Ustwo

I'm not sure what killed it, but I think we can say its now dead. This is a historical date for the fall, much like a dead empire, parts will live on, but in some distant future they will say 'this was the day'.

I thought, perhaps, it was not dead but having a resurgence. Crysis, COD4, Orange Box, Unreal tournament, Quake Wars.......

But it was a chimera, these were all FPS's, and all competed against each other as well, making the sales of each lower.

It was the xboxification of Oblivion which signaled the end, but the rot has been creeping for years.

Where are the space games? Where is the improved AI? Where are the virtual worlds?

We've been getting better graphics and the same games for years now, and lately not even the quality of those games in the past.

But whats prompted me to write this now? It could have been written last month, it could have even been a year ago, maybe two, but why now?

Behold...

http://pc.ign.com/articles/851/851255p1.html

http://pc.ign.com/articles/850/850118p1.html

There is so little to review, that IGN is now reviewing 10 year + old games.

Games that had better stories and design than most released today.

Its over.

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Esoteric

If you like RTS games there's StarCraft 2 and Red Alert 3 on the way. >_>

I'm looking forward to both of them. For the most part though all you seem to see for PC is MMO's, and I don't see that trend stopping anytime soon.

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Made a date with Divinity, but she wouldn't let me fuck
I got touched by a hazy shaded, God help me change
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Scorps

How can PC gaming be dead if like 10 million people play World of Warcraft?

Console suck imo, I grew up using mouse and keyboard finding it hard to change.

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powerclown

The problem (one of them anyway) is that pc games are too goddamn short. I mean seriously, you pay $60 a game, finish it in a week or less and never play it again. I just bought Earth Defense Force 2017 (Xbox360) for my son ($20) and it has 53 (FIFTY THREE) freakin levels!

I played though Crysis so fast I almost can't remember anything about the game. I remember the graphics were unbelievable, and the gameplay was unbelievable, and I remember it being over in a few days. Same with COD4. These games lately are like orgasms, they incredible for like, 10 seconds, then over. BioShock was good and long, and I liked Condemned: Criminal Origins (I hear theres a part 2 coming out) but theyre exceptions aren't they? Another retarded thing is the hardware requirements ARE ALWAYS RISING.

Those articles are just sad.

Mondak

I think Starcraft 2 might have something to say about that. We shall see.

Also, I don't play WoW and never have, but there are like a gijillion people playing that and as I understand it, paying a subscription ongoing to do so. Seems like there a market there somewhere.

Good point about all the decent games right now being FPS. I don't even LIKE FPS and I have succumbed to the powers of Team Fortress 2.

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All truth passes through three stages:
First it is ridiculed
Second, it is violently opposed and
Third, it is accepted as self-evident.

ARTHUR SCHOPENHAUER (1788-1860)

Baraka_Guru

I doubt PC gaming is anywhere near dead. If anything, it is changing, and in a profound way. I could go into detail, but I need to get back to work. For now, I will say that the one thing that indicates that PC gaming is alive and well is the "indie" game industry.

Currently, developing games on consoles have barriers that are too high for indie designers. Designing games for the PC is far more accessible. Just about anyone can get into it.

I admit that there are certain genres of PC games that have fallen to the wayside (I'm a big fan of the underserved adventure genre), but I wouldn't be surprised to see a resurgence. The huge difference between PCs and consoles is the accessibility to gamers. Not everyone has a specific console (Wii vs. Xbox vs. PS3, etc.) but many people have PCs. You can afford to be a casual gamer and use your general purpose machine for gaming. There will always be a market for PC games. It will likely grow, if anything.

PC gaming isn't dead; it's evolving.

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Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
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Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
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Shauk

World of Warcraft isn't a game, it's a lifestyle, it's a job, it's everything but a game to some people. Games have an end

and yeah, SC2 has been the only "blip" on my radar for over a year now as far as my "care-o-meter" goes.

Fotzlid

Right there. The number one reason why I gave up on PC based games.


That and I have to bring a freaking magnifying glass to the store so I can read the microscopic print on the box telling me what the system minimums are and how many different video cards the game supports.

