kutulu

Seriously. The quality of school lunches needs to increase big time. Before we even worry about the shit our kids get from McD's we should worry about what the government feels is acceptable for our kids to eat.

animosity

This is true, I never went to public schools so I had no idea what these kids ate untill recently. I now realize why all these kids are "ADD" now... they all eat crap food all day and their brain can not function!

Xell101

What I was taught had no real relevance to anything I knew. It was all obscure bits of information that required a preexisting understanding of the subject that I dind't get until much later, so none of what I was taught had any impact, as none of it had any relation to what I knew about eating. Eating was just another activity like games, TV, movies, magazines, etc.


That is where advertising comes in. Billions wouldn't be spent on advertising by companies if more billions weren't too be earned from it, it works, it takes more than simply having in your head that it's bad for you. We're bombarded by so much information daily that it takes more than simply knowing something to have it affect your life.

I personally don't believe that being bombarded by so much crap information is healthy for anyone. For most adults I'd wager that, assuming they are sound of mind, they can take that with no ill affect. Children however know nothing, their environment has the most affect on them and the two biggest influence in most children's lives now adays it seems is the Education system and the media. Neither of which I think should have much influence on a child outside of skills and consumer awareness.

I don't about you, but I was brought up to be a monkey of consumerism and reinventing myself is quite energy consuming, I can't just up and change myself, my environment as a child was so riddled with horseshit that any good information about how to live had it's meaning perverted to suit the purposes of what I was being raised to be, a monkey of the US brand of rampant consumerism.

"Hah" indeed Mr. Aroe, "hah", indeed.



One thing I'd say is a great issue for society is the public education system, school was usually the least mentally stimulating activity I had all day. It quite literally had a negative affect on me overall, and up till 6th grade I was teaching myself probably about 3x times the amount of junk they taught us in roughly an hour a day of personal studies, most of high school was a refresher, the schools I went to were pathetic and most of the people knew considered them the standard, and feeling the standards were too high, generally fell a bit below what was expected.

powerclown

I, as an obese American lemming who loves to eat and whose mind has long ago been taken over by corporate advertising gamma rays via the delivery sytem known as TV, resent the fact that anyone else should tell me what I shouldn't eat, and that its wrong to eat at McDonalds or White Castle or Subway. In case anyones never been there, Burger King makes a damn tasty double cheeseburger that I hope to enjoy til the day I die.

And speaking of dying, so what if I die from heart disease, its a reasonably acceptable way to kick off as far as Im concerned. I'd rather die from clogged arteries than drown or get shot or get hit by a drunk driver or get a brain aneurysm. I don't understand this institutional concern over obesity, seems like yet another way for somebody already rich to get even richer.

Leave the fat people alone. Go pick on the skinny people. I can't stand bony girls with no ass. And to those fat people looking to make a buck by suing the advertising industry, just stop, you fools. This is America, built on entreprenuership. Find another way to make a buck.

The day I want to lose the fat, I'll know what to do. Until then: GIMME A CHEESEBURGER, DAMMITT!!

kutulu

As long as you are comfortable with yourself that's cool with me. I have to disagree with you on the BK double cheeseburger though. Whenever I eat that, my burps taste like BK for the rest of the day. I've completely stopped eating there because it grosses me out so much.

For the most part though people should be more healthy. We should start with our children by instilling good health knowledge at young ages. Once they are adults they can do whatever they want but they should at least have the chance to live a healthy lifestyle.

ironman

AMEN!!!!

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Cowman

Sorry my post wasn't specifically directed as you, as I have no idea what your situation is

I was just saying that, in general, a lot of north americans have it drilled in their head that cooking is healthy, so no matter what they eat at home its going to be good for them. As a result, many eat way too big portions and fill their foods with buttery, oily shit that keeps them overweight. Yeah, its better then fastfood, much better then fastfood, but as you get older and your metabolism slows down..its going to start taking a toll.

Someone mentioned earlier about "adding 10 years to your life"...well for me, it's not that I want to add 10 years to my life, but that I want to make the last 10 years of my life that much more enjoyable....I don't want to be sitting around in a room dependant on others to serve my fucked up body...

