sapiens

This is in Tilted Politics. I viewed Carno's original post as a critique of posting rules on TFP in general - an extension of other posts he made in General Discussion. I thought that it reflected some hostility. I thought that it was wasn't appropriate for politics. As a critique of thread placement in TFP, I suppose it was appropriate. I felt that my comments above were reasonable and on topic. I wasn't at all hostile. I received the response above. Not particularly understanding or "fun". Apparently, a person can't talk about the politics of the board in a thread about the politics of the board in Tilted politics without getting sworn at.

RB's post initial post may have been less friendly, but it was an extension of other related posts by Carno. RB's subsequent posts seem to be related to the topic of this thread as well. (Granted, they are from a different perspective).

I think that if we're concerned about the tone of Tilted Politics, we should all work on our tone...

abaya

With all due respect to the naysayers, I have to say, this thread makes me laugh. I don't like the smart-assed intention of the OP, but as long as that thread on Hezbollah remains in GD, I have no problem with this one existing in Politics.

And, for the record, Honey Maid plain and simple for my S'mores. I can't stand for anything else!

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

pig

roach, just to double jump on pan's post a bit - i think that's the point of this post, to me at least.

no. don't take it seriously. carno was making a point...although i don't necessarily agree with how he set out to do it - i agree with you there, i'm not sure this post would have stood in other circumstances - i think it serves the point to open up for some venting of frustration at the way discourse on politics occurs by member who may not be regulars here, or who may be intimidated by the environment here. i think in the context of the little period of internal reflection going on across the boards right now, this post is strangely appropriate in that it might start making politics more approachable to some outsiders to express themselves here...and it could serve as a reminder that it doesn't always have to be so serious in here all the time.

a little irreverence is ok, i think. i can definately tell you work in academics - that symbolism with analogy between consumerism and politics i think is something only you thought of. i think carno was just being an irreverent smartass when he started this thread - no real "framing" or "positioning" involved.

supple - that italicized "I" ( I ) in your post looks like a slash.

edit: roach: i also know you can be a little sensitive about these things, so to clarify: i don't think anyone is saying there is no place in politics for yourself and/or host...well, ustwo may have made some comments about host - but seriously, you're one of the pillars in this part of the community. i honestly don't really know why, but people are apparently intimidated a bit by your on-line persona...always framing and contextualizing and positioning and so forth. as i said above, i think the best thing here is the opportunity for people to let their hair down and relax a little...even within politics. i think it could even help move the quality of conversation forward in general.

__________________
You don't love me, you just love my piggy style

roachboy

superfluous post.
what is important is below somewhere

__________________
a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle
spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear

it make you sick.

-kamau brathwaite

powerclown

<embed src="http://home.comcast.net/~powerclown/TheTrashman-SurfinBird.mp3" autostart="FALSE">
You Know It, Pan

spectre

Which is why this thread was allowed to stay. To be honest, when I first saw the thread, I wanted to kill it off until I saw something pretty unprecedented in here, people actually having fun rather than bickering. Liberal, Conservative, and everyone in between just relaxing for a bit and having a laugh. It isn't pointed at any specific person as "stop posting because we think your style is silly," it's just a little light hearted fun. If you don't stop to have a laugh once in a while, life becomes really boring. But if you don't want to, that's fine, just skip the thread and post in a different one.

__________________
"Fuck these chains
No goddamn slave
I will be different" ~ Machine Head

roachboy

ok....i have a busy afternoon and have to go, so want to clairfy one thing that i think went away in the flurry of activity this morning: what i object to really--fundamentally--in this thread is the post by cynthetiq. i take it as personally disrespectful. that is why i asked about the status of the post--whether he is talking as a mod or as a memebr who happens also to be a mod. i interpreted analog's post in light of cyn's. had these things not happened, i would not have reacted at all---i do not think the thread is interesting--i have NO problem if the intent is to inject some joking around here--but it wasnt. you have to sever the op from other "discussions" to think that. i do not make any such separation, not in this case.
but i already said as much.

