Nirvana

I can't beleive a man could ever eve think of laying his hands on a woman. Even if a girl is slapping or hittong you, you just pick up your arms and Block the blows by shielding ur face, but never ever hit back.

In a highchool setting, i dont think people comehend how much of this violence is going on between couples. and our laws are so mild towards this sort of abuse.

If i had it my way, all these "men" wouldnt be tried, i'd just string them up and kill them.

cellophanedeity

Though I agree, I can't help but wonder what sparked this thread. 'Cause I find it hard to think that there may be someone out here that thinks that violence against women is good (though someone may disagree about the not fighting back thing)

Is there a particular incident that made you want to post this?

Cynthetiq

While I think that it is not acceptable, to hit women in most situations, I'm not going to "pick up my arms and block blows" by some woman who is 250lbs and 6'1, I will fight back and I will do more than just defend myself.

I will do what it takes to stop the attacker even if it means that I live to see another day and they do not.

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The_wall

People hitting other people is wrong regardless of sex.

On a side note it sounds like you havn't quite achieved your name yet Nirvana.

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SiN

it should have nothing to do with gender, imo.

I find sexism rather repulsive.

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ShaniFaye

any person who hits another person should be prepared to be hit back...period

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pig

Hey, it's pretty much A-OK in S.C.

COLUMBIA, S.C. - A lawmaker's comments questioning why abused women would return to men who batter them brought protests from South Carolina lawmakers, television viewers and victim advocates.

"I do not understand why women continue to go back around men who abuse them," Altman said Tuesday in the interview on WIS-TV. "I've asked women that and they all tell me the same answer, 'John Graham, you don't understand.' And I say you're right, I don't understand."

The interview with Altman came after the House Judiciary Committee approved a bill Tuesday making cockfighting a felony but tabled one making second-offense criminal domestic violence a felony.

"The woman (who is abused) ought to not be around the man," Altman said in the interview. "I mean, you women want it one way and not another," he told the female reporter.

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the_marq

I am so tired of this bandwagon.

"Stop violence against women!"
"Any man who harms a woman should be killed!(with out a trial)"

Some very trendy and popular "calls to arms," but seriously. I am fucking tired of it. Now, I am not at all violent, I can't recal being in a violent altercation since the 8th grade, not including a breif stint as a bouncer in the 1990's. I am all for the cessation of violence in all it's forms... but why are women so fucking special that they get a whole movement dedicated to them?

The implication, albeit exaggerated, is that all violence against women is so horrid that we need to dedicate all our resources to killing men who perpetrate these crimes. On the other hand... violence against men is perfectly acceptable because they are less valued by society and most likely deserve whatever they get.

Well I can't tell you how happy I am that you don't have your way.

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The Truth:

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#3 in a series

CMH

I feel that regardless of sex, if you hit somebody, you should expect to get your ass beat. It's very unfair to men.... dudes get beat the hell up by their girlfriends, but as soon as a guy pushes back he's a monster.

Motto is "don't dish out what you can't take!".

StanT

While I would never hit a woman first, I would defend myself and respond proportionately.

It has only ever come up once. While it's a long story, it involved a barroom brawl, an attempted kick to the groin, and a pool stick over my head. She had it coming, in my opinion.

astrahl

Because, as women, we have suffered indignities and abuse at the hands of our men for centuries and nobody cared. We didn't even have the right to vote until very recently. There are still many men out there who value women only as subserviant beings. Just look at some of the recent comments, the article mentioned in this thread and that idiot Nascar guy...women are still fighting for equality in the eyes of the law and in the eyes of society.

The squeaky wheel and all that...

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Maybe Maybe...
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rsl12

heh...i've been in situations where I felt like strangling some guy.

I've been in situations where I felt like strangling some woman.

If I ever believed that the 2nd thought was worse than the 1st thought, or vice versa, I'd say I was sexist.

ps. I ended up not strangling anybody.

