Wolf ammo sucks - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Walt · 06-30-2011, 10:32 AM

I have never had a good experience with Wolf ammunition in an AR. It seems like every other round gets hung up and fails to feed or fails to extract. This happens regardless of the rifle, whether I run my gun with a normal amount of lube or if I run it wet, and regardless of the magazine used. As far as I can tell, all of this is due to the shitty rough finish of the zinc casings.

Just got back from a laid back range trip. While there, I let a friend feed my AR some of his new Wolf ammo (against my better judgement) and suffered a fairly inconvenient malfunction on the 2nd round. A round fired and failed to extract, seizing the bolt shut. I ejected the mag and gorilla gripped the charging handle (straight back - there was no torsion)....and broke off the charging handle. The bolt remained stuck.

I had to remove the upper receiver, insert a small pry bar between the bolt carrier and receiver and whack it with a mallet to get the bolt open.

KirStang · 06-30-2011, 10:39 AM

Lol, well at least now your friend can upgrade to a big-latch charging handle.

It seems like other steel cased ammo, like Brown Bear isn't suffering from as many malfunctions?

samcol · 06-30-2011, 10:59 AM

my ak loves wolf ammo, but it loves pretty much anything.

KirStang · 06-30-2011, 12:12 PM

Are we going down this road? I guess we're going down this road.

:Starts masturbating furiously:

I believe the russian case design is more tapered, such that the rear is bigger than the front. Supposedly, this aids extraction. In contrast, the 5.56 rds are straighter walled, resulting in more failures to extract....

I try to avoid Wolf, although it's nearly half the price of decent cheap brass 5.56 (PMC and Centurion).

RogueGypsy · 06-30-2011, 12:28 PM

That's good to know about the AR and Wolf. My condolences to your charging handle.

Wolf is the only ammo I can get to fire worth spit for accuracy in my Mak90 and SKS. I've tried a few, Russian, Czech and Chinese surplus, what else is there?. Always end up going back to Wolf. Although I have to say, I've had the least trouble with the Chinese surplus, as far as miss fires and jambs go. It just patterns like a shot gun.

KirStang, I seem to recall from another thread, that you have a nice collection of SKS', what do you use for ammo in them?

.
..
.

KirStang · 06-30-2011, 12:48 PM

I'm sorry, I should have been more clear:

In my AR15s, I try to avoid steel case, and only use brass. However, I have heard that steel case Brown Bear works well in ARs. Plan9 uses Golden bear (brass plated steel case) and hasn't had any adverse effects, but that was in low round count, ideal shooting conditions.

In my AK and SKS, anything goes. Usually wolf. It's cheap and the AKs eat it up.

Walt: If you're looking for a fancy replacement CH:

The Bravo Company Charging Handles are the Heat. I fricken love them. It's much easier to get purchase on your charging handle compared to the GI nub.

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCMGU...ndle-s/123.htm

I've used my AR with the large CH for a while, and it works pretty well. Especially when playing with malfunction drills.

Plan9 · 06-30-2011, 12:56 PM

Did you let out a thunderous "WALT SMASH!" when you broke it? C'mon, you know you did. Beer on me.

...

I can't hear you over the sound of the thousands of rounds of Bear-brand ammo I've cycled through my M4.

Maybe, uh, "informal shooting" and "plenty of time" and "cleaning rod to tap stuck casing out" or something.

Bonus points for breaking the charging handle with your hands. That takes effort. Usually done with a boot.

I'm not trying to be a dick but the order of operations for a stuck casing should prevent a broken charging handle.

And, yeah, sure, it's easy for me to say. My scrawny ass can do pullups on a charging handle and not break it.

...

Damn, another Wolf ammo story that'll perpetuate the elitism at various forums. "I only shoot M855. Period."

Me? I don't use Wolf anymore. I prefer Barnaul Bear ammo. It's almost as cheap and has pretty good performance.

Got PMC / Lake City sitting around in ammo cans for when I need to impress someone but it does the same thing.

...