Shauk

I can't really name a game that had "cutting edge" graphics that ever went down in my book as a pc gaming classic.

once you stick to your guns and play with the mid level systems and only those (which are affordable) you start to realize just how bad some games are once you get past the glitzyglam b.s.

Ustwo

Exactly.

Crysis was a good game, but the only thing outstanding about it was the graphics. Spoiler: The enemy AI was quirky, the levels were standard linear and typical, (you don't find a missile launcher until you know you will need it, aliens conveniently left every weapon in the game floating in their collection bins, that sort of thing) the story wasn't bad or great, just sort of sci-fi normal, down to the Admiral who won't listen about nuking the island, despite the fact some chick with no obvious credentials or proof says it would be bad, you know shes going to be right. Even a fight with the super boss with a weapon you just get that only happens to work on said super boss.

Its a formula and pretty much the same one for most of the FPS games, its a good one but nothing new.

One of the last real unique takes on a game I played was Sacrifice, sort of an FPS + RTS + wacky game. I mailed the developers at the time telling them it was one of the best games I'd played and they were interested only in my online play experience with the game, even after creating a very fun single player game, but at that point in time, online was the future.

Perhaps thats the real problem. Its just that much easier and profitable to make a MMO, or even FPS multi player, where the players ARE the content, the game just lets it happen. Designing a great single player game is far harder than just making maps and setting up the engine.

__________________
Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.

Scorps

Well maybe to some people I enjoy the people I play with so maybe it isn't a game to some but to me it is, games are a pass time and thats what WoW is to me. I see the people on there that have no life and well I kinda just laugh when they say I have crap gear or weapons, all I come back with is I have a life...

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A.K.A. PainTrain

silent_jay

Why some kids shouldn't play WoW:

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Absence makes the heart grow fonder

allaboutmusic

I have never been a conventional gamer, but now and then I get addicted to quirky computer games that involve bursting bubbles and the like. I find those far more fun, personally. Maybe I'm just a kid inside.

crazybobmarley

WOW is a job(as previously stated) or an addiction.

Last I checked Tetris has an infinite number of levels, it doesn't make it the best game ever.

If you want a space sim there's always X3 which is probably the best there is, granted it's not a large category.

Same shit as always tho, just inspire controversy. Computers are becoming more and more accessible to non technical people, I just don't see it.

Lasereth

I've always wondered what people meant when they say "PC gaming is dead." Dead? Was it ever alive? For the past 10 years the PC gaming market has always been lackluster with a handful of buy-worthy games coming out. Sales may be marginal compared to consoles, but the amount of quality games has definitely not slowed down (maybe some genres are lacking recently, but overall quantity of good games is up I think). Look at 2007, year of the FPS. Plus Supreme Commander, Company of Heroes, and World in Conflict have came out recently and showed that RTS is anything but dead. The only genre that I see lacking is the RPG market and the PC market has always seen 1 or 2 good RPGs per year at most.

PC gaming isn't dead, I think it's simply consoles going way up.

Shauk

tetris is beatable.


and ustwo, I HAVE that game.

Sacrifice and WoW have a similar interface actually, once I went back and played it I was like "huh, this seems familiar"

excellent game though, I liked having my own "i beat the game" custom spell book for multiplayer. God that game was a blast.

Cynthetiq

I can't agree that it's dead now... I felt it was dead after the look and feel pac-man laws were created. (KC Munchkin vs. Pac-Man)

I felt that since the orignal Nintendo the games were no longer needed to be original at all, but creating small incremental steps instead of radical departures for games. The 1980s has TONS of games that were ALL different. But in the mass market, everyone was trying to capitalize on the scrolling shooter, puzzle, fighter, driving, flying.

It's not much different, just that FPS seems to be the no brainer engine. Take any license and make it an FPS and you're guaranteed to get a decent amount of sales.

Even the stories were getting tiring in the 90s. Everything was taking down the drug dealers, now it's the aliens or brownskinned people (still aliens.) Funny you can customize yourself, but it would be racist if you were able to customize your opponents.