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lefty8080

This type of thinking is very dangerous. As long as we ask the government to legislate our problems away we will continue to give our freedoms away. This is a very serious problem and a sign of an even bigger one. In a free market WE HAVE THE CONTROL. If we don't like the unfair advertising practices we can not buy the product, not watch the TV station, not buy the magazine and make sure we get others to do the same. As long as we BELIEVE this does no good and we don't have any power we won't have any. Once we start asking the government to regulate markets for our own good we have opened a dangerous and scary door. Next thing you know nightclubs are bad for you so we will shut them down, or driving is too dangerous so we will make everyone ride public transit. Living in a free society means there will be some things we need to take care of ourselves. I think we need to find a way to deal with this advertising and the image they are putting in our minds, but it should not be through legislation; once the government is involved you have a real mess. If these companies are spending millions on advertising what makes you think they won't spend millions on elected officials to get their commercials approved. Then you have people thinking they are protected and they are not. Any type of media can be resisted if need be. If people stop watching stations that run questionable advertising it will change. If we learn to use our power of the free market we as consumers will have an enormous amount of control. With the internet growing as fast as it is I would think this type of control is more realistic that ever. The biggest crime against our society is the fact we have been convinced we have no influence in a free market, people have bought that line and we are suffering because of it. JMO

ARTelevision

It is equally dangerous to believe that human beings are super-endowed with awesome and impenetrable will power.

It may well be seen as simply our hubris - that is, our inability to comprehend the relative helplessness of the individual against the collected might of billions of dollars of corporate research into the most sophisticated and advanced manipulation apparatus ever imagined by mankind - that was responsible for the blind unwillingness to stem the causes of our ultimate downfall.

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lefty8080

Asking people to be more responsible for their own lives may not help them, but neither is asking them to become professional victims. I can't believe people let themselves be belittled with this trash. In essence what is being said is "here, you can't take care of yourself so let me do it". If that isn't control of another person I don't know what is. This country is full of sheep, because people let self important snobs control them. You are complaining about the corporations using mind control, at least their mind control is not in form of legislation, if you had your way a LAW would tell me what I can and cannot watch. If you want this kind of control please move to Europe, leave us FREE AMERICANS to make our own decisions, a right our fore fathers died for. I am fat and it has nothing to do with advertising or “mind control”. It has everything to do with liking to eat and making poor choices when I do. The weight I have lost has been from making better food decisions and exercise, which is the ONLY thing that will make ME loose weight. Quit looking at us poor helpless victims that are brainwashed by the big nasty corporations. It will not help me and it will insult me. I am a free American and I don’t need some pompous leaf eater turning me into a victim. I am more that capable of turning off the TV (and pretty much have done that.) We are doomed as a free society if we let well intentioned, misinformed snobs take our freedoms away. If you are one of the brainwashed and you are speaking from experience I am sorry for that, but don't try to take our freedoms away because you are weak. If you are not one of the brainwashed get over your arrogance, and let people live THEIR life as they see fit.

ARTelevision

Yes. It is clear that you have strong feelings about the subject. It is best to address the subject in less emotional ways. Please take a step back and count to ten before you post again. I am expressing a set of ideas in a reasonable manner. You are requested to do the same.

I trust you will consider this public request.

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powerclown

Once upon a time, we used to shoot the shit about starting up a chain of health-food drive-thru restaurants. Just like McDonalds, but instead you could order low-fat sandwiches, fruit, yogurt, bran muffins, just healthy foods. I know this isn't an original idea, but I also wonder why there aren't chains of "fast health-food" places around the world also.

Asuka{eve}

If I was what I ate. Then I would be a Subway sandwich.

Trisk

Well there's this really good fast food(ish) place in California (and a few in MD) that are really good and pretty healthy. I really want to see them spread out.
Baja Fresh

I think it would be good to get more healthy chains out there but, in a free market, companies aren't able to survive and expand without a good amount of demand. ANd right now...I'm not sure how much demand they'll get in much of America. However....this dieting fad America is on right now is slowly changing a lot of normal fast food places. At least they offer salads now...which is a change. Perhaps if we keep this up, they'll keep offering healthier and healthier foods

Cowman

Simple. Most "real" or "healthy" foods rot. What are you going to do, freeze a shitload of bran-muffins and then microwave them when they want to be served?

I mean, ya, there probably IS a way you could work around it..but it would be so expensive to the customer, and at such a smaller profit to the owner, that *most* people wouldn't go for it.



ps. Yes, places like Tim Hortons(here in Canada), etc serve up Bran-muffins and the like, but take a look at the nutritional info sometime....they cut corners to preserve costs.

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Arroe

I am really perplexed (sp?) by how people are "brainwashed" by commercials. I hate commercials. I change the channel during commercials, TV and Radio.