KirStang, he stated it was HIS rifle, and that his friend put the Wolf ammo through it. He broke his own blaster.

That and the only BCM charging handle worth buying is the "small" Mod 5. The rest are super retarded large.

KirStang · 06-30-2011, 01:14 PM

Shhhhh. I'm compensating with my large charging handle.

Walt. At least you know your extractor works...

RogueGypsy · 06-30-2011, 01:32 PM

Doh, my bad, it was Remy that has the 'drool all over' collection of Eastern Block weaponry.

..

.

ChrisJericho · 06-30-2011, 01:46 PM

Have you guys tried Silver Bear? I noticed at many online stores it's just 1 or 2 cents more expensive per round than brown bear/wolf and supposedly the quality is much better due to the plating.

Kirstang I might get one of those charging handles. While fondling my AR alone in my bedroom late at night with elton john music playing, I notice how difficult it was to manipulate and I have just medium sized hands and I wasn't wearing any gloves. I was wondering why the part was designed so awkwardly and the little story on the BCM site shed some light on it.

Plan9 · 06-30-2011, 02:04 PM

Yes, Barnaul ammo is grood.

remy1492 · 06-30-2011, 02:36 PM

yeah, wolf is dirty and is slower in ARs. Its great for AKs but AKs eat anything anyways.

Two of my ARs jam in 30rds or less with a stuck case, guaranteed.
My other ARs shoot only brass NATO.

However, my buddy has a rock river that eats wolf all day long. go figure.
I would use it to plink wtih but not for zombie or defense.

My 5.45 S&W upper eats surplus ammo all day long, I am thinking it IS something to do with the US rifle beign designed for brass cases, because my US rifle designed for the 5.45 steel case also performs just fine.

The stuck cases in my ARs rendered them useless in the CA desert while out shooting, and not having a cleaning rod made them clubs. This is why ever since, I always carry the small GI cleaning rod section kit, while it eats bores and barrels if you use it too much, its a great tool to punch out stuck cases.

I may be moving to OH, NY or CA soon so we will see where I wind up, perhaps closer to some of youz. Need a blastin' buddy!

KirStang · 06-30-2011, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by remy1492

I may be moving to OH, NY or CA soon so we will see where I wind up, perhaps closer to some of youz. Need a blastin' buddy!

Oh noes. NOT NY or CA. Don't you know those states hate guns?

remy1492 · 06-30-2011, 10:30 PM

I know, what can I do, gotz ta go where the job is. Ohio looks promising and Aimsurplus is down the way so it will be good place to live with my classII stuff. Praying.

Got 1000lbs of ammo and 1000lbs of guns to move, no easy task.

Unless of course we shoot it all up first

Plan9 · 07-01-2011, 05:53 AM

What do you mean "we," white man with forked tongue? There is no such thing as a TFP gun guy meet-up. *SAD FACE*

"We" all live on opposite sides of the planet and have schedules that resemble something out of one of Homer's epics.

...

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChrisJericho

While fondling my AR alone in my bedroom late at night with elton john music playing...

I want to party with you.

Walt · 07-01-2011, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KirStang

The Bravo Company Charging Handles are the Heat. I fricken love them. It's much easier to get purchase on your charging handle compared to the GI nub.

99% of the folks I know rocking the tac latch charging handles love them. I stay away because for some reason, they tend to get hung up on my kit or whatever and will pull the bolt out of battery just enough so that I dont notice until it's time to pull the trigger. The GI charging handle works well enough for me, though its obviously no match for my retard strength.

Remember that old Army story about leaving a Private to guard a rock, a hammer and an 600 lbs anvil? Yeah, that was me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Plan9

Did you let out a thunderous "WALT SMASH!" when you broke it? C'mon, you know you did. Beer on me.

...

I can't hear you over the sound of the thousands of rounds of Bear-brand ammo I've cycled through my M4.

Maybe, uh, "informal shooting" and "plenty of time" and "cleaning rod to tap stuck casing out" or something.

