:::OshnSoul:::

For some reason all my life I have been drawn to the fascinations of science. Everything about it- from biology, to astronomy, to physics. It made me think- made me wonder....and *feel* of a lot more that was there or yet to be discovered. Things without words are the most powerful and truth-binding.

Scientists in the recent years have discovered how everything is made of energy. They have run into solid evidence with test upon test. To me, its a simple realization- energy binds, energy connects, energy moves, and it can be manipulated- but never destroyed. The faster it is moving, the more "solid" it becomes.
Energy can do and already DOES so much. It affects climates, moods, weather, and we can apply it to everything in existance. Driving, flying, walking, electricity, even thinking- yes, thinking.

And energy acts on how it is manipulated. And how is energy manipulated? By humans. We make electricity happen, we affect the climate with pollutants, we pick something up or move it, we can generate a thought and bring action from it.

All results are created by the generation of thought- which is the most powerful source of energy.

Can we see God as not a being, but a source? The source? That binds, connects, and moves, and manipulates? All because of us? Because we have the will of using it in any way?

Why do we beleive that God has to be A Form of Being.....when we could consider God as ALL forms of Being?

MageB420666

That's a very interesting way of looking at things, except that I got the impression from your post that you consider humans to be OUTSIDE of this system of energy.

And I would post further thoughts on this topics, but they're refusing to form correctly in my head.

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Apathy: The best outlook this side of I don't give a damn.

SERPENT7

Grand Unification Theory deals with this very issue. Some called it science, some call it religion disguised as math, but I simply call it ART.

d*d

I was onboard until I read that, thought as an energy process? maybe in relation to chemical processes in the brain, but it is by no way a source of energy in a scientific sense

Bill O'Rights

So...God would be like the ultimate electrical outlet?

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"I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires." - Susan B. Anthony

"Hedonism with rules isn't hedonism at all, it's the Republican party." - JumpinJesus

It is indisputable that true beauty lies within...but a nice rack sure doesn't hurt.

asaris

I don't know. For a variety of reasons, some personal and some philosophical, I have to think of God as a person (actually, for theological reasons, I have to think of Him as three persons, but that's neither here or there). Among other things, it doesn't seem to me like a non-personal deity would be worthy of worship.

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"Die Deutschen meinen, daß die Kraft sich in Härte und Grausamkeit offenbaren müsse, sie unterwerfen sich dann gerne und mit Bewunderung:[...]. Daß es Kraft giebt in der Milde und Stille, das glauben sie nicht leicht."

"The Germans believe that power must reveal itself in hardness and cruelty and then submit themselves gladly and with admiration[...]. They do not believe readily that there is power in meekness and calm."

-- Friedrich Nietzsche

nezmot

Quite. If He's the fabric that we're all made from and we're the cells within his body, so to speak - then he's not likely to care about any of us individually - and isn't that what God is there for? To provide comfort when there is none to be found anywhere else?

:::OshnSoul:::

I am intrigued by all of your responses.....

Mage- I was not referring to humans as outside of the system of energy as I said everything is made up of energy and that we can control its flow and movement.

Serpent- ART, yes, indeed. I do agree there. I think anything mysterious and beautiful is art.

d*d- the motion of our brain cells- in fact, the creation of brain cells, is formed by energy. The movement of chemicals, etc. how do you think it is all put into motion? How do you think it became in the first place?

Bill O'Rights- I like that.

asaris- you say that as if it is not chosen by you to believe that God is an Entity. You say you "have to" think....And do you beleive at all that there HAS to be something or someone to worship or is this what you were taught/told?

nezmot- let's think of it this way....it's not about not caring per say- but as we have heard God has given us the free will to choose. God gives us what we need and that is experience. If you look between the lines, you will see that God, life, energy, and free will all tie in together. God isn't motionless or emotionless- He moves with the movement of Us.

asaris

No, I mean given my assumptions about good and evil, I'm logically required to believe that God is a personal entity. For what it's worth, it's not just about giving comfort, like nezmot suggests. I believe that the evil in this world would be a great injustice if there were not a personal God to bring good out of it. I've never been able to explain myself on this point very clearly, I'm afraid.

