Where there's smoke, there's fire? - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

SabrinaFair · 01-31-2004, 07:46 PM

Hello lovely ladies...

All right. I just thought I'd get some feedback from a larger audience to a rather interesting dilemna. I must begin with a slight back history so you can understand the circumstances leading up to a rather bizarre evening that still has me reeling.

First of all, Nick. Nick is a romantic musician with an interest in philosophy and performance art. The best way I can describe him is "out there." He's very individual, very creative, and a lot of fun to be around if you have a sophisticated sense of humour. He's not had a real relationship since high school. That being said, a history.....I've known Nick for about 13 years. Considering that I'm not-quite 20 years old, that's a freakin' long time. He was the first guy I ever liked. Seriously. My first crush. We were friends through most of elementary school, until he moved after sixth grade. We met up again a couple of years later, exchanged some letters, then lost contact again. I didn't see or hear from him for like two or three years. Then September 2002, I found out he was attending school a little more than an hour from UofL, where I attend. So, I get his e-mail address from a friend that attends the same school (God bless school-provided e-mail accounts) and send a message. A couple of messages are exchanged, we met and caught up, fun times. We saw each other maybe three times that semester, then kept up by phone until the next September. He came up to visit me, and things kept their usually friendly rapport until my roomate left to attend a party out of town. He then acknowledged the attraction between us. So after much much MUCH diliberation, we ended up making out for about four hours. That's it...kissing. So much fun! I've had much more passionate encounters, but never one quite so fun. Late that night, I slipped on my silk nightie, the one I got on sale at Victoria's Secret. I made us a bed out of a relatively uncomfortable futon. As we laid down, he whispered, "I bet this is what it feels like to be married." I suppose I should interject that Nick has this romantic notion of marriage. We spent that wonderful evening together, and nothing more become of it, because I started dating someone else a couple of weeks later. Although it hurt him, he pretended to be happy for me and we continued to be friends in much the same manner we always have. Somewhat from a distance, but always able to pick up where we left off.

So last week, I went to Nick's town because my boyfriend lived there. I was going to break up with him (Ryan) Nick took me to dinner first, while I waited on Ryan to get home from work. We had a nice conversation, and he did his best to comfort me as I mentally prepared myself for a rather wrenching breakup.

Nick came to see me last night. We got some dinner, sang some Dashboard Confessional, and talked like friends until about 9 o'clock, when I opened up a rather large bottle of wine. We shared that bottle of wine and talked, flirted, danced around the issue. Although Nick can irritate the crap out of me sometimes, I'll always be amazed by his smile.

So...what I'm getting at here is that while intoxicated, Nick asked me to marry him. At our drunkest, we had a conversation about getting married in two years, moving to Savannah, and then having children when I get out of law school. WFT? We ended up taking a walk...please keep in mind it's the coldest winter I can remember. So we walked and talked, and held gloved hands. And he asked me again...out in the snow, on the street where I live, he got down on his knee and asked if I would marry him in two years. "Sabrina, with the bluest eyes, will you marry me?" he said.

To quickly wrap up this rather legnthy story...we're not entering into a relationship because of the distance. And I seriously doubt he'll hold me to that proposal, which I think I accepted in my deluded state. But anyway. I know he was drunk...but have you ever heard the expression, "Where there's smoke there's fire?" I'm just not really sure what to make of all this. I'm just starting to remember somethings. I drank a lot of wine. We said "I love you". Which is true, although my love for him is largely as a friend. He said, "I want you to have my children, and...you could inspire me." I remember asking him if he would want to wake up next to me...he said something to the effect of, "Are you kidding? I'd love that." So yeah. I really would like to hear what other people have to say about this. If nothing else, it was nice to get the story out there. Sorry I took so much of your time (if you're still reading this)

Much love,
Sabrina

Averett · 01-31-2004, 08:29 PM

Wow. If you don't marry him can I? But yeah, I understand the delima.

I really have no advice, but that's a pretty damn romantic story. I wish I knew guys like that

(great taste in music too!)

InTeGrA77 · 01-31-2004, 11:35 PM

Wow, it sounds like he's just dying to marry you...like he can't wait. It almost seems to me like he's scared that you're going to "leave" him again, and he wants to seal the deal now. He sounds like a great guy and I think that he'd be extremely loyal to you. He's soo romantic too,

and that's so rare these days.

