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#1 (permalink) |
follower of the child's crusade?
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Why is Marion Jones going to jail?
I understand she loses her medals, but what criminal offence has she committed??
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"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate, for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain without being uncovered." The Gospel of Thomas |
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#2 (permalink) |
Junkie
Location: Greater Boston area
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Jones, 32, pleaded guilty in October to lying to federal agents over a steroid distribution scandal involving California laboratory BALCO and her role in a cheque fraud scheme.
perjury and she was involved with a check-fraud case Last edited by Fotzlid; 01-11-2008 at 05:08 PM.. |
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#3 (permalink) |
"I'm sorry. What was the question?"
Location: Paradise Regained
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If perjury means that she lied under oath, then yes, that. Six months was the maximum sentence.
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I have faith in a few things - divinity and grace But even when I'm on my knees I know the devil preys |
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#4 (permalink) |
Junkie
Location: Ontario, Canada
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Hope they catch a few more such cheats but more importantly tighten up the drug testing. She was tested over 100 times in and out of competition, but the BALCO designer drugs were never found. Apparently, there are better tests available than that which the Olympics and IAAF use, but the cost is higher (and I think they are afraid they'll catch over half the athletes at major competitions, too).
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Si vis pacem parabellum. |
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#5 (permalink) | |
Banned
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Because Jones represented our country so well in the 2000 summer olympic games, I'm fairly certain our president will step up, as he did recently, here. She has two young sons at home, and her crimes were certainly less serious than Mr. Libby's were....
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#7 (permalink) |
Currently sour but formerly Dlishs
Super Moderator
Location: Australia/UAE
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i think you will find that hosts' comment was tongue in cheek
marion lied under oath. she got caught up in cheque fraud with her former boyfriend (and former 100m world record holder) tim montgomery who has been banned from racing due to drugs also. she deserves what she got. being a single mum is no excuse, nor should it be. i personally think they went easy on her.
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An injustice anywhere, is an injustice everywhere I always sign my facebook comments with ()()===========(}. Does that make me gay? - Filthy |
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#8 (permalink) |
follower of the child's crusade?
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sending a woman to prison is a pretty serious thing.
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"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate, for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain without being uncovered." The Gospel of Thomas |
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#9 (permalink) | ||
Minion of the scaléd ones
Location: Northeast Jesusland
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Light a man a fire, and he will be warm while it burns. Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life. Last edited by Tophat665; 01-12-2008 at 06:08 AM.. Reason: Automerged Doublepost |
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#10 (permalink) |
follower of the child's crusade?
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It is completely different to send a man to prison than to imprison a women. It is far more serious to imprison a woman, especially a mother. What crime have her children committed to deserve this punishment?
__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate, for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain without being uncovered." The Gospel of Thomas |
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#11 (permalink) |
Getting it.
Super Moderator
Location: Lion City
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First of all, Host... that was a bit of unrelated nonsense. Please take your grindstone elsewhere.
Second, sending a woman to prison is not more or less serious than sending a man. To suggest otherwise is pretty sexist. Crime is crime. To the crime be prepared to do the time.
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"My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars." - Old Man Luedecke |
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#12 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: Ontario, Canada
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Women should be allowed to commit crime (in this case something called "fraud" - as in cheque fraud, which is stealing - and perjury) while men should be imprisoned for the same crimes? Marion Jones is a thief, a liar, a cheat, and a criminal - fell no sympathy for the likes of her.
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Si vis pacem parabellum. |
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#13 (permalink) | |
follower of the child's crusade?
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To think that men and women should be treated by the same standards is intolerable. Should women be sent to the front line of a war, to fight and die like men? Of course not. In the worst cases a woman may be sent to prison, but it is a pretty serious thing, especially as she is also a mother. In my opinion it is pretty sexist to say that women should be thrown in jail just the same as if they were some kind of common hoodlums, because her boyfriend mixed her up in some bad business, and she lied about cheating in a sport. Cheating is cheating, and the only punishment for cheating in a sport should relate to sanctions by the governing body of the sport. If she is said to have committed perjury presumably she was questioned by some kind of court about drug taking, but drug taking in sport is not a criminal offense, so why was she compelled to make statements under oath? The cads who would place a young mother in this situation are as much villians as the coaches who exploited her and forced the steroids on her.
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"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate, for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain without being uncovered." The Gospel of Thomas |
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#14 (permalink) | ||||||||
Minion of the scaléd ones
Location: Northeast Jesusland
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I think you have an idealized vision of this woman. I doubt she was forced to do anything. Being scum, like any other occupation, has become equal opportunity. I'm not saying that's what she is, jut that it can't be ruled out on the basis of sex. Or motherhood, for that matter. Plenty of delightful stories out there proving that it's often a very good idea to separate mother from children. Google "Fark Mother of the Year" for links to a panoply of such instances.
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Light a man a fire, and he will be warm while it burns. Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life. |
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#15 (permalink) |
Junkie
Location: Ontario, Canada
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So, to get out of going to jail, a woman should just get knocked up, and then we can give her a pass? Because that is what you are suggesting.
