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Old 11-22-2004, 07:12 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Raunchy Newspaper Causes Campus Turmoil

Raunchy Rutgers Newspaper Causes Campus Turmoil
By PATRICIA ALEX
STAFF WRITER



The Medium, a student-run weekly newspaper at Rutgers University, includes the kind of content that used to be shrouded in brown paper wrappers.

In the past two weeks alone, the paper has featured a comic strip depicting a man slapping a woman in the face during sex, an anonymous editorial calling all Rutgers women bitches, computer-created photos of President Bush and Osama bin Laden having sex and personals with homophobic, racist and anti-Semitic references.

All of it - including the obscenity and the hateful speech - is protected under the First Amendment, university officials say. And here at the public university, The Medium has another court-protected advantage that allows it to stay in business: It's funded by activity fees that students are required to pay.

The Medium will get about $22,000 in student funds this school year, allocated by the student government associations at the university's Livingston and Rutgers colleges. The public funding allows it to distribute 6,000 copies each week among the five Rutgers campuses in New Brunswick/Piscataway.

Some students are fed up.

"It subjugates women right, left and center," said Kim Brynildsen, a freshman at Rutgers' women's college, Douglass. Brynildsen, who is from Parsippany, and some of the other students at Douglass have launched a petition drive to get The Medium off campus. The initiative, she said, grew out of a women's studies class assignment to "construct a feminist action project."

And the students surely are getting a lesson. The Douglass group rallied on campus last week and was approached by editors of The Medium.

"They started counterdemonstrating," Brynildsen said. "They were being very hostile and not listening to what we were trying to say."

The editor of The Medium, Michael Stanley, said he and other staffers went to the rally merely to "have a dialogue" with the protesters. "We tried to explain to the people that we're not there to degrade women," he said.

This week's issue of The Medium responded to the protesters with a cover of topless women headlined "Douglass Protest Gone Wild."

Last week, 5,000 issues of the Medium disappeared. An anonymous group, whose members call themselves "The Progressive Activists," took responsibility. "If you're going to be progressive, don't steal our papers," Stanley said.

The Medium bills itself as "the Entertainment Weekly" of the Rutgers campus. Founded in 1970 as the campus newspaper of Livingston, The Medium says it provides "a special brand of light-hearted humor" to students. Many of the submissions are anonymous. It is delivered every Wednesday to student centers, dining halls and academic buildings.

"We are an envelope-pushing paper," said Stanley, the editor, a senior from Scotch Plains. "From speaking with students, I've realized we're an integral part of Wednesdays on campus."

This isn't the first time that the paper has been at the locus of controversy.

Last year, there were more student protests over the profane personals, which routinely slur many groups. This spring, editors apologized for publishing a cover-page cartoon that mocked the Holocaust. It featured a man throwing a ball at another who sat atop an oven. The text read: "Knock a Jew in the oven!" Editors said the drawing was not intended to be anti-Semitic but was "meant to amuse through extraordinary absurdity."

The cartoon sparked outrage from many students, school officials and outside groups. Nonetheless, Rutgers President Richard L. McCormick, in a letter to the university community, said not much could be done.

"It's understandable that many students want to shut down the paper because of its content," McCormick wrote. "To do so would clearly break the law."

The nation's courts have allowed wide latitude for speech on college campuses. Language that incites (there is a suggestion in The Medium this week that those who stole the papers be "hanged" in the middle of campus) likely doesn't cross the legal standard of "fighting words," some experts say.

Obscenity is mitigated by whether the material has redeeming artistic, social or political value. The Medium purports to be political and cultural satire, which is protected, legal experts say.

"There is a pretty strong threshold for obscenity," with all but hard-core pornography being exempt from protection, said David Hudson of the First Amendment Center at Vanderbilt University. Similarly, a U.S. Supreme Court decision in 2000 found that universities could not withhold student-fee funding from registered student groups.

In a unanimous ruling involving a case at the University of Wisconsin, the Supreme Court said that student funds can go to diverse groups, even over the objections of individual students who disagree with some of the groups they are funding. A majority of the justices said that a student-fee program is constitutional as long as it is applied with "viewpoint neutrality," meaning that the views of any registered student group, no matter how objectionable, can't be used to deny funding.