Bonus points for breaking the charging handle with your hands. That takes effort. Usually done with a boot.

I'm not trying to be a dick but the order of operations for a stuck casing should prevent a broken charging handle.

Walt just pawn in game of life. I probably shouldn't have hulked out and smashed stuff, but I think breaking my rifle was for the best as it allowed me to justify my odd obsession of keeping extra parts for everything.

Quote:

Originally Posted by remy1492

yeah, wolf is dirty and is slower in ARs. Its great for AKs but AKs eat anything anyways.

Yeah, my AKM will eat Wolf all day like a fat girl at a Golden Corral. Then again, I'm pretty sure I could load Pez, small rocks and bits of pocket lint and the rifle would still go bang.

remy1492 · 07-01-2011, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walt

Yeah, my AKM will eat Wolf all day like a fat girl at a Golden Corral.

VERY true in Texas. I did not realize how big people here are, until I visited OH, where people seem to be normal sizes.

Plan9 · 07-02-2011, 09:05 AM

I love how the AK crowd completely derailed this thread. "But my AK..." STFU, Francis.

Quote:

Originally Posted by KirStang

but that was in low round count, ideal shooting conditions

600 rounds a day is low round count? Damn. Oh, my bad... you must be a M134 gunner.

Rumor has it that 600 rounds is three times the "universal basic load."

Even though grunts typically carry twice the UBL, let's be realistic.

rocnrich · 07-11-2011, 10:41 AM

FWIW I had a problem with Wolf not ejecting from my Bushmaster. Then I found a thin layer of buildup underneath the spring loaded ejector paw, that I must have missed when I cleaned it last time. Since then I have cycled 500+ more round with only one stove pipe jam. Not a bad percentage. Give a look see under that extractor (located on the bolt) and I would bet you'll be lovin' that cheap wolf ammo again.

Plan9 · 07-11-2011, 11:05 AM

This thread has made it clear that Walt is incapable of cleaning his bolt. He breaks all parts under eight ounces.

samcol · 07-13-2011, 09:09 PM

lol AR users have to clean their guns, mine just shoots

KirStang · 07-13-2011, 09:23 PM

Yea. Cuz AKs never jam or need cleaning.

‪AR vs. AK dirt/dust test‬&rlm; - YouTube

samcol · 07-14-2011, 04:28 AM

That's not even typical of the ak's and ar's I've seen. I've never thrown dirt on them like that but the ak's are much less finicky and everyone knows it.

Plus that's a 74 which isn't even the original platform.

Plan9 · 07-14-2011, 07:46 AM

Up in the mornin'... all day...

Samcol be trollin'... no way...

Walt · 07-14-2011, 08:58 PM

Eh. I've spent enough time working with AR's to know a little bit about what it takes to keep them running properly. There's "good enough" cleaning as in good enough to bet my life on it working in a war-time environment. And there's "gun safe" clean for when you have time to clean, soak to remove brazed copper and carbon from the steel pores, re-clean and lubricate your rifle. I make it a point to keep personal AR's "gun safe" clean, to the point of buying a special tool to scrape carbon off of the inside of a bolt carrier and then taking a dremel brass brush to the ass end of the bolt. Because fuck nonmetallic/tetravalent elements, that's why.

If my rifle won't run; it's not for lack of cleaning.

Plan9 · 07-14-2011, 09:07 PM

Posts his trollin' too damn soon...

Be trollin' another thread... by noon.

/don't be fallin' into AR/AK trollin'

...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Walt

If my rifle won't run, it's not for lack of cleaning.

Yeah, it's because you snapped it in half. Starting to think the smallest gun you can handle safely is a 75mm field piece.

...

That's funny, Walt. I've got a Bolt / Carrier scraper tool as well. Great gadget; works really well. I thought I was the only nerd that liked them.

My new blaster has Fail Zero on it and it seriously speeds up the cleaning time. Shit just wipes off. I'm sold so far. Needs 10k rounds through it.

