Starshine

I find this to be an interesting topic to ask friends:

What do you consider cheating? Is a one time drunken make-out cheating? Or even spending excessive time with another member of the opposite sex that is not your significant other?

What do you think?

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Frosstbyte

Cheating is when you do something you're ashamed to tell your significant other.

That sounds like something I read somewhere else, but I can't think of where it would've been, so I don't have an attribution. Obviously the scope of that is constrained to "somethings" that you do with another person who could be a potential romantic interest or lust object or what have you. Being ashamed that you gambled away all your money and puked in her new $300 shoes doesn't count.

Plan9

The answers to this thread can definitely be found elsewhere using the search feature in the bar above the thread body. It's located between "New Posts" and "Quick Links."

...

To use "cheating" (a la sex) might imply that a relationship is a game.

It's all a game, isn't it?

/Rollins

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Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

Starshine

I guess I've really never done anything I'm "ashamed" of telling my bf, cause I'm pretty honest about everything. But to me, making out while on Liquid Courage isn't cheating...it's fun. HA. I'm really not that shallow, but really a momentary slip up shouldn't all trust is my thought.

That was a really good quote i must say! And thank you for your input on threads, I'm new....I don't understand all this so your advice is much appreciated!!!

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Halx

This is a tried and true debate here. Frosstbyte pretty much summed up the opinion of the masses. If you can't/won't tell your partner, you're not in the clear.

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inBOIL

IMO, you're responsible for ensuring that you don't act in a way that disrespects your SO. Making out with someone else is disrespectful; doing so only because you're drunk is no excuse. Unless, of course, the two of you have discussed it beforehand and agreed that being drunk means it doesn't count.

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blahblah454

I agree with the above posters.

To me if you even kiss someone else, be in male or female, its cheating and its over between us. Simple as that.

KirStang

You betray the other's person's reasonable trust--then you done fucked up.

levite

I'm not necessarily opposed to defining cheating as anything you're ashamed to tell your partner that involves you and another member of the gender in which you're interested.

In the strictest sense, I would probably say that anything physical that goes on between you and another person of your gender-of-interest, which you would not ordinarily do with your friends of the gender-not-of-interest, definitely crosses the line. I think emotional intimacy is much more difficult to gauge, and largely constitutes a grey area which I would call "walking the line."

But being intoxicated is definitely no excuse for anything.

And all of these things, of course, are subject to clear and open discussion with one's partner: quite often, people are willing to make many allowances, or give their partners a substantial amount of room and free rein, if they are given the opportunity to discuss the matter abstractly in a fair and honest fashion first.

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Dull sublunary lovers love,
Whose soul is sense, cannot admit
Absence, because it doth remove
That thing which elemented it.

(From "A Valediction: Forbidding Mourning" by John Donne)

Starshine

After rereading what I asked/said, I realized I wasn't as complete as I should be...
I really sound like an ass for my "Liquid courage making out is fun...etc. etc." and it really makes me sound immature, but that gets me to another point that maybe someone can help me understand:

Is it just a "young person" thing? (not sure on the age range around here, nor am I positive that age has anything to do with it) But has anyone had a period in their life when they were "boy/girl crazy"? And just have all these little crushes and just couldn't make up their mind? And do you think that's okay to have that time to be a "wild child"?

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levite

Sure, I think we all have our wilder days. I mean, any human being is, from the ages of around 13 to 22, basically just an enormous spewing gusher of hormones with legs.

And I think we all have, in that context, probably done a couple of stupid things we regret later in life as things we might not have done with a little more maturity.

But I think even when you're young, you know cheating is wrong. My pals and I, growing up, were fairly randy little bastards, but we still knew you either don't cheat on your girl, or you break up with her before you hook up with someone else. I admit, I knew a fair number of guys who, at one time or another, made that break-up phone call with another girl waiting for them in the next room. But still...they broke up before they hooked up.

__________________
Dull sublunary lovers love,
Whose soul is sense, cannot admit
Absence, because it doth remove
That thing which elemented it.