That protection can be tough to swallow. "We've gotten a lot of complaints from those who feel their student funds should not go to the publication," said Gus Sara, president of the student government association at Rutgers' Livingston College.

Efforts to rescind that funding last year were met by threats of a lawsuit and warnings from university attorneys that the case could not be won, Sara said.

The process has been aggravating and frustrating, but ultimately a learning experience, Sara said.

And that's part of the point, say administrators at Rutgers.

"The purpose of student activity fees is to create a marketplace of different and diverse student viewpoints," said Brian Rose, vice president of student affairs. "And the expectation is that we do it a viewpoint-neutral way.

"Over several years, there have been different articles, cartoons and editorials [in The Medium] that have created various controversies on campus," Rose said. "What we have generally tried to do is facilitate dialogue between the students and the people responsible for content. The hope is that people learn from these experiences."

---------------
I'm too lazy to google to find the actual content of the paper, and papers have disappeared en masse from the university, however, the question up for discussion:

Quote:
A majority of the justices said that a student-fee program is constitutional as long as it is applied with "viewpoint neutrality," meaning that the views of any registered student group, no matter how objectionable, can't be used to deny funding
Do you agree with the Supreme Court, should university funding go to create something that students and faculty find quite objectionable. If you were a student at Rutgers, or your own university, and part of your tuition went to fund this newspaper, woudl you object?
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Old 11-22-2004, 07:19 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I applaud the creators of this "offensive" paper. These people are directly demonstrating the effect of the First Amendment and what it really means. If something I write or express is offensive to you, too bad. Don't look at it or don't read it. It takes guts to stand up and do something like this. I'd give these people an award of some sort.
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Old 11-22-2004, 07:35 PM   #3 (permalink)
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It goes beyond that though. If you want to say or write whatever you want that's fine just don't do it with my damn money. I hope these little bastards get whats coming to them though.
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Old 11-22-2004, 07:36 PM   #4 (permalink)
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he Medium will get about $22,000 in student funds this school year, allocated by the student government associations at the university's Livingston and Rutgers colleges. The public funding allows it to distribute 6,000 copies each week among the five Rutgers campuses in New Brunswick/Piscataway.
You wanna run an offensive newspaper, good for you, but do it on your own dime.
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Old 11-22-2004, 07:46 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Who determines what's offensive and what isn't? I'm personally offended when I see feminazi propaganda or bleeding heart rags, but I still support their right to publish it, even with my own student activity money.
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Old 11-22-2004, 07:46 PM   #6 (permalink)
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i think it should be put up to a vote. If a large enough majority of students think the paper is a waste of resources, funding should be cut. freedom of speech is great and all, but the best thing about freedom is having enough taste to know when you're abusing it. If you don't understand the meaning of restraint, you don't understand the meaning of freedom.

there's a difference between rocking the boat and being assholes.
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Old 11-22-2004, 07:49 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timalkin
Who determines what's offensive and what isn't? I'm personally offended when I see feminazi propaganda or bleeding heart rags, but I still support their right to publish it, even with my own student activity money.
Right to publish doesn't automatically equal means to publish. Others may find their money is better served elsewhere. The student council should vote on pulling funding from the paper.
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Old 11-22-2004, 10:41 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Why cut funding? Remove the editors. If it's a student newspaper and enough students don't like the content, change those who are responsible for the content.

In the real world, you need to be responsible to your advertisers and readers or no one will buy your paper. The editors of this paper are responsible to no one in this case. It seems like a big joke. There are no consequences. Make some.

Freedom of speech is great but this has nothing to do with that. This is irresponsible kids getting away with as much as they can.
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Old 11-22-2004, 11:15 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Obviously people read the paper; I know I would. And frankly it's good that we don't allow individuals to determine how their money is spent, as it would prevent minority groups (including this one) from getting funds. I don't think the majority of students on campus would want to fund the Gaming Club, but we get funds nevertheless.

