MuadDib

So a friend of mine recently acquired the password to his girlfriend's email account. The other night while we were out having a few drinks he devulged to me that he's started worrying that she seeing other men. He swears that he hasn't checked her account yet, but is seriously considering it. Long story short, I advised him not to, going along the lines that a relationship is made of trust and that if he went down that road than rather she was true to him or not he could never have the relationship with her that he wanted.

The point of this post is that the conversation got me to thinking; what is the value of trust? Hypothetically, if you could go throughout your entire life never trusting any one, but never having to, would you? That is to say, if you never had to have faith in any one because you always knew the truth, would you choose that option. On one hand, it isn't as though you are effecting the situation just by knowing the truth of the matter, but on the other hand, it seems to me that you lose something in not having to risk being hurt by others. Similarly, would you choose to be able to verify, after the fact, if you rightly put your trust in someone, where you otherwise would have spent the rest of your life not knowing.

Finally, would it make any difference if you could act on that knowledge? Hypothetically, say you could know any one's actions or motives, but you could never act on that knowledge or do anything to change the result. Would you want to be in that situation or would you be happier not knowing; even not knowing that you had been deceived.

I like to think that I have faith in people. More importantly, I like to think that there is value in having faith in people beyond the mere practicality of its consequences. However, I cannot deny that there is an inquisitory/voyeuristic desire in me to just know what is real. It was so easy to say from the outside that my friend should not check up on his girlfriend when he suspected she might be cheating, but now, after thinking about the whole trust thing, it's hard for me to put into words just why. Thoughts?

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"The courts that first rode the warhorse of virtual representation into battle on the res judicata front invested their steed with near-magical properties." ~27 F.3d 751

phathom

I would. I think that with my knowledge of social behaviors and psychology as well as my keen observation of how others behave around me, compared with my memory of previous actions and behaviors from the same or even other individuals, I feel as though I can see and figure out from all that data I gathered before, the true motives, actions, feeling behind something, etc of those individuals most of the time.

It'd be nice to have that all of the time without the headwork involved of trying to figure it out on your own.

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-snooch to the nooch

icevrething

I've found from experience that people can change in a blink of an eye. A best friend of mine whom I trusted for 9 years bailed on me after I finally stepped my foot down and demanded he start making payments back to the money I lent him in good faith. You never can tell in my opinion, because humans are adaptable and can be unpredictable. However, I still have faith in some people, like my family and best friend (who's like my brother). I'd like to give people the benefit of the doubt, but when trust is broken, you won't catch me gasping for air in surprise.

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Master_Shake

Love many, trust few. The highest priority in most people's life is him or herself. Understand that and you shouldn't have any problems knowing where you fit in.

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You know something, I don't think the sun even... exists... in this place. 'Cause I've been up for hours, and hours, and hours, and the night never ends here.

Plan9

Trust is totally an awesome Megadeth song and I had hoped that this thread might feature it. Oh well, it does now:


Trust... hmm. Trust. Has a weird texture to it, no?

Trust is all that Rick Astley superfeelgood pop spooge: I'm never gonna give you up, never gonna let you down.

I've done the blind tin soldier sucker routine with a number of people, especially women. And I've been knocked down by all sorts of blows... indecision, immaturity, infidelity, non-repayment (always a real cock-in-the-ear, never EVER lend money). Every time I get up a little slower and with a little more karate chop action. I've learned that the people you can really trust are the ones that don't ask questions and don't demand you answer them.

...

Regarding your question:

Don't violate the "trust" and privacy of the potential cheater. It not only goes against the professional ethics of broken-hearted Beta males everywhere, it just sets you up to do it again later.

If your buddy is worried about his girlfriend double-dippin', he needs to be assertive about it instead of being sneaky. Nobody likes the sin-for-a-sin routine. "You're cheating on me! I read those emails after stealing your password and violating your privacy!" You put yourself on their level and only give into the temptations that'll eat away at your soul later because you've set a new lower standard for yourself.

I've had numerous relationships where the woman just didn't understand privacy and tried to make me feel bad that they were, as Wayne Campbell so eloquently puts it, a "psycho hose beast."

Plus, it's easier to play the holier-than-thou card when you actually are. Hah, but don't take my word for it. I'm a sellout.

...

I worry that when I say "trust" I'm really saying, "Don't worry, I have an escape plan." That can't be healthy.

Real trust is something I've felt between my guy friends and I... army buddies and karate cronies. Trust is definitely different than romantic love, it's something that comes from real world stress tests. It is devoid of gender, age, pants size, bank account girth, etc. It cannot be manufactured. It can evaporate in seconds. It is valuable but not expensive and yet it doesn't come cheap.