the problem is with the mod interventions, so far as i am concerned.
everything else is just reaction on my part to things that, taken on their own, are not such a big deal--all part of the game itself--but cyn's action here i take as personally insulting.
and i assume that in their capacity as mods, the rules against such personal attacks do not apply.
so it is doubly insulting--because the rules do not apply (it seems) i would expect more restraint. instead, i get the above.

that is the problem.

this is reinforced by another problem--the treatment that has been accorded to host, routinely. in that i see nothing but disrespect. i am surprised he has put up with it--he is perhaps a better person than i am--but it has really been appalling to watch the sustained attacks on host for months now--attacks in which cyn also played a part. i wonder if host as departed--he said he would--that would be a real loss. i do not think the "community" values him enough, even if folk disagree with his style.
but apparently, ridiculing host is a special case, wherein (again) the rules about personal attacks are suspended.
nice work, comrades.

so there it is.
clarify that, please.

__________________
a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle
spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear

it make you sick.

-kamau brathwaite

pig

roach: i know you're going to want clarification from cyn directly; but i think what you're asking for is a difficult distinction. i think there's some modiness in cyn's post, in that he is at least indirectly giving the thread some direction, but I also read it as one member challenging another member to relax a little, and maybe throw out some subtle humor-laden "well fuck you too buddy" style commentary.

I'm not sure that this is a good thing, if it's something that persists across the boards. Here we've just spent a lot of time complaining about posters not respecting each other, and its hard to laugh at each other and ourselves without being outright dicks to each other.

I guess the question, at least for me, is 1. cyn were you actively encouraging roach to tear into carno's shit, 2. is that a good idea in keeping with tfp policy, and 3. do you have any idea how many multisyllabic adjectives would be involved in roach properly ripping someone's ass?

__________________
You don't love me, you just love my piggy style

Ustwo

Powerclown wins the thread.

If you don't know why, you are part of the problem.

__________________
Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.

Bill O'Rights

Roach...if, as you believe, Carno came in and pissed all over the floor in politics...then most everyone else threw down some boards and made a bridge over it. Why...would you want to walk in it?
If, as you claim, Carno's op was a "dig" at politics, then turn it around on him. Laugh at him.

I purposely left this thread open yesterday for a reason. It was subsequently closed for discussion, and I argued to open it back up for the very same reason. Blow off some damn steam, people. Look at yourselves, and have a good laugh. Take off your blinders and look at the guy next to you. Laugh at him, too.

Ustwo? Don't just point. Point and laugh. Take up the liberal view (whatever the hell that might be) in this little graham cracker debate. I've seen several good paradys here. It's your turn.

__________________
"I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires." - Susan B. Anthony

"Hedonism with rules isn't hedonism at all, it's the Republican party." - JumpinJesus

It is indisputable that true beauty lies within...but a nice rack sure doesn't hurt.

powerclown

This is all Pan's fault for resurrecting the all-conquering spirit of...GHOUL POWER!!!

Carno

Yes, Honey Maid is indeed a fine brand. As for ketchup and mustard, everything in moderation! Reverend Graham may have invented the taste sensation known as graham crackers, but he ain't powerful enough to fight ketchup and mustard!

War? No.

Nor does it treat my ungodly lust either. Reverend Graham was most certainly a failure in that department.

Terrorist food? Hell no!

"what a disappointment."
Luckily I have heard that sentence enough in my life that I am oblivious to it.

Well, it seems they just don't want to reveal their taste preferences; despite our disappointment, we can't force them.

Yes I do have a certain disdain for the climate in Politics. I am only trying to add some humor into a deathly serious forum.

I can't disagree with you here; I'll have to try all the flavors.

Yeah, maybe he secretly likes the chocolate ones but is scared to admit it. It's okay roachboy, no one will judge you here.

I posted this thread with many intentions and many expectations. So far all of them have come true. I wasn't really trying to troll here though.

Sorry dude, in this rough and tumble world, you gotta think for yourself.

Oh damn, I forgot about teddy grahams! They fucking rock.

Graham crackers are a staple of my diet and I felt they weren't getting the attention they deserve. Despite Reverend Graham's motives, I do think he created a quality snack.

Hah...

Yeah, it's a good habit to have.

Interesting question, pan. We'll have to dig deeper into this...