Pulling funding from the paper would require a legal reason to do so; not liking the content is not a valid reason.

If you accept the idea of free speech, you have to accept the idea of ALL free speech, even the stuff you hate.
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Old 11-22-2004, 11:52 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Equity

There are really two different issues here. The first being whether or not the university should/can bar the rights of a registered school orginization. The second being the division of money between the registered orginizations.

I consider the first to be a no brainer. While it might be offensive and hurtful to some students, the university should not have any power or control over what registered orginizations do. Strange as it may be, "The KKK of the University of XXXX" should have as much rights as "The chess club of the University of XXXX". College is about scholary enlightenment through education and diversity. You cannot pick and choose elements of diversity- that's called segregation.

The second issue is where things start to get hazy. Because orginizations get university funding, students are indirectly supporting them through their tutition. Since I come from a Jewish family, I don't suppose my relatives (who are helping to pay my tuition) would like to support the "Neo Nazi Club" at my school. Most students woudn't want their tuition money going to fund such orginizations either. Still however, even if every single orginization at my school was aligned with something I disliked, I'd still support their equal funding. The point of university funding is to give a voice to a group of people who normally woudln't have one. The fact that people get any money at all is something amazing. Imagine getting a check, with no strings attached, specifically to start a chess club at your local library?! Imagine how much more power and voice the club would have if a third party funded all the fliers you passed out to generate more enrollment.

It is more predjudace for me to specifically deny the "Neo Nazi Club" funding than it is for the club to spread anti-semetic fliers around campus. The effect can be reversed as well: If students chose where their money went, what would happen if I wanted to start a pro-homosexuality club, or a videogame club? The college I go to is quite conservative- I wouldn't get much funding for a pro-homosexuality club, and I wouldn't get much funding for a videogame club either (people don't understand the value videogames give to nerds like me). Like I said before: "College is about scholary enlightenment through education and diversity." It is doing a disservice to education if voices are silenced because they lack funds in comparison to others.

Funding for university orginizations should be equal or nonexistant. (no funding for all is technically equal) In the same swipe that you would deny a hate group funding, you are conversely giving preferential treatment to other groups. As I said before, even if every single orginization at my school was aligned with something I disliked, I'd still support their equal funding. This is because, at any point in time, I'd have the freedom to start my own orginization and it would have the same resources as every other orginization. My group would be equal.
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Old 11-23-2004, 12:57 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Article
That protection can be tough to swallow. "We've gotten a lot of complaints from those who feel their student funds should not go to the publication," said Gus Sara, president of the student government association at Rutgers' Livingston College.

Quote:
Originally Posted by timalkin
I applaud the creators of this "offensive" paper. These people are directly demonstrating the effect of the First Amendment and what it really means. If something I write or express is offensive to you, too bad. Don't look at it or don't read it. It takes guts to stand up and do something like this. I'd give these people an award of some sort.
That pretty much sums up my view right there. Freedom of speech means FREEDOM OF SPEECH. This newspaper is an example of what broadcast television and radio should be like.

If you look hard enough you would find that no matter what you think/do/say/wear/are there will ALWAYS be SOMEONE out there that HATES it and would like to see it gone. Imagine if everything that *someone* hated was banned, what would be left? The alternative to banning everything is freedom. I think I like that a lot better.
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Old 11-23-2004, 01:17 AM   #12 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tricks
Why cut funding? Remove the editors. If it's a student newspaper and enough students don't like the content, change those who are responsible for the content.

In the real world, you need to be responsible to your advertisers and readers or no one will buy your paper. The editors of this paper are responsible to no one in this case. It seems like a big joke. There are no consequences. Make some.

Freedom of speech is great but this has nothing to do with that. This is irresponsible kids getting away with as much as they can.
I like this response and suggestion. Vote to remove the editors.
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Old 11-23-2004, 02:13 AM   #13 (permalink)
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I tried to get worked up about this. I re-read it, I thought real hard about it and...well, nothing.

All I can say to the folks who are upset about this is that's apparently how it works. In this case, the rules have been laid. Unless you pick up and physically take command of the paper, you have to work inside the confines of the system because counter protesting doesn't seem to cut it.