What's that old saying?

"Friends will help you move a couch. Good friends will help you move a body."

I really believe that.

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Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

Xerxys

I trust no one!! No exceptions. Life is full of shit then you die. Everything is more simpler without the complications of trust.

Plan9

Xerxys... I trust you. To be sugared-up like a toddler with a bag of Pixie Stix.

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Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

snowy

Or how about, "A good friend will come bail you out of jail, but a true friend will be sitting next to you saying...'Damn, that was fun!'" I just like that quote...it doesn't really have anything to do with trust.

Crompsin summed up some of my thoughts on trust pretty well. While my trust in others has been tested and broken many times over the years, I've learned that it is a precious, precious thing to be trusted and to trust someone in return. If anything, my work with children has taught me that above all else. Children are given into my care, and their parents trust that I am able to take care of them and keep them safe. That is a serious level of trust.

The best trust is the kind that happens between two people over time, but that kind of trust is gained through shared experience. Trust is definitely different from romantic love, you're right on that score, Crompsie--but romantic love is soooo much better when there is that earned, developed trust in addition to the romantic love. It's like the hot fudge on my sundae. It takes a while to get there, though.

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If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

Xerxys

Pixie Sticks ... OMG, you know me so well!!!

Plan9

Sure it does. My good friends are my good friends because I trust them. I can have friends that I don't trust. Coworkers, acquaintances, random people I meet more than once... but there is no trust. I have Plan B fired up when I'm dealing with them so it won't be a huge shock if they decide to ditch me, stab me in the back, or eat my Lucky Charms. Good friends are a part of Plan B. I like to use the jail / body saying because I feel it is pertinent.

Who can you really count on in life? Those are the people you trust to the fullest extent of the word, second-guessin' semantics aside.

Pfft, romance is a diversion. I've never had a girlfriend that would help me move a body. I'll keep looking, though. She's out there, waiting for my weirdness.

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Whatever you can carry.

"You should not drink... and bake."

gardens

to the email, he should simply talk to her about it

to the idea of knowing I'd prefer to even if I can't do anything about it,

the thing about friends versus lovers is that one you should never have to worry about getting an STD from, so if you can't trust your lover then why are you with them

trusting your friends is good but how far does that go the whole moving the body thing is a little scary (how often do you need to do that?) as I'd always fear that 5 years down the line their "conscience" would get them (theres a reason I don't like people named Jiminy, and that extends beyond the cricket variety)

ametc

A few people know my pin number to my bank account and my password to my online bank account, but I don't worry. I trust them enough to not fuck me in the ass and steal my money.

I trust them because I know they trust me and there's a relationship between us where we're able to determine the most likely thing the other would choose to do.

In broad daylight in the middle of Downtown, I walk past a thuggish looking kid.. I trust him for that split moment because who the hell would mug me in broad daylight in the middle of Downtown where there are hundreds of people who could see? For that moment him and I have a relationship of trust. It wouldn't be the same in a dark alley... but that's the level of trust I have with that thuggish looking kid. I mean.. he COULD mug me right there in broad daylight.. but I trust he won't.

By knowing people (in different ways) and by guessing what they would choose to do, that creates trust.


It's alright to wonder if your partner is cheating on you because we've grown up being taught that cheating does happen... and it's created a fear in us. We become afraid of being unloved. It only becomes unhealthy in a relationship when the wondering turns into invading our partner's privacy or personal space. Couples have their own kind of personal space.. so it differs with everybody, but invading it will remain the same.

I trust my friends and family to my account numbers, but if they steal money from me, that trust will be gone because they'd have crossed the line into my own personal territory.

Turpis

real true trust i believe comes out of the opposite.

for example: my ace, my best friend (though i dont take friend to mean anything close to what I mean) we started out severely mistrusting each other in highschool. he dresses like what you might call a thug. I on the other hand am a long time metal fan. what we both have in common is our inability to take the BS of most people.

we slowly warmed up to each other smoking weed and combat training. he showed me how to be a true warrior and i introduced him to alot of culture(i mean this in the least offensive way possible, not to say he was uncultured that is) we realized that even though we sure as fuck didnt trust anybody else, there was no real reason not to trust each other.

now we run a very amateurish hip-hop operation. made some money from selling our beats and we have fun doing it.

of all the people other than my family i have ever met. this dude is the only person i will die and kill for, and i know he would do the same. I dont say that to seem tough( i would really really like to live to see an old age). but that is the extent of our trust.