(From "A Valediction: Forbidding Mourning" by John Donne)

hannukah harry

there's nothing wrong with being "boy/girl crazy" or a "wild child" as long as you don't hurt yourself or someone else in the process. if you're dating multiple people at the same time and there are no commitments, that's fine. but if you spend all your time with one person, act like a couple, etc, and then make out with others without your main person knowing? that'd be wrong.

if you want to hook up with a different person each night, go ahead. just make sure you're not leading any of them on.

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mixedmedia

I agree with most everybody on the thread. Yes, making out with someone when you are committed to another person is cheating.

And maybe it's just me, but I never 'make out' with someone I'm not intending to have sex with. Do people really do that? Sexually active adults, I mean?

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PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

ShaniFaye

Making out with another person when you are committed to someone else AND its been established that such behavior is cheating....is cheating

Please remember not all of us in committed relationships see fooling around with a 3rd party cheating.

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mixedmedia

Granted.

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Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus
PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

hannukah harry

true, but usually that only happens when you've previously discussed it with your significant other. if you have to ask if drunken make-out sessions with others is cheating, it probably is...

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Jenna

Cheating to me, is anything that is not discussed and approved with your partner.

So, for instance, if I was to go make-out with another man without telling my boyfriend, that would be cheating.

But, if we had previously discussed and approved the making out, it would not be cheating.

In my opinion.

snowy

Yep. Actually, because of TFP, when my partner and I first got together this was one of the first things we laid ground rules for. Having had the conversation here made the conversation with him much easier. Thanks TFP!

But it's okay to drunkenly make out with guys if you have no definitive commitment. God knows I did my fair share of that. I was always clear with the men I was seeing that we were just dating, however.

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Xerxys

OK, So I got this from Craig's list and this dude in Omaha left a messsage dor a certain cuckold in the neighbourhood.

to the guy doing my wife
Date: 2008-02-21, 1:43PM CST


To the guy doing my wife. You know who you are. Yes I know. No I am not angry, I would just ask a few things of you. After all you are giving it to my wife.

1.Please stop leaving the seat up, I keep getting blamed and it is starting to get old.

2.You may be giving me a chance to go fishing more often but please stop drinking all my beer. It is fine if you have a couple while you visit(god knows
I drink plenty before I find her attractive), but please leave me a few as I have to be there longer than you.

3.If you do drink the last one buy more or leave money on the counter I will pick some up.

4.Please replace the toilet paper when you use it all. For some reason my 5 year old son belives if its not there he does not have to wipe. We keep it under the sink, unless you can recomend a better spot?

5.After doing my wife please use something disposable to wipe off with. The basket of clothes on the right is mine and the clothes are clean as my wife does not do my washing, Irun out of time rushing to work. Last week my sweatshirt was crusty(thanks).

6.Please do not tell my children that you are their uncle, they are young not
mentaly challenged.

7.Please stop turning the heat up, You pay nothing and MUD is putting it in my ass, my wife may like it but I think it hurts.

8.When she asks "do these pants make me look fat", say no. You may think giving a different answer will make her think twice about eating a gallon of ice cream a day but all you are doing is giving her a reason to go buy more pants that she will look just as fat in.

9.Stop eating the baked goods. The brownies you ate were from my mom for my birthday. My wife has not cooked anything that good for years and if she does she will not share.

10.Try shifting your weight when you sit on my chair. The recliner that I rarely have time for (soccer games and practice, basketball camp for the kids takes much of my time and I try to help with school work too)has a grove in it that forces me to roll to the left.

Lastly I would like thank you for taking her to lunch on Valentines Day. She was not as hungry as usual and only orded one meal.I may be able to use the money I saved to take the children to a movie. I hope you can help me with these items, it may become ackward if I have to confront her. If you can do this for me I will give you a heads up on when I will be gone and for how long so that you don't feel rushed.

P.S. I am going to take the kids to the Great Wolf Lodge on the 3rd of April for four days, I have abottle of vodka above the fridge if you find yourself low on beer.

Thanks This was not writen by anyone named Jack S.

............Gosh, this was good!! I really wonder if it was for real!!

marshmellow

For me, I have two definitions of cheating:
Physical: When you knowingly do something that you would not normally do with someone who you are not in a committed relationship with.
Emotional: This one is gray. If your in a relationship with someone, but you are romantically in love with someone else, to me, your cheating because your not giving your partner your full true feelings, only a fake image of it.

