raeanna74

The last two day my daughter has been "acting out" terribly. I can't understand what has caused it. Our daily schdule has not changed except that she has gotten to outside a little more. I don't think that should cause this problem. It's possible that she's just had a growth spurt emotionally or mentally. I'm at my wits end to help her. She's been talking back to Dad a lot too. Sometime she'll stop and listen when he talks simply cause he's not around as much and it makes her notice. I think he's a little more strict with her too but I'm not too lenient. Here are some examples of yesterday's behavior and this morning.

I went to Walmart with my mother and one of Laura's little friends. She and Ashy are only about 1 month apart in age. They do a lot together and we've gone to the store together. All through the store she not once listened to me, she ran off, she screamed at me, and she hid in the clothes on me. She's usually well behaved in the store but yesterday was embarressing and frustrating. She often will listen to Grandma pretty well because it's a different person and she doesn't know how far she can push grandma. Grandma will spank too if necessary. I do sometimes as well. Her little friend even asked her to stop running and to hold her hand. She wouldn't listen to anyone. She ran around the corner of one isle right smack into another woman with two young children who were behaving pretty well. When I apologized she just chuckled and told me "Oh don't worry. Yesterday was my day." Then she spoke to Laura saying "Are you giving your Moma a hard time today?" Laura spoke in a snotty voice and said "YEAAAHHH!" I was so embarrassed and frustrated. I got her out of the store ASAP but what had already happened wasn't going to change. That incident was only the tip of the iceburg.

She also locked the door on one of my day care parents when they brought their kid. I told her to let go and tried to pry her hand off. She screamed at me. So I swatted her butt. She still would not let go. When I finally pulled her away from the door and pried her hand off she screamed and tried to reach the door. I carried her to her room and shut the door. She threw herself on the bed and carried on until the parents left.

After I got Star busy playing I went to talk to Laura. I asked her why she was so angry. I asked her if she wanted to play with just me. I recieved an adamant "NO!". I asked if she wanted to be quiet and alone for a while? "NO!!". I couldn't understand what was going on in her head. Why was she being so destructive, angry, mean, and disobedient?

This morning she got up and first thing she did is pitch a royal fit when I wouldn't give her a sucker for breakfast. She has cereal, poptarts, yogurt, fruit. Anything she wants like that in the morning. I offered it all to her. She threw herself on the couch and screamed until Dad came. He talked to her. She screamed at him "Go AWAY!!" I told her to go to her room. She said "FINE! and on the way stripped her clothes off and said "I'm NOT Wearing any clothes." We usually let her go with just a diaper at bedtime if she wants or if she stays in her room but during the day we make her wear clothes since I have people coming and going often. She knows that Dad makes this more of an issue and so I think it was targeted at him as rebellion.

I'm just grasping for straws here really. She's usually pretty good natured and listens relatively well for 3 1/2 years old. I realize kids go through stages where they stretch and test their bounderies but she's already worn me out. This is so extreme of a change from her usual. I didn't even tell everything she did. My mother called, Joe called, and Mom-in-law called yesterday and they all had opportunity to hear her scream and throw a tantrum. I tried sending her to her room, withholding treats, taking away toys, spanking even, and time outs (which were a battle all their own). Nothing seemed to work. Spankings which I knew hurt didn't hardly bring a tear to her eye. She has a high pain tolerance anyway so they aren't very effective. I'm not sure what to do. She's been at it already today. Including climbing on numerous stools and chairs to reach the top of my closet, get my paint, and you can guess the rest. She is refusing to use the toilet today too (we are mid potty training and WERE making excellent progress). She even played in her you-know-what and then came to show me. I'm at a loss. Any suggestions, psychological analysis, or sympathy even would be appreciated. Thanks

__________________
"Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama
My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

sapiens

Wow. I'm sorry that you have to deal with that. It's very hard to raise a child (as I'm sure you know). It's very easy to give advice. I'm probably telling you things that you already know. So, take whatever I say with a grain of salt.