Quote:

Originally posted by Averett
(great taste in music too!)

I agree!

Yalaynia · 02-01-2004, 11:52 PM

Wow! He sounds like a wonderful guy. Just need to do some serious thinking. I dont know anything about either of you other then what you said in the post. I m just going to throw out a bunch of questions to consider and think about. I dont mean any harm in them its just something to help the thinking process.

1) How do you really feel about him you said you only love him largely as a friend. But can you love him like he loves you. Friend love and husband wife commitment love are totally different levels.

2) You have always had a friendship love, but is the love hes feeling for you now still that love of the past that you had together or is this something hes developed over the exchange of letters and that over the last little while?

3) You mentioned he told you that "I bet this is what it feels like to be married" Has he ever hinted or anything before now that he would someday like to marry you?

4) He hasnt had a serious relationship since highschool, which is no big deal. But has he had a bad streak with woman that he doesnt feel as comfortable with them as he does with you?

5) Is he asking you because he is comfortable with you, and afraid that hes not going to find anyone else?
(Dont take that the wrong way please)

6) Can you see yourself married in the next couple of years?

7) Are you ready to settle down into a life long commitment?

8) Are you falling in love with him? if so is it for who he is now or are you falling in love with him because hes rekindeled a long lost crush that you had for him?

I dont know if you can make any heads or tails out of this but I hope they help in some way. The one thing you both have to do is sit and talk to each other. It would be really sad to see a wonderful friendship end over differences of feelings. But its something that has to be done because if he is in love and really cares deeply for you and you dont have the same feelings towards him and doubt that you could ever develope those feelings its best to put an end to it now , and remain friends then to lose everything.

onodrim · 02-02-2004, 12:56 AM

Wow, very romantic story!

It'd be nice to just say go have your happily ever after, but life as we know is not always like that. Yalaynia covered everything very well - take a serious look at all those questions when you've had time to digest the situation. And let your relationship with this guy develop as it will over the next few years, who knows what could happen.

Minx · 02-02-2004, 02:17 PM

A great story and yes, I agree with the others in that he sounds like he's crazy over you. Don't think that "distance" will change that.
Ask yourself the questions that Yalaynia put forth to you, though.
If this is only a "drunken, semi-friendship/flirting" thing then don't break the poor guy's heart! If it's serious though....I say go for it. What have you got to lose?

sillygirl · 02-02-2004, 09:25 PM

I haven't read all the posts before this one... but here's my two cents.

My ex boyfriend asked me if I wanted to marry him (yes, in a relatively drunken state) the week before he broke up with me. He had our wedding practically planned. When I brought it up later (as in, a few days, a week, somethign like that) he couldn't remember a bit of it.

I hope things work out for you.

He sounds like an awesome guy, and I really hope that everything turns out for the best.

lurkette · 02-03-2004, 06:19 AM

I don't meant to throw water on the very romantic fire, but I would advise you to proceed with caution. He does sound like a nice guy, but drunken marriage proposals are generally not the basis for a sound relationship

When you get the chance (if distance no longer becomes an issue) by all means date the guy, but proceed slowly and with all due caution. My first boyfriend was also a romantic musician. I'm not married to him. Long story for another day, but bottom line, I would advise you to keep a level head, which you seem to be doing.

If nothing else, it's a GREAT story!

raeanna74 · 02-03-2004, 01:20 PM

Don't let a lack of romantic love on your part stop you. The friendship you have with him can go anywhere you want it to. Look at him objectively. Is he responsible, hard working, mature, etc.? If so don't hold back. He sounds great. Do what you feel you should when you are ready to? Good Luck.

teriaki · 02-03-2004, 06:31 PM

I was in a similar situation, with another amazing man, and as much as I loved (and still do love!) him, there wasn't any *spark*.
Granted, a lot of long-term, very healthy, happy marriages don't have sparks, or fireworks or whatever you want to call them...

My thoughts are that if you started seeing someone so soon after your makeout session, this one probably isn't what you're looking for long term- or he *is* "if only ____"- it's the blank you need to fill in

Best of luck, and I wish the best for you (& Nick!)

