abaya

The short question: What kinds of things have you "quit" or bailed out on? How did you make the decision? Did you have any regrets afterwards, or was it a "never look back" type of thing?

For example, most people know when a person should be getting out of a bad relationship. We see it all the time on TFP... people who are on the edge of getting out of one, or freshly gotten out of one, but in the end, usually they feel like they've done the right thing. They know it was time to quit the relationship for X reasons, and most of us agree with them. Common sense or something. (Don't worry, I'm not talking about that situation for myself right now!) No one wishes they had stayed longer in a bad relationship, once they're out.

But what about other endeavors? When does it become okay to quit a job, or a committee, or a sports team that you play on, or bailing on a commitment to buy a house, or quitting a city because it makes you unhappy to live there? So many people advocate "hanging in there," but at some point, everyone either resolves the conflict and gets motivated to commit themselves again, or they hit a breaking point and decide to quit, cut their losses, move on. I'm curious about how people make those kinds of decisions... when does the goal stop being "to hang in there," and start being, "How the hell can I get out of this situation?"

----- The long part... (feel free to skim)

Me, I used to be a pretty good quitter when I was a kid. I took every kind of lesson possible (ballet, tap dancing, tennis, swimming, music, etc), and quit damn near all of them within a few years, max. I remember waking up one day before tap dancing lesson when I was 6 or so, and telling my mom that I didn't want to go anymore. She said I didn't have to. That was it. I moved on.

As I got older, I became a very committed person. Once I joined a team, I didn't quit, even if I wasn't very good... as long as I got some pleasure out of the activity (running, rowing, etc), I found enough motivation to keep doing it. Even waking up at 4:30am 6 days a week for 4 years (college crew), I didn't start to doubt my commitment until the last year... but I held on. I finished that commitment, I finished college, I went through the paces to become a teacher, I survived my first year of teaching (I simply could NOT quit that year, there was no option), and started graduate school.

So that is the reason behind this OP. The first year or so of grad school was alright for me... challenging, but I really enjoyed it, too. It was worth the effort to me, just like always. The 2nd year was less worth it, and I was starting to think about quitting after I got my MA degree along the way. Then I got to go to Africa and Iceland for research in 2005, and that boosted me for a couple of semesters. I kept hoping along the way that my funding for the dissertation research would not come through, so I would have a reason to quit, by being forced to do so. Didn't happen. I got the funding, ktspktsp and I got married in a hurry so we could move to Iceland in March 2007, and here we've been ever since.

I haven't felt any intrinsic motivation to do this thing for about 3 years now. And yet, for the people closest to me, my greatest supporters on this path... none of them say that it's okay to quit, even when this thing brings me to tears on an almost weekly, if not daily (right now) basis. If I felt this way about a relationship, I would have been done years ago. No way would I have hung in there. I have no desire to be a professor or continue in academia. There is no reward for me at the end of the tunnel, other than having the "PhD" at the end of my name, and knowing that I "hung in there" enough to get a degree that I'll never use, and waste 2 more years of my life not working, not contributing, not having a normal life. That's 5 years of being unhappy with my professional life, at a time when I'm supposed to be moving up in a company, succeeding and working into management positions. And I'll have to start all over again, when I get out, in a new field... because I sure as hell am not continuing in this one.

So at what point can I say "I quit," and have it make sense to everyone around me? How do you make these kinds of decisions without feeling like a cop-out? Taking into consideration all the effort that other people have invested in me, to get me this far... and who would be so disappointed in me if I quit. They are really the only reason I have been doing this for the last 3 years, and the only reason I can see myself doing it for another 2, if not longer. Any personal joy I felt about it is long gone.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

Alta

I am guessing that this post was your personal effort to lay out all of the pros and cons. All of the pros appear to be the expectations of others (and this isn't necessarily bad, how many of us would have dropped out of school at age 8?) while the cons are your personal revulsion against what you are doing.

I think one really key point is that if you never ever intend to work in this field, then it is a total waste of time. While not against people getting education for interest, in your case that isn't even there.

Generally i am the sort who would urge completion of what you start, but in this case you may indeed have to fold'em and start down a path that works better for you.