Storm the offices and physically throw the "editors" from their chairs or use the system to replace the "editors" in their chairs.

Or of course.....you could just not read it at all.

There's always going to be a niche for things like this, public dime or no, but the only thing their doing right now is drawing attention to it. In this case, isn't that counter-productive? How many people have read this? How many people are now trying to get their hands on it? How is this hurting the paper?

I'm all for demonstration, believe me, but sometimes you have to put down the sign and start looking for practical ways to get the job done.
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Old 11-23-2004, 05:24 AM   #14 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by bermuDa
i think it should be put up to a vote. If a large enough majority of students think the paper is a waste of resources, funding should be cut. freedom of speech is great and all, but the best thing about freedom is having enough taste to know when you're abusing it. If you don't understand the meaning of restraint, you don't understand the meaning of freedom.

there's a difference between rocking the boat and being assholes.

100% agreement on the idea that this should be voted upon by the student population that's the flipping the bill for it's publication.


Quote:
The Medium will get about $22,000 in student funds this school year, allocated by the student government associations at the university's Livingston and Rutgers colleges. The public funding allows it to distribute 6,000 copies each week among the five Rutgers campuses in New Brunswick/Piscataway.

Student's funds being used = student's right right to vote on this.
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Old 11-23-2004, 05:40 AM   #15 (permalink)
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Our newspaper is horrible, and sometimes offensive, but this is over the top. We had a big uproar over a comic strip depicting a chinese restaurant using cats, but that doesnt reach this level.
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Old 11-23-2004, 07:15 AM   #16 (permalink)
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These papers make that one look lame:

- Golden Words, Queen's University
- Toikie Oikie (sp?) U of T
- Red Rag, UBC

all the engineering newspapers circa late '70's early '80's
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Old 11-23-2004, 07:15 AM   #17 (permalink)
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here at Texas Tech there is a paper like that the perversity weekly... but it doesnt sound as crude or offensive as the one in this article... it usually just makes fun of events in lubbock and on campus... no printers in lubbock will print it anymore, they have to print it at UT...

i think the worst article in it was the one making fun of the dildo on the front cover of the official university paper a week ago... said it was offensive to have disproportionatly sized penises on the front cover of newspapers
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Old 11-23-2004, 07:18 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by ObieX
That pretty much sums up my view right there. Freedom of speech means FREEDOM OF SPEECH. This newspaper is an example of what broadcast television and radio should be like.
Freedom of speech doesn't automatically grant the means for that speech. Just because I have a right to freedom of speech doesn't mean that the federal government should automatically give me money to publish/broadcast that speech.

Quote:
Pulling funding from the paper would require a legal reason to do so; not liking the content is not a valid reason.
As the the newspaper is run by students and funded by students, no legal reason is required. All that is required is for the student government to pull funding.

Quote:
Funding for university orginizations should be equal or nonexistant. (no funding for all is technically equal) In the same swipe that you would deny a hate group funding, you are conversely giving preferential treatment to other groups. As I said before, even if every single orginization at my school was aligned with something I disliked, I'd still support their equal funding. This is because, at any point in time, I'd have the freedom to start my own orginization and it would have the same resources as every other orginization. My group would be equal.
I'm not sure exactly how this school runs it's student groups, but it is simply unfeasable to give every student group the same amount of money, or even any money at all. Certainly a student newspaper requires more money to run than a student group that does nothing but read shakespear. (I don't mean to disparage shakespear, but simply mean to point out that it is much cheaper to buy shakespear's plays than to print several thousand newspapers.)

Quote:
There's always going to be a niche for things like this, public dime or no, but the only thing their doing right now is drawing attention to it. In this case, isn't that counter-productive? How many people have read this? How many people are now trying to get their hands on it? How is this hurting the paper?
Since the paper recieves money regarless of it's readership, I don't see how it is hurting 'the cause'. Perhaps as more people read it, more people will grow to dislike it.
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Old 11-23-2004, 07:48 AM   #19 (permalink)
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A University isn't in the business of opression, like the government is. When you enter the grounds of a University you enter another world. A world of education and possibilities. A place where art and news can both flourish and intermingle without the fear of being stamped out. Basically they try to be what this country is supposed to be. Universities are very big on things like freedom of speech and freedom of expression and art.

