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View Poll Results: What would you do? | |||
Give info to the police straight out |
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47 | 85.45% |
Give info to the police on the quiet |
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4 | 7.27% |
Dont tell the police anything |
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4 | 7.27% |
Voters: 55. You may not vote on this poll |
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#41 (permalink) |
Confused Adult
Location: Spokane, WA
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I'm not a flaming douchebag, I'd turn his ass in. If my "friend" was stealing from my neighbor, why would I want him as a friend anyway? Whats to say he hasn't been stealing from me? Besides, you'd do for your neighbor what you would want your neighbor to do for you.
for some of us, what we own is what we base our lives on. how devastated would you be if you lost all of the data on your computer, because someone stole it. your saved works, be it your writing, music you make, photoshop productions, or spreadsheets for work, or the more sentimental photos over the last 10 years, emails, or home videos. (although strangely enough that's exactly what happened with pamela and tommy lee lol) or maybe musical studio equipment, irreplacable records, and so on. seriously if people stole stuff from me and my neighbor watched it, and did nothing, and I found out about it later, I'd want him charged as an accomplice. Last