, and expect literally nothing from them, then I suppose they don't.

Same with friends. If you expect them to listen to you talk about it, and/or you want thier support, they get to have an opinion.

That's how it works.

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I can sum up the clash of religion in one sentence:
"My Invisible Friend is better than your Invisible Friend."

flamingdog

Yeah, they get to have an opinion on it, I can't stop that. But basically, I expect my friends and family to take my engagement seriously because they trust my word, not because they arbitrarily decided how long an engagement ought to be, how long we ought to be courting the idea before we 'tie the knot'.

Frankly, if I propose to my woman tomorrow and set a date ten years from now, I expect my parents to be there just the same as if I'd set the day for next freakin' week. That's called unconditional love and support. Same goes for my friends, and if they have a problem with the way I'm behaving, they can tell me, and we can talk it out, or they can stop calling themselves my friends. As long as my reasons are pure (and I'm always open to self-analysis), then what business is it of theirs?

Answer: MY commitment to the person I want to spend the rest of MY life with is nobody's business but MY own (and the business of my partner, obviously - though, that isn't the question), and frankly, I don't give a shit if my friends and family take me seriously or not - about as much as I care whether they think it's overly long or not. They can raise their opinion to me, sure, I won't deny them that. But I won't accept ridicule, doubt or nit-picking on the basis of value judgements as long as I believe what I'm doing is right for me, for my partner, and in both cases, for the right reasons.

I suppose what all this boils down to is: It's your engagement, and it can last for the rest of your life if you and your partner so choose. That's my opinion on the matter.

Edit: With all that said, I agree with this one hundred per cent:

Cynthetiq

We were planning on a lengthy engagement of 2.5-3 years because of where we wanted to get married in Iceland at Skogafoss along with the logistics of getting the family members over.

I proposed in Nov. 2000, and the Xmas after 9/11, I said to her, "I don't want to die without being married to you." and we got married 60 days later, much to the annoyance of the rest of the family. They thought they were going to have lots of time, and suddenly we were rushing them.

edit: oooh..sorry, bad math, from 12/25/04 - 02.02.02, is not 60 days, it's just over 30

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betula

I have lived with my girlfriend for about 3 years now, and I've given thought to proposing. However, the biggest thing keeping me from doing that is that I wouldn't know when we'd actually get married. I personally don't want a long engagement because, as Billege alluded to, a long engagement strings everyone along without a clear idea of when the marriage will go down. I'll wait until school is done, and jobs have been found before getting engaged.

That said, to each their own. Good luck with your relationship!

ophelia783

Wow....
I can sit here and say a lot of things about your post; why you're wrong and whatever, but it's not even worth my time. You can think that people with long engagements are "stalling"; that's your opinion.

But to say that I'm dicking around and wasting everyone's time, that's beyond offensive. Maybe you believe in rushing into things; I don't. I'm 21 years old, which to me is too young to be married. That doesn't mean it's too young to make a commitment, or to live with someone. We're waiting 3 years for him to be out of school, so we can move back to Canada. If we get married now, I wouldn't be able to get a student visa, which means I also wouldn't have my medical expenses paid for while I'm at school. As an epileptic, I wouldn't be able to afford my treatment and be a foreign student.

I understand I asked for opinions and views, and for those of you responded, thank you so much.

However, I don't appreciate being attacked by someone who obviously feels my relationship is a waste of their time.

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Sweetpea

Ophelia,

you're doing the right thing . . . you're both getting your educations first and then going to focus on your marriage . . . but you've taken it up to a great level of committment, i seen it work for others very well.

I had a long engagement . . . 2 and 1/2 years . . . we got engaged at a young age, and wanted to get our educations and jobs security squared away before making the committtment to each other. Getting those other things finished first has given us the opportunity when we got married to get focus on each other and our marriage instead of trying to do it all at once. We've been married for three wonderful years now and i'm glad we choose the long engagement route.

people will react any way they want to. don't let it affect you, just focus on the love you have and look foward to the future, don't let people ruin this happy time for you . . .


also: Congratulations!!!!!

Sweetpea

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Cynthetiq

I did have a previous engagement when I was about 20, engagement plan like yours, wait until after finishing school putting it at about 25, not too young to make the commitment etc.

After that did not work out, I'm glad that we didn't rush it because well, I'd be on my second marriage now.

At the same time, I don't know why I didn't get married to Skogafoss sooner.

Of course the major difference between my two scenarios is that we weren't in school and our careers were very established. Maybe it's more of a function of being older and more mature, experienced?

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ophelia783

Thanx Sweetpea and Cynthetiq, you both made me feel much better about the cause of my rage

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Ustwo

I think the issue is you don't have to be engaged. My wife and I 'dated' for 6 years. Had we been engaged for those 6 would it have mattered? Engagement is a public statement, WE WILL BE MARRIED, and when you wait for years it does seem like a lack of commitment.

