Wes Mantooth

I think this fits here, apologies if it belongs elsewhere.

So the one night stand. I was having a pretty good discussion at the bar earlier with some friends based off a fling I had earlier this weekend and we were kind of split on the "etiquette" of casual sex, particularly the aftermath. Some thought it was proper to spend the night and wake up together, others thought a phone call the next day was the right thing and still others agreed it was perfectly fine to leave and just walk away (I'm in agreement with the latter). We argued over the nature of the relationship, was it a friend? A complete stranger? Fuck buddy? Did it matter? Nobody could really agree on that either but we kind of agreed that with a friend it might be proper to stick around and iron out the situation while a stranger it was much more acceptable to walk away.

I'll give you my example as its what started the whole conversation, skip ahead a few paragraphs if your not interested. Honestly I'm not really entirely sure how to classify this situation in the first place...but it seems like a one night stand. I was out at an after party with a band I'd spent the weekend doing some shows with, we're all good friends and often times we don't get a lot of time to really visit. In this case I was pretty tired, not in the mood to be sociable and wound up heading out back, with Will (our singer), to an empty bedroom with a couple bottles of Jack just hoping for a quite visit and time for a little catch up.(Yeah I know what your thinking, this isn't about hot man love, keep reading) About an hour later a good friend of ours, Karen, burst through the door all hopped up on something or other, she immediately takes off her top, hops onto the bed and remarks "Feel em! They're spectacular!". Now I knew she was pretty F-ed up and when she started offering blow jobs, I actually turned her down (shes a good friend and well..next day regrets and such), kicked back on the bed and grabbed a magazine. Will wasn't quite so nice about the whole thing and took her up on the offer. So there she is butt naked, ass skyward, head under the sheets giving what looked to be spectacular head and I'm sitting on the other end of the bed reading Guns & Ammo and nursing a bottle of whiskey. A few minutes later she pokes her head up from under the sheets, looks at me and says "Go ahead, fuck me if you want to" before mumbling something about condoms in her pocket and going back to the task at hand.

Now at this point I thought about it and with condom in hand I took stock of the situation. I'd most likely be going at this from behind meaning that as I was in the throws of passion all I'd see when looking down was her hot ass and my buddies face etched with ecstasy. I put the condom down, grabbed my bottle of Jack and went back to the magazine...c'mon guys some things just can't be unseen. She finishes up, climbs over on top of me and whispers "you're the whole reason I came in here and I'm not leaving disappointed." Honestly folks, she's pretty hot and a guy only has so much self control. I thought fuck it, she straddles my lap, I unzip and we went to town, Will grabs the magazine, the the bottle of Jack, turns on some Iggy Pop and kicks back. We had a pretty good go around...actually it was...yeah, wow! She climbs off and lays down between us, mediates a joint passed back and forth and we just kind of relaxed, enjoyed some good music and a had a visit. Really we spent the next few hours discussing politics, well, as best we could in our state.

I sobered up, headed home and went to bed not thinking too much about what just happened. Later on Sunday morning, around 11:30 I get me a call, I woke, up rubbed the sleep out of my eyes and tried to figure out who I was talking too, it was Karen. "I didn't see you when I got up this morning and noticed you hadn't called...just wanted to see what was up." I'm trying not cough up a lung with my first morning smoke and said I'd had a good time but was tired and went home to get some sleep. "Oh" she replies "didn't want to stick around?". I told her I hadn't really thought about it and just...went home. She sounded kind of hurt by my answer, said to give her a call sometime and hung up. I did the only thing I could do after such a conversation...went back to bed.

I met up with my buddies later at the bar, Will included, who she hadn't called, apparently he went home too...yeah I don't know whats up with that. Anyway we got talking about the whole situation and the etiquette involved...hence deep discussion...hence the thread you're still reading now (bless you for getting this far) and the question at hand.

Now maybe I'm just an old fashioned romantic but I'm of the school of thought that says a drunken one night stand is just that, a one night stand. I get that emotions and such can get involved in these kinds of things but lets not get crazy here, there was no romance involved, it was just drunken casual sex. How much of a commitment are you supposed to make for something you didn't even ask for?

So discuss. One night stand, strings attached or freedom to just walk away? Does it matter who the person was and if so does that change the level of commitment? I'd love to hear what all of you think about it. Heck to spice up the thread share a few stories if you feel like it.