PorscheBunny · 02-03-2004, 10:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lurkette
I don't meant to throw water on the very romantic fire, but I would advise you to proceed with caution. He does sound like a nice guy, but drunken marriage proposals are generally not the basis for a sound relationship

If you can get him to repeat it sober, then you got a keeper. If not, start looking for the firemen.

SabrinaFair · 02-17-2004, 10:40 PM

To revive my old thread there...

I'm in trouble!!! Well, maybe not trouble. But I have it bad for Nick! I just realised this over the weekend. We saw each other for the first time since the drunken proposal. It was not a really romantic experience...but we made a movie, which was fun. And he kissed me goodbye, which I wasn't really expecting. He gave me our usual goodbye hug...and then he sort of leaned, then I sort of leaned, then we both leaned back, then we both leaned forward and kissed. It was cute. But that's it...and I'm left a wanting more...and craving conversation..and wanting to call him all the time (but I don't) I really really like him...I feel like I've expressed that, so I don't know how to proceed. We've established mutual attraction...where to go from there?

GRRRRRRRRRR.

Sorry. Needed to vent.

I'm normally very sure about how to proceed in matters of love...because I just act straightforward about it, and say to hell with playing games or working on strategy. But this situation is...different. So any input is valued. Y'all are goddesses.

Love,
Sabrina

Litespeed · 02-18-2004, 01:08 PM

Sounds like an excellent man. Are you ready for marriage though? I look at myself and I wonder how I'll ever make a decision like that. Do you like the direction that he is headed in his career? Do you see yourself happy with him?

Years of friendship is the only way to go into a relationship that is going to last. I wish you the best in your decision-making.

brianna · 02-20-2004, 09:32 AM

I hate to be the party pooper here but this is sounding a little crazy.

Firstly, it didn't sound like you *really* liked this guy until after he made it clear just how into you he is (and one might take that with a grain of salt since you haven't spent that much time with him and he hasn't done much dating.. it seems possible that he may be idealizing you and not getting to know you -- 13 years non withstanding it doesn't sound like the two of you have spent much time together as adults.). It is always tempting to let ourselves be talked into a relationship with a person that thinks so highly of us, compliments feel great! but this often leads to a rather one sided relationship.

I don't think it's ok to let the marriage thing lie -- you've said yourself that this man has a very romanticized(and i suspect unrealistic) idea of what marriage is and this leads me to belive that drunk or not he thinks you guys have some sort of life pact. You need to be clear about your intentions if for no other reason than to spare his feelings. I don't understand how people jump into marriage without a solid relationship to support their decision. Yes Nick sounds romantic, yes it's hugely flattering that he likes you so much but frankly i think it's scary as hell that anyone would be so cavalier about what is supposed to be a life long commitment.

txlovely · 02-23-2004, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lurkette
I don't meant to throw water on the very romantic fire, but I would advise you to proceed with caution. He does sound like a nice guy, but drunken marriage proposals are generally not the basis for a sound relationship When you get the chance (if distance no longer becomes an issue) by all means date the guy, but proceed slowly and with all due caution. My first boyfriend was also a romantic musician. I'm not married to him. Long story for another day, but bottom line, I would advise you to keep a level head, which you seem to be doing.

If nothing else, it's a GREAT story!

I'm with lurkette here. Strange what things happen when under the influence. I have male friends with whom I have colorful histories and it's comforting to be with them because they know me so well, but I wouldn't accept marriage proposals from any of them. I think making a history with someone can be what builds a relationship. Date him and see where it goes. I have to wonder though, why would you have dated this other guy if there had been any underlying interest in Nick? Don't do a rebound - that's real trouble. He sounds like a nice guy who has probably had a crush on you for some time. Take it slow and maybe something incredible and unexpected will develop. Tell him that it's a little early to discuss marriage and you'd like to spend some more time with him without that pressure. If it's meant to be then it's meant to be.

fallenangel · 03-17-2004, 12:55 AM

maybe it's just where i'm coming from at a certain point in my life, but sometimes there are situations in life that present themselves in such a way that even though they are SO unbelievably 'out there' you just want to get swept away in them just to see where you would end up... hmm, the hard part is deciding which opportunities are worth risking so much on.