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the_marq

I see, so all future generations will be saddled with the sins of our fathers. Marvelous.

Why is it that society seems to forget that the root word in "equality" is "equal?"

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The Truth:

Johnny Cash could have kicked Bruce Lee's ass if he wanted to.

#3 in a series

tecoyah

Violence is to be avoided
defense a last resort

Hit me once bitch.....I will run
Hit me again...you will wish I did

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Holding onto anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned. - Buddha

Minx

I know it sounds stupidly simple but I believe in not hitting anyone....man or woman.

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pig

Well, for what it's worth, I pretty much believe in pacifism until violence can't be avoided or is necessary to defuse the situation or protect the safety of non-initiators. Then you commit as much violence is necessary, but never enjoy the act of committing violence, etc.

Instead of battery of women or men - how about battery itself is just weak and ignorant, etc?

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Redlemon

Well, I think we've taken a vague opening statement and ran it in as many directions as possible. Nirvana, do you want to try again and provide some focus for this discussion?

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Glory's Sun

I agree with cellophanedeity, there's gotta be more to this. Did a friend of yours get battered?

KungFuGuy

i've seen some very formidable kung fu practioners who were female and had my ass handed to me on occasion (sparring). Gender should not be an issue when it comes to defending yourself. If a woman comes at you with deadly force then you should respond the same way as you would if a man comes at you with deadly force.

Cynthetiq

Well stated. I did one time tell a woman jujitsu trainer that I didn't care for jujitsu because it was too passive for me. Next thing I knew I was layed out on the sidewalk because she hip check flipped me.

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I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

IC3

One of my friends Christina told me that if she hits a guy, She expects to get hit back..She also says that, If she was a guy and a girl punched him in the face..she wouldn't hesitate to hit back.

I have never been hit by a girl, Not in a serious way anyways and if i was..I wouldn't hit back, But i also wouldn't stand there with my arms up..I would definatly put her on the ground and restrain her till she calmed down.

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JStrider

the only time ive ever really hit a girl was my sister when we were kids...
but that wasnt an abuse thing... that was a sibling rivalry thing...

I'm not gonna go out and beat a woman... but i wont stand there and take a beating from a woman... i'll defend myself as necesary...

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MooseMan3000

"Male violence towards women is digusting"

So are poor grammar and spelling. Too riled up to proofread?

If i had it my way, all these "fucking idiots who cant spell" wouldnt be tried, i'd just string them up and kill them.



Whether I actually believe this is irrelevant. My point is that you made a sweeping, ignorant claim and expect it to be choked down whole. Excellent work.

Male violence towards women may be disgusting. But it's not always disgusting, nor is it any more disgusting than any other type of violence. To claim so is patently sexist. Your claim not only implies but clearly states that that women are less capable than men and must be defended. It also states that because of this, men are less important than women. Am I the only one that sees a slight contradiction here?

Now my take on things. If you hit me, expect to be hit back. It you start a fight, I will finish it. Try to hurt me and you will be hurt. Try to hurt one of my friends, my family. Try to hurt anyone who is not trying to hurt you. I dare you. If you have a penis, expect it to be kicked. If you have a vagina, expect it to be kicked. I don't fucking care what you look like, you will soon be on the floor.

highthief

My take - you don't beat on people weaker than yourself. I'm a very strong, trained grown man - it would have to be a pretty extreme situation to provoke me to beating on a woman, child, old person, cripple or anyone else significantly weaker than me. People who hit such weaker persons deserve a good beat down. Now, if I'm seriously threatened of course I'd fight back, but unless armed, 99.9% of women have no chance against someone like me. I realize that some men are weaker or less capable than me, and they probably have a lower threshold for being threatened, but overall, hitting someone weaker and smaller than yourself is cowardly and immoral.

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Siege

When a man hits a woman, women march in the streets.

When a woman hits a man, the other men just laugh at him.

I've never hit a girl. If a girl hits me, yes, I would at first just block all incoming blows. If this doesn't get the message through within about 5 seconds, you can expect some blows to be coming your way.