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little_tippler

I don't think you owe her anything but it sucks because she seems hurt. She probably made a bad decision here because it sounds like she's been into you for a while and just got the guts to go crazy. Now she's hoping though it was a crazy drunken sex thing, that you may have feelings for her too and will now feel free to come out and say so. Which is obviously not the case.

I think it does matter who the person is. If it's a stranger, obviously they can't expect anything from you except maybe a little gratitude and a minimum of politeness. With a friend or acquaintance, it's a little sketchier because if you want to maintain the friendship, it's important to do what is necessary to stay on good terms (unless it goes beyond what you're willing to do for them, for example if they want you to sleep over after and cuddle, that may be a good moment to be straight with them and say 'hey this was great and I love your company, but don't get me wrong, I don't think I want anything further than this').

But it's not just about them being a stranger or someone you know. It's what you know about them and what you have been able to gather from them about what their intentions are with you. If you're with a stranger but they seem all dreamy eyed and romantic toward you even if they just met you, then you'd probably do best to walk away from the one night stand scenario because the ensuing mess won't be worth it.

So, back to Karen. She is your friend in some capacity. It could have just been a one night, drunken sex thing. But here's the catch - she made a point of telling you, in no uncertain terms and in private, that she's into you and has been for a while, when she said "you're the whole reason I came in here and I'm not leaving disappointed."

I don't think this is your fault but it's probably going to change things between you. If it were me, I would probably have walked away from the offer, just because of what she said. Sex always changes something, however small, and it's usually best to make sure you are clear of what the consequences are.

What will probably happen is she'll still be your friend, but less so. She'll avoid you more. She'll be colder. The mistake was essentially hers...having sex with someone you're sweet on hoping they will declare themselves to you is a pretty bad idea.

Another possible scenario is a little less miserable: she's not sweet on you but since you're friends and had sex she expected a little more caring after the fact. It could just be that. To her, courtesy after a one night stand is expected.

Good luck figuring it out.

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Whether we write or speak or do but look
We are ever unapparent. What we are
Cannot be transfused into word or book.
Our soul from us is infinitely far.
However much we give our thoughts the will
To be our soul and gesture it abroad,
Our hearts are incommunicable still.
In what we show ourselves we are ignored.
The abyss from soul to soul cannot be bridged
By any skill of thought or trick of seeming.
Unto our very selves we are abridged
When we would utter to our thought our being.
We are our dreams of ourselves, souls by gleams,
And each to each other dreams of others' dreams.

Fernando Pessoa, 1918

Iliftrocks

Being in a relationship, and not getting any, I'm tempted to say start something up with her. She's at least willing to have sex. But that is pathetic. :-(

Just call her up, have lunch, and talk about what happened. Let her know how you feel, and listen to how she feels. Tell her she was great, by the way. She might be feeling that she was somehow sub-par...

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bill hicks - "I don't mean to sound bitter, cold, or cruel, but I am, so that's how it comes out."

snowy

As I see it, it's her own fault for being hurt. If she doesn't want to get her feelings hurt, she shouldn't offer sex while drunk/high. She put herself in the situation to get hurt.

That said, you also contributed to this by not walking away when you could have--and probably should have. Sex changes things. So now you owe to the both of you to have a frank discussion about what happened if you want to keep your friendship.

This is why you don't do one night stands with friends--friends of friends are a good bet though, especially friends of friends that are "just visiting."

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Halx

It really is about what you want out of it. You're in a situation where you can probably arrange a FWB situation out of it. It doesn't seem like you want a relationship, so why not just have some fun. Set ground rules and go at it.

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rahl

I don't think this girl really has the right to be upset at all. She walked into a room got naked blew one guy and screwed another. Is her blowing your buddy before mounting you supposed to make you all warm and fuzzy inside? Does she really have the right to expect anything from this?

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Plan9

What issue of Guns & Ammo were you reading and why aren't there girls like this in my life?

...

Yeaaah... this sounds like a "sexually-liberated woman" of the bad type. All-bad type.