Damn, Rev. Graham was a Yankee bastard. Maybe I should rethink my opinion of graham crackers.

The South will rise again!

Someone send this man a case!

As for the pronunciation, I always just say it like "gram". I'm not an academian or anything though, and in fact still a disappointing undergrad.

Yes, you really should introduce graham crackers to those poor, grahamless souls.

Well, this was not my intention, but it's your decision.

But they're still not graham crackers.

Boo!

We should call them Fucking Good Crackers. I dislike the Reverend Graham now, so I don't want ot be reminded of him every time I eat one of these things.

All humor must be checked at the door.

Haha, could be true. Those godless heathens can be tricky sometimes.

No milk?? That's a travesty.

I've read your agruments and your sources, but I feel that I'm still right. Ha.

When did I ever say that it was my primary complaint?

This time you got it right. I've had a change of opinion though, I think the other thread is fine in GD, and this one is fine in Politics. I'm a reasonable man, and I've changed my stance.

I wasn't aware that there were different rules when it comes to me. I have been moderated my own fair share. I even think some of the mods secretly hate me

Whoa, you're overthinking things.

Indeed.

wtf? No graham flour? Those bastards.

Hey, it's like Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon, for politics!

It's all an effort to destroy the little people.

This thread had no hostility in it until people added their own.

I certainly was not saying that the current frequenters of Politics leave. I was simply using "ham-fisted, undergraduate level sarcam" to try and change the way they come down on people who aren't academians or part of the elite.[/QUOTE]

I feel that he doesn't, no matter that I have no proof or substantial sources to back up my arguments.

__________________
http://how-to-spell-ridiculous.com/

host

Supple Cow,

I reacted to what I observed as an "official" defense (preservation)of an obvious troll thread, that was formed in the context of this insult by this thread's author, that I covered in my last post:
The taunting post directed at roachboy, after he posted similar points, triggered my last post. That taunt, IMO, would have been inappropriate if it had come from an ordianry member.

I posted in the context of my experience here....check this list of politics threads that I have authored, look at the last post in each of the threads with the "locked" symbol, and draw your own conclusions. Additionally, consider the thread titled, "The giant merged Karl Rove thread" that was authored by me as two threads, and then combined and re-titled without any prior communication with me:
http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/search.php?searchid=686656

Consider the circumstances of the last thread that I authored here that was closed, just the other day:
My point Supple Cow, is that some of us who participate here regularly, have paid a higher price, in terms of criticism and harrassment, as a direct result of our participation, than anyone who you think may be discouraged from participating here for the first time, will ever experience. To observe now, that an obvious troll thread, created by someone who has made the comments that this thread's author has made, is "officially" supported, complete with taunts directed at roachboy, because he objected to the motivation of the thread's author, and the subject and content of the OP, is quite a disturbing development to observe.

filtherton

I, for one, am appalled by the thinly disuised anti-semitic comments in this thread. Especially in light of the fact that those graham cracker boxes are clearly doctored.

HOW CAN WE EVEN BE SURE THAT GRAHAM CRACKERS EVEN EXIST?!?!?!?!?! I'm know for a fact that the notion of the existence of graham crackers is nothing more than a clever ruse created by a bunch of cowardly, cut and run cheeze-its.

pig

And just who are you calling a "cracker," anyway? So what if I'm from deep in the Incestous South??? I'm part of the Gang of 14 bitches!!! I'll own you. Rich white people own shit...always have, always will. Kiss the Rings!

__________________
You don't love me, you just love my piggy style

Supple Cow

Host, I genuinely appreciate how invested you are in this board, and that is why I am going to add something here in response to what you've said, even though I am still a touch confused about why you are responding to me about something I said to roachboy. I can only assume that you feel that you feel that you are both under some ill-conceived scrutiny from certain people for the some of same reasons, and this may be true.


I think I understand where you are coming from a little better now. However, I hope that you will investigae each part of this argument a little further before you come to any conclusions about any conspiracy between the mods and Carno (or any other member anyone might seem to think is favored in some way). Cyn is a human being whom you can challenge (respectfully) to be more careful with his words or in any other way you wish.