I have some cautions but perhaps they are not worthwhile at this point.

lotsofmagnets

i wonder if we´ll get the opinion of someone who´s able to quit tfp :P

how long have you felt this way about it? is this not just a rainy day? so many times i thought about quitting my degree and even had no interest in the field when i finished. was it worth it? hell yeah. after a break i´m ready to dive back in and while the focus has changed significantly i realise why i took this path in the 1st place. but then i´m one of those people who thinks it´s never ok to quit so i´m probably not the best contributor to this thread...

__________________
mother nature made the aeroplane, and the submarine sandwich, with the steady hands and dead eye of a remarkable sculptor.
she shed her mountain turning training wheels, for the convenience of the moving sidewalk, that delivers the magnetic monkey children through the mouth of impossible calendar clock, into the devil's manhole cauldron.
physics of a bicycle, isn't it remarkable?

Willravel

When does it become okay to quit something?

When your wife finds out:


I quit something when it becomes destructive in a way that I cannot fix. My last job stands as a perfect example. CEO was being investigated for doing something very illegal while simultaneously pissing the company's profits away on his own lawyers. I tried to fix it—I basically ran the company, I called in a few favors with PD and with some attorneys I know, etc.—but there reached a point where I wasn't capable of fixing that which was destructive in the job, so I helped my employees find other jobs and then I left myself.

snowy

You already know what I have to say about this, abaya, but I'm going to repost it here for the good of the conversation with others:

There is no shame in quitting, despite what some people would have us believe. There is such a thing as self-preservation, and sometimes you do have to quit in order to preserve yourself and your mental health. Is it worth it? Only you can answer that question.

To elaborate beyond what I said to you, I am very in touch with my mental health. Having dealt with anxiety, depression, and other things through the years, by the pricking of my thumbs I can tell when a situation is not doing me any mental good, and when I'm on that slippery slope to more depression and anxiety. Unfortunately, I do not always listen to myself. There was a situation a few years ago where I was in an unhealthy work environment, and I had the chance to be laid off or stay on in another position, and I mistakenly chose the latter. Three months later I quit--ended up leaving before my two weeks notice was up because I was so fed up with the boss and how she treated her employees--and became a nanny. Best decision I've ever made.

In addition to the advice I've already given you, I would definitely suggest taking some "me" time to figure out how this situation is truly affecting you. I want you to stay healthy and happy, and if this isn't doing that for you, you should move on--and people who really love you would want the same. Period.

__________________
If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

Cynthetiq

Unless people are paying for your way in some manner, they don't have much if any stake in your life. You don't wake up next to them, so the only people you need to concern yourself about is you and your husband.

You quit when you decide.

This means the simplest terms, you may have already quit, but not really know that you have. But like the relationships, you may be dragging it out unnecessarily.

Sometimes people can see the lessons inside of metaphors, when equally structured as their own they cannot see it. It is a personal fancy of mine parables, tales, myths, fables.

I offer you Who Moved My Cheese, which uses 2 mice and 2 little men to describe the process of change. PDF variant of the electronic book.


You've listed a bunch of different things, some of them are based on fear, from the act of quitting itself, to the wondring of what other people will say to you. One of the questions I ask myself often from this book is "What would you do if you weren't afraid?" and that's what I know I need to do.

good luck.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

abaya

Thanks to all for your thoughtful answers so far. It's good to know about other people's experiences and thoughts about this kind of thing. As I said, I'm usually an advocate of hanging in there, finishing what you started, etc... which is what makes this decision even harder. I usually love being challenged, in a way that I know I can handle it. But this is not like that.

No, it's not just a rainy day (in fact, magnets, you know it's a beautiful day in Iceland!)--as I said, I've had crises like this of wanting to quit my PhD pretty regularly for the last 3 years. They've become far more intense and regular since we moved to Iceland and I've been 100% on my own in terms of no supervisor, no classes, no structure on my day, for going on 16 months now.

I don't know if I've "quit" yet (in my mind) or not... I do believe that if I were working on a non-quantitative dissertation, then I would have finished a PhD in no time. But the stickler remains the increasingly quantitative nature of the dissertation, and that is 100% what has stolen the pleasure out of what I am doing. There is no way around some extremely complex statistical calculations in my work, and let me tell you, I barely know my way around a basic correlation.