Personally, I would ignore the tantrums entirely while they occur (as long as she isn't hurting herself, others, or property). Don't give her any reinforcement for negative behaviors. Attention can be reinforcing. Spankings can be reinforcing. If you have to send her to her room, make sure that there are no toys in the room to play with, etc. (I know people who send their kids to their room as punishment. The child's room has a tv, computer, nintendo, etc. That is not punishment). Basically, remove all rewards for negative behavior.

Once she calms down, I would talk to her about what happened. (She might not know herself what made her "go off"). I would identify the specific behaviors that she was exhibiting that were troubling, identify what you think she might have been feeling, and ask her if that was what she was feeling. Try to figure out what set it off. Get her to confirm the cause. If that works. Try to work out with her what specific behaviors would have solved her
problem more effectively. If she messed up the house, if she covered the bathroom in shit, make sure that she has to clean it up before she gets any reinforcement (no TV, no video games, no toys, no playing with friends, etc.) Never clean up her messes.

Another important thing to do is REINFORCE POSITIVE BEHAVIORS. Make sure she gets lots and lots of attention for behaving appropriately. Reward positive behavior with whatever your daughter likes. You might try making her earn the things that she normally gets for free.

Also, keep your word. If you set consequences for certain types of misbehavior, follow through. Be patient and loving, but also be strong.

Again, it's very hard to raise a child. It's very easy to give advice. So, take whatever I say with a grain of salt.

One last thing: You titled your post: "My Brat". In my opinion, all kids are brats (including my own daughter). It doesn't make you love them any less (as I'm sure you have experienced). You are not alone.

raeanna74

Thanks. I actually had kindof forgotten to try to avoid the negative reinforcement when possible. I was trying to give her as much positive reinforcement as I could. Got her to play a game of Candyland that she loves and a couple other things. I just got so frustrated because the moment we stopped doing something like that she was back to her fits of temper. I know why some of it happened but not all. I also try to make sure she doesn't play while in her room. She has to sit. I have to store plenty of stuffed animals and other toys in her room since that's where HER toys go and all the "daycare" toys go out in the livingroom. I make it her place. The tantrums yesterday were so frequent I was in shock pretty much. Today seems better thankfully.

__________________
"Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama
My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

:::OshnSoul:::

Have you personally tried to sit down with her and calmly talk with her? Patience is the biggest virtue here. We have realized that with our son. Simply not talking about the issue and immediately punishing them without letting them know why they are being punished. She is begging for attention, and she is getting plently of attention- but it may be negative. Like people say "negative attention is better than no attention" to a child.
One thing you can try is creating games out of tasks. That way she is more apt to listen and calmly go along without too much trouble. Try not to raise your voice, spank, give a time out, until you have tried to calmly reason with them in a kind, gentle manner.
Remember, it's the parent's responsibility to change a child's behaviour. And, it may also have a lot to do with Daddy not being around as much. All the weight is on you and Daddy is not there. Is she a Daddy's girl? If so, that't it right there.
What we do now more than ever is create family time every day and focus on him and what he wants to do. If he does not receive attention, he will start acting up as well. Remember- ATTENTION- are you giving positive or negative?
Pick up a parenting book, even. Those are always great to read together as parents and help you and your husband discuss important issues so that you both are on the same page in parenting issues.
best of luck- kids will try your patience- demonstrate your patience with them- they will notice.

powerclown

Of course Im not there and I don't know everything that goes on there, but what you said above might be a clue. She resents the attention and care you provide to the *other* kids. Maybe in her mind, she thinks that they must all be more important to you than she is, because its your job to take care of them every day, you have to feed them, change diapers, stop the crying, entertain them, make sure the parents are happy, etc...And she can't understand all this.

My advice would be to take her to a professional, a child psychologist/psychiatrist, to see if all of you can get to the bottom of it together. I recently went through a divorce and my daughter started acting out. We took her to see a doctor, problems were identified and a course of action was layed out. Not saying that things are now all rosy and there are no more conflicts, but its a start in the right direction I believe.