Basically all this article is, is a student project that got blown all out of proportion and was picked up by the media. A couple of people who picked up some signs to stroll around in front of the paper so they can get an A in their Women's Studies class. The counter protest was unexpected and interesting and was probably the reson this got so much attention. After that anyone with a bug up their butt and in search of a cause to rally behind started pushing the paper's buttons. In reality i doubt many people care much about this whole hoopla.
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Old 11-23-2004, 08:10 AM   #20 (permalink)
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In the words of that eminent statesman Rodney King - 'Why can't we all just get along?'

I certainly understand the first amendment issues and these constitutional arguments have went on long before this particular paper was published.

But my question is 'Why are the editors of this publication acting like little children?'. They are publishing this for the attention and shock value. They might argue that there is indeed some redeeming social value to publishing shocking and degrading words and pictures. I will not debate this in itself. But why? To continue the tradition of college publications printing shocking and degrading words and pictures? Uh, ok.

Here's a novel concept, print something that people might somehow enjoy reading. Humorous (not degrading) comics. Poetry. Stories about college students lives and experiences. Social commentary on our times and our place in history. Oh, because it's not exciting enough. So what? Does everyone who reads the 'The Medium' feel like their lives are somehow enriched for the experience? I doubt it.

The fact that there are not advertisers or subscribers to answer to is the reason that these immature editors are able to continue with their tantrums. Cue the scene of the little kid jumping up and down on the bed shouting at his Mom 'You can't stop me, you can't stop me'. Mom knows how to stop him - just walk away. Giving these editors all this attention just encourages them.
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Old 11-23-2004, 10:10 AM   #21 (permalink)
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I was fully supportive until I saw "Public University." This means that not only student activity fees, but tax dollars are funding a paper that I'm willing to be would befound objectionable by a majority of taxpayers, if not students.

Poll the students, if they overwhelmingly support it, make sure that only their activity fees are supporting it.
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Old 11-23-2004, 10:27 AM   #22 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by MrSelfDestruct
Poll the students, if they overwhelmingly support it, make sure that only their activity fees are supporting it.
As long as the activiy fee itself is refundable. At my school it was and when it came out some of the crazy things that got funded a lot of people opted to get a refund. It ment you couldn't use the school lawyers, but since the school lawyers were worthless in all things accept for advice (they couldn't help you with school issues and would not go to trial for you).