If there's anything that we can be sure will continue around here, it's that people will make mistakes. Just as you can be challenged by the moderators to work on the style and content of your posts (as evinced by the actions they took, e.g. the Karl Rove thread), you can challenge the moderators (or just one) by bringing the matter up directly with the moderators or in public as you have done. I hope now that Cyn will return and address this.

__________________
"I've missed more than 9000 shots in my career. I've lost almost 300 games. Twenty-six times I've been trusted to take the game winning shot and missed. I've failed over and over and over again in my life. And that is why I succeed."
(Michael Jordan)

Cynthetiq

[QUOTE=roachboy]so let's think for a moment, shall we?
let's assume for a moment that this cretin thread is worth taking seriously.

Insult? Where in the world to you get insult from my quote:

I never stated any insult nor implied it. You inferred or assumed it. I stated that you walk the walk you talk. Period. Did you see additional letters and words that do not exist? I had actually had something that could have been interpreted as insulting so I removed it so as not to confuse anyone. But please show me where in the above 45 word quote there is any insult or personal attack written or insinuated by me. I was simply stating that if you think you can do better, than by all means show us.

I see, so a shrouded thinly veiled personal attack? Please include the rest of the reason why I don't like to read all of hosts linkapalooza. Reading each link, verifying the position, motive, background, etc of each citation post and authors. I cannot keep up with the volume that host provides. Isn't that what kind of critical thinking that you're imploring people to do? But if it takes 3-4 days to digest the topic and it's citations, I don't have time for that, I have other things to do in life as do you.

It's not much different than your own dislike for punctuation and capital letters. You dislike them so you don't particpate in them. Is it fair for me to continue to badger and hound you for it? You've stated it, I've moved on from it. It appears you can't let my own style go.

As far as host, the only thing I've continued to request of him is to venture out of the politics forum. Let the community know more about host outside of politics. IMO, he's risen to the challenge and done it.

I cannot comment on what happened to the thread yesterday. I wasn't party to nor privy to what happened with it.

As I've stated before people are entitled to their opinions, however they are founded and discovered. They are also entitled to respond and engage, and also walk away from the discussion after exclaiming their opinion as such.

I agree with that, some threads exist outside of the Politics thread and a good thing for the community. It's hard to discuss how the price of gas affects you and your household without someone popping bipartisan politics blaming some special interest group or vilifying someone who wants to open ANWR to ease the costs.

Again you make an assumption. I have never met Carno. He's been in NYC and I've not had the opportunity to meet him. I do not give privilege to those I know in 3D IRL, that would be totally absurd. The only thing I can say to that is that if I do know someone who I know IRL and they posted something questionable, I have called them on the phone and asked them to change it before another mod or someone else picks up on it. I will not put myself in the middle, I never have and never will.

My posts have been that there is space for EVERYONE. Those with voluminous links and citations and those with gut unfounded opinion. To your point of stating that there is no longer space for you here seems to me like you're playing the martyr card. If you or host think there is no place to exist, then that's your issue not mine.

Interesting to see that when a majority of the people seem to take an interst in folding into the politics forum, instead of trying to ease them in you'd rather ostracize and criticize them which seems rather cliquish and elitest to me.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

ktspktsp

The problem, Cyn, is not so much the content of Carno's objections (he's certainly entitled to them), but rather his noxious style about it. Bringing up a point countless times in several threads, and starting a trolling thread about it, are rather uncivil things to do.

I feel that such behavior is detrimental to the community feeling in the TFP.

Cynthetiq

And that's his style, as is host's voluminous quotations and citations, as is roachboy's disdain for punctuation and capilization. So long as no one is flaming another member, where does it go against the TFP charter?

I'm sorry but I try to remain objective, I must be completely blind but I have not seen the post that you or roachboy seem to be talking about.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

uncle phil

/me is making 'smores on the deck...anybody join me?