well that was pretty much useless on my part... sorry lol

01-31-2004, 07:46 PM	#1 (permalink)
SabrinaFair Junkie Location: Louisville, KY	Where there's smoke, there's fire? Hello lovely ladies... All right. I just thought I'd get some feedback from a larger audience to a rather interesting dilemna. I must begin with a slight back history so you can understand the circumstances leading up to a rather bizarre evening that still has me reeling. First of all, Nick. Nick is a romantic musician with an interest in philosophy and performance art. The best way I can describe him is "out there." He's very individual, very creative, and a lot of fun to be around if you have a sophisticated sense of humour. He's not had a real relationship since high school. That being said, a history.....I've known Nick for about 13 years. Considering that I'm not-quite 20 years old, that's a freakin' long time. He was the first guy I ever liked. Seriously. My first crush. We were friends through most of elementary school, until he moved after sixth grade. We met up again a couple of years later, exchanged some letters, then lost contact again. I didn't see or hear from him for like two or three years. Then September 2002, I found out he was attending school a little more than an hour from UofL, where I attend. So, I get his e-mail address from a friend that attends the same school (God bless school-provided e-mail accounts) and send a message. A couple of messages are exchanged, we met and caught up, fun times. We saw each other maybe three times that semester, then kept up by phone until the next September. He came up to visit me, and things kept their usually friendly rapport until my roomate left to attend a party out of town. He then acknowledged the attraction between us. So after much much MUCH diliberation, we ended up making out for about four hours. That's it...kissing. So much fun! I've had much more passionate encounters, but never one quite so fun. Late that night, I slipped on my silk nightie, the one I got on sale at Victoria's Secret. I made us a bed out of a relatively uncomfortable futon. As we laid down, he whispered, "I bet this is what it feels like to be married." I suppose I should interject that Nick has this romantic notion of marriage. We spent that wonderful evening together, and nothing more become of it, because I started dating someone else a couple of weeks later. Although it hurt him, he pretended to be happy for me and we continued to be friends in much the same manner we always have. Somewhat from a distance, but always able to pick up where we left off. So last week, I went to Nick's town because my boyfriend lived there. I was going to break up with him (Ryan) Nick took me to dinner first, while I waited on Ryan to get home from work. We had a nice conversation, and he did his best to comfort me as I mentally prepared myself for a rather wrenching breakup. Nick came to see me last night. We got some dinner, sang some Dashboard Confessional, and talked like friends until about 9 o'clock, when I opened up a rather large bottle of wine. We shared that bottle of wine and talked, flirted, danced around the issue. Although Nick can irritate the crap out of me sometimes, I'll always be amazed by his smile. So...what I'm getting at here is that while intoxicated, Nick asked me to marry him. At our drunkest, we had a conversation about getting married in two years, moving to Savannah, and then having children when I get out of law school. WFT? We ended up taking a walk...please keep in mind it's the coldest winter I can remember. So we walked and talked, and held gloved hands. And he asked me again...out in the snow, on the street where I live, he got down on his knee and asked if I would marry him in two years. "Sabrina, with the bluest eyes, will you marry me?" he said. To quickly wrap up this rather legnthy story...we're not entering into a relationship because of the distance. And I seriously doubt he'll hold me to that proposal, which I think I accepted in my deluded state. But anyway. I know he was drunk...but have you ever heard the expression, "Where there's smoke there's fire?" I'm just not really sure what to make of all this. I'm just starting to remember somethings. I drank a lot of wine. We said "I love you". Which is true, although my love for him is largely as a friend. He said, "I want you to have my children, and...you could inspire me." I remember asking him if he would want to wake up next to me...he said something to the effect of, "Are you kidding? I'd love that." So yeah. I really would like to hear what other people have to say about this. If nothing else, it was nice to get the story out there. Sorry I took so much of your time (if you're still reading this) Much love, Sabrina

01-31-2004, 08:29 PM	#2 (permalink)
Averett Is In Love Location: I'm workin' on it	Wow. If you don't marry him can I? But yeah, I understand the delima. I really have no advice, but that's a pretty damn romantic story. I wish I knew guys like that (great taste in music too!) __________________ Absence is to love what wind is to fire. It extinguishes the small, it enkindles the great.