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guthmund

What about folks who don't capitalize 'I' and leave out necessary apostrophes?

Oh, the sweet, sweet irony....

I think the vast majority have this one right. I'm going to defend myself, plain and simple.

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martinguerre

i've got mixed feelings on this one. i know too many women who are survivors of domestic violence or sexual assualt to take this subject any way but heavy. at the same time, i think the only reason why this whole meme works if if the meme of "women don't start fights" is also operative.

it's morally despicable to pick on someone who does not start a fight, or who cannot defend themselves. without ignoring the gendered implications of this statement, i would hope that we could move past a model that men hit and women get beat. it's a little more complex than that.

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BenR

Basically, if she doesn't want to act like a "lady", she shouldn't expect to be treated like a "lady".

snowy

I think there are some basic things to be said here:

1) There are some key differences between playfully hitting, defending one's self, and systematic abuse.
2) Yes, a male should be able to defend themselves, but having to defend yourself against someone most likely weaker than you is silly.
3) Some men don't realize how hard they hit, even jokingly.
4) And yes, though all of you may not want to realize it, or even admit it, more men hit out of anger than women. Men are more likely to be perpetrators of domestic violence.

The reason WHY women march in the streets when a man hits a woman is because usually it happens more than once. These protests are not about a slap across the face one time, they are about continuous, regular abuse. They are about getting BEATEN. We're not talking about one punch. We're talking about several. We're talking about women with broken bones, bloody noses, and bruises galore.

Yes, women can be abusers too, but it's much less likely. It's less likely to be physical abuse and more likely to be emotional abuse.

To make a blanket assumption, I'm going to assume that the majority of you have not been around or dealt with domestic violence victims. Seeing someone who has been beaten black and blue by someone who is supposed to love them might change your perspective on the whole issue. The aftereffects of domestic violence are enormous--my mother still suffers from post-traumatic stress disorder 25 years after divorcing her abusive second husband.

The fact is that no one should hit someone weaker than themselves, and preferably no one should hit anyone else. Everyone has the obligation to take the moral high ground here--but men especially must realize that they are typically stronger than women and have even more of a burden to bear. Yes, maybe she slaps you once out of anger--but you hitting her back isn't a solution.

Violence is NEVER a solution, regardless of who instigates it.

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OFKU0

Some women deserve it. Most don't. That's the line between idiot and victim.

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Jinn

Chivalry is all well and good, but there are certainly women stronger than me. Likewise, if they attack me first -- even if its a slap -- its assault. You're simultaneously taking the grounds that no one should hit another person, but excusing a woman slapping me because she's "weaker." Under the EQUAL eyes of the law, no matter who hits me or how hard, its assualt.


I think BenR said it best:
You can't ask that we not defend ourselves against "fragile women" if the aforementioned woman is attacking us. Stronger or not, I will defend myself to the full extent of the law regardless of sex. THAT is equality. Saying that women are weaker enforces gender specific stereotypes and takes you from the "cause" of equality.

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Daniel_

I'm 6'2" tall and significantly broad shouldered (not to mention overweight) so I never get much hassle with people.

In general I abhor violence in all its forms, but violence that is abuse of the weak by the strong (as domestic violence often is EITHER way round - there are many battered husbands) is the most abhorrent of all to me.

I don't hit people by choice - Ive got into very very few fights in my life, and generally have been thumped for interceding to try to end an abuse of power that was going against a friend (no more than half a dozen times in 20 years though).

I hit people with only one intention - to make them stop hitting my friend. I hit them hard. I hit them wherever will stop them soonest. I only ever had to hit them once.

Then I walk away.

So far, nobody ever followed me.