Good luck...parenting is the toughest job in the world. (2 young kids here.)

raeanna74

I try to give her as much one on one time as possible. I have been doing the day care thing for over 2 years now so I would think she would be accustomed to it. I don't know that a psychologist would be much help at this point. She's not able to talk about her feelings too well beyond "I'm angry", "I'm sad", etc. My mother who has education and experience working with Dyslexia, Hyperkinetics, and ADHD children dug into some of her ideas and we talked for over an hour last night about ways to work with her. Excercises to do and other things that might help her get control of herself. The exercises are physical "games" that have been proven to help those types of children. It won't hurt to try them and I'm hoping that I can see an improvement. (I'm not about to get her ritalin.) She had a fit today too and I started playing on of the games with her. She refused to begin with but finally joined it. 2 days ago she refused to do any play that I suggested. She calmed down and is actually napping now. I have hope for improvement. Thanks for the support guys.

__________________
"Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama
My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

sillygirl

Wow. Okay. Um. Wow. I can't offer much advice on the matter, and I don't have my own children, but I can say that I've been locked in a house with someone ELSE'S children all day when one of three was acting out like that. What I did when she started 'goin' nuts' on me was ignore her. I stayed calm and ignored her. At one point I picked her up, put her in her room (she's 7 or so), and ignored her screams of torture. I told her that when she was ready to apologize for treating everyone badly, that she could come out and play with us. Once she realized she wasn't going to get the attention she wanted (and usually got from her parents when she acted this way), she calmed down. :shrug: I don't know if that'll mean anything to anyone, because it wasn't MY kid, and I didn't deal with them on a daily basis, but...... :shrug:

__________________

Anyone can be passionate, but it takes real lovers to be silly-Rose Franken
....absence makes me miss him more...

:::OshnSoul:::

If she were to say draw a picture of something- maybe of how she felt or what's going on in her life, that could portray more of what's bothering her. That is known to be a popular psychological evaluation technique- I would highly consider seeing a psychologist, because there are ways other than immediately trying to get her to talk.

jbrooks544

This sounds not too far off from my 3.5 yr old girl. My oldest is a boy, now 5.75 and he was never 1/4 as tough to deal with as the girl. My personal experience is that girls are whiny and mine cries and has several cry/hysterical fits per day lately. I wouldn't over-analyze things. We don't give her attention when she is like that. If she is whining I say "I can't hear you when you talk like that" and don't respond until she asks nicely. Just don't give up. If she disobeys you then just bring her out to the car with you or if at home - 1, 2, 3 off to room for 5 mins. I had very good AM with her yesterday - wakeup, dress, eat in car, off to daycare with no crying or fits. I did it by starting off the second she woke up with a gentle talk - outlining what I expected and what I was going to say and how she would say "yes daddy" and not cry. It helped. When she would start to not accept an answer and want to cry, I would remind her and she stopped. It is a real struggle though.

Don't give her extra attention - positive or negative for being bad or crying. Just do 1,2,3 and at three she goes in the corner or room or loses a privilege or gets a favorite toy taken away. There is some book out now on the 1, 2, 3, thing and it works.

As for the spanking thing - personally, I think it is very bad for kids and teaches them violence, etc. Plus, where I live, or at my day care I would have the police or DSS show up wanting to take my kids away if I spanked them. I can't see how this will help you raise happy and well adjusted kids. I'm not judging - I'm just saying I really can't relate and wouldn't even consider spanking. Can't see how it could possibly help. You don't want to beat your kid into submission. You just have to try to get through this period - stay firm - don't give in - be strong.

Again, I feel your pain and have been going through a tough time with my little girl for the last year at least. Many kids have much bigger problems so let's try to be thankful that they are healthy and ok in most ways and that this is just something that will pass. By the time you figure this phase out she will enter a new one and you will start over again. My five year old is a joy. When she is 5 she will be eager to please and be a ray of sunshine all day - really.