Mugzy6

I think the definition really changes from relationship to relationship. Some people are totally fine with their SO's kissing other people and other people definitely aren't. The boundary is where you make it.

Starkizzer

Coming from a family where cheating has run rampant and seeing the ones I love so distraught and the turmoil it causes, cheating is a deal breaker.

For me there are no apologies or second chances. I realize that some people do have different types of relationships and thats what makes the world wonderful and interesting. But for me I need the stability, since much of my life has been unstable, and those ground rules were discussed very early on.

Plus, he's a knife lover and has therefore given me several as presents so I playful remind him that by giving me the tools we have come to an unspoken agreement that if he cheats I can use them to ensure he will never cheat again...mwuahahah!

In all seriousness, I believe that if you don't love a person anymore than have the common courtesy to tell them first. At some point you did love them so end things in a way that you won't be ashamed of later in your life!

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mandy

Cheating Is Bad!!!!!

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dd3953

It is all a game. And the game of relationships is one where the rules need to be set up, clearly, from the start. I don't think having sex with another person is cheating, unless there is true feelings involved. As is was stated, cheating is when you do something you are ashamed of telling your SO. So if it's something you don't wanna share, don't do it.

And although I don't think having sex with another person is cheating (we would have discussed this and both agree) I would feel some type of way about kissing. But this is only because I think kissing is "more" than just fucking.

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telekinetic

Sure...it's called "being single"

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twisted no more

Plan9

HAHAH! +1 Man, that shit gets expensive.

I think a lot of us settle down to save money on pretentious dates.

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Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

vancityboi

spending time with the opposite sex that is not your S.O is not cheating...my best friends are girls...

on the other hand, drunken make-out IS cheating. Just because your intoxicated does not waive your right to be unfaithful to your S.O

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Life is easier to measure by experience points -Watch The Guild

genuinegirly

Xerxys, that was a hilarious addition to this thread.

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lotsofmagnets

my friend´s gf went back to her hometown to sort herself out for a week and got drunk one night and ended up sleeping with her ex. all of his friends told him to dump her sorry arse and i was at the front of that chorus, especially given all he´d done for her (she was in an ashram by pressure of one of her friends and had confidence issues, my friend guided her for almost a year and was by far the main reason she got back on her feet.) he ignored all of us and overlooked it. their relationship is just entering their 2nd year and it´s looking like he was right and the rest of us were wrong.

footnote: he met her after i´d left australia so i´d never met her but heard all about her (my friend has known me since he was born.) thus it was pretty easy for me to tell him to put her out in the street. i did meet her when i went back for christmas and turns out she´s a champion so i guess it´s all good in the end if this story has a point, it escapes me at the moment.

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she shed her mountain turning training wheels, for the convenience of the moving sidewalk, that delivers the magnetic monkey children through the mouth of impossible calendar clock, into the devil's manhole cauldron.
physics of a bicycle, isn't it remarkable?

william

Cheating is doing w/those you would have a problem w/your SO doing to others. i.e.- If you don't care if he goes down on her(or shagging) (or sucking tongue) (or her on him), okay. It's a personal decision between the couple.

girldetective

I think cheating is all about intention. I dont think I have ever kissed someone other than family or friends without the intention of more, more, more

and really I need to feel something for that person first even if Im drunk. I may think to myself when sober that it was a mistake and I might ignore telling my SO, but I wouldnt ignore my own behavior. I would start lookin at it and why, and make sure that I didnt have that kind of fun again.

Babydoll is a little deeper than might be expected.

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As far as possible, without surrender, be on good terms with all persons...be cheerful; strive for happiness - Desiderata

highthief

Why should cheating in a relationship be any different from cheating at cards or on your taxes?

Relationships have mutually agreed upon ground rules that either come about because you have discussed them (recommended) or because you and your s/o have a shared value system. If you deviate from those rules, you have cheated, no matter how you may try to justify what you have done.

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Si vis pacem parabellum.

Psycho Dad

Well I guess it doesn't have to be different. But I can't see how cheating in a relationship is going to bring anyone financial gain unless they are hooking.

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Don't always trust the opinions of experts.

highthief

Cheating at cards for no money, cheating at golf, cheating at Monopoly, take your pick.