There are PLENTY of people in America who are not fat, and who are resposible enough to control what they eat. When I look in the fridge for something to eat at night, and I already had a bowl of icecream earlier that afternoon, I'll make a turkey sandwich or something a little more healthy to snack on. McDonalds can fit into a healthy diet with moderation. Eatting fast food 2 or 3 times a month will not kill you or make you fat, if you are responsible in what else you eat.

I also don't buy the arguement concerning costs of healthy foods compared to fast food. Go into the grocery store and you can buy fruits, vegatables, chicken, beef, whatever, and make a meal to feed 4 people for the price of 1 person's meal at McDonalds. Meats are healthy anyway, and don't always lead to clogged arteries.

I know some people might not believe this, but for my brother and I, we could really care less about losing wieght and are trying to GAIN wieght all the time. We drink protein shakes with 2000 calories for desert. My brother is a football player and I work out for an hour 5 days a week. An hour a day of intense physical activity is not much, it makes you feel better about yourself, and it also allows you to not have to starve yourself. Maybe exercise is what these weak-willed people need; they will feel more confident (the body releases adreneline and other chemicals to give a natural high), and they will still be able to eat their burgers and not gain weight, even though they will probably soon stop eatting the burgers because they will be throwing up when they exercise.

ARTelevision

We are influenced by media. The only differences between possible points of view regarding this fact are a matter of degree.

There's an ongoing general discussion of the subject here:

http://www.tfproject.org/tfp/showthr...=&threadid=911

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Cynthetiq

You'll have to do better than just be marketed to...
link

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NoSoup

Originally Posted by Trisk

__________________________________________

**This is not meant to be a personal attack, just an example. If this is not appropriate, please remove it**

Trisk, do you see what the problem is now? You say that you haven't eaten at McDonalds or any similar place, then base your next comment on a resteraunt that obviously assumed their goal in marketing to you. Alright, so you haven't really been too influenced by fast food marketing. What type of shoes are you wearing? What kind of clothes? What car do you drive? What toilet paper do you buy?

Marketing certainly doesn't "Control your Mind" and force you to do whatever the commercial is you're watching, but it certainly does have an influence on you. You have proved that it does, regardless of all actual facts, in your previous posts. Simply because you aren't as affected by certain advertisements doesn't mean others aren't either. Your very ignorance as to the actual "healthiness" of the food chain you had mentioned illustrates my point very well. You can walk around thinking that you haven't been affected by all this advertising, believing that it is simply willpower and that YOU can't be herded around and manipulated like the rest of America - while wearing your Nikes, driving your Lexus, buying Charmin and eating "healthy" fast food. Everyone else feels the same way.

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raeanna74

It is a constant daily battle to ignore advertizing. Especially with my daughter. She sees friends wearing things or playing with things that they saw on TV and decided was "COOL". She sees things inbetween her shows that make her want more stuff. I go to the store and the encaps and racks beside the cash register have the flashiest kid appealing things. It's a battle with her to just get out the door without spending practically hundreds of dollars for this "HOT" item or that "NEW" thing.

I also struggle to ignore it. I go out on a hot day walk into the store and see a picture of a sexy chick drinking a COLD soda. At least subconsciously I want that soda whether I succumb or not. It would be nice to not have that battle with myself and my daughter daily.

Most of the time I can resist. Part of the reason I'm a SAHM and do daycare in my home is so that I can fix our meals. Yeah I might fix something oily but will my portions be as big as the restaurant?? I can put it in the fridge right away before it gets stale or goes bad. I do rarely use butter or oil in my cooking unless I absolutely have to. I have come up with a way of making gravy with no oil whatsoever and hubby doesn't even notice. I use spices and herbs to flavor things instead of relying on fat to make things rich. I bake a lot of my own cookies and things using more whole grains and fewer empty calories. I never make my daughter finish what she is served even if I've paid for it at the store. I will ask that she TRY a bite of each thing but that is only to widen her tastes and teach her to enjoy more healthy foods. Most of the time if we go to get fast food I'll either buy her and myself a kids meal to share or I'll get one for each of us. I always promise myself that "If I'm still hungry I can go get more to eat." I'm never still hungry. I'm not tempted to finish the last of those fries because I paid for them because there aren't any last fries. I walk out satisfied and not stuffed. Part of it is a matter of deciding BEFORE you go to the store or the restaurant decide what you're going to eat. BEFORE you're exposed to the deluge of advertizing on the shelfs or specials in the menu. I find when I make my grocery list and promise myself to get only that, that I tend to buy possibly $20-$30 less in groceries each week. I also don't find that stuff is left over or unused for weeks at a time. I buy what I need. A lot of it is planning. Plan what you're going to eat for supper and you won't be snacking as much, you'll be looking forward to supper.