__________________
"We were wrong, terribly wrong. (We) should not have tried to fight a guerrilla war with conventional military tactics against a foe willing to absorb enormous casualties...in a country lacking the fundamental political stability necessary to conduct effective military and pacification operations. It could not be done and it was not done."
- Robert S. McNamara
-----------------------------------------
"We will take our napalm and flame throwers out of the land that scarcely knows the use of matches...
We will leave you your small joys and smaller troubles."
- Eugene McCarthy in "Vietnam Message"
-----------------------------------------
never wrestle with a pig.
you both get dirty;
the pig likes it.

pan6467

See I never really have seen a Carno thread because I don't venture much into TFP like I used to. I stick to things I like and just don't look at other things.... (my problem I should venture out more.)

Anywhoooo, I saw this thread and read it. I didn't see it as a "troll" or as sour grapes. I truly saw it as a man who was fed up and wanted to show that there would be people in this political forum, that would take this thread meant as a joke/test and turn it into a fight.

The joke have an opinion on something inconsequential and have at it.... have a sense of humor, satarize and make a parody of politics and release some stress.

To me, I loved it..... I loved being able to let loose and share my sense of humor and maybe have someone laugh. And I loved the way most people jumped in and let themselves loose and enjoy a harmless thread.

So Carno made disparaging remarks somewhere.... I never saw them nor knew about them. So I was not participating in anything but a fun for me thread.

My God, some of you sound like John Lithgow in "Footloose" or Ted Knight in "CaddyShack" or some of those other old bitties from 80's movies, who refused to allow others to have fun.

You have to ask yourselves when you became so fucking high and mighty and judgemental over where and when people could have fun and humor and when that judging included taking everything so seriously that even a goof off thet truly could not hurt anyone, became what you believe to be a shot at you and your friends (actually, it's quite egotistical to believe that this whole thread and all these silly posts were aimed at an elite few).

I close on the old saying.... "if you can't laugh at yourself..... you are taking life way too seriously and you need to go watch a 3 stooges marathon."

I wish to thank Carno for this thread and injecting some humor and fun into the Politics Forum.

And I wish to truly thank the mods responsible for allowing this to continue and having a go at it themselves....

No ass-kissing, just I truly enjoyed this thread and I needed the laugh it gave me. Had this been in any other forum, it wouldn't have been as funny and I would have probably never seen it. Sometimes, we need to inject humor into something we take too seriously so that we can come down off our tangents and see how far off our true beliefs we have gotten.

__________________
I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"

roachboy

walking around the city for a few hours is good.
clears the head.

cyn--i think i overreacted to your post--it *was* patronizing and it *was* unnecessary. it advanced nothing--but judging from your post above, it was not meant as an insult so i apologize for claiming the contrary.

on the question of how host is treated in here: this is more a problem. in your capacity as a mod, you have legitimated a recurring and tiresome type of sniping at him--which is rarely--if ever---about the content of the posts and which focusses on the amount of material he gathers as if the amount of material was in itself an imposition on you personally and an imposition on others as well. since you, as mod, made this attack seem hunky dory, it has been repeated over and over in this forum and elsewhere.

the critique says nothing--at all---about what host is saying--it seems little more than a petty sniping that is only ok because you, cyn, sanctioned it because you occupy the double position as mod and member who happens to be a mod and you do not make a distincton between these roles when you post. i think this runs absolutely counter to everything you say above about openness--about acceptance.

so i am not sure that you are in a position to lecture me or anyone else abotu acceptance and openness.
=========================================================

as for this empty category of "elitism": it is a particularly worthless limbaugh buzzword used to present folk who do not agree with limbaugh-esque political views as some kind of persecuting Other.

i see it as nothing more than a device used by people to exempt themselves from thinking too much and to blame others for their doing so. can't deal with arguments you dont agree with: it's the fault of the person who advances those arguments...they are Persecuting you by trying to argue that the world could be seen otherwise. to avoid being Persecuting by these requests that you think about what you believe, the planet limbaugh offers you the option of total passivity. that is how "elitism" functions as a term.

i think it ridiculous--but curiously it keeps coming up here, and seems to work in itsd limbaugh-esque sense. it is "elitist" to make demands on a reader. it is "elitist" to pose questions and not accept bullshit in response.

is that what the folk who throw this term around mean by it?
either explain or give it a rest...