Additionally, you minimize the importance of fatherhood, it seems. Should fathers not go to prison either? Do I get a break if I commit a crime because I have a young child? If I die on the front line of a war, is it less tragic than if the dental hygenist next door gets blown up? My life has less value? If women want the same opportunities as men - to be high earning pro athletes like Marion Jones, to be world leaders like Maggie Thatcher or possibily Hillary Clinton, to run Fortune 500 companies like Martha Stewart - they can enjoy those opportunities, but if they fall afoul of the law, they must pay the penalty just as the other 50% of humanity would.
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Si vis pacem parabellum. |
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#16 (permalink) | |
Currently sour but formerly Dlishs
Super Moderator
Location: Australia/UAE
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as he said. child or no child. u do the crime. u do the time
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An injustice anywhere, is an injustice everywhere I always sign my facebook comments with ()()===========(}. Does that make me gay? - Filthy |
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#17 (permalink) |
Asshole
Administrator
Location: Chicago
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host, I always get a chuckle when you try to derail a thread as only you can do. Nice try, though.
SF - I certainly appreciate the sentiment of your statement. In a perfect world, it makes sense. Unfortunately, if it were to come to pass, it would be abused in this world.
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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - B. Franklin "There ought to be limits to freedom." - George W. Bush "We have met the enemy and he is us." - Pogo |
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#18 (permalink) | |
Pissing in the cornflakes
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They get to do time.
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Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps. |
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#19 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: Pats country
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"Religion is the one area of our discourse in which it is considered noble to pretend to be certain about things no human being could possibly be certain about" --Sam Harris |
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#20 (permalink) | |
Tilted
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#21 (permalink) | |||||||
Banned
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I have now supported my the legitimacy of comparing justice for Marrion Jones with 'justice" for the president's perjurer. I would appreciate it if posters who logged what amount to "drive-by sinped) criticism, seemingly more aimed at me, and my "rep" than as rebuttals of what I actually posted, would drive back around to this thread, pull into a space, shut of the motor, or at least put the shift selector in the "P" position, and actually post an opinion about what I posted, instead of a "quickie", about me. Fair enough? Quote:
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You don't see hypocrisy, you aren't disgusted by the lack of equal justice, under the law....but you bothered to drive-by to log here, that "host" is posting OT, in your opinions, but, in a one sentence, toss the rolled up newspaper out the window and onto the porch kinda delivery, you really couldn't say why, host was the problem with the discussion here. He just was....right? |
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#22 (permalink) |
Getting it.
Super Moderator
Location: Lion City
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Host this is one of the biggest problems with your posting... it might have been relevant to the discussion but ultimately you did not make your point, you left it up to the reader to read a posted article and then hoped that that reader would come the same conclusion as you. It is lazy posting and people don't like it.
__________________
"My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars." - Old Man Luedecke |
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#23 (permalink) | |
Banned
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Compared to a "drive-by", one or two "liner", do you really feel comfortable describing my posting style as "lazy"? It seems an unfair, and an inaccurate description. Last edited by host; 01-13-2008 at 04:56 PM.. |
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#24 (permalink) | |||||
Pissing in the cornflakes
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Because Jones represented our Country so well by cheating in the 2000 Olympics I hope our President will step up like his predecessor did with Marc Rich. Quote:
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__________________
Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps. |
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#26 (permalink) | |
Minion of the scaléd ones
Location: Northeast Jesusland
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__________________
Light a man a fire, and he will be warm while it burns. Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life. |
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#27 (permalink) | |
Deja Moo
Location: Olympic Peninsula, WA
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Host made his point to anyone that chose to read his links, and that includes me. I easily understood the analogy and intended sarcasm, and saw a bit of political irony of the Jon Stewart kind. Is it a case of lazy posting, or *people* choosing to be lazy readers?
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"You can't ignore politics, no matter how much you'd like to." Molly Ivins - 1944-2007 |
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#28 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: Ontario, Canada
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__________________
Si vis pacem parabellum. |
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#29 (permalink) | |
Minion of the scaléd ones
Location: Northeast Jesusland
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Heck, the Sports aspect of this ended when they put out the torch, and she went from being an athlete to some lanky chick with more self confidence than sense.
__________________
Light a man a fire, and he will be warm while it burns. Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life. |
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#30 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: Ontario, Canada
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She's not going to jail because she's black, or because she's a woman, or because she voted for the other guy.
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Si vis pacem parabellum. |
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#31 (permalink) | |
Minion of the scaléd ones
Location: Northeast Jesusland
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Whether doping should or should not be legal and what the punishment for it should be, and whether that should apply differently to men and women, mothers and not, this is a legislative matter - politics.
__________________
Light a man a fire, and he will be warm while it burns. Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life. |
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#33 (permalink) | |
Minion of the scaléd ones
Location: Northeast Jesusland
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__________________
Light a man a fire, and he will be warm while it burns. Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life. |
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#34 (permalink) |
follower of the child's crusade?