ChrisJericho · 07-15-2011, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by samcol

That's not even typical of the ak's and ar's I've seen. I've never thrown dirt on them like that but the ak's are much less finicky and everyone knows it.

Plus that's a 74 which isn't even the original platform.

Yeah plus the ar's 5.56 round doesn't do any damage to people, real men use 30 cal's.

06-30-2011, 10:59 AM	#3 (permalink)
samcol Junkie Location: Indiana	my ak loves wolf ammo, but it loves pretty much anything. __________________ It's time for the president to hand over his nobel peace prize.

06-30-2011, 12:28 PM	#5 (permalink)
RogueGypsy Insane Location: The Great NorthWet	That's good to know about the AR and Wolf. My condolences to your charging handle. Wolf is the only ammo I can get to fire worth spit for accuracy in my Mak90 and SKS. I've tried a few, Russian, Czech and Chinese surplus, what else is there?. Always end up going back to Wolf. Although I have to say, I've had the least trouble with the Chinese surplus, as far as miss fires and jambs go. It just patterns like a shot gun. KirStang, I seem to recall from another thread, that you have a nice collection of SKS', what do you use for ammo in them? . .. . __________________ Methods, application and intensity of application vary by the individual. All legal wavers must be signed before 'treatment' begins. Self 'Medicating' is not recommend. However, if necessary, it is best to have an 'assistant' or 'soft landing zone' nearby. Any and all legal issues resulting from improperly applied techniques should be forwarded to: Dewy, Cheatum & Howe, Intercourse, PA 17534. Attn: Anonymous.

06-30-2011, 12:56 PM	#7 (permalink)
Plan9 I Confess a Shiver	Did you let out a thunderous "WALT SMASH!" when you broke it? C'mon, you know you did. Beer on me. ... I can't hear you over the sound of the thousands of rounds of Bear-brand ammo I've cycled through my M4. Maybe, uh, "informal shooting" and "plenty of time" and "cleaning rod to tap stuck casing out" or something. Bonus points for breaking the charging handle with your hands. That takes effort. Usually done with a boot. I'm not trying to be a dick but the order of operations for a stuck casing should prevent a broken charging handle. And, yeah, sure, it's easy for me to say. My scrawny ass can do pullups on a charging handle and not break it. ... Damn, another Wolf ammo story that'll perpetuate the elitism at various forums. "I only shoot M855. Period." Me? I don't use Wolf anymore. I prefer Barnaul Bear ammo. It's almost as cheap and has pretty good performance. Got PMC / Lake City sitting around in ammo cans for when I need to impress someone but it does the same thing. ... KirStang, he stated it was HIS rifle, and that his friend put the Wolf ammo through it. He broke his own blaster. That and the only BCM charging handle worth buying is the "small" Mod 5. The rest are super retarded large. __________________ *Whatever you can carry.* "You should not drink... and bake." Last edited by Plan9; 06-30-2011 at 01:19 PM..

06-30-2011, 01:32 PM	#9 (permalink)
RogueGypsy Insane Location: The Great NorthWet	Doh, my bad, it was Remy that has the 'drool all over' collection of Eastern Block weaponry. .. . __________________ Methods, application and intensity of application vary by the individual. All legal wavers must be signed before 'treatment' begins. Self 'Medicating' is not recommend. However, if necessary, it is best to have an 'assistant' or 'soft landing zone' nearby. Any and all legal issues resulting from improperly applied techniques should be forwarded to: Dewy, Cheatum & Howe, Intercourse, PA 17534. Attn: Anonymous.

06-30-2011, 01:46 PM	#10 (permalink)
ChrisJericho eat more fruit Location: Seattle	Have you guys tried Silver Bear? I noticed at many online stores it's just 1 or 2 cents more expensive per round than brown bear/wolf and supposedly the quality is much better due to the plating. Kirstang I might get one of those charging handles. While fondling my AR alone in my bedroom late at night with elton john music playing, I notice how difficult it was to manipulate and I have just medium sized hands and I wasn't wearing any gloves. I was wondering why the part was designed so awkwardly and the little story on the BCM site shed some light on it. __________________ "A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows us that faith proves nothing." - Friedrich Nietzsche

06-30-2011, 02:04 PM	#11 (permalink)
Plan9 I Confess a Shiver	Yes, Barnaul ammo is grood. __________________ *Whatever you can carry.* "You should not drink... and bake."