==============
as for the humor thing--i simply dont find anything about this thread funny.
i didnt think caddyshack was funny either....like i dont think shit jokes are funny--i dont think fart jokes are funny. just a question of taste--i am not much of one for fratboy humor--i am not much of one for fratboy anything, really. so there is no particular need to revisit the thread.

__________________
a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle
spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear

it make you sick.

-kamau brathwaite

ktspktsp

Pan,

So, am I being "fucking high and mighty and judgemental" for explaining my view about the thread? It's not very clear who your comment is addressed to. I do have a sense of humor, don't worry. That doesn't mean I'm amused by the same things as you.

Anyway, while I do see the funny aspect of this thread, I am bothered by the negative and confrontational undercurrent of it; and therefore I am pointing it out.

spectre

*sigh*

This is why this thread was so badly needed in here. Even in a humorous thread, people are ready to start flaming.

Everyone needs to relax. And you're right ktspktsp, there is an undercurrent of negative and confrontational aspect to the thread, so again, I say to everyone, why not just have a little fun with the thread?

__________________
"Fuck these chains
No goddamn slave
I will be different" ~ Machine Head

Grasshopper Green

I wasn't going to get involved since I rarely post in here...but I have a pretty strong opinion about the matter.

It's all about the moon pies, baby.

__________________
"They say that patriotism is the last refuge to which a scoundrel clings; steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you king"

Formerly Medusa

spectre

Moon pies?!?!?

Blasphemy! Everyone knows the Hostess Fruit pies are much better!

__________________
"Fuck these chains
No goddamn slave
I will be different" ~ Machine Head

pan6467

Sure, GHOUL POWER you say, but what of Froggy??????

Back to Graham Crackers:

Professor F. Roggenstein of Ghoulardi U. wrote and I quote:

Link:

And did not G. H. Oul of Big Wheat Industries Think Tank write:

Link:

And finally we see the fruition of the plan come to pass with Ow Ow Ow Boomboom CEO of Big Wheat Industries say this in their quarterly report:

link:

__________________
I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"

Cynthetiq

whatever you believe is what you believe. Just like me.

I believe that I was trying to get host to add more content of his own and also post whole sources because initially it seemed like he was posting out of context. I even was trying to get him to post outside of politics, which he did prior to this thread.

And again, your buzzword elitism definition is exactly what you are claiming for others, yet it also applies to how you were stating that "ratcheting down" to the other's level left "no place" you you.

but again, the idea here is to evolve and grow. I know that I have and still am, even if you don't think so.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

roachboy

i meant no personal attack on you cyn.

__________________
a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle
spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear

it make you sick.

-kamau brathwaite

Cynthetiq

and vice versa. trust me, I'm trying hard to read more and understand what you and host post, it's not easy for me, but it takes effort to change behavior. I don't think myself a stupid person, but ignorant in aspects that you both frame your arguments. As I've stated before, I'd like to understand more, but when it starts to become work, then the learning is no longer fun and not worth the extra time it takes. If the critical thinking position against one's citations is to stand, then conversely one cannot just accept the other's position at face value because one stated it with citiation and backup.

There is still the deconstruction of current belief as part of the process. Again, it's not an easy thing. For me it's looking at some things that I don't want to nor care to look at, but to at least make the attempt with honesty and effort.

First and foremost, this is supposed to be fun, not work not hardship. This goes for being a member to being a staff moderator. All I'm asking and I think that all the staff is as well, is that we all do enjoy our time here.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

aberkok

There are over a dozen TFP members here that know me personally and at least half of those know me well. My sense of humour should not be brought into question when I get to my point. This thread is about as funny as a joke that needs to be explained ("get it?....get it now??). So for those who keep trying to tell roachboy, host etc. that this thread is "funny! blow off some steam," please stop it... your point is made.

Since all our opinions are equally valid, here's mine: most of these attempts to blow off steam reek of a thinly veiled attack on host and roachboy. I can think of one that was particularly out of line (see if you can spot it on a quick scroll down the page!! ). It's easy to attack someone and hide behind the defense of "I was just joking around."

Specifically, I am bewildered by Cyn's equating of roach's use of lowercase, host's long quotations and Carno's trolling.

Explanations aside, whether they were made or are coming, here's what my gut's telling me: I feel agression from this thread, not humour.