Trust me, and don't try to make me feel better on this one: I am BAD at math and statistics, and I have been since I was in grade school. I accepted that long ago (otherwise I would have loved to study physics in college, but I could not keep up in math). If I had EVER known that I would have had to write a dissertation based almost completely on number-crunching and interpreting statistical analyses--no way. I would never have gone down this road, not in a million years.

I know my skills and talents, and I know that statistics is not one of them. I am tired of feeling disabled and stupid just because I can't make sense of a simple calculation. I know that I'm smart in other ways, but those ways have been completely squashed by the requirements of this PhD. I like being able to "shine" when I work (doesn't everyone?), knowing that I am contributing to success and being useful... I have not had that feeling for 5 years now.

Cyn, you're right in that it comes down to me and my husband, since he's the one supporting me now that my funding has run out. Due to my intensifying crises in the last month, ktspktsp has suggested that I continue collecting the data I need for the dissertation (which I cannot begin to write until I have 260 surveys returned--and that will take about 6 more months), and then we move back to the US as we hope, at the end of this year.

Then I could take a whole year off to work, live like a normal person (the whole 9-5 lifestyle that I crave), contribute to the household, and figure out what the hell I want to do... basically, give myself a true break. And then, after all that, decide if I still want to quit, or take up the data and start analyzing it, and write the dissertation (which will take about a year, I think).

This offer from him has been my saving grace, recently. It's all I can do to pull together this conference paper for Spain (due Tuesday)--and after that, I'll just be collecting data for the rest of the year, which I can manage. And then, I might just be able to take the break that my husband is talking about, and sort my head out about whether or not I should continue.

As for Cyn's question, "What would I do if I weren't afraid?... I would quit, and be overjoyed about it. However, the other question is, "What would I do if statistics came easier to me, and if I wanted to do research for the rest of my life?"--I would continue, hands down. But neither of those two conditions apply to me, and I feel like it's useless to continue forcing myself into two molds that I cannot see myself ever fitting into, nor do I want to.

So, it's more a matter of figuring out 1) What am I good at? and 2) What do I enjoy doing? and 3) What could I get a job doing, that combines those two things?... and re-evaluating this whole PhD plan in that light.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

Cynthetiq

here's what I believe I understand from what I've read from you.

You've answered it then, you should quit. The rest of it is, how you are going to do so (you mentioned taking data collating it later), and when (about 6 months for the return of 260 surveys.)

What's left is finding out what cheese you like, and where it's located, and how are you going to get it... wraps up all those 3 items

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

JustJess

Well, I quit the acting world. And it was fucking HARD. We attach a lot of self-worth and definition of selves based on these ideas we had many years ago about what we wanted out of life... but you know what? That was a lot of years ago. And you are not that same person. Neither am I.

It becomes very simple: you think about the life you want, and then you take steps to attain that life. If it does not include paying someone to do your stats for you and living in a publish-or-perish atmosphere, then that is the first thing to go. It's hard to let yourself down, but in fact, what you are truly doing... is NOT letting yourself down. Not punishing yourself for the sake of some ideal that is entirely baseless at this point. You're not giving up. You're choosing to do something else.

I like kstp's idea, because that gives you time to not feel like you're giving up, but also to search out what will make you happy in a career life.

__________________
My heart knows me better than I know myself, so I'm gonna let it do all the talkin'.

little_tippler

Abaya,

it's a shame that something which I imagine used to give you personal joy, as you put it, now is a great cause of grief to you.

Things do change...and we change also. It's okay if you don't feel that this is what you want to do anymore. But it's a tough step to take, I'm sure. Because, after that, what are you left with? I'm sure that crosses your mind. Perhaps you've put yourself on hold for so long that you no longer know what you like. I've felt that way...and still do, often.

For me, I'd find it hard to quit something I'd invested so much in. Even if it did drag on for a while longer, I'd finish it, see it out. In fact I did just that in Art School, for all five years of the degree. I felt that it hadn't beat me...I'd taken it down. I had to take a break after that...and hated art for a while. But now I'm being drawn back into it...and it feels good.

