Sparhawk

Anyone have any experience using this? I know it's dangerous for those who don't actually excercise while taking it, but I'm wondering if it'd help me get to the 'next level' of fitness. I run about 30-120 minutes 5-6 times a week, and have a good clean diet (low in complex carbs, more protein, simple carbs).

I've been on it for about 3 months now and had been pleased with the progress, but for the last 2 weeks I haven't seen any change. I'm 6'1, 172lbs, down from 195lbs when I started.

Thanks for any tips y'all might have.

BBtB

You are fine. I wouldn't recomened taking pills for anyone. Thats just one of my own personal philosphys. From all I know about Ephedrine (not alot but still) its more about gaining muscle. From what you stated you are not really doing much to gain muslce at this time. You seem more concerned with losing weight. Well first off. You are light enough. Keep running and watching what you eat just for health but your goal should no longer be to lose weight. 170 lbs is fine for your size. Now if you ARE trying to gain muscle what I would recomened over pills is to just start working wieghts into your workout. Starting at about 2 or 3 times a week just 20-30 minutes a day and work up from there. You seem like you are defintly on the right path. Just keep following that.

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"I would like about three fiddy"

EleqTrizi'T

I agree. You did not need these pills.

If you've hit a plateau, you may consider just taking a week off from working out. Sometimes, you just need to give your body a break. When you return, you'll probably find it easy to resume progress.

sierra2774

I used to take pills all the time that contained Ephedrine and they made my heart race, but I still took them....I may have lost a few pounds or so but it always came back. For the past three or four Months I have been just watching my calories and keeping them below 1000 per day...I have lost over 30 pounds.

I really dont think those pills work, they are just a waste of money, in my opinion.

Watch your calories and get some exercise and the weight will come off naturally and you will be more likely to keep it off.

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Sparhawk

Thanks for the comments. The more I look at it, the more dangerous some of these pills seem. I just hate hitting a plateau when it seems like I still have a spare tire to work off.

hrdwareguy

Ephedrine is a dangerous thing. When I was taking paramedic classes, one of the girls was taking ephedrine, we hooked her up to the heart monitor one day. 6 irregular beats in a one minute interval. Roughly 10% of her heart beats were not correct.

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BigBlueWrecking

Ephedra is not to gain muscles...it is to try and increase metabolism. It is a very dangerous thing as it does do funny things to your heart. I have taken it, and I never felt right on it. Be very careful if you are trying to take it for anything.

MacGnG

if u really wanna find out, goto a store like GNC or something and just ask them, they know what they are talking about and will get u the stuff u need, it is kinda expensive but u can always goto a cheaper store once u find out what u need

butthead

Consider you are labeling the drug "dangerous" and not the girls use habit, especially when the drug can be taken with a wide safety margin.

debaser

Sparhawk, you really need to let your body recover. The amount of running you are doing is not only unhealthy, it is counter-productive. Recovery time for a muscle group is every bit as important as the exercise itself.

Everybody: If you are interested in getting in shape safely, I highly recommend getting a copy of FM 21-20 (here is a link to the text: http://155.217.58.58/cgi-bin/atdl.dll/fm/21-20/toc.htm ). It will explain some basic concepts of fitness that are essential to anyone, not just soldiers. It is proven methodology, and it isn't trying to sell anything.

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gonadman

Ephedra is a stimulant, plain and simple. It increases metabolism to burn calories. As a stimulant it can cause heart rhythm abnormalities, high blood pressure, and in those with coronary artery disease, heart attacks. It has been implicated in a number of deaths. The FDA is currently looking into banning the drug in over the counter preparations due to its danger, and it looks like they will succeed.
The people who sell ephedra(GNC etc) may not be the most unbiased people to ask an opinion of (ever hear a car dealer say his cars suck?) Look to a well respected medical site for more info

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butthead

Then link me to a "well respected medical site" for more info, or perhaps one with the most accurate information. I really doubt they will be able to prove that it is a "dangerous drug" worth banning.

Ephedrine and ephedra can be used with a great deal of safety. Note that life-threatening reactions are caused by irresponsible use.

BigBlueWrecking

Not true. 30-40% of Americans have subtle heart problems (read murmur's) that they may or may not be aware of. Ephedra increases heart speed in it's attempt to increase metabolism. This can lead to serious harm even when taken according to what the bottle says.

If Ephedra was so innocent, why all the lawsuits and why is it banned for the NFL and other sports. Sorry if you take it and like it, but it is bad for you. This margin for use you speak of is complete BS.

butthead

Note I said RESPONSIBLY. Responsibility, for example, would be to NOT take drugs that put you in danger if you have certain conditions. And to completely shoot down your point about "what the bottle says," the label will contain precautions and warnings about certain conditions and most likely will advise that you consult your doctor before use. If you experience adverse effects, STOP TAKING IT and see a doctor if you are concerned.

Why all the lawsuits? Probably because of irresponsible use, overreaction, and the desire to pass on responsibility to the drug than oneself. Whatever the reasons are, I know ephedrine and ephedra can be used with great safety. Go read about the history of ephedra's widespread use. You'll see it has been used safely for millennia. It's unfortunate that a handful of people don't pay attention to the label end up dying or getting sick, but ephedra and ephedrine are not "bad". Go read about its positive effects too. I don't take ephdrine or ephedra, but I'm quite a stickler when people cling to bullshit arguments.

The safety margin I mentioned is bullshit? What leads you to believe this? 50 or so lawsuits most likely caused by irresponsibility on the consumers part of the thousands of people who use it without problems? Please.

It's too bad if stupid/ignorant Americans have to ruin things for themselves, but just because fuck ups happen doesn't mean the drug is bad.