'We will be married, but not now we are too busy, and don't have the money, so at some point, we don't know when, we will be married, and we will let you know then, nothing to see here.'

You don't need a ring to be commited to each other, so if you say you are engaged you better damn well expect the next question to be 'when is the wedding' and expect people to be a bit ambivalent about it when you say 'we don't know' or '5 years from now'.

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ophelia783

We actually have an exact date, and have a budget and all that, so it's not like we're being vague about it

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crow_daw

These are my sentiments exactly.


Now if I could convince my girlfriend........

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billege

Wow, "beyond offensive." That's pretty good. If I'd actually called you names, I wonder what level of offense that would have been?

And your "rage?" Give me a break lady. If you're feeling "rage" because: someone you don't know, whose life will (in all probability) never affect yours more directly than a text message, made a post you felt commented negatively on your plans, then you've got some seriously thin skin.

If you’ll take a look at what I’m offering:

I said "If you're serious about getting married, do it. You could get hit by a bus tomorrow and die. Life is too short to dick around." It is, you could.

Did I say you were?

No, and tied to my post's general statements -- relating to the many couples I've personally experienced "dicking around" (so to speak) -- and never getting married, the implication *should* be that "dicking around" can result in not actually getting married.

A few sentences later, "I understand the distance factor, and the money factor, and all that stuff. If you're ready to get married, MAKE IT HAPPEN, don't dick around wasting everyone's time." Do you feel you're "dicking around," that my words applied to you? I've talked to parents whose kids "dick around" during long engagements. Those kids can't ever decide on a location, they can't choose this, they change their minds, etc, etc. They put those who love them through a long, tough wait. Many, though not all, times they're just avoiding the commitment they've pledged themselves to. Are you doing this? Well.....no one will know for sure until you say "I do." That's the tough reality to this whole "marriage thing." Until you are married, you haven't done it yet, and everyone should be wondering (maybe a little, maybe a lot) if you really will.

I've met plenty of people, my sibling included, who had a date, a budget, and a date far into the future. Guess what? They were every bit as sincere as you. They reacted as badly to anyone questioning them, and they're every bit as unmarried now, as they were then.

I'd say good for you, make your plans and get married, but don't waste time. If you're not wasting time, and have faith in yourself, where's all the anger coming from?
Marriage is a wonderful thing, and I hope you do it.

Do I generally doubt young people with long engagements, hell yes.
Should that matter to you? That's up to you isn't it?


As to your asking for opinions.

You didn't want opinions. I think:
You wanted validation. You wanted other posters to tell you what you're doing is a great thing, all your reasons are reasonable and sane, justified.

You wanted to hear success stories from people who did something like you, and how wonderful it was. You wanted support. You didn’t want me offering doubt.

To say you didn't like that, I think, is an understatement.

I suppose if I was someone else, someone older and wiser, my method would have been sweeter to your ears. I guess I suck like that.

I stand by what I said. I see no point, not one, where I personally attacked you, and I don't intend to. You said I feel your relationship is a waste of time.
On the contrary, I spent time writing this, and time writing that, because I think you are worth time.
I also think wisdom and knowledge is gained through intelligent thought. You aren’t thinking if you’re not at least addressing contrary opinion and/or doubts. Hopefully, you’d overcome them all, and get your wedding.

I still say: I don't think a couple who's been dating all of 5 months (and got engaged at the 2!! month mark), is young, in college, long distance, and setting a 3 year engagement is overly likely to actually GET married.

People look at you oddly, shocked, because they might be older, have seen more, and KNOW that your chances of actually doing that are far from "bettin' odds."

You said you don't understand that. I offered you the reasoning behind someone who WOULD look at you like that. I took time out of my day, to offer you something personal. I gave you a part of my thoughts, to use for your benefit.

Did you remotely want to hear it? Did you consider anything other than how wrong I was? What an asshole I am? I seriously don't think so.

I ended with:
When you get out of school, whatnot, and you can make the marriage happen, you should.

Everything else is just stalling.

I meant it. Obviously, you have good reason to wait until school is over. I made that assumption, I showed trust in your word, with that original line. I said "when you get out of school" and I said "make it happen."

I believe in love, and I believe in marriage. I sincerely hope you experience both.

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I can sum up the clash of religion in one sentence:
"My Invisible Friend is better than your Invisible Friend."

StormBerlin

Very well said. I agree completely.

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chickentribs

Which actual responsibilities are you referring to? Couples who are committed and living together put just as much work into a successful relationship as a married couple. The idea that marriage validates and makes the relationship more "real" is a heck of an assumption in the era of nearly 60% divorce rates and drive thru chapels. I understand that for many people religion is an important part of the committment and respect that, it just seemed a bit flippant to dismiss "shacking up" as a pretend relationship.

In regards to the OP, I do question why a couple gets engaged and sits on it? I have thought of engagement as a period of time for planning the wedding rather than a new "level of relationship". If it gives you a bit more confidence in the committment, great... but it seems pretty natural, even polite for people to ask about a date. If you really think you're too young to get married, I guess I don't understand being comfortable making marriage decisions at that age.