02-01-2004, 11:52 PM	#4 (permalink)
Yalaynia Insane Location: here but I wish I lived there	Wow! He sounds like a wonderful guy. Just need to do some serious thinking. I dont know anything about either of you other then what you said in the post. I m just going to throw out a bunch of questions to consider and think about. I dont mean any harm in them its just something to help the thinking process. 1) How do you really feel about him you said you only love him largely as a friend. But can you love him like he loves you. Friend love and husband wife commitment love are totally different levels. 2) You have always had a friendship love, but is the love hes feeling for you now still that love of the past that you had together or is this something hes developed over the exchange of letters and that over the last little while? 3) You mentioned he told you that "I bet this is what it feels like to be married" Has he ever hinted or anything before now that he would someday like to marry you? 4) He hasnt had a serious relationship since highschool, which is no big deal. But has he had a bad streak with woman that he doesnt feel as comfortable with them as he does with you? 5) Is he asking you because he is comfortable with you, and afraid that hes not going to find anyone else? (Dont take that the wrong way please) 6) Can you see yourself married in the next couple of years? 7) Are you ready to settle down into a life long commitment? 8) Are you falling in love with him? if so is it for who he is now or are you falling in love with him because hes rekindeled a long lost crush that you had for him? I dont know if you can make any heads or tails out of this but I hope they help in some way. The one thing you both have to do is sit and talk to each other. It would be really sad to see a wonderful friendship end over differences of feelings. But its something that has to be done because if he is in love and really cares deeply for you and you dont have the same feelings towards him and doubt that you could ever develope those feelings its best to put an end to it now , and remain friends then to lose everything. __________________ I couldnt think of anything to put here , but I guess anything would do Last edited by Yalaynia; 02-01-2004 at 11:55 PM..

02-02-2004, 12:56 AM	#5 (permalink)
onodrim Cosmically Curious Location: Chicago, IL	Wow, very romantic story! It'd be nice to just say go have your happily ever after, but life as we know is not always like that. Yalaynia covered everything very well - take a serious look at all those questions when you've had time to digest the situation. And let your relationship with this guy develop as it will over the next few years, who knows what could happen. __________________ "The world is so exquisite with so much love and moral depth, that there is no reason to deceive ourselves with pretty stories for which there’s little good evidence. Far better it seems to me, in our vulnerability, is to look death in the eye and to be grateful every day for the brief but magnificent opportunity that life provides" -Carl Sagan

02-02-2004, 02:17 PM	#6 (permalink)
Minx Junkie Location: Up yonder	A great story and yes, I agree with the others in that he sounds like he's crazy over you. Don't think that "distance" will change that. Ask yourself the questions that Yalaynia put forth to you, though. If this is only a "drunken, semi-friendship/flirting" thing then don't break the poor guy's heart! If it's serious though....I say go for it. What have you got to lose? __________________ You've been a naughty boy....go to my room!

02-02-2004, 09:25 PM	#7 (permalink)
sillygirl Newlywed Location: at home	I haven't read all the posts before this one... but here's my two cents. My ex boyfriend asked me if I wanted to marry him (yes, in a relatively drunken state) the week before he broke up with me. He had our wedding practically planned. When I brought it up later (as in, a few days, a week, somethign like that) he couldn't remember a bit of it. I hope things work out for you. He sounds like an awesome guy, and I really hope that everything turns out for the best. __________________ Anyone can be passionate, but it takes real lovers to be silly-Rose Franken ....absence makes me miss him more...