Quo8

I was takin Ripped Fuel for a while and liked the results - I just didn't like the anxious feeling I had all the time. I was working out regularly while taking the stuff but due to the stress it put on my body, I had to quit taking it. My reasoning was that it just didn't make me feel right.

Anyway- just my 2 cents,

Quo

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gonadman

try:
espn.go.com/mlb/news/2003/0228/1515993.html

The article is from the AP remarking on the FDA's investigation into ephedra. The FDA's comments include:

"Ephedra has been linked to life-threatening side effects, even when used by outwardly healthy people at recommended doses, because it speeds heart rate and constricts blood vessels. Those effects can be exacerbated by exercise and use of other stimulants such as caffeine, and they're particularly risky if the user has certain underlying medical conditions such as heart disease."

Its not just dangerous when used irresponsibly, its dangerous at recommended doses. Over 100 deaths have been linked to it. If you don't see any problem with taking it, fine, but don't tell us its safe at recommended doses because its not, and the FDA supports that conclusion

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butthead

I don't care what the FDA and "experts" claim may be "linked" to whatever. "Links" can and often are made without sufficient evidence, and I believe no actual evidence showing ephedrine is a life-threatening substance for most people when used responsibly has been brought forward.

Not to negate loss of life, but there are more risky and widespread substances. I never said ephedrine was 100% safe, but that it had a wide safety margin. It is a subjective term, but most people would not be in much danger if they took all precautions into mind before using ephedrine.

The FDA hasn't made any conclusion. Do you trust everything to FDA says? What about the FDA's decision about l-tryptophan? What about their claimed links of kava and liver damage? Just because the FDA made a claim doesn't mean it is accurate.

No drug is 100% risk free and risk must be evaluated before using drugs, taking yourself into consideration.

Also, are you talking about ephedrine or ephedra?

Leviathan[NCV]

Same difference, but take my advice and do NOT take this. Several people in my family practice medicine, and they see quite a few people with heart problems due to taking ephedra. You may also have heard about an ECA stack, which many professional bodybuilders take while cutting, taking it may not hurt you, but niether do some heavy drugs, is it worth the risk? The effects of it on your metabolism are also limited, and if your looking for an extra little boost, nab a 200mg caffine tab half an hour before you go running.

Best of luck.

gonadman

If you don't trust the FDA, how about the New England Journal of Medicine?

http://www.coloradohealthsite.org/CH...s/ephedra.html

The authors conclude:


"The authors note that the risks of taking ephedra as a dietary supplement are difficult to justify because it has no demonstrated benefit. Unlike vitamins and minerals, ephedra alkaloid supplements are not essential for proper nutrition. People who take these products to increase their exercise capacity or to lose weight place themselves at risk without a substantial likelihood of benefit.
Because of the severity of the adverse events that the authors reviewed and, in particular, the occurrence of events that caused permanent disability and death, they concluded that dietary supplements that contain ephedra alkaloids pose a serious health risk to some users."

The evidence is there, whether you choose to accept it or not is your decision. Nevertheless, at least those reading these posts are aware of the problems and can make their own decisions.

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For me there is only the traveling on paths that have heart, on any path that may have heart. There I travel, and the only worthwhile challenge is to traverse its full length. And there I travel, looking, looking, ...breathlessly.
-Carlos Castaneda

butthead

This isn't evidence dude. I disagree with the claim and do not "trust anyone" simply because they're "experts". If you want to use expert opinion against me in this thread because you don't know anything about it and havent realized that experts disagree, that's fine.

It's clear you guys aren't open-minded to anything in this thread, so this will be my last post. On that note, it may very well be that ephedrine is not as safe as I claim, but you guys haven't done anything to prove it's a dangerous substance to most. Seems many of the heart related incidents would be just as likely to happen without ephedrine.

gonadman

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-Carlos Castaneda

aaaShrimp

Seems that all your "anti-ephedrine" acticles are about ephedra, not ephedrine. I don't know a lot about this stuff but isnt ephedrine the safer version of ephedra? And psnuephedrine(sp?) the safer version of ephedrine?

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Not_You

Yeah, this guy I know was on the Atkins diet and taking epheaderine. He got an ulser. Not fun.

But epheadrine is always fun for recreational use.

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gonadman

There is a good description at
http://www.fda.gov/bbs/topics/NEWS/2003/NEW00875.html

From the site:
Ephedra is a naturally occurring substance derived from the Chinese herbal Ma Huang. Its principal active ingredient is ephedrine, which when chemically synthesized is regulated as a drug. While products containing natural ephedrine alkaloids have long been used to treat certain respiratory symptoms in traditional Chinese medicine, in recent years they been extensively promoted and used with the goals of aiding weight loss, enhancing sports performance, and increasing energy.


Thus ephedrine is actually the active ingredient in Ephedra

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For me there is only the traveling on paths that have heart, on any path that may have heart. There I travel, and the only worthwhile challenge is to traverse its full length. And there I travel, looking, looking, ...breathlessly.
-Carlos Castaneda

butthead

Correct.

Incorrect, there are other ephedra alkaloids present, including ephedrine. Ephedra containing products and ephedrine only products have different safety profiles. Primatine is the only ephedrine only product distributor.

Phaenx

Someone reccomended a process called "shocking the system" to me a while ago regarding plateaus. What you do is go off your diet for 2 or 3 days, bone up on some carbs in this case, take some time to enjoy yourself, then go back on your regular diet. This always works for me.

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Lucky24601

Ephedrine is actually a chinese herb called ma huang. It has been used for centuries wothout adverse effect, but it is not traditionally used for weight loss. It was mainly used for sinuses. Try it next time you you have a stuffy nose and you'll see why. It is an extreme stimulant simalar to caffiene but not as addictive. Do some research and you will find alot of people have had problams with caffiene overdose as well, but you never hear about lawsuits against Mountain Dew or Vivarin.

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