Surely your passion is not dead entirely? If you feel it is...and think that not even time will heal that rift...then possibly there is something else out there better suited to you and to making you happy. It's always worth trying other things...you never know. I have many friends who eventually turned off the expected path and did other things which made them much happier.

I also have to say that you're being very negative about the PhD, even if you don't want to finish it, surely the only way to use it is not as a professor or an academic. There are practical applications...I doubt it would be useless. I don't see how it would be better to be in management or having a normal life...it's your life, nothing else. I also think that if you have stuck with it for so long, it's because you don't want to give up, not like this.

About the subject of the dissertation...can it not be adapted? Changed? Can we help you in any way? I'd be happy to if there was any small way I could.

You see...I'm a quitter. Or, I am, often enough to think that. But then sometimes I'm strong. And I always feel better when I saw it through. This doesn't mean to say that I think you should stick with this, no matter what...but the fact that you're asking us here, means that maybe you wish you could find a way...or I am getting you wrong?

If you want me to tell you it's okay to quit, I think it is. If you feel that you will be alright despite that, and I'm sure you would be, then it's definitely okay. Sometimes, you just need to move on.

__________________
Whether we write or speak or do but look
We are ever unapparent. What we are
Cannot be transfused into word or book.
Our soul from us is infinitely far.
However much we give our thoughts the will
To be our soul and gesture it abroad,
Our hearts are incommunicable still.
In what we show ourselves we are ignored.
The abyss from soul to soul cannot be bridged
By any skill of thought or trick of seeming.
Unto our very selves we are abridged
When we would utter to our thought our being.
We are our dreams of ourselves, souls by gleams,
And each to each other dreams of others' dreams.

Fernando Pessoa, 1918

Lasereth

Me, being a person that values education, motivation, and hard work above all will have a different opinion on the subject. There's a reason why most people don't have a PHD and it's because it fucking sucks to get it. My professor said it was the worst experience of his life and the stress was too much.

The only reason I didn't further my education is a lack of funding. No one paid for my 4-year degree so I left college already $35k in debt with no financial help at all. I couldn't get my masters because there was simply no way to pay for it. The government won't even give you loans for your masters if you already have a huge sum amounted for your previous education. I am bitter towards people who actually have the option of higher education and waste it.

So to me, quitting a PHD that you've already worked hard for is absolutely ridiculous regardless of how bad it sucks. This isn't dance class or band class or poker night, this is a huge decision that will affect how you live for the rest of your life. You will most likely never get your PHD if you quit now. You mention that you should be working your way up in a company now and that you're wasting your time getting the letters behind your name: it will be 5-10 more years before I make the salary of someone with a PHD in my field. You start so high with a PHD that "working your way up" is negated. Having that doctorate is simply tremendous.

The biggest waste of your life would occur if you quit now (from my perspective). I think it's OK to quit when you are ABSOLUTELY sure you will never, ever regret the decision or look back and think "I should have kept going."

snowy

abaya, I hope you don't mind but I talked to my mother about your situation. Her main piece of advice was: "Follow your heart and you can't go wrong." Expanding on that, she said that if you're miserable and find it isn't worth it, then you should walk away from it, and do what makes you happy.

__________________
If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

thespian86

So far in my rather short life I met two kinds of people; those who regret, and those who don't. I honestly think a life without regret isn't a life worth living; to me it means a life of no risks (because you can't win them all). Those who don't regret seem to be kidding themselves at this point in my life; perhaps someday I'll think otherwise.

I quit when I feel I can't push further; in anything. Or in a spurt of self-confidence. For instance, if in a situation where I have been in an obvious rut, but stay out of convenience and safety, I will often go through times when I'll find no reason to push myself and in those times where I do I tend to shed my unwanted baggage (sometimes by quiting a job, relationship, friendship, school, etc) I tend to only quit after lots of time and thinking though.