06-30-2011, 02:36 PM	#12 (permalink)
remy1492 Crazy Location: CA TX LU	yeah, wolf is dirty and is slower in ARs. Its great for AKs but AKs eat anything anyways. Two of my ARs jam in 30rds or less with a stuck case, guaranteed. My other ARs shoot only brass NATO. However, my buddy has a rock river that eats wolf all day long. go figure. I would use it to plink wtih but not for zombie or defense. My 5.45 S&W upper eats surplus ammo all day long, I am thinking it IS something to do with the US rifle beign designed for brass cases, because my US rifle designed for the 5.45 steel case also performs just fine. The stuck cases in my ARs rendered them useless in the CA desert while out shooting, and not having a cleaning rod made them clubs. This is why ever since, I always carry the small GI cleaning rod section kit, while it eats bores and barrels if you use it too much, its a great tool to punch out stuck cases. I may be moving to OH, NY or CA soon so we will see where I wind up, perhaps closer to some of youz. Need a blastin' buddy!

06-30-2011, 10:30 PM	#14 (permalink)
remy1492 Crazy Location: CA TX LU	I know, what can I do, gotz ta go where the job is. Ohio looks promising and Aimsurplus is down the way so it will be good place to live with my classII stuff. Praying. Got 1000lbs of ammo and 1000lbs of guns to move, no easy task. Unless of course we shoot it all up first

07-11-2011, 10:41 AM	#19 (permalink)
rocnrich Upright	Wolf 5.56 ammo. FWIW I had a problem with Wolf not ejecting from my Bushmaster. Then I found a thin layer of buildup underneath the spring loaded ejector paw, that I must have missed when I cleaned it last time. Since then I have cycled 500+ more round with only one stove pipe jam. Not a bad percentage. Give a look see under that extractor (located on the bolt) and I would bet you'll be lovin' that cheap wolf ammo again.

07-11-2011, 11:05 AM	#20 (permalink)
Plan9 I Confess a Shiver	This thread has made it clear that Walt is incapable of cleaning his bolt. He breaks all parts under eight ounces. __________________ *Whatever you can carry.* "You should not drink... and bake."

07-13-2011, 09:09 PM	#21 (permalink)
samcol Junkie Location: Indiana	lol AR users have to clean their guns, mine just shoots __________________ It's time for the president to hand over his nobel peace prize.

07-14-2011, 04:28 AM	#23 (permalink)
samcol Junkie Location: Indiana	That's not even typical of the ak's and ar's I've seen. I've never thrown dirt on them like that but the ak's are much less finicky and everyone knows it. Plus that's a 74 which isn't even the original platform. __________________ It's time for the president to hand over his nobel peace prize.

07-14-2011, 07:46 AM	#24 (permalink)
Plan9 I Confess a Shiver	Up in the mornin'... all day... Samcol be trollin'... no way... __________________ *Whatever you can carry.* "You should not drink... and bake."

07-14-2011, 08:58 PM	#25 (permalink)
Walt I'm calmer than you are, dude Location: North Carolina	Eh. I've spent enough time working with AR's to know a little bit about what it takes to keep them running properly. There's "good enough" cleaning as in good enough to bet my life on it working in a war-time environment. And there's "gun safe" clean for when you have time to clean, soak to remove brazed copper and carbon from the steel pores, re-clean and lubricate your rifle. I make it a point to keep personal AR's "gun safe" clean, to the point of buying a special tool to scrape carbon off of the inside of a bolt carrier and then taking a dremel brass brush to the ass end of the bolt. Because fuck nonmetallic/tetravalent elements, that's why. If my rifle won't run; it's not for lack of cleaning. __________________ Calmer than you are...