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ObieX

i think a big part of comp games losing track is the fact that you need a CD key to use them and therefore cant resell them to places like funcoland or gamestop that take console games. Why get a PC game that may not work on your comp and cant return/trade-in when you can get a 360 version of the game that you know will work and can trade in or return if you beat it or it sucks.

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We Must Dissent.

spindles

well, the original tetris only gave 1 'next' tile and no ability to hold a tile (as was shown in the youtube clip). That guy(girl??) was freaking amazing but he used to options he had available, which weren't in the original game...

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who hid my keyboard's PANIC button?

Jinn

Check this game out. I got turned onto it by a friend, because there's almost no marketing at all about it. It's developed and produced by the same company, and they do online distribution only, to keep the costs down.

It's an RTS + FPS, where one person plays the commander, playing in RTS style. He builds the garrisons, the mines, the tech tree, and even the defenseive structures. He also has spells and a limited amount of mana, which he can use to heal, ressurect and buff his units, while also debuffing, slowing and dispelling the enemy units. He can also issue commands to his officers, draw on the map (like follow this path, etc..)

Everyone else plays in FPS mode, and what classes they can spawn as is determined by what the commander has built tech-tree wise. What abilities each class has is also determined by this, like whether there's an Academy built yet. Their goal is to follow the commanders orders, kill the enemies, help build structures (there's a build assist unit in each race), and ultimately take out the enemy bases, gold mines, etc. The classes vary from pure ranged to siege, mages with pets to humans dual wielding swords. The melee combat is pretty neat too, but simple; it's just timing between block, block break and normal hits. If they're normal hitting, you block to stun them. If they're blocking, you block break to stun them.

It's a very awesome game, and I've become addicted to it. Better yet, there's a five hour free trial. And trust me, the five hours is a long time. The only restriction is you can't be commander and you can't spawn the Hellspawn units (which require 10 and 15 enemy kills respectively).

http://savage2.s2games.com/

I'll command or defend for you anytime if you do get it. It sounds exactly like what you need.

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"I'm typing on a computer of science, which is being sent by science wires to a little science server where you can access it. I'm not typing on a computer of philosophy or religion or whatever other thing you think can be used to understand the universe because they're a poor substitute in the role of understanding the universe which exists independent from ourselves." - Willravel

Kadath

Spore comes out in September. Will Wright will save us all.

PC gaming may not work for you any more, but plenty of people haven't abandoned it.

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it's quiet in here

shakran

X3:Reunion. If you get the patch to remove the horrid bugs, it's actually a good game. The graphics are stunning, the storyline is good, and assuming you don't cheat it will take you months to finish.

It's better than it was but no, it's not there yet

There's tons of 'em. Second Life is the well known one but there are many, many more out there.

Well I'm looking forward to Spore, which is due to arrive in September. That looks to be an interesting game. But really, you're going to end up with the same 12 games no matter what - - -just as there are, it is said, only 12 real storylines in anything and all stories are just variations of those 12, so it is for video games as well.

What we really need is a video game in which human opponents really have an impact on how the game goes. We have that, sort of, in the FPS's, but really that doesn't impact the storyline. "oh I got fragged. Guess I'll respawn and keep going as though nothing happened" is not as interesting as "i have to use strategy to get ahead and if I get killed, I've lost everything and have to start from scratch with a radically different character." In short, we are missing the politics. It's what always annoyed me about Civilization. No politics. No intelligence. Just battle strategy. Boring.


There's a reason my Atari 2600 is still hooked up to the TV



BTW watch for Deus Ex 3, due 3rd or 4th Q '08. Promises to be interesting. Yeah, it's a FPS-style game but the storyline and strategy you must employ in that series makes it infinitely more interesting than the norm.

Ustwo

X3:Reunion eh?

Somehow I missed that one. I think its where I ended my WoW playing and started my EvE playing when it came out.

Looks good, I'll be getting it.

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Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

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Seaver

Warhammer: Age of Reckoning is coming out soon Ustwo. Don't worry.

Also, Total War: Empires will come out soon... and they always rock.

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"Smite the rocks with the rod of knowledge, and fountains of unstinted wealth will gush forth." - Ashbel Smith as he laid the first cornerstone of the University of Texas

Ustwo

Warhammer has been hit or miss. Warhammer 40000 was very good though.