__________________
EX: Whats new?
ME: I officially love coffee more then you now.
EX: uh...
ME: So, not much.

abaya

Thanks again to all of you. These are incredible responses... I appreciate your sincerity and honesty. I would not say that the anthropology has ceased to give me joy. I still love hearing people's stories, especially immigrants', and that is what I came to grad school to work on. But I never expected it to become so... formulaic. Maybe I was naive about that, I don't know... but I never thought that "the study of people" would involve so many pages and pages of numbers and analysis. It just made the whole subject dead to me, after some years.

I came from a literary background and stumbled into anthropology, and the only reason I started grad school was because I didn't have to pay for it (Lasereth, I'm in anthropology--which in fact, would not get me a huge pay jump when I start working, unless you know something that I don't--but the benefit is that in the liberal arts, most MA/PhD programs are paid for because you work as a teaching assistant for the department.)--and I said to myself then, "I'll stick it out for the first 2 years, to get the MA, and after that point... if the funding stops, then I'll walk away with a free MA." So I suppose that has always been in the back of my head, too. I didn't come into grad school with a blazing passion to become a professor and do research for the rest of my life... I came in with a minimum commitment to see if I could make a career out of this, but if I didn't like it, I would give myself room to change directions.

So, thing is, it's hard to change when you're so deeply embedded in a system, that it's basically all or nothing. I have quit many things where I have invested a lot of energy... that has never been a problem for me. The regret is not so much my own, but guilt over what other people have done for me to get there (and guilt that I have so much opportunity, and would be wasting it--the Lasereth view)--that's strong, and it's something that I have struggled with in several other areas of my life. Much of my life is lived in debt to others' sacrifices for me to have these opportunities--and I think, after 30 years, that's starting to come to a head. (Iceland is one HUGE case in point--my father's death before I was born.)

Punkmusicfan: I'm right in the middle of that "lots of time and thinking" that you're talking about. That's what I'm coming to TFP for, to get some objective advice. Tippler, there is some part of me that still loves the core of anthropology--studying people--and that will never change, no matter what career I end up in. But the baggage of what that requires, at a professional level... that's what I'm evaluating here. A degree in anthropology is really not going to give me a huge boost on any salary scale, believe me--it's not engineering. The one thing I can see myself doing with the degree is working with immigrant populations--but I don't want to walk in with a PhD and be placed at some supervisory level, far away from the people. I want to be on the ground, face to face, listening to people... not sitting up high, determining policy and never seeing how it shakes out.

So maybe I wouldn't end up in some corporation, shooting for management--but I could see myself working for a non-profit or NGO, and engaging with the people on a daily basis. I really need to feel that I've contributed to individual people's lives, in order to go home feeling successful. The question is whether I need a PhD for that kind of work.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

thespian86

It's great that you have here to come to and feel welcome; you certainly are.

Just a follow up, because I think I understand the situation better, and I think perhaps you and I handle problems similarly. All I have to say is don't hold yourself back from FULLY investigating every avenue. I know personally that because I've always excelled academically, I tend to fall back on that rather then pushing myself harder to do better (since I already do quite well). Even in research I tend to less then I originally intended to do; I am pretty analytical naturally and I can pretty much turn something great out of absolutely nothing.

My point is your probably the same, find a few things that sound nice, analyze it to death, then choose the best of those options. But don't be afraid to look at every avenue your education provides to you. I find I'm often disappointed, with no one to blame but my own lack of trying.

I could be wrong, but don't limit your wonderful talent, charm, and affinity for well placed words and diplomacy. I've worked a bit with NGO's (though not much and not really outside of my own continental bubble) and I enjoyed it a lot but my skills serve me better in acting. You just need to find a place where your passion serves your skills well. But I wouldn't recommend dismissing that much education and work; I'm sure you can find something that serves you well within it. With that level of education under your belt, your options are pretty much endless (including a PhD.)

__________________
EX: Whats new?
ME: I officially love coffee more then you now.
EX: uh...
ME: So, not much.

abaya

Btw, I don't mind at all. From what you've told all of us about your parents, I respect them for being wise people. Thanks for honoring me with asking your mother about the situation!