People today are rushed, buy on impulse, and consequently succumb to advertizing more often than they themselves would like to admit.

One thing I learned as a preteen from my mother was "If you see something in the store that you want, walk away, go home, and if you still want it next time you go to the store, then get it." Most of the time you'll find that you realize you don't really need it or want it. Impulse buying is what advertizing relies on. If you PLAN buy, you won't succumb as much.

Hubby and I also have canceled our credit cards completely and we never take our checkbook anywhere unless we absolutely have to. We pay our bills in person as often as we can and we usually only end up writing one check a month. We put our money in a tin or box where we keep the cash. We take out only what we plan to use at the grocery, store, or restaurant. Then we're limiting ourselves to begin with. We CAN'T succumb to the temptation. We've only learned this method in the past few years. It works great and we rarely feel like we're going without.

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Cynthetiq

that's great advice. I do that to and I do something along those lines as well...for *any* large purchase

If it's over $100 there is a 24 hour cooling off period before buying or signing on the dotted line.

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kutulu

Exactly. However, Chipotle's ingredients aren't the problem. The problem there is the portion size. When I eat there, a burrito is a minimum of two meals. I'll get the steak burrito and add lettuce, salsa, and cheese. If you split that over two meals, a total of around 1000 calories and 12 grams of saturated fat isn't that bad (especially since I only eat two meals a day). I don't see how people can eat those burritos in one sitting.

Cynthetiq's article is a bit misleading though. For an effect, the article has the calorie content and fat increase with each burrito by adding more ingredients. At Chipotle they make it for you at a counter. You tell them what you want and they put it in there. You can add the things that really boost the fat and calories (cheese, sour cream, guagamole) or you can leave them out. You can also ask for less beans, rice, or meat (or none at all).

Basically it is a combination of meat plus beans and/or rice. They should have presented it in that fashion and then tell you what each extra item adds to the overall fat and calorie content.

Imagine that, an article about deceptive marketting using deceptive journalism...

edit
I was just looking at the pasted portion of the article. The link is a little better. There is also a pdf link on that page that has a much better breakdown of Chipolte, Baja Fresh, Rubios, and La Salsa. I was really surprised that Rubios and Baja Fresh did so well. They both had a lot of recommended items.

lefty8080

The idea that people are not smart enough to take control of their lives and not be controlled by advertising is absurd. It serves, one purpose, and that is to convince people they need the government to control their lives, as they aren’t smart enough to do so.

Our fore fathers did not believe in an elitist society. That is why they felt “..all men are created equal..” Even if it is for their protection, our fore fathers believed one person should not make decisions for another. Our Constitution protects our freedom of speech, there is no footnote saying “unless someone thinks it’s bad for society”. I agree advertising has gotten out of hand, but treating the public like substandard individuals, powerless against the evil empire is not the solution. If we can teach people to take control in their lives, we not only fix the advertising problem, but give the individuals the tools to solve other problems in their lives.

So long as we are told over and over we have no power against this vicious advertising demon we have no hope of control. As any sports coach will tell you, you cannot motivate a team to win by telling them they can’t do it. When faced with a constant “you can’t do it” message, chances are you can’t.

This thread made me think of an old friend. I have not seen her in about 15 years, but I know where she would stand on this issue. My sister ran into her a while back, she is teaching in an urban area of a major city. She stated the kids she was teaching would never have what she does, and she thought this was sad. I did indeed think this was sad. It is sad that their teacher is helping convince them they are victims and have no choices in life. It is sad that she doesn’t even realize she will be aiding this fact by her supremist attitude. I know she doesn’t realize that she is looking down on these kids and classifying them as less than equal to others.

Please don’t insult me and others by telling us we aren’t smart enough, or strong enough to overcome advertising we can chose to ignore and dismiss as irrelevant.

Cowman

From the sounds of it, you've got an extremely fast metabolism that most of us are not blessed with. If I, for example, ate a 2000 calorie shake, the majority of it would quickly be turned to fat. My body simply doesn't process food as quickly as yours.

So, I don't think its really fair to be using yourself and your brothers example and say others are weak willed because they're not in shape like you and your bro.. for some of us, Mcdonalds once or twice a month IS too much, and moderation means *never* eating it.