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Overhead, the Albatross hangs motionless upon the air,
And deep beneath the rolling waves,
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The Echo of a distant time
Comes willowing across the sand;
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MSD

The only rules I follow are that I don't take the first swing against anyone, I don't hit back if doing so is more likely to escalate the situation than refusing to react, and I don't use any more force than is necessary. Gender, age, and other variables only factor in to the extent that they are required to calculate the necessary force required to terminate an assault. An attacker is an attacker and any unprovoked assault on anyone, regardless of gender or any other factor, is wrong.

I fully agree that women (and others) have been at a a disadvantage throughout history and I fully support the right of any deserving group* to be treated as equals. I will help them in their struggle if I can, but I will not, in any situation, put someone above others because they have historically been at a disadvantage. I'll pay you the same as a man, I'll treat you as equal to anyone else up to the limit of individual ability (I'm not going to suggest that equality requires a 5'1" woman to cut down trees and haul lumber while her husband does dishes,) but there's no way in hell I'm going to stand there and let you hurt me if hitting back will stop you.

* - I say "deserving group" because I'm not going to be nice to neo-fascists or terrorists no matter how much tolerance gets shoved down my throat.

Seer666

I'm going to disagree with you here. You never hit a Lady. Once she swings, she is no longer a lady, and I'll coldcock her same as I would a man. Once you deside to take things to a physical level, sex no longer matters. A physical altercation is life or death, and that is how I treat every one I get in. I do not play fight, I do not fight to satisfy my ego. Hell, I'll run before I fight, but once you lay a hand on me, there are no kid gloves.

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james t kirk

I have been struck by 3 different women at 3 different times.

1. In 1985, while at the beach with my then GF, I was feeling all frisky and scooped her up in my arms and ran her out into the surf in a fit of playfulness.

Bam, she cold cocked me right in the temple for getting her wet. (She was 5-11 and a pretty strong girl by the way.)

I was stunned, never hit her back. Just left her standing and swam out for about a mile and treaded water.


2. With my long term significan other, with whom I lived with for serveral years, we were in a heated arguement and she just charged me (5'-6 and the woman had a Phd). Full on frontal assault which I repelled by grabbing her and holding her.


3. (The wierdest one ever) Out on date, she started hitting on other guys at some bar, I told her I was leaving and if she wanted a ride, now was the time. (Should have just left).

We were mouthing off at each other and as she was exiting the car she hit me, I shoved her back, and as she was opening the door, used my foot to push her in the ass right out the door and hit the gas.

So, there's 3 times I have been attacked by 3 separate women (I am 6-2) for whatever reason.

I have never initiated any physical violence. I guess I just drive women to it, orelse have a knack for picking nut-bars (my friends tell me at least.)

Nirvana

im not saying some random women smacking te crap out of you, even tho in that case i would not hit back. Ive known women who were in abusive relationships whp got hit for no fuking reason, and when they tried to defend themselves, they got hit harder, near death even.

and comeone, if somebody swings at you and ur a 200 lb man and lets just say a petite woman hits u, its not a matter of life and death. u honestly wont sustain much injurty, unless shes attacking u with a knife, but thats obviously another story.

Nirvana

my initial post was rash and i should have been more specific

Nirvana

and the statements that i made above are not in regards to all situations. for example, the people tlaking about women trained in jijitsu or whatever. im talking about domestic violence situation or abusive relationsnhips where men feel women arent anywhere equal as they are.

Cynthetiq

if that was the frame of your post, then you should have framed it as such and not "who did it and ran" type of "drive by" post, which is why you got the various kinds of responses you did.

Next time be more thoughtful before you press the submit button.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

wombatman

pigglet, that article is NOT indicative of South Carolina. The bill was tabled because of some very vague legal verbage (including the fact that it would have allowed a judge to issue a restraining order based solely on the woman's word). It has since been reworded and I believe it was passed, although I wouldn't swear to it. My point is, there are ass-backward people all over the country and unfortunately Altman is able to speak publicly, making all of South Carolina look bad. He was pretty much ridiculed all through the news here. Make sure you look into everything about an issue before lumping people together next time. We're not all in the same boat.