Just because students LIKE it doesn't mean it should get student funds directly. I'd have loved a school paper that put nude shots of the female students in it, but that doesn't mean such a publication deserves school funding. It means that I should pay for it myself if I wanted to see it, like I would any other publication.
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Old 11-23-2004, 10:39 AM   #23 (permalink)
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I'd be curious to know exactly how much money is being taken on a per student basis for their student activity fees. My guess is that it's a rather trivial amount, and I personally feel that letting these kids remain kids for another four years is worth the sacrifice of tolerating a message that most people wouldn't like, in order to stretch the breadth of the experience for the student body. If you don't like it, don't read it. I work at a Southern university, and around here if the precedent of "let the students vote on it" is followed, say goodbye to most International Student Associations (The French Club...we're changing that to the Freedom Club, then kicking them frog-ass sumbitches out the country...vote 'em the fuck out)...any club associated with Middle Eastern nationality? I don't think so), the LBGA (We don't want no gay homosexuals getting married, and we certainly don't want 'em congregating on campus on getting to know each other), Society for Creative Anachronism...I don't think so. You'd pretty much have some sports teams, the NRA, and some African-American organizations around. And more frats/sororities. I think that for that four-year experience, it's an acceptable sacrifice to encourage introduction to varying viewpoints...and for people to learn to recognize the difference between what you should be free to express, because of the 1st Amendment, and what you should express.
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Old 11-23-2004, 10:45 AM   #24 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ustwo
I'd have loved a school paper that put nude shots of the female students in it, but that doesn't mean such a publication deserves school funding. It means that I should pay for it myself if I wanted to see it, like I would any other publication.
As a side note, I'm pretty sure that these student papers are still bound by whatever thin lines that "real world" papers are...ie. I'm pretty sure a paper would print those pictures if the school wouldn't get the living tarnation sued out of it. I'm betting these kids have a pretty good idea of how far they can push it and stay protected by the university. I'm pretty sure that the schools I have been to had a faculty liason that would advise the students / editors on legal issues.
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Old 11-23-2004, 01:05 PM   #25 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by pigglet
As a side note, I'm pretty sure that these student papers are still bound by whatever thin lines that "real world" papers are...ie. I'm pretty sure a paper would print those pictures if the school wouldn't get the living tarnation sued out of it. I'm betting these kids have a pretty good idea of how far they can push it and stay protected by the university. I'm pretty sure that the schools I have been to had a faculty liason that would advise the students / editors on legal issues.
I didn' t mean illegaly, but playboy style. If they girls agreed, they couldn't be sued, but it still shouldn't be student/public funded. The amount per student doesn't matter. I'm sure if there was a nazi paper, you could understand if the Jewish students were a little upset their 10 cents were going to its funding.
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Old 11-23-2004, 08:17 PM   #26 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by fckm
Since the paper recieves money regarless of it's readership, I don't see how it is hurting 'the cause'. Perhaps as more people read it, more people will grow to dislike it.
It's not about money (What money?). Like I said, there will always be a niche for this stuff. Now that your drawing attention to it that niche grows. Now instead of a few hundred folks, it's thousands. (I have no way of knowing actual numbers, it's just a way to get the point across)

That being said, where is the incentive to stop publishing the "offensive" material? The whole point of the paper excercising their first amendment rights it seems was to thumb their nose at the "establishment," who can't do a damn thing about it because the paper has played by the rules.

The paper is garnering attention, which is exactly why it printed the "offensive" stuff in the first place. Now they have an even larger audience at their fingertips. What do you think they're going to do? Report responsibly or show more boob pictures and dirty cartoons?
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Old 11-24-2004, 10:13 AM   #27 (permalink)
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How is this going to benefit the students?

I wouldn't want my money to goto waste so a bunch of stupid college morons can publish a pointless paper they can laugh at, but that's just me.
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Old 11-24-2004, 10:34 AM   #28 (permalink)
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Humor is a form of art. Besides, would you say that you wouldn't pay for a pointless college football team just so some stupid jocks can have fun? Or you wouldn't pay for a pointless mascot uniform so some stupid moron students can get a chuckle from it's antics? The paper is for satire purposes, its not really meant to be a serious paper, its meant for enjoyment and entertainment of students who happen to find it funny or entertaining, while possibly making a small profit for the school (like that football team). Who knows, with all this new attention they may very well make up the cost of their club with money that goes directly into the school to make your education that much better. All the while you're kept atleast slightly entertained by a few morons with a sense of humor and a printer.
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Old 11-24-2004, 10:36 AM   #29 (permalink)
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BTW that Colin Powell chick is hawt!!!
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Old 11-24-2004, 01:38 PM   #30 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ustwo
I didn' t mean illegaly, but playboy style. If they girls agreed, they couldn't be sued, but it still shouldn't be student/public funded. The amount per student doesn't matter. I'm sure if there was a nazi paper, you could understand if the Jewish students were a little upset their 10 cents were going to its funding.
Sorry it took me so long to respond to this...I took some time to think about it, then I sort of forgot about it.