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Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

Wes Mantooth

Thanks for the answers all. Just to be clear about the situation, when I said walk away the next morning in THIS case (strangers are much different) I didn't mean forever I had planned on calling her again, but didn't see the need to right away or wake up cuddling the next morning or something like that. What's really odd is she does this ALOT (its become kind of a running joke around the circle), she seems to just love hooking up and getting some, which is great, but she's always complaining that the guys she picks up won't leave the next morning and keep calling her. I really figured she just wouldn't care.

I do appreciate all the advice and opinions and thank you for taking the time to offer it. I would love to hear more about what all of you think about the practice in general and the rules involved I think it would make for a great discussion. For example if you had a one night stand tonight how would you handle it? Would you feel obligated to stay overnight, call the next day? I don't think their is a proper answer but the opinions might interesting.

Plan 9: I have NO idea what issue it was I found it on the nightstand...it had a gun on the cover and maybe a red background...I didn't get much reading done that night though

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Plan9

I'll be in the Memphis / Nashville area later this year. Hook me up, Wes.

*rimshot*

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Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

yournamehere

There are no romantic strings attached if she was blowing someone else while you were fucking her.
My 2 cents.

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If you want to avoid 95% of internet spelling errors:
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It won't hurt your fashion sense, either.

Wes Mantooth

Hey pal anytime. Nashville's a great place to get stupid and crazy and in my opinion the more the merrier! Just be careful, as I'm just starting to learn myself, there are some crazy womens 'round these parts

EDIT: Snuck in on me there yournamehere, I'm in agreement, I don't think strings should be attached in this case either. Sometimes things just happen and its better to let them be.

Random thought, does anybody think sticking around or calling the next day opens you up to further commitments down the road? IE breakfast the next day leads to dinner next week, ect.

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MSD

If I stick around and am coherent enough to make breakfast in the morning, I run the risk of her wanting to keep me around for the gourmet meals. I don't know if I'm ready to make that kind of commitment after a one-nighter.

Shauk

Sounds like she has issues. Seriously if she was in there for you, why'd she bother sucking off some dude who wasn't you right in front of you? lol.

She's obviously one of those girls who uses sex to gain approval. She seems grown up enough to know that you can classify what happened as casual sex, and if you're interested in having a "fuck buddy" out of it, you're probably well within the realm of possibility to negotiate that arrangement.

that said, she sounds a bit too raunchy for my tastes.

Plan9

Relationships are only as complicated as you let them become.

...perhaps this is why I'm single. I'm never thinking that hard.

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Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

Wes Mantooth

MSD - I feel kind of the same way, one of my friends went all Dr Phil on me and said it was a fear of commitment..I don't think I agree though. In most cases, you don't really know the person and have no real emotional connection so why pretend you do? Know what I mean? Sometimes people just hook up and thats all it is and ever will be.

Shauk - I think she just REALLY likes sex. I've known her for awhile and hooking with guys is...well its a big part of who she is. Honestly I'm not really convinced she specifically wanted me in the first place. I think she got it in her head that she was going to get it on with two guys that night and was going to do and say anything to get it.

I think you hit the nail on the head when you said she uses sex to get approval and thats why I think she called me the next day. She's used to guys jumping through hoops and following her around like a lap dog to get some (I'd probably do the same if I didn't know her so well), when I didn't do either she had to try something else. She's actually a very sweet girl, and I don't mind spending time with her as a friend, but there is a LOT of emotional baggage going on there. Don't know if I'd want to get all tangled up in that for a fuck buddy though...yikes!


PS I hate when I hit backspace and for some reason my browser goes to the previous page and I lose everything I just typed...GRRR!

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Shauk

I hate it too, so I disable it. (assuming you're using firefox?)

Disable or Enable Backspace as ‘Go Back’ Page Browsing Function in Firefox

lagoonguy

How old are you guys? I think age plays a factor here. I myself am 37, and all of my single 30 something friends kind of have an idea that the occasional drunken (or what it sounds like with Karen, some other 'enhancement') hookup happens. For example, my friend Kaye and I are very close friends, and i've met a lot of girls through her (in this example, Susan). Well, after a night of drinking with Susan and some others, i ended up at Susan's place... First we were just chilling, then started making out, and i was the one that said 'we can't have sex' --- and Susan actually said 'don't be a boy'.... then she said 'you know, we can NEVER let Kaye know we've fooled around' - and I said 'well, i don't want sex to fuck anything up' and again she said 'stop being afraid' ---- so we had sex. And it was fine. the next day we had a few texts back and forth, but that was it. It was kind of an understanding that it was a casual thing... especially since she, Kaye, and our circle are all close. But I think we've got the maturity (if that's the right word) of being mid to late 30s, and can understand that casual sex can be just that, as long as it's understood to begin with.