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Cynthetiq

If that was the case then people wouldn't be consuming the following products:

veal (based on the unethical way the animal is raised)
SUV's (in light of the gas situation and eco impact)
Von Dutch Apparel (based on a racist alcoholic)
smoking (based on the number of deaths and warnings on cigarettes)

and if you read history books and understand how they did setup the land you'll know that they did set up the country as ELITIST...

only LANDOWNERS could vote... that's a class division right there.

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ARTelevision

lefty8080, no one is insulting you.
You are taking a general statement, that has it's own reason for being, personally. I'm responsible for exactly what I say - not for how you may incorrectly interpret it.

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kutulu

That is a very good point.

A lot of frightening things could happen if we start delegating our competence at deciding what we are capable of to the government.

lefty8080

Just a couple quick questions , How far do you live from where you work?
What kind of car do you drive?

Trisk

Cynthetiq/NoSoup....you do realize that companies like Baja Fresh can be bought out? Only a year or two ago, they were a their own company, only in California. When the dieting fad started sweeping America, Wendy's bought them out because they thought a healthy chain might help them gain money...plus, a chain like Wendy's had pretty much spread out as much as it was going to. A budding chain is always good for more business.
In the article you posted, they're trying to say it's unhealthy IF YOU ORDER A QUESADILLA! Do you *know* what a quesadilla is? It's a piece of pita bread stuffed with cheese. OF COURSE that's going to be unhealthy - no matter where you get it. Hell, Subway says they're healthy but if you walk in and get a steak and cheese sandwhich, you know you're doing something wrong.
HOWEVER, did you take a look at the specials? 300-600 calories? That's not bad. AT ALL. I am not ignorant to the healthiness of the chain. But at least it's possible to order FRESH, healthy food there IF THAT'S WHAT YOU WANT.

As for what NoSoup said....actually, since Baja Fresh is predominantely in California and I've never been to California (as a matter of fact, I live on the opposite coast), I'd have to say that no, I haven't had Baja Fresh marketted to me. As a matter of fact, I never even HEARD of it until I was driving around in Maryland and saw it. And no, I would hardly put it in the same league as McDonalds. McDonalds goes with Burger King, Taco Bell, Wendy's and other stuff. At places like McDonalds, most of their food is cooked and frozen in liquid nitrogen and shipped from a factory to the resturaunts, where it sits on a hot surface on the side. When you order, they plop your heated stuff in a bag and that's that.
At Baja Fresh, all of their food is fresh - made that day. Even the salsa. I'm not just buying into marketting when I say that because if you've ever had tomato salsa, you can tell the difference between "just made" and "5 days old". They have an open kitchen there that you can SEE when you walk in. WHen you order, they go to the kitchen and cook it right there in front of you. Have you ever seen McDonalds or another fast food place do this? If you go to the site, they have all their nutrition info there. If you care to check it out, you'll see that it's not that bad.

I'm not trying to say that the media or society has absolutely NO INFLUENCE on me. I *will* buy a brand name shoe over a no-name shoe, simply because I know the name. BUT, if I don't like a New Balance shoe, for example, I'm not going to buy it because their commercial was just SO DAMNED GOOD. There's a difference between influence and MIND CONTROL.

And...at the end of the day, yes, I will take my friend's word over that of the television. I mean, the television tells you to buy about 20 different kinds of shampoos/cars all the time. Does that mean I'm going to buy all 20 of those shampoos/cars? No. But if I'm with my friend and she says "Wow XYZ shampoo smells soooo good and it made my hair so silky smooth!" I might be like "hmm maybe I'll try XYZ shampoo."

And I will take common sense over that of the television. Just because, let's say, I see a commercial for Kentucky Fried Chicken saying they're healthy because they're good for Atkins, doesn't mean I'm going to run to KFC and start buying FRIED chicken. That's just not how things work. YOu have to use a teensy bit of common sense now and then if you want to get by in the world.

To me, it takes absolutely no willpower to pass by McDonalds or Niketown or some other big name store and not buy anything. Yes, I've seen the McDonalds commercials tons of times and...actually...McDonalds *still* disgusts me. All advertisements do is let the name be known to me. I never find my feet walking to the store to buy brand name stuff after commercials. And, considering that 90% of the stuff in America *has* been advertisted somewhere, I think I can safely say that buying a brand name shoe doesn't mean you are brainwashed and just being herded around like cattle.

powerclown

But, why?

kutulu

DIY, the PETArds were trying to sue KFC for that ad? That organization is so pathetic.

ARTelevision

powerclown, simply because they are harmful to children.