I personally wouldn't have any problems with the pictorials you described. I'd actually be surprised if a school like Vassar might not actually have such a magazine (campus nudist club or nude photography club or something). I know that a friend of mine appeared in a school-sponsored play there in the full nude. As far as the nazi paper, I could certainly understand Jewish students and their families not liking school funding going to such a publication. As to whether or not I think that school funding should be given to such a group, that's another matter. I certainly don't think that everyone should like everything that's published, and it would probably depend on the actual content of the publication. I'd also be surprised if there wasn't a student chapter of the World Church of the Creator (unless they've been deemed a terrorist/subversion organization - not bush bashing, that Matthew Hale guy did try to assassinate a federal judge, I believe) that was a RSO somewhere. I would think that as long as they didn't call for mass executions of all blacks, latinos, etc. that they could talk about white supremacy and aryan pride all they wanted to. That's a separate issue from whether I personally think it's material worthy of printing. I know that different people are going to have problems with the content of various groups' viewpoints, but unless it directly threatens the student body or the academic mission of the university, I tend to say more exposure is better. These kids are supposed to be learning how to be adults...might as well that a part of being an adult is learning to filter out crap.
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Old 11-24-2004, 01:44 PM   #31 (permalink)
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God, this kind of stuff is getting too common nowadays. If you dont like it, dont watch/read/etc it. Some people do. There are so many people into so many things, just get over yourself, and let people do their own thing until it actually affects you.
 
Old 11-24-2004, 02:44 PM   #32 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by thinktank
God, this kind of stuff is getting too common nowadays. If you dont like it, dont watch/read/etc it. Some people do. There are so many people into so many things, just get over yourself, and let people do their own thing until it actually affects you.
If you pay for it, it affects you which is the whole point of the thread to date.
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Old 11-24-2004, 02:50 PM   #33 (permalink)
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i dont think it should matter. if it's a school run newspaper of course part of the school's funding will go towards it. Everyone who writes for the college newspaper in my town are morons, but i'm not campaigning to have it shut down just because i dont want to read it.
 
Old 11-24-2004, 03:11 PM   #34 (permalink)
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It's Still A Right

This complaint has been launched again and again, from many quarters and in many directions. And it still all comes down to the same thing: The right to express.

In Canada we have a law about promoting hate, so neo-nazi groups would find it difficult to find any such outlet as a University paper, or evne club funding. Yet this paper, even with some of the edgier examples that have been quoted, are doing nothing more than stimulating public conversation and initiating that through means available to them.

I can appreciate that people may fail to see the humour in the "jew in the oven" cartoon, and I can also understand the sense of female subjugation in some of the headlines, yet none of this promotes hate in any real way.

One thing that I always tend to throw in such debates is that I love that people like Larry Flynt (sp.) exist because with extreme thoughts floating around, people become aware of issues and public consciousness tends to find a middle ground. I think this is the case here, and if public consciousness is raised, even by extreme examples, and real dialogue takes place as a result, it becomes the opposite of harmful.

I am kind of going on here, but I think I have made my point. Don't forget, you have the same rights to communicate your ideas as they do, and it is your right, and perhaps even your civil responsibility, to excercise that right if you find something offensive.

Pierre
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Old 11-24-2004, 04:27 PM   #35 (permalink)
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Yeah, the newspaper at our school has had some pretty bad things in it too. I think that school is unprofessional, of course, but if they are under the first amendment, then there is nothing anyone should do about it.
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Old 11-24-2004, 06:09 PM   #36 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by la petite moi
Yeah, the newspaper at our school has had some pretty bad things in it too. I think that school is unprofessional, of course, but if they are under the first amendment, then there is nothing anyone should do about it.
This has nothing to do with the first amendment.

Its all about who should pay for. Public funds being used to fun material of limited value and objectionable nature. They are asking for the tax payer to foot their bill.

If it was a private paper and it was being shut down that would be a free speech issue.
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Old 12-01-2004, 06:35 AM   #37 (permalink)
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If I were a part of another student group I would not object to having the funding pulled from all student groups and have each support themselves. Have the student feesbe paid directly from the students to the student groups that they support and go to buy the school newspapers that the students want to read. Judging from the controversy started by this paper I would expect students to continue to buy it only to satisfy their curiosity but I have a feeling that a lot of them would stop buying it at least eventually. That would be motivation enough to tone the paper down at least a little. What's the point of giving all student groups funding? What about teaching these students how business works? You piss off the consumer and you loose support. It's about teaching the students that they are responsible in many ways for what they do. Not just legally but commercially, economically...etc.
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