Every day you love each other is a great day - if others feel it is "dicking around" until you get your signed piece of paper they have no sense of what is important! Good luck!

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and most oft there Where most it promises
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billege

I should be going to bed, but I have to touch on that.

If marriage does not make the relationship more "real" than dating, then what is the point of marriage?

I DO think that married couples have more of a commitment than dating, and living together couples. That, as they say, is the point. A living-together relationship is *not* pretend. I said "pretending to be married." I simply wish people would read what I wrote, and not what they wanted me to say. I reject couples who live together but want me to treat them the same as a married couple. I have no problem respecting a couple living together, and I believe in, and honor, their relationship. *Until* they ask me to belive they're the same as a married couple. They have NOT gotten married, yet. When you're married, you say "I will be respoinsible to, and for, this person until I DIE."
That's pretty fucking heavy, and that's why society has held marriage to be a special bond for hundreds of years. It's pretty flippiant to dismiss that. I think.

At any point, an unmarried couple may just walk away from each other. The law has no bind on them, they've never said the vows, they never made that lifelong commitment that marriage is. That's what makes a married couple different than a dating one.

A married couple got up in front of: whatever god they do or don't believe in, friends and family, the government, and said "This is it, until death do us part."

If that makes no difference between dating/living togther, and married, I fear for the whole idea.

Why do you think marriage matters to gay people? There is a difference to being married and dating! There is a validation there that society recognizes. Gay people want society's recognician of their relationships in the form of marriage.

I will not grant dating couples that validation UNTIL they're married, because it makes a difference!

From your last line, which could be considered a parting shot at me, I think you are missunderstanding what I mean when I say "dicking around." I've done the best I can to explain it, I won't waste more of your time.

__________________
I can sum up the clash of religion in one sentence:
"My Invisible Friend is better than your Invisible Friend."

spindles

Given you have an exact date chosen, I don't see a problem. I do think it is wrong for people to get engaged and be woolly about when they are getting married.

My preference is for a shorter engagement, but that is all it is - a preference.

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chickentribs

Billege, I appreciate your thoughts and share the need for sleep... My point is that marriage does not hold the value in society today that it once did, so to give higher regard to a couple based on a marriage license doesn't make sense. It is a shame - I cringe at every episode of "The Bachelor" or "Who Wants to Marry (fill in the blank)", every week-long celeb marriage, and Defense of Marriage proponents who are on wife number 4! I don't disregard the tradition of marriage, but "til death do us part" piece is only heavy when it's true.

Most gay couples I know are pursuing marriage for legal, economic, and equality reasons, not so much to lock down a committment or seek validity from the straight community.

I know I sound cynical, but I actually have great faith in love and families because many of my friends have amazing relationships, and they wouldn't trade their love for 10 Britney Spears weddings! And they deserve all the respect I give them, even without the wedding cake.

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Oft expectation fails...
and most oft there Where most it promises
- Shakespeare, W.

alansmithee

I pretty much agree with the above current view of marriage, except for the last part about having faith in love. Previously (and currently in some situations), marriage was (and is) as much an economic bond as it was a bond about love. Now with much of the economic impetus eroded over time, there is less need to stay in a marriage that has cooled emotions. Also, disagreements that would previously been smoothed over due to the need for economic stability now end in divorce. It seems that with much of the reason for marriage being eroded (economic) there would be a proportionate decrease in marriage, but that doesn't seem to be the case. There is no "til death do us part", it's more like "til you piss me off or I find someone better do us part". There's no real commitment now, you aren't making any sacrifice getting married. The disposability of current relationships is one of the reasons i'm horribly scared of any long term commitments myself-I realize that not only are the chances against it lasting, but when it does end, it will 4 times out of 5 be very bad and leave a bad taste about the whole relationship.

As for long engagements, I don't see the purpose of being engaged any longer than necessary to prepare the wedding. I don't find being engaged any more validating than two people who have just dated long. At most, you have made some sort of financial commitment (ring), but the cost of that can be mostly recouped if something goes wrong. If you are sure you want to marry someone, there's no reason in my mind to delay. Many people list reasons for waiting, but if you can't rely upon someone through everything why bother marrying them? If your finances aren't in order currently, why should that matter if you want to spend the rest of your life with someone? Do you plan on getting a divorce later if you get into financial difficulties until those get settled? It just seems to me that any reason for delaying a wedding is a reason to not get married in the first place.

And this isn't necessarily directed at the OP, it's just my view on marriage and long engagements in general. People should do what works best for them.

ophelia783

In Quebec, where I live, living with someone is considered a form of marriage, called common-law, where you have all the benefits of a married couple, because by law you are considered to be married.

The law recognizes that you have the same responsibilities and such; therefore they give you the same benefits. Here, you don't need a ceremony or a document to be considered married.

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