I would try to completely change the way you react and interact when she is bad. Not because you are doing anything wrong really, but just to completely inturrupt the current cycle of give and take between the two of you. All this while still enforcing boundaries and rules and behaviors of cours. I mean, If you yelled before - maybe try to talk calmly and softly. If she was getting attention by acting up then just ask her once to stop and then the 1, 2, 3, thing and BAM! consequence - off to room or corner for 5 minutes. If she makes a fuss BAM 10 minutes. We use an egg timer.

amonkie

While I don't have kids of my own yet, I've spent much of my time playing surrogate mother to about 5 kids over the last 5 years or so. Like some have said, I've found that when they show behavior resembling your daughters, negative attention just feeds the frezy. When one of them gets in the mood to start throwing a tantrum, I usually start off calmly saying" : _____, you know that when you start whining or crying, that I can't understand you(I'm almost completely deaf) and will not listen to you. When you can be a big boy/girl, and tell me what's the matter, and then we can have some fun. Ok? " Granted, this changes from scenario to scenario, but you have to be consistent and as calm and unexcitatory as possible. Especially when taking care of 3 kids at the same time, you can't behave one way with one child and let something another does slide.

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Calling from deep in the heart, from where the eyes can't see and the ears can't hear, from where the mountain trails end and only love can go... ~~~ Three Rivers Hare Krishna

sexymama

Ignoring the tantrums and outbreaks is definitely one positive way to go. Children at this age may suddenly realize that they have personal power. As such, they need to test it out to find the boundaries. If you remain calm and consistent and build in as much routine as possible, then she will feel safer and more empowerd.

When she is upset, one way to help her calm down is to name colors and objects as quickly as possible. (Red shoe, black blouse, green sofa, etc.) I used this technique with my daughter when she went through this stage. After she calmed down, I helped her label her feelings. (You sound frustrated right now. You were angry, etc.) Then I would tell her that we all feel frustrated, angry, hurt, etc. sometimes and that is okay; however, what we do with those feelings matter. I would give her two healthy choices to help her deal. (Would you like to go outside and scream really loud or would you like to draw a picture?) Once she calmed down, if possible (and it wasn't always) we would talk a about what was going on for her. She may not have always understood and I never pushed it. Also, I never asked her why she felt the way she did as that would put her on the defensive and she was much to young to put a finger on it. (Heck, sometimes I still don't know why I feel the way I do.)

This technique takes a lot of work. But I support it tremendously! I knew it was working when one day she came to me and whimpered, "colors mom, colors." Also, now at the "wise" age of 10 she is very capable of labeling her feelings and dealing with them. I'm proud of just how healthy she is!

__________________
If you can go deeply into lovemaking, the ego disappears. That is the beauty of lovemaking, that it is another source of a glimpse of god

It's not about being perfect; it's about developing some skill at managing imperfection.

raeanna74

Well she had a major tantrum yesterday. I changed my MO and completely ignored her. Then I got busy doing something she enjoys helping with a LOT. Baking. She loves to mix stuff. She surprised me by continuing to roll on the floor and scream for about 10 minutes. She was even a little horse by the time she stopped. Finally she quit. I didn't get another argument or peep even out of her the rest of the evening. She helped and cooperated so much better. Guess all it took was changing my MO. Thanks. Hope it works next time too.

__________________
"Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama
My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

:::OshnSoul:::

Best wishes and keep patience and positive enforcement in mind.

skinbag

Thanks for the post and replies, folks. I just realized that my MO has always been to stop and address my full attenton to my son and his misbehavior immediately. That works in logical, rational situations, but kids are not that way. (not "things") I have tried ignoring him, a' la- "go to your room if you can't behave, treat people with respect", etc. That hasn't worked. (We live in an apartment, and he begins to physically destroy the door, so I decide to do a hold down, which has worked the best, but is hardly ignoring him and not fully effective, not to mention labor-intensive.)
But there is something there...I can do something new..*thinking, thinking, thinking......*