Thing is, I've always been one to follow my heart. That's how I got to this spot in the first place... it was almost accidental, a grad school opportunity that fell into my lap while I was pursuing other things. I'm not the type who did the "practical" thing all my life and kept my dreams on hold for later... I've tried to live my dreams for as long as I remember, experiencing as much as I could whenever I had the chance. But I am the type of person who thrives on change, who can't do one thing for too long... if I feel that I am being limited in the realm of human experience, then I get claustrophobic and eventually break out of whatever cage I happen to be in. So the part of me that wants to quit, is that part of me.

The part of me that is keeping me committed to the program... well, that's the grown-up part of me that says this is the adult, practical thing to do, that in the end it will pay off, that I can't just fly around from activity to activity like I used to do when I was younger, that I have to choose something, and this isn't all that bad. I am not very good at listening to that voice. I never have been. Sometimes adulthood just seems to be one cage after another, and you just have to pick one that is least uncomfortable. I am not yet ready to surrender to that reality, and I'm aware that I'm privileged in having that choice. Very few people get to escape out of even one cage that they're born into, let alone changing them whenever they feel like it (see, there's the guilt again).

And some voice is saying, "This is all just masturbatory navel-gazing. Shut up and get back to work, and soon this will all be over." I don't know whose voice that is, actually... or whether it's right or wrong.

Thanks for your kind words, btw. And don't worry, we are the same in that aspect... I analyze pretty much EVERYTHING to death, so I'll exhaust whatever options I might have available to me.

__________________
And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

pig

abaya:

I've been where you are, somewhat. My field is one of those fields where a Ph.D. can really give you a boost in salary - both in terms of starting salary and in terms of terminal salary. So caveat emptor. However, if you just want to make more money, don't get a Ph.D. You can make more money other ways.

That said - I wanted to quit my Ph.D. a number of times during the process. Regardless of what you choose, you won't make the "wrong" choice. As I've been told many times by many people who care about me - give yourself a break. I'm guessing this whole process feels overwhelming - the Ph.D., and the decision you're trying to make. I'd suggest being ok with that - because if you're like I was, you feel that you shouldn't be this stressed out over this, you don't like having to make these decisions, and somehow you might translate it into a question of "what is wrong with me? I've always excelled and now I'm having these problems?" I think that's natural.

I don't know that I can really give good advice on this - but I will say a few things. I'm going to avoid making a pro/con against having the degree in your field. I will say that one of the things my mother told me when I working my way through the end of my degree, when I'd call up and say "Shit, I just don't know what I want to do. I don't know what I'm going to do with it. I don't give a shit about what I'm studying. I hate my advisor. I hate what I do every single day."...she told me not to run away from my degree, but to run towards something else if I chose. You run away from your degree because it's hard and you hate it - then you "quit." You decide to take a different path in your life - then you don't "quit," you change direction. Only you can know what you want to do.

I will say that having that degree does give you credentials in your work life, and in little ways in non-professional situations. You're negotiating with someone in a business sense, and your information/card/whatever says "Dr. Abaya" people tend to fuck with you a little bit less. I'm not saying that's right or wrong, but it is what it is. It can be useful.

If I were you, I'd definitely finish collecting the data - pending funding and financial support. Are you saying you're not receiving any grant money or stipend or anything to finish this fucker? To me, that's horrendous. As a graduate student, you're already working for peanuts. Someone should be ponying up that $$$ to get ahold of your analysis. Regardless, I would also suggest doing some career planning exercises, if you already haven't done so. I didn't do them, not really, while I was in graduate school - and I wish I had. I simply didn't have real exposure to it.

If you figure out some possibilities of what you want to do in 5 or 10 years, then I'd ask myself if having a Ph.D. would be an asset in that.

Although I'm almost afraid to do so, I will also tell you that I'd be happy (in theory ) to try to help you make some decisions to alleviate your difficulties with the statistics you're having trouble with. How are you supposed to analyze the data? What types of mathematical calculations are you supposed to be using? Mathematical packages? Are you familiar with MathLab, Maple, MathCAD? You might be able to find some ways to simplify the things you're having trouble with, although for all I know you've already looked into this and I'm asking ridiculous quasi-insulting questions.

