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Old 03-20-2006, 12:24 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Thinking about dropping out.

Alright TFPers I know I don’t really post much on here but I do try to make them count, so I’m hoping you can all help me out with some advice here. Every other time I’ve ever read the advice offered to someone else it’s been impartial and far from sugar-coated. I’m looking for honesty, even a ‘get over yourself, there are people with real problems’ if that’s what you think I need.

Here is the situation. I’m 20,(21 shortly), I’m in my junior year at a good college as a pre-med. My grades have been sliding and my cumulative has dropped from a 3.4 to a 2.7. I rarely attend class, if I do I don’t do the work and my grades reflect that(as they should). The problem is I can’t find a reason to get back into things. I haven’t a clue whether or not I want to be a doctor of any sort anymore and I don’t even really think I have the grades to be if I wanted to. I feel like I got on this conveyer belt that seemed nice at the time without ever really considering if it’s what I wanted. Ever since then I’ve just been going through the motions and I just don’t have a clue where I’m going or what I’m doing and I want some time to get it figured out.

The problem is I have a good bit out in loans and if I were to drop out several things would happen. First and foremost I’d be having to find a new place to live in a hurry. My parents have made if very clear they’ll help me as long as I’m in school but if I screw it up: I’m on my own, as in all my stuff on the lawn that day(Which is fine, I mean why should they have to help me at all, I’m 20 right). Along with that I would have to start paying on my loans, which would include getting a job and being stuck paying off my large amount of debt. Basically, if I quit now it is going to become very unlikely that I can ever come back. On the other side, I don’t see the point in staying if I’m not going to get anything out of it anyway. I feel like I already screwed it up and should just cut my losses and head out. I don’t see the point in digging myself a deeper hole to climb out of.

Any advice?
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Old 03-20-2006, 12:39 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I dropped out in second year.

My marks were sliding, my desire to go to class wasn't there. I dropped out and got a job as a waiter. Within a month or less, I knew I needed to be back in school. That year was a succession of crappy jobs that paid the bills until I could get back to school.

Once back, I had never been more motivated. My marks never slipped below an -A.


Dropping out gave me the perspective I needed.
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Old 03-20-2006, 12:42 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Have you looked at other majors? Are there any elective classes that held your interest?

If you check the "What was your college major" thread, you'll see that a lot of us here have degrees in something completely different than what we ended up doing in the real world. The college that I went to actually has students that are proud that the school only offers one major that directly correlates into a career in the real world (computer science). I know a whole lot over very successful history and political science majors in the business world. The most gifted historian that I've ever studied with is now a residential general contractor, for instance.

As an employer, I don't necessarily hire people that have training or experience in my field for entry level. In fact, I've gone out of my way to hire folks who majored in humanities. Stay in school, but find something that holds your interest better.
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Old 03-20-2006, 01:06 PM   #4 (permalink)
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For me, it was simple, I had a self taught skillset that people were willing to pay me handsomely for and continue to do so. I had to chose between getting paid or going to classes and missing out on getting contracts.

I dropped out. I keep thinking I will return to school and that decision keeps flitting past me from time to time, but I decline it each and every time.

Why? I'm not 100% sure, but one reason is that it won't give me any advantage to my current career or possible career moves in the foreseeable future.

If you can accept the consequences you put in the OP then why waste your time, the professor's time, the other students time if you don't really want to be there?
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Old 03-20-2006, 01:06 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Hektore, explore other majors, like Jazz said, and you can also ask your school if they have a sabbatical allowance, where you can basically drop out for a year, but not close out your studies. There may be a number of options, they may allow time out for mission work, Americorps, etc.
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Old 03-20-2006, 01:17 PM   #6 (permalink)
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It's not like the only options are

1. quitting altogether or
2. staying on the current track

Sounds like you need to assess where you want to go. If you don't want to be a doctor, what do you want to do? Your career counseling center on campus should be able to give you a head start on that question (for free). If you stay and take time to figure things out, the worst that happens is that you take longer to graduate; however, your parents continue to foot the bill, and you graduate with the credential behind your name, which WILL make a difference in terms of getting a job.

If you quit, you might have the time to think about the direction in your life, but you will likely find it powerfully difficult to jump back into school should the direction require higher education. I know many people who have dropped out and, while they have decent jobs, they feel trapped because they often lack the educational credentials necessary to jump tracks or get a different job.