As for the total war ones, I've gotten kinda sour on them, though it took a LONG time. The problem is the AI. Some mods like Rome Total Realism helped a lot but the enemy is just too stupid for the engine.

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Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.

Spritebox

im pretty sure i still have fun playing warcraft 3 (DOTA!) on my pc!

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it's all nice on ice alright
and it's not day
and it's not night
but it's all nice on ice alright

guy44

I too think that PC gaming is simply evolving. PCs are best for the intensely geeky, intricate, or complicated games with hardcore fanbases: I love really deep RPGs (yes, BioWare has a couple good RPGs on consoles, but nothing beats a good old-fashioned D&D RPG on the PC), small developer games (don't forget: by far the most popular genre of games is little puzzle games and the like which go great on the PC, and there are other niche areas like text sports simulators), MMOs, of course, are big, the adventure games out there are still overwhelmingly on the PC (ICO was great, did lousy business on the console), etc. I'm sure others have mentioned other games that do well on the PC...FPS, for one...

Anyway, my point is that the PC's capability for really intricate play and controls and easy, cheap game development will probably result in a game market that highlights those features - if it isn't there already.

FWIW, I have always been a PC gamer and much prefer its in-depth, deep, obsessive games to the sort of fire-and-forget games you tend to find on consoles, although I will admit that this is a very broad generalization in many ways.

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Frosstbyte

I will never understand why people keep saying this. They've been saying it every time a new more powerful generation of consoles is released. If you want to play an MMO or an RTS or a true RPG, the computer's flexibility in control options and power remains an unparalleled option. You can disparage the MMO as a "job" or a "hobby" all you want because you don't like it's play style, but 10 million people playing WoW alone (forget all the other MMOs or MUDs out there) disagree with you and enjoy playing this type of game on their computers.

Furthermore, this argument generally ignores the rapidly growing Asian gaming market, which is focused much more heavily on computer gaming like RTS and MMOs and in which consoles (especially the xbox) have little market share and have had very limited success.

The console RPG (FF series, etc.) and the FPS and the platformer (Ratchet and Clank, etc.) are clear winners on consoles, because of the limited needs for flexible keybinding and I think they will continue to have success there. That being said, that doesn't mean that for other markets and other game genres, the computer doesn't and won't continue to have great success. In fact, it is still very successful and there's really nothing out there to indicate that there's going to be any change.

Ustwo

Can't say the Asian gaming market is a concern for me right now so if thats doing well thats great, but it doesn't put games on my shelf.

I have a VERY state of the art gaming machine. Its about as good as you can get without going into liquid cooling and the like. The problem is there are not very many new games coming out and many of those that are, are not very good.

Its me looking back at 25 years of gaming, seeing the evolution, expansion, followed by hitting a wall. Many of the major titles are meant for console platforms and nothing is added to take advantage of the PC and its flexibility.

Its not that the PC is a dead machine for gaming, in fact its never been better, the problem is that developers see far bigger dollars making console games and as such we don't see much new material PC side.

Heh I should complain more often...

http://pc.ign.com/articles/852/852735p1.html

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Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.

Cynthetiq

claiming WoW has 10M people is quite the misnomer. A couple of things are questionable. How many of the 10M are paying customers? Shauk and I both no longer play. I'm sure we're counted. Chinese Gold Farmers? I'm sure they are counted in the churn. It has had 10M people at one point and time, so I will be willing to agree that 10M in sales is possible.

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I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

Ustwo

Wow stopped releasing North American numbers quite a while ago, the speculation even then was it was in the decline.

__________________
Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.

CyCo PL

I think WoW is a huge reason the PC gaming market is dying. PC game requirements keep going up, but people don't want to shell out the cash to upgrade their PC's because they can already run WoW, and they're satisfied with that. Consoles are significantly cheaper and the graphical quality almost matches that of a high-end PC.

The console gaming market is basically taking over every reason there was to remain a PC gamer--great graphics, online play, friends lists, downloadable content/patches/mods. The consoles (except Wii) are becoming the PC gaming market.