Hmmm...I'm not sure if this is a useful post. In the end, it's your decision. If you decide to bolt, I'd say make sure you've got your post bolt plan in place so you can be happy with your decision. Either way you play this, you can choose to regret it later. So I'd resolve to be ok the decision I made, and always remember that you did the best you could at the time you had to make the choice. And as I said, if I can be of any help, let me know.

abaya: the other thing I'd say is this: don't lose the time you've already put in, leverage it. If you think you want to work for an NGO or non-profit, identify some and see if they're interested in a Ph.D.-trained go-getter who is thinking of pre-empting her degree to pursue something she finds more meaningful. Maybe you can use your work thus far to get a job you really want. Maybe if you spoke to the people you want to work for, you could ask them if having a Ph.D. would make you more of an asset to them in your field. Do you have contacts with any of these groups? Could you make contacts?

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You don't love me, you just love my piggy style

jewels

First of all, your decision to quit something wouldn't be questioned by anyone who's spent any time here and read your posts. You're not someone who'd be characterized as reactive and it's obvious you're a thinker and would weigh the pros and cons and mull it around before quitting something you've committed to.

In answer to your question, that's the difference between a quitter and someone who comes to a realization that something isn't right for them. One is a spoiled brat (okay, yeah I know one) who quits when the going gets tough or when they become bored or have to work too hard. The other spends time and often agonizes, realizing that perhaps this wasn't what they really wanted and has a true and realistic understanding of the situation.

I've switched careers, husbands and lives several times. Each time it took me years to get up the chutzpah to do it. When you know, don't question yourself and stay miserable. Please, don't remain a people pleaser. You're a brilliant girl. Take care of you FIRST. *hug*

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We are always more anxious to be distinguished for a talent which we do not possess, than to be praised for the fifteen which we do possess.
Mark Twain

Psycho Dad

Would you not consider that a form of conditional positive regard? If the people in your life have been supportive of you thus far, I'd suspect that they should be understanding that you can't pursue this any longer with a happy heart.

You have too much life ahead of you to live it unhappy.

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Don't always trust the opinions of experts.

abaya

Hi folks, thanks for the ongoing feedback... I haven't been able to get back to the thread as I wanted to, since this #$%& conference paper is due tomorrow and it has sucked away my life for the last few days. No time for existential crises, but your words are all in the back of my head for me to respond to, after this. I really appreciate the candid and supportive thoughts offered here. I'll be back!

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And think not you can direct the course of Love;
for Love, if it finds you worthy, directs your course.
--Khalil Gibran

kramus

Hey abaya, I really liked pig's post. He said with eloquence what my Lady said when I mentioned this thread to her.
Points that got mentioned were - that all grad students go through this, it is part of the Phd process. Really consider the sunk cost - that is, you have a huge investment that with some more time will garner the permanent result that the rest of the world can recognize in a flash, which is your final degree. This isn't like a gambler throwing money on the table - you can definitely get your result by putting in your time.
Is there a way to farm out the number crunching? In my mind having a number guy do that work is a bit like getting people to collect data while following your guidelines. If you have a statistics guru run your numbers, and you take the resultant refined data and analyze that to the results - is that not acceptable in the world of Phd thesis writing? People write papers while utilizing the skills and training of others all the time - editors, guidance people, you name it. I would take a hard look at finding a numbers mechanic because it is your major stumbling block.
You really need the community of like-minded scholars to help you over this hump. Take your husband's offer and run with it, get yourself back to the States and finish things off at your own pace.
The last thing is this statistics turn is not where you want to go. Somehow you have wound up in a numbers jungle and it will take a slog on your part to find your way back to where you want to be. IMHO the slog is worth it because in the end having the Phd as part of your arsenal will garner you more. You will have gravitus, weight, you will be accorded more consideration because of what you evidently were willing to invest in in order to get that final degree.
I have quit a marriage after 25 years, and a job after 23 years. It was a long hard go, and at the end it was definitely time and past time to quit. But I am also glad I hung in because the job and the marriage both really got the old school try. No regrets about not giving those worthwhile things every bit of available energy and work before I finally hung up my hat

Enjoy your Spanish interlude. Take some time to look around even if it only can be half a day. That is time spent that you will never regret
My 2 cents.

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And now to disengage the clutch of the forebrain ...
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