Another option is to find out what happens if you take a semester's leave of absence. Usually student loans have a deferment period during which you don't have to pay them off (about 6 months). If you take a semester off, it's likely that the loans won't come due; you'll get a taste of "real life" to see if you like it; and you'll have the time you wanted to think. However, be sure that you have things lined up for getting back in - "real life" can look pretty juicy when you' are used to an academic life, but it's for the REST OF YOUR LIFE, and after a while you start to miss the time when your only responsibility was to go to classes and learn shit.
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Old 03-20-2006, 01:35 PM   #7 (permalink)
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lurkette
"real life" can look pretty juicy when you' are used to an academic life, but it's for the REST OF YOUR LIFE, and after a while you start to miss the time when your only responsibility was to go to classes and learn shit.
Great observation, Lurkette. I'd have to second her on that one... I'm in the 3rd year of a PhD program, but I spent a year as a high school teacher and went running back to school after that. I figured I had the rest of my life to work my ass off... why would I want that kind of life any earlier than necessary? Lurkette's very right... the working world can be rough. You think going to class a few hours a day and doing some homework is tough? Try being "in class" 40 hours a week, 8 hours a day, if not more, on a regimented schedule where there is no option of sleeping in (unless you want to lose your job). Granted, not all "real world" jobs are like this, but a heck of a lot of them are.

Now, I started off college as pre-med, too (10 years ago! yikes), and after a while grew bored and decided to major in English. I don't regret that decision; I was quite passionate about my major throughout college, even though my mom hated the idea since I had been groomed to be a doctor all my life. It took me years to convince her that I was making the right decision. Do you feel like your parents would no longer fund you if you studied something else? What about getting a job in college (like many people do) to put you on more of a schedule and give you the responsibility of paying for your own courses? Once you realize the financial weight of those missed classes, perhaps that will increase your motivation.

Believe me, as a PhD student I feel a substantial lack of motivation almost all of the time. I feel like dropping out sometimes because I don't know what I'm doing, wonder if the grass is greener, etc. The reality is that I just don't do well without structure, and if I let myself become too undisciplined, I REALLY start wanting to drop out. It has helped me to go to counseling through the university and get some of my mental life on track, as well as hold myself to a schedule of working out at least three times a week. I'm not saying these are answers for you, but do you feel like you are mentally and physically "in shape," and just really dislike pre-med now? Or are you out of shape in some areas, and thus your ability to enjoy your studies has also diminished?

I've rambled too long here, but I hope some paragraph or another was helpful to you. Just saying what came to mind for me, since I've been a student for life and it hasn't always been pretty, either. But it's not a bad life for a while, really.
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Old 03-20-2006, 02:20 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Just to touch on things that have already been said:

There are a lot of different types of schools you could go to with a lot of different majors. Then again, it isn't as though there are no options for those who drop out without a degree. Here are my recommendations:

Talk to someone on campus (academic advisor, career counsellor, etc) about different options that might interest you. Then, sign up for a wide variety of courses next semester: take things that you have never been exposed to or that you have only vaguely studied. Since you're a premed, I'd suggest looking at the humanities disciplines, like English, History, Philosophy, Anthropology, Sociology, Government, etc.

Try out some really different courses are see if anything sparks your interest. Also, it might be enlightening to get a job over the summer with similar hours and content to what you would do if you dropped out of school. That said, I highly recommend going back for another semester to try some other disciplines.
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Old 03-20-2006, 03:33 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Thanks for all your replies so far, couple things I probably should have mentioned in my OP,(the first one of which will probably make me seem crazy) - I pay for my own schooling, well all the loans are in my name and I will be the one paying them back anyway. My parents don’t foot the bill(they can’t afford to). The only thing they provide now is a place to go for breaks and occasionally is a few bucks if things get tight for me and I need it. Along with that the deferred payment on my loans is “12 months after I cease to be a full time student” – for up to 25 years of continuous study. In terms going out and getting a real job, for my summer jobs I simply work wherever I’m going to make the most money. Which means I usually end up at jobs that work me 50-60 hours a week at some pretty crappy/dangerous places, so I have had a taste of what the real world would be like – minus being totally self-sufficient, which might be the problem.

abaya-Something that had never occurred to me was that it could be lack of structure. All throughout my life I’ve played football and held a job during ‘school’. This meant no free time because I had to do my work to continue playing ball and didn’t have time to do anything else…This hasn’t been the case for the past two years and my whole attitude about college has really changed since then. Also I've become rather displeased with my physical condition as I know I've been in much better shape, even though people tell me I am not overweight or out of shape I know where I can be. So yeah, I’ve been in a bit of a slide, it just has only started to reflect in my grades over the last year once I started to really get into some harder upper level courses.

lurkette-I am almost positive that my college allows for a semester leave as long as you provide a reason, something I also had not thought of, looks like there were more options that I originally thought. My campus is very small ~1400 students. So I think I may actually just go and directly talk to the dean about some of this since I’ve chatted with him several times about my absenteeism as well as around campus and he is a pretty reasonable/approachable guy.