Now, if you guys are early 20s, I think a girl throwing sex around is more of an attempt to get you, or get approval from you, or something like that. Of course I'm not saying i'm the wise man because i'm in my 30s, but I certainly recognize there is a difference between how it is now, and how it was for me 15 years ago.

Wes Mantooth

I just turned 30, Will I believe is 28 as is Karen. I agree with everything you said and feel the same way, sometimes things just happen and in the end you just walk away. There is no need for two adults to mess up a good friendship because alcohol and libido got the best of you for a night.

However I do think some people for better or worse have sex, love and emotion wrapped so tightly together they can't or won't separate casual sex and...what would be the proper term? Real sex, Relationship sex? In the end you wind up with one person being perfectly fine with it just being casual and another who thinks its the beginning of something special no matter what the circumstances or age. I think these are usually the people who want you there the next morning or expect phone calls and further dates even when it was perfectly clear it was only a one night thing.

I think someone like Karen sits on the other end of the spectrum and uses casual sex to fill some sort of hole in her life. The problem is as much as she wants it to be just casual sex her emotions are all still all wrapped up in it and she feeds off the reactions and attention she gets. In other words its not so much about the sex as getting respect, acceptance or approval and if sex doesn't fulfill that for whatever reason she keeps going to the next step until she gets it. I don't know if either example is really based on maturity or if its just something that is part of who that person is and will always exist in them to some extent.

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yournamehere

I cannot think of any age when blowing my friend in front of me would "get me," other than for very casual sex.

And to be fair, if I was serious about a lady, I don't think going down on her friend would be in my playbook to win her over.

I can, however, agree with the PSY 101 correlation of sex and approval.
But sticking your ass in the air mid-blowjob and saying, "You can fuck me if you want?' Sorry - I know all about thinking with the wrong head - but as soon as I cum; I'm gone.

__________________
If you want to avoid 95% of internet spelling errors:
"If your ridiculous pants are too loose, you're definitely going to lose them. Tell your two loser friends over there that they're going to lose theirs, too."
It won't hurt your fashion sense, either.

MSD

So she tries to substitute sex and sex appeal for self esteem, but still ends up feeling hollow and unfulfilled when she wakes up hungover and not entirely sure how many dicks went into which holes. It's predictable behavior, and it's unfortunate that one of your friends got caught up in it and dragged you in.

I'll be realistic, you're going to drunkenly fuck her a few more times before you realize how immature and shallow she is, and you're going to get tired of it and start distancing yourself from her before she drags you down mentally.

Plan9

MSD, the sex never gets old. Dealing with the person when you're not having sex is what gets old.

There is nothing wrong with using people that want to be used as long as its consensual.

You shouldn't feel guilty putting quarters in a vending machine and getting a drink.

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Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

raptor9k

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Plan9

Heh, I think a lot of people use booze/dope as an excuse to act a fool instead of it actually being the reason they're actin' a fool. Scapegoat'd!

Well, I figure the quarters are attention and the drink is sex. And sure, we're all great high brow moral philosophers here... but I think a lot of us on this board would have rolled on the rain jacket and plundered the community hotpocket. Some hot-hot "NSA FWB" monkey sex action is just what we need.

...so what if it's true?

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Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

Wes Mantooth

Plan9 - LOL, crude but you make a great point in both posts. Sometimes people just set themselves up for the roll they play in life and endless people are going to take advantage of that. I don't really know that its wrong to "use" somebody who wants or even asks be "used" for lack of a better expression. But like you pointed out while the sex is great you have to be ready to carry a whole lot of baggage with it and personally I think its never really worth it.


MSD - Pretty much nailed it on the head. I do think the behavior is more prevalent then people realize though. Its almost similar to a drug addict in a way, the high is amazing but, big surprise, when you crash you feel like garbage and spend all your time looking for more. Anyway I don't know if I really want to go down that road again, shes a friend and pretty sweet girl when she's not on something or after someone and I'd really rather leave it at that to be honest.

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