02-03-2004, 06:19 AM	#8 (permalink)
lurkette My future is coming on Moderator Emeritus Location: east of the sun and west of the moon	I don't meant to throw water on the very romantic fire, but I would advise you to proceed with caution. He does sound like a nice guy, but drunken marriage proposals are generally not the basis for a sound relationship When you get the chance (if distance no longer becomes an issue) by all means date the guy, but proceed slowly and with all due caution. My first boyfriend was also a romantic musician. I'm not married to him. Long story for another day, but bottom line, I would advise you to keep a level head, which you seem to be doing. If nothing else, it's a GREAT story! __________________ "If ten million people believe a foolish thing, it is still a foolish thing." - Anatole France

02-03-2004, 01:20 PM	#9 (permalink)
raeanna74 I'm not a blonde! I'm knot! I'm knot! I'm knot! Location: Upper Michigan	Don't let a lack of romantic love on your part stop you. The friendship you have with him can go anywhere you want it to. Look at him objectively. Is he responsible, hard working, mature, etc.? If so don't hold back. He sounds great. Do what you feel you should when you are ready to? Good Luck. __________________ "Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

02-03-2004, 06:31 PM	#10 (permalink)
teriaki Tilted Location: San Francisco	I was in a similar situation, with another amazing man, and as much as I loved (and still do love!) him, there wasn't any spark. Granted, a lot of long-term, very healthy, happy marriages don't have sparks, or fireworks or whatever you want to call them... My thoughts are that if you started seeing someone so soon after your makeout session, this one probably isn't what you're looking for long term- or he is "if only ____"- it's the blank you need to fill in Best of luck, and I wish the best for you (& Nick!) __________________ Cute, but useless.

02-17-2004, 10:40 PM	#12 (permalink)
SabrinaFair Junkie Location: Louisville, KY	To revive my old thread there... I'm in trouble!!! Well, maybe not trouble. But I have it bad for Nick! I just realised this over the weekend. We saw each other for the first time since the drunken proposal. It was not a really romantic experience...but we made a movie, which was fun. And he kissed me goodbye, which I wasn't really expecting. He gave me our usual goodbye hug...and then he sort of leaned, then I sort of leaned, then we both leaned back, then we both leaned forward and kissed. It was cute. But that's it...and I'm left a wanting more...and craving conversation..and wanting to call him all the time (but I don't) I really really like him...I feel like I've expressed that, so I don't know how to proceed. We've established mutual attraction...where to go from there? GRRRRRRRRRR. Sorry. Needed to vent. I'm normally very sure about how to proceed in matters of love...because I just act straightforward about it, and say to hell with playing games or working on strategy. But this situation is...different. So any input is valued. Y'all are goddesses. Love, Sabrina __________________ "With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be cheerful. Strive to be happy." -Desiderata

02-18-2004, 01:08 PM	#13 (permalink)
Litespeed Loser Location: Thousand Oaks, CA	Sounds like an excellent man. Are you ready for marriage though? I look at myself and I wonder how I'll ever make a decision like that. Do you like the direction that he is headed in his career? Do you see yourself happy with him? Years of friendship is the only way to go into a relationship that is going to last. I wish you the best in your decision-making.

02-20-2004, 09:32 AM	#14 (permalink)
brianna Addict Location: nyc	I hate to be the party pooper here but this is sounding a little crazy. Firstly, it didn't sound like you really liked this guy until after he made it clear just how into you he is (and one might take that with a grain of salt since you haven't spent that much time with him and he hasn't done much dating.. it seems possible that he may be idealizing you and not getting to know you -- 13 years non withstanding it doesn't sound like the two of you have spent much time together as adults.). It is always tempting to let ourselves be talked into a relationship with a person that thinks so highly of us, compliments feel great! but this often leads to a rather one sided relationship. I don't think it's ok to let the marriage thing lie -- you've said yourself that this man has a very romanticized(and i suspect unrealistic) idea of what marriage is and this leads me to belive that drunk or not he thinks you guys have some sort of life pact. You need to be clear about your intentions if for no other reason than to spare his feelings. I don't understand how people jump into marriage without a solid relationship to support their decision. Yes Nick sounds romantic, yes it's hugely flattering that he likes you so much but frankly i think it's scary as hell that anyone would be so cavalier about what is supposed to be a life long commitment.

03-17-2004, 12:55 AM	#16 (permalink)
fallenangel soaring Location: near the water	maybe it's just where i'm coming from at a certain point in my life, but sometimes there are situations in life that present themselves in such a way that even though they are SO unbelievably 'out there' you just want to get swept away in them just to see where you would end up... hmm, the hard part is deciding which opportunities are worth risking so much on. well that was pretty much useless on my part... sorry lol __________________ all I wanna do is - give the best of me to you