__________________
!check out my new blog! http://arkanamusic.wordpress.com

Warden Gentiles: "It? Perfectly innocent. But I can see how, if our roles were reversed, I might have you beaten with a pillowcase full of batteries."

Elphaba

Thank you, Ali. That observation was long overdue.

I tried to play this thread in fun, but as you said, it was never meant to be in fun.

pan6467

Actually, I did mine all in HUMOR.

If you feel I was attacking someone or you feel I was attacking you..... that was not my intention... but I will not appologize for what I wrote strictly as humor.

__________________
I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"

analog

You're all welcome.

abaya

aberkok, I'd have to modify that and say there's a strong sense of passive-aggression coming from this thread. Which is not usually tolerated around here. As I said earlier, I do not like the smart-assedness of the OP, or of those who have tried very deliberately to offend certain individuals here.

However, I also have a sense of humor and see that *some* aspects of the thread can be taken lightly... and as I also said earlier, I will tolerate it as long as the Hezbollah thread remains in GD. A semi-fair exchange. However, it would seem more fair if we could get as many people paying attention to and posting in that thread as they are with this one. Otherwise, this thread serves little purpose than to point up its smug attention-whorishness.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

uncle phil

thank god governor "moonpie" isn't running for anything...

__________________
"We were wrong, terribly wrong. (We) should not have tried to fight a guerrilla war with conventional military tactics against a foe willing to absorb enormous casualties...in a country lacking the fundamental political stability necessary to conduct effective military and pacification operations. It could not be done and it was not done."
- Robert S. McNamara
-----------------------------------------
"We will take our napalm and flame throwers out of the land that scarcely knows the use of matches...
We will leave you your small joys and smaller troubles."
- Eugene McCarthy in "Vietnam Message"
-----------------------------------------
never wrestle with a pig.
you both get dirty;
the pig likes it.

tecoyah

TFP does not allow for direct personal attack between members...mmmm Smores.....and thus some resort to somewhat backdoor tactics to show disdain....chocolately marshmallow goodness....we need a basement.

What if there was a place, unmoderated, totally free of limitations on aggressive response, a paradise of painful exposure for hidden feelings we all carry towards other members. A place seperated from TFPolitics as a whole, that is not allowed to bleed into the forums, yet is indeed the depository for all negativity created within the politics forum itself.
Wouldnt it be nice to know you can bash anyone you want, and release your pent up frustration without intervention, to argue with the one you disagree with in a fashion more condusive to the truth your emotions hold inside? Knowing what is said in this little world within a world stays there.
Think of this suggestion as a way to evolve the politics board beyond the stagnation you all complain about, and remove the main issue it has from serious debate. I have seen this Idea in action elsewhere, and have come to appreciate its benefits, which are twofold in my opinion:

1)It allows for serious expression of the dark side we all have, and creates honest communication between members (though not always kind)....this in the long haul allows for understanding of underlying dissagreement, and releases unsaid issues into the open.

2)It (if done properly) removes the worst issues from what should be a political discussion, and creates a place for the Garbage to be aired, saving those uninvolved from smelling someone elses laundry.

If there is interest , Staff and otherwise, I have an understanding of how this might work, and will explain in depth if requested.

__________________
Holding onto anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned. - Buddha

sapiens

Doesn't that place exist on nearly every other forum you can visit? Isn't that what we're trying to avoid of TFP?
It never stays there. It would most certainly bleed into other forums.

abaya

So basically, TFP Fight Club?

It sounds intriguing, but I don't know how effective it would really be. I mean, to some extent, people often resort to Journals to vent about one another (often when the journal is made "private," I've found), but that's not terribly productive. Venting is good in the short-term, but it doesn't actually solve issues between people in the long term. That takes mature discussion and responsibility for self (which not everyone around here are willing to do).

Honestly, I'm not sure if the TFP is ready for something as bare and honest as a textual Fight Club. I think it probably would leak into other forums and taint what happens there. But, that's just my opinion.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

tecoyah

Oh well....just an Idea...heh

Anyone ever have Graham Cracker and Cheese together....it almost hurts

__________________
Holding onto anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned. - Buddha