Thanks for the input so far– more is always welcome.
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Old 03-21-2006, 01:10 PM   #10 (permalink)
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I know its been said already, but i just want to echo that taking time off and coming back is almost always an option. In fact, thats what im doing right now. I was in a similar position as you (21, junior year, grades slipping, etc etc) so im taking a year off of school and working and taking one class at the local University. Sometimes a change of pace is what you need. I dont know what your school's policies are, but if you have any specific questions as to the hoops i had to jump through feel free to ask or message me.
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Old 03-21-2006, 01:59 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Talk to your college counselors\advisors. You aren't the first one to have these feelings and problems. Their job is to help everyone there be sucessful. Make them earn their money.
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Old 03-21-2006, 02:01 PM   #12 (permalink)
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Get the hell out and cut your losses. I was in a similar situation and am now at a job I despise trying to pay my way out of years of student debt I shouldn't have made.

Go to a technical school and get a job that can pay your bills. Being overeducated and underpaid is as depressing as it gets.
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Old 03-21-2006, 07:40 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Everything said here is personal perspective. That said, if you want a kick in the ass...

I dropped out of high school. I think that's probably fairly common knowledge around here. Those who keep up with me also know why I'm not around lately. It's because I'm working my ass off 40 hours per week plus overtime in addition to two night school courses (an additional 12 hours per week, not counting the piles of homework).

You know that question some people like to ask? When people ask me what one thing I'd do differently if I could, I don't hesitate with the answer. Dropping out was the absolute worst decision I ever made.

Granted, I left earlier than you did. But all those college or university courses mean jack shit until you have the paper to go with them. Those little slips of paper they give you at the end count for a lot in just about any field you care to name. You might luck out and be able to market a particular skillset. Then again, I tried that too. I am an accomplished computer technician with over ten years experience working on the damn things. When I was contracting and running my own business... well, I made some money, but I had to work my ass off for it. That was easily 40-50 hour weeks, sometimes 60.

If you don't like your major, it might be time to switch. And ultimately, you're going to do what you're going to do; I'm well aware of the fact that I have very little ability to change your mind. But if you want to know how the other side lives... I'm there and I wish more than anything else that I hadn't put myself in this position.

Stay in school. You'll rack up some big debts, you may loathe it for the entire four years or more you're there. But if you think life's tough now, try going out into the world with only a high school diploma to back you up. You're looking at menial jobs, no money, constant stress about how you're going to pay your bills, constant worry. You'll always have to prove yourself.. nobody takes a high school diploma seriously.

When I'm done my high school courses (which in itself will take a year and a half) I'm looking at five years of university to get into my chosen field. I keep finding myself looking at the people who tell me it'll be the best years of my life like they have some sort of disability. It's going to be hell; I'm well aware of the fact. But I've seen what the alternative is and I've decided that having an education is pretty much essential in today's world.

Take from that what you will, I guess.
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Old 03-21-2006, 08:08 PM   #14 (permalink)
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Man, you sound just like me. I have no motivation for school, and I am just kinda going through the motions. My outrageously high amount of debt is the only thing that has kept me in school.
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Old 03-21-2006, 09:02 PM   #15 (permalink)
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I dropped out. I sucked at real life, and went back. Then I used my degree in the real world, realized it STILL sucked, and went into a trade.

Long story short? I have tons of student loans I'm still paying off, I have a degree I will NEVER use (willingly mind you) and a fantastically incredible career where the work changes every day and I'm never bored. Oh, and I make as much as I would have with my degree.

I'm going to go out on a limb here. Make sure your bases are covered, and if they are, make a jump. Try something new in life. You only live once, you only get one chance, so make the most of it. Don't force yourself into apathy for the sake of a piece of paper or to please others.

I went from economic modelling to electrician. I don't regret it, although it scared the shit outta me at the time. But it was worth it and I thank my lucky stars every day I'm not still stuck in an office with the fake manniquens and posers.
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Old 03-21-2006, 10:40 PM   #16 (permalink)
 
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I have to say, some of the folks here have something with their take on getting technical training. Sometimes I think I'd be better off dropping this anthropology PhD track and learning a trade, something useful and interesting I could do to actually help people on a daily basis. I've always had great respect for manual laborers. My dad dropped out of college (he was studying marine biology) and apprenticed himself to carpentry; he learned to build houses (and everything in them) like it was nobody's business.

Even though he has now moved into the more specialty area of plumbing (a lucrative trade, I can tell you that) in order to take off some of the physical strain of carpentry, he is kick-ass at his job and manages his own hours. No one to answer to, always his own boss, and doing his best at helping people, which is what he really loves about the job. Not to mention making a hell of a lot more per hour than I ever have, with my multiple degrees.

Of course, manual labor is HARD. That's why Dad always wanted me to stay in school as long as I could; he didn't want me breaking my back like he has (literally--his physical problems are legion), and he seems to regret never going farther in college. Even though he is what I would call a professional, someone who deserves a farking PhD in what he does, he still thinks formal education is the way to go. Who am I to argue? All I can say is that I've never held his lack of official papers against him, but maybe he would've chosen to stay in school if he had his 'druthers.