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brianna

claiming you are completely unaffected by advertisements is naive. no one consciously buys things based on a commercial. advertisements affect our subconscious, esp when the're directed at children for long periods of time. when we see something advertised repeatedly our subconscious mind internalizes that image and it leads to name recognition and us buying more of the product often without the consumer being aware of how his/her mind made the choice to buy the advertised product. If everyone in society were more aware of how advertising works and how to resist it this would not be much of a problem but that is hardly the case esp when children are concerned.

kutulu

I thought parents had authority of their children.

raeanna74

I hate this part of marketing. I hate where they are targeting our children. They're using our children against us.

And yes we have authority over our children. The ability and responsibility to say no when something wouldn't be good for them. We want them to be happy and when they want something VERY badly because it's flashy or they've seen the commercials and think it's cool or tastes good we would LIKE to get it for them because it would make them TEMPORARILY happy. Many parents do this too. I have done this on occaision. I try not to make a habit of it though. It's a battle that I would rather not have to fight. Why should I have to fight it? In short it causes family conflict - Not what I would consider good for America.

What gets me the worst is when I see advertizing for things that just aren't kid appropriate on the cartoon channels for Nickelodian and things. At times when the elementary kids are just getting home from school and are all begging to watch TV. A couple months ago and once again in the past month or so I've seen commercials for CONDOMS. I realize that sex isn't a bad thing but what parent wants their 4 yr old coming to them talking about freaking condoms?? This isn't sex Ed. They are directing brain washing at my kids and they get it all the time even if I turn off the TV. They get it filtered through their friends, at the store, walking down the isle, on the little TV's at Walmart (god I hate those), and on bilboards and posters and signs all over timbucktu. It's ridiculous. I think the choice of target audiences should at least be controlled. My kid has no idea yet that she's been "brainwashed" by the fancy music, pictures, colors and slogans of commercial America. I can't stop it completely. It would be nice to not have to deal with it quite so much. Everyone's got some freaking agenda. Leave my kid out of it.

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kutulu

If you make a product for kids, who else are you going to market it to? The parents? Do the parents care that GI Joe has a kung fu grip or do the kids?

Say we regulate what can be advertised to kids. Who would be the authority for what is and isn't acceptable for kids? How can you be certain that their beliefs are considered extreme when compared to your beliefs? How can you be sure that they aren't taking kickbacks from the industry? What if you're a parent that would rather their 12 yr old used a condom instead of risking a pregnancy?

You have the power. If you have cable you can probably block the channel so that your kid can't even watch it.

Nazggul

It isn't about being blessed or not. You can control your metabolism by increasing your aerobic exercise. You will require more feul when you burn more energy.

To make the point that this is purely an over eating problem is to simplify a more complex issue. I also require an intake of 2.5K to 3K calorie diet. This is because I work out very often (Training for IM distance Tri's). I can eat those burritos in one sitting easily and then be hungry again within a few hours.

The only reason I would use myself as an example here is because I eat what is required by my body, and not more. I choose quality food instead of the crap that many people choose (McDonalds's, HoHo's, Crispy Creams, etc.).

The fact that we see astronomical percentages of the population here in the states that are over weight says that there is a problem, that people do need to be told what to do. If you feel insulted by what Art is suggesting then you are ignoring the problem and you should open your eyes to other persepectives.

Would I rather have my tax dollars go toward avoiding a problem, or toward fixing the result of the problem. Which do you think will be more expensive?

Edit: Spelling

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powerclown

I could go on and on but in deference to artelevision - who started the thread - I won't.

Healthy kids are a good thing.

lefty8080

You believe the government should pass a law telling us what advertising we should be able to see and what food we can eat.



The reason is you believe the average person is not capable of making good decisions on their own because of the power of advertising.


You believe the government needs to protect us, for the good of society.


What did I misinterpret?

What we have here is a difference of opinion, I agree advertising has got out of hand, but I do not believe we should let the government make the decisions on what we can eat and what advertising we can watch.

I believe the average person does have the power to resist advertising, if they want.

When you shift responsibility you also give away rights, I do not feel we should give away anymore rights.


This will be my last post on this thread because obliviously neither of us will be swayed from our position.

Luckily we live in a free society where we can both express our opinions freely. Unless of course the arguments are so strong the average person can't resist them - then they can be deemed "bad for society" and outlawed - right Art?

ARTelevision

lefty8080, well stated.
Yes, that about sums it up.
And yes, we disagree.

Except for your final paragraph.
I don't grant you that.

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