Ace_O_Spades

Until they release a console with a standard Keyboard & Mouse I'll be sticking to my nice comfy controls instead of punishing my thumbs that are obviously not as evolved as current-gen kiddies are.... Fuck dual-analog.

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Feh.

Cynthetiq

you know I went to the arcade recently to see that some of the fighters have plugs for the joysticks. It was rather weird to see someone kick ass with a dual analog and someone with the redball arcade sticks.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

CyCo PL

It's starting to happen. I know that on the PS3, you can plug in an USB mouse/keyboard and use it for web browsing and stuff, and Unreal Tournament 3 has full mouse/keyboard support. I think this is a step in the right direction, but also another sign that PC gaming is being taken over by consoles.

I wouldn't be surprised if the next generation of consoles had full mouse/keyboard support for all of the first-person shooters, massive hard drives for game installs, and a heavy reliance on digitally distributed software (even more so than today).

Ace_O_Spades

If this happened I might... MIGHT consider investing in a console. But really, at that point aren't you just playing a hyper-specialized PC? I mean really...

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Feh.

CyCo PL

Yeah, but that's what consoles are becoming, and that's why they're pulling so many PC gamers away... I mean, one of the main reasons I'm so interested in computers today is because I've been a PC gamer for the past decade. I learned how to upgrade computers so I could play better games, I learned how to build computers so I could constantly be upgrading to play the best PC games out. Consoles couldn't ever hold a candle to the capabilities of PC games in regards to graphics, online play, downloading mods, patches, demos, etc.

But now, consoles are beginning to offer all of that--equal graphics, online capabilities, downloadable content, etc. for a significantly lower price. Given, every generation of console is going to seem crippled compared to PC's three or four years after release, because PC's are able to stay on the cutting edge of graphics while consoles are stuck with what they were manufactured with, but the gap is extremely small now. Basically, I think PC gaming is dying because consoles are the whole gaming aspect of PC's now.

Ace_O_Spades

However, console gaming is just EXPENSIVE! Console, controllers, games, HDTV to make it worth it... As a *POOR* student, as long as I don't need a CD key to play online I will download the game to play for free.

Can't do that with a console, unless you mod it. Which is just sketchy.

Yes, I know I'm part of the problem. Do I care? No. If games were priced in a way that made them worth it then I buy them.

I bought the Orange Box (PORTAL FTW), I bought Gal Civ II, I put 5-10 bucks into Second-Life every six months or so. On the other hand, I downloaded Crysis.

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Feh.

Ustwo

So instead you steal them because to you they aren't worth the cost. Brilliant.

Crysis has a development budget of about $20 million

http://playsquad.commongate.com/post...ion_of_Crytek/

If I made games I'd be sure to do console games as they are harder to pirate. You are willing to pay for only the very best of gaming, Orange box, and gal civ II (the best 4X game) and the rest, just download.

Yes, you are part of the problem.

I think the savior of PC gaming may be online verification/protection much like Steam uses. Its a pain, it would suck always needing to be connected to the internet to use games, but it may be the only way to make the insane development costs worth it.

Unrelated scary side note, the thought of EA buying Crytek is awful, EA has become the destroyer of games.

__________________
Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host

Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps.

Ace_O_Spades

Yeah, well as a server you cheated on your taxes because you felt the system was broken and that was how you worked around it.

I know I'm part of the problem. I stated that.

I think the savior of PC gaming will be making the games worth the cost. Gal Civ II as a game was barely worth it out of the box, but needing a key to get the upgrades and bonus content made it worth it.

It becomes a harsh market where you *gasp* need to make a decent product and out-smart the hundreds of thousands of people trying to steal your product (like me) in order to turn a profit. Gal Civ II did both of those things in spades. So does Steam (as you mentioned) with the online verification.

The market has to adapt. Or die, as you seem to think it already has.

I should restate... I think the ONLY way PC Gaming will survive is if they can outsmart people like me or make us believe it's worth buying the game because you need to authenticate online in order to download the patches and bonus content.

I should also mention that Gal Civ II was excellent in that it allowed me to play the 1.0 release for free before deciding if it was worth it to buy the game for the bonus content and upgrades.

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Feh.