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Old 09-30-2010, 09:59 AM   #1 (permalink)
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Vengefulness...??

While browsing this evening, I came across this:

Quote:
...maybe there's another reason we sometimes get into, or stay in, abusive relationships - a desire to beat the person at their own game, covertly. If your boyfriend or girlfriend is sometimes passive aggressively sneering at you or making backhanded comments, you sometimes feel the need to gather some dirt on them and then challenge them with everything they've ever said to you, and then overpower them. Sometimes you want to cut them back and then revel in delight at the expressions on their faces when you've made them think they were never in control of the situation to begin with.
I've done this a lot many times in the past, and can attest to the fact that such a act almost invariably backfires on the executor. While I'm a lot more thick-skinned now, I'd like to know your take on why such things don't usually work?

Is it because the person who (mistakenly) believes (s)he has been wronged spends too much time plotting, instead of using it more productively...??

Last edited by w4r10ck; 09-30-2010 at 10:10 AM..
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Old 09-30-2010, 10:15 AM   #2 (permalink)
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Hey, man... I haven't seen you in a while. Good to see you're still here.

...

As far as the thread? Those activities "don't work" because they're just plain childish. "Getting back at" or "getting even" with a partner in a dysfunctional relationship is a drama bomb head game and you shouldn't waste your time with those. Unless you're into BDSM.

If the only reason you're with somebody is a name-calling competition or to point out their failures and flaws, you need change it up. Get somebody new. Partners are supposed to build something together, not tear each other down or hold each other back from their goals.

Other popular head games include: "Am I as good as my partner's last significant other?" and "I'll never be the best person they've been with at X."

I can't find the link to it on TFP from when I posted it like 3+ years ago (holy shit, that long ago?), so I'll post it again.

You may find this pertinent:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Untouchable, a rant by Henry Rollins
Most of you have been through like... the relationship... ya know, you've gotten down with the boy or girl or whatever - rock, a table leg, or whatever... whatever your preference is... and you remember, of course... how the relationship... like, ya know... EERRRRRZZ... BAAAM! Ya know, and so number two comes around and you say to yourself: "Ah-ha! Well, I'm not going to do that, that, that, and that... 'cause I remember the last time I did those things - look where it got me."

So, relationship number five, a little bit more crafty: "Aaaah-well-hahahaha, I know now that when you say this, she thinks it means this, so if you want her to know that you mean that, you gotta say this."

Okay, relationship number fifty. Really crafty, really mean, you're like, ya know, like some god damn secret agent. Ya know, it's like emotional chess. Okay? It's like: "Well... so I can do this, this, and this... I'll say this, this, and this... so when I go out and do it she won't be able to say anything 'cause I've given her permission to go out and do this, this, and this at the start of the relationship. She can't use it against me in court." It just gets really ridiculous and you find that maybe you had a bad trip with someone else and you take it out on this innocent other person who comes walking down the pike. And this is this thing about that:

That feeling, that untouchable feeling. After you've been through a rough thing with someone else and somehow you managed to survive it and come out in one piece. Whole, but harder for it. That untouchable feeling, like no one is going to do that to you again and why don't they just try it and see how far it gets them. Ya might go as far to get yourself into another relationship and test yourself by seeing how cold and realistic you can be and how far you can go without feeling something, like some kind of messed up drinking contest where you down a gallon of whiskey and show off the fact that you're not drunk, that you can handle your booze, no sweat, that you can emotions, no sweat, that you can go almost all the way and pull out right before you start to feel.

What control you have, so proud of yourself, you tell yourself that you're really doing it right now. That this is good because you've got a grip on the whole thing and it's a good thing that you grew up in time before you wrecked yourself on some stupid relationship. You laugh at all the old things you used to do, a month ago, in the old days, before you got wise, before ya saw the light, before ya got hip to the fact that only way to enjoy someone's company is to enjoy yourself on their time. To be open about being closed, to be honest with yourself about lying to yourself, about using someone else's body to masturbate with instead of using your own, to come to the realization that the only way not to get hurt is to hurt somebody else and keep it that way.

And somehow you make it all right. You have a better understanding of yourself now and you've learned that it's okay to feel good, even if it's at someone else's expense. It's okay because now you are your own best friend. No one loves you like you do. You gotta look out for number one because that's the only one that matters. You! You tell yourself you've been through the wringer and you're smarter, stronger, and tougher now because of your trials, when really you are meaner, more petty and cruel than you've ever been and it doesn't matter who the next person is in your life, they aren't going to get away with what the last one did, and why not? Because you will get away with it first!
Nobody wants to be like that. That's just damage.

Last edited by Plan9; 09-30-2010 at 10:23 AM..
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Old 09-30-2010, 10:17 AM   #3 (permalink)
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What do you mean by "why such things don't usually work"? Do you mean why the promise of "delight" at getting back doesn't happen or doesn't last?

It's easy. Vengeance, anger, "getting even" are destructive both outwardly and inwardly. No true delight or happiness can arise from it. To think otherwise is to be delusional.

People are better off dealing with the anger rather than using it. I have yet to meet anybody who uses anger and happens to be a happy and balanced person in the long run.

Vengeance is a game. If you want to give into the whims of emotions, go ahead. I'd rather seek a better way to live my life.
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Old 09-30-2010, 10:31 AM   #4 (permalink)
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I think it's funny that Baraka and I were the first two that posted on this topic.

Personally, I had real problems in the past with, uh, bitterness management.
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Old 09-30-2010, 06:12 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Plan9 View Post
If the only reason you're with somebody is a name-calling competition or to point out their failures and flaws, you need change it up. Get somebody new. Partners are supposed to build something together, not tear each other down or hold each other back from their goals.
Plus one, Plan9.

I've known couples, some of them long time couples, that play this game and I've always wondered what they get out of it. In my world somebody might get away with that once. Okay, maybe more than once.
But pretty soon my question would change from "Why does he do that?" to "What the hell am I doing in a relationship with this jerk?"
And it's not enough that you want to be in a relationship with me. If I don't want a relationship with you, you're a history lesson!

Lindy
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Old 09-30-2010, 08:02 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Doesn't sound like a case to be in abusive relationships; sounds more like what happens in every relationship to some extent. If it's malicious then the relationship is breaking up, most of the times it's just jokingly and doesn't result in anything.
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