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The prosecution did not seek a prison term in any case.
The judge acted out of nothing but mysogony, brutality, and the desire of the cheap and tawdry rewards of fame. If the prosecution does not ask for jail time, how can the judge pass this sentence? Everyone involve recognised that she had been punished enough - except for this judge who is so desperate to see his name in headlines that he will attempt to destroy the life of this woman to do it. The cheque fraud is a separate issue in any case. This sentence is for lying about taking steroids. It is lunatic to jail someone for this. EVERY sports star should refuse to ever answer a question in any kind of congressional court of this nature again, in defence of Marion Jones. I would refuse to attend their session alltogether, and advise them that they would need to arrest me and bring me to trial for a criminal offence before I would speak to their court. If every athlete did the same, this kind of outrage couldnt happen.
__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate, for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain without being uncovered." The Gospel of Thomas |
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#35 (permalink) | |
Pissing in the cornflakes
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Perjury is a serious crime and to do so in a criminal investigation is not a wise move. She did and now shes paying for it. Whats interesting is that if the judge let her off, odds are there would be people talking about how celebrities and women get off easy.
__________________
Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps. |
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#37 (permalink) |
Wise-ass Latino
Location: Pretoria (Tshwane), RSA
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It's only six months. Less time than what Martha Stewart got when she purjured herself in the ImClone insider trading scandal. Less time than what Li'l Kim got when she purjured herself over her involvement in a shooting outside of a radio station.
We'll talk injustice and mysogyny and racial bias or political affiliation and preferential treatment for the rich and famous when she's getting 5-10 for this.
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Cameron originally envisioned the Terminator as a small, unremarkable man, giving it the ability to blend in more easily. As a result, his first choice for the part was Lance Henriksen. O. J. Simpson was on the shortlist but Cameron did not think that such a nice guy could be a ruthless killer. -From the Collector's Edition DVD of The Terminator |
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#38 (permalink) | |
Asshole
Administrator
Location: Chicago
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Ben Johnson, by the way, got caught using a drug that had, at the time of his "incident", a test available for 10+ years. Really, in the 80's and 90's it was the stupid sprinters that got caught. And host, as a close follower of track and field, I didn't "drive-by" your post. I actually read it. You just chose to respond take one sentence in the NYT article and post about it. I'll discuss politics in the appropriate place, but don't try to derail one of the few places that I actually get to talk about track here. All you "proved" was that you and the reporter want to grind the same axe.
__________________
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - B. Franklin "There ought to be limits to freedom." - George W. Bush "We have met the enemy and he is us." - Pogo |
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#39 (permalink) | ||||||||||||
Banned
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The_jazz, I sincerely cannot grasp why you think the crux of this thread is not political, or that you're comments about me, in either of your posts, are appropriate or accurate:
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We have a former celebrity, a US triple gold medal Olympic champion. She is a first offender, pleading guilty to a charge of lying to investigators, before a federal judge appointed by president Bush, and her sentencing takes place six months after Bush commuted, in advance of any incarceration, the entire prison sentence of Lewis Libby, a former presidential advisor and COS of the VP, who did not plead guilty to any of 5 counts of perjury before a federal grand jury in a criminal investigation, and went to trial and was found guilty by a jury of four of the perjury counts. The former Olympic champion's sentencing judge, is on record of going out of his way to sentence this first offender who pled guilty of a non-violent crime, to prison time, contrary to expressed sentiments of the prosecutors in the case. Marion Jones pled guilty, she did not put prosecutors and the court through the time and resources expending effort of a criminal jury trial, as Lewis Libby had. Libby's prosecutors communicated this, in a memo to the trial judge: Quote:
A month later, before Libby reported to prison to serve even a day, the president commuted his entire sentence and said: Quote:
It is reasonable to make that comparison on this thread, and to highlight the different reactions to the two offenders, and the different "justice" they have received. The accused who pled guilty is going to prison, contrary to her prosecutors' sentencing memo to the judge, <h3>and the accused who resisted the process, forcing a lengthy trial before he was convicted, and who was sentenced exactly in accordance with the prosecution's sentencing memo to the judge, later had the good fortune to have the president of the United States decide that Libby's prison sentence was "excessive", to the point that it was just to wipe it completely away.</h3> I don't believe that it is unreasonable given the above comparison, to post here as if the injustice done to Marion Jones, compared to Mr. Libby, is obvious, since I immediately thought that it was. I've already commented on my reaction to how you have chosen to respond to my posts in this thread. |
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#40 (permalink) |
Pissing in the cornflakes
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All I can say is I'm very upset no read my very important links which would teach you many things about this harry situation and really show you who the head ape in charge is, wielding the big pardon banana.
__________________
Agents of the enemies who hold office in our own government, who attempt to eliminate our "freedoms" and our "right to know" are posting among us, I fear.....on this very forum. - host Obama - Know a Man by the friends he keeps. |
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jail, jones, marion |
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