I wouldn't want to have a relationship with a person who plays fast and loose with the rules, nor would I want to work with them, and I sure wouldn't play cards with them!

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Psycho Dad

No... I know what you meant. I just couldn't help not step through that opening.

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Don't always trust the opinions of experts.

host

In one survey, 57 percent of adults admit to flirting online. We live in an age of instant and discreet communication. We are human, in that we are imperfect and impulsive.

IMO, our reactions to being "cheated on", by a partner are more about us, than about our partner. We can set standards high enough....for other people.... to increase the certainty that we will end up alone, with no ongoing risk of sudden disappointment....we can live it 24/7, in a small and constant dose, of "aloneness".

We all have to do much growing, emotionally, throughout our lifetimes. Draw a line in the sand, set all the immovable standards you wish, for yourself. If you impose them on others, you set yourself up for the disappointment that follows.

Is it an accident that literature and stage and movie drama are replete with stories of infidelity and amorous intrigue? Are you or your partner different enough to be exempt from all of the situations befalling the actors and characters? Also, aren't the lives of prominent artist, actors, politicians, and other ambitious people, seemingly accompanied by stories of adultery and other example of infidelity?

Is it because of ambition, opportunity, narcissistic personality.....or is it just a part of living life to a fuller degree, than less prominent or accomplished people?

Is refusing to give in to every inappropriate urge that comes up, LIVING? Is your partner so unlike you that they cannot understand, at all, how it could happen, to consider making an allowance for it? Are you so unlike them? Why are you with each other, then?

It isn't easy to resist all temptation. Is it worth it? Is what is left, after all is resisted, LIVING?

In hindsight, cheating is always regarded as destructive, even irrational behavior, but much less often, in realtime. One LIVES one's life. Living does not always mean following the predictable or the wisest path.

Collectively, we are becoming more conservative, in so many ways. We take a dimmer view on infidelity than we do on war mongering.....why?

Tully Mars

If someone's in a committed relationship and they're engaged in sexual activity with 3rd party and the SO is neither aware of or would not approve- then it's cheating. If you're involved with someone cheating on some else what's your trust level of that person going to be? I mean you know going in the person cheats, right? I'm always amazed then people who cheat on their SO's get together. It always seems to be just a matter of time before I end up hearing "Oh god! (he/she) is cheating on me!" Well duh, wasn't she/he cheating on their ex when you got together?

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host

It doesn't seem to happen to the sharper ones, Tully.... but that doesn't make the ones who avoid that pitfall, more sincere..... their lack of sincerity ends up being a "saving" grace.

girldetective

Tully Mars
I can answer this question for you. In order to have trust of your married lover you must be able to suspend reality, rather like reading a piece of fiction. It is easy to do as your lover will help you. However if your lover lies pathologically and about most anything at anytime to the point that he has forgotten or slips up, then there is no trust. If you continue to see him, you must do so with eyes open and realize that you are in a very adult situation that requires top form thinking. You must be able to curb or stunt your feelings in order to continue to see this lover. If you dont, you run the risk of being terribly hurt. Even if you do curb your feelings, you still wonder if it is worth it, why you are doing it, what it is about this lover, and it becomes messy within yourself. You end it a million times in your head, until he comes around with his romance and sweeps you up. You go along, and the next day you think to yourself once again about what are you doing. It is poor cyclic behavior that is an injustice to your self-worth. You are suddenly worthwhile to your lover as a lover, but not necessarily as a person. Your worth becomes tied to your body, how you busta move, and pleasing him rather than who you are or what it is that may be important to you. All along though you watch and see what is happening. You know that it isnt real, and yet he makes it real for you and in doing so it is easy to lose that top form thinking. Although you might look at it analytically and know whats going on, it can remain a very difficult, confusing situation and one that is best looked at as a game that even girldetectives have trouble with. The fire is gettin hot.

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As far as possible, without surrender, be on good terms with all persons...be cheerful; strive for happiness - Desiderata

TH12

Anything that you won't tell your partner. Hmmm. I have thoughts and fantasies I won't tell my partner about. When I check out a lady's body, I don't tell my partner, and she doesn't like it if she notices that I did. No, that definition is to broad. But I agree that anything you do with someone else, that you won't tell your partner about is cheating.