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"Die Deutschen meinen, daß die Kraft sich in Härte und Grausamkeit offenbaren müsse, sie unterwerfen sich dann gerne und mit Bewunderung:[...]. Daß es Kraft giebt in der Milde und Stille, das glauben sie nicht leicht."

"The Germans believe that power must reveal itself in hardness and cruelty and then submit themselves gladly and with admiration[...]. They do not believe readily that there is power in meekness and calm."

-- Friedrich Nietzsche

Willravel

If were going that route, then I don't see it as much different than worshiping an animal or plant for giving it's life to feed you. If Gos is all things, then thanking him for existing and creating us would function to remind us how precious reality truely is. It is a matter of placing great significance on EVERYTHING.

Also, many religions say that a part of God or God him/herself exists inside of all people and all things. This would seemingly coincide with this theory, as matter and energy have a reationship (non-exculusive, last time I checked).

Nezmot, if we are all made up of parts of God, than wouldn't His concern for us also be his concern for Himself?

I'm going to go have some grapes knowing full well they may be a part of God.

nezmot

It all depends on what God is. Choose between:
a) Creator
b) Creation/The Universe/Everything
c) Protector/Guide
d) a combination of the above
e) or something else

Some people believe that the New Testament God is different from the Old testament God, others that the Old Testament God was *just* the creator, who was aware of Other Gods. ("Worship no other Gods but me.") but wanted Man to worship him. Others believe that He is all - or that He sees all - or that He knows all etc. I prefer to think of Him as someone who sees nothing, knows nothing, but cares a great deal about how we end up - at which point, He'll be very interested in finding out what we thought about the whole experience. It's important for us to keep Him in mind as we live our lives, because those thoughts will channel and guide our experience into something good.

If God doesn't care, then why do we pay so much attention to Him? He must care, that's his function - at least that's how I see Him.

cybersharp

That... was hilarious..

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0PtIcAl

d*d

Now thats a question, where did all the energy come from? that I cannot answer, I subscribe to the big bang theory but am open to suggestions, and I have no idea what all the energy in the universe was doing in an infinately small area in the first place.
I agree that it takes energy to form a brain cell, and to process a thought, what I took issue with was the statement that suggested it was also a powerful source of energy.

cellophanedeity

Oshn, I wrote a paper on pretty much what you're proposing a while ago. I lost it when my old computer died.

I think it's definitely a point worth considering, though, I've been searching for an appropriate word to use in place of "God" here.

asaris

I said that a non-personal God was not worth of worshipping, not that everything personal was worth worshipping. Moreover, it seems fairly clear that most (if not all) animals other than humans are not persons and that no plants are humans. It seems to me that only that being greater than which no being can be conceived is worthy of worship. Since it is better to be a person that to not be a person, that being must be a person.

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"Die Deutschen meinen, daß die Kraft sich in Härte und Grausamkeit offenbaren müsse, sie unterwerfen sich dann gerne und mit Bewunderung:[...]. Daß es Kraft giebt in der Milde und Stille, das glauben sie nicht leicht."

"The Germans believe that power must reveal itself in hardness and cruelty and then submit themselves gladly and with admiration[...]. They do not believe readily that there is power in meekness and calm."

-- Friedrich Nietzsche

Tashah

[bold empahsis added]

The bolded point above needs a bit of clarity. As Einstein noted in his famous equation (E=mc²), matter and energy are interchangeable. What is the underlying difference between the two then?

In essence, matter is simply frozen energy. Until about 300,000 years after the Big Bang, the universe was too hot, compact, and energetic to allow energy to transform into matter. As the universe expanded it also cooled, allowing less energetic and slower moving particles to bind together and form simple elements such as hydrogen, helium, lithium, and deuterium (heavy hydrogen). These initial bound elements are the foundation of all baryonic matter. One can also reverse this de-energizing process by simply re-energizing matter. Thus, one may say that matter is simply energy in its rest state.

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Suave

Oshn, read up on Buddhism. I think you'll find you agree with a lot of its perspectives. In fact, you quite nearly wrote one of the major principles down right there.

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"Few people are capable of expressing with equanimity opinions which differ from the prejudices of their social environment. Most people are even incapable of forming such opinions." - Albert Einstein

"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." - Plato