It comes down to what you want, and what you might regret someday. Let me know if you ever figure that out, since I'm still thinkin'...
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Old 03-22-2006, 11:49 AM   #17 (permalink)
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Stay in school. Try a few different majors. (Maybe try a leave of absence.)
There is a very good chance that completing a degree will only get more difficult the longer you wait. Life happens, getting married happens, having kids happens, gaining a mortgage happens. All of these things, and more, will make it more difficult for you to return to school.
I dropped out of college when I was 20 years old. By the time I was 35 I realized that I had progressed as far as I possibly could, I my career path, without my degree. It took me until I was 38 to complete my Bachelors degree. That was over two years of hell working full time and going to school full time. I couldn’t afford to stop working……. I often asked myself, “Why didn’t I just stick with it when I was 20? It was so easy back then.”
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Old 03-22-2006, 12:36 PM   #18 (permalink)
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For the purposes of my above post, a technical school or apprenticeship in a trade counts as post-secondary education. I strongly considered going into a skilled trade and see it as a valid and fulfilling career. Not for everyone, but neither is theoretical physics and we wouldn't get very far without either field.

My overarching point was that you definitely need to do something. Whether that be a doctor, a lawyer or a plumber, it's bound to be better than flipping burgers and it's not something you're likely going to manage with only a high school education. The world just doesn't work that way anymore.
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Old 03-22-2006, 08:20 PM   #19 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Hektore
Any advice?
Join the Army.
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Old 03-23-2006, 02:11 AM   #20 (permalink)
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I went to college for a little over 2 years, wanting to do computer programming. Finally, the same thing happened as you- interest waned, attendance slowed, grades slipped. It's very ok to rethink your future, especially while it's so early. People of all ages rethink their direction.

I wanted desperately to get a good job and just work on my writing. After dropping out of college, I worked and tried to do my writing. As a manager in a cellular phone store, I found the money didn't make up for the job, and the stress of the job kept me from writing, because I hated being stuck in my job. It was still retail, it was not what I wanted my life to be about.

I finally decided I needed to go back to school, to get a degree in something I WANTED to do, would feel happy doing. Well, now i'm back in school this semester, taking care of a few loose classes, and I start my Paramedic program on May 9th.

It's something I really want to do, I'll have a college degree, and it will be decent money. The thing is, for me, even if I spend the rest of my life writing, i'll still have a degree, and a good career- and if I never sell one thing I write, I'll still be proud of the things I've done and the choice I made to finish school with some degree.

So just go find out where your real passions are, and do that. I, also, thought about being a doctor at one time, but I decided I needed something faster, more involved, more intense. I guess you can figure out how I came to decide on being a Paramedic from there.
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Old 03-23-2006, 04:42 AM   #21 (permalink)
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I was feeling a little 'out of it' with Computer Science for a while. I started studying Japanese, and am now in Japan studying abroad.

I'm still going to graduate with Computer Science.. I have good options for some great jobs.. but.. I don't want to start working yet.

I am thinking of attending graduate school in Japan, I can get it on Japans dime as well :P

I am also racking up student loans, but not too worried about it.. my friends who have already graduated aren't having trouble with money.
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Old 04-04-2006, 07:01 PM   #22 (permalink)
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So, I know I've fallen of the wayside with this but that's because I've been running around talking to some faculty, my profs, the dean and one of my advisors(who also happens to be the head of academic support services). Looking into the reality of what I would be stuck doing if I dropped out was a serious kick in the ass.

I went around to my professor's and talked to them about my situation in each of their classes. Of the ones I've talked to they all seem to think that I am more than capable of earning a respectable grade in their course if I put in real work. I talked to my advisor about the realistic chances of me getting into med-school which I already know are slim to none as things are now.

I've decided to put if off applications for a year to really focus on earning respectable grades. I'm going to go back in to her to talk about the chances of getting into a post-bac program to try to improve my chances of getting into school. I also decided to put off MCAT's until August instead of trying to make the late registration dead line. I think it will help me prepare better to do it over the summer when I won't have to worry about my prep competing with classes.

Thank you for the advice everyone, every bit was helpful as it helped me realize all my options and actually get me motivated to go talk to people and do something instead of rolling over and dying.
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Old 04-05-2006, 01:12 AM   #23 (permalink)
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Not to sound like an ass..

School (university), in terms of studying, has always been ok for me.

My only regret is I didn't get any in college.

Sucks.

1 month left..

But yeah, you should just do what you enjoy the most. Because, if you force yourself to learn something you don't like but you feel will earn you $, you're probably not going to be good at it, and you probably won't be in it for the long-haul anyways. And even if you are, what's the point of being bored/unhappy??

Of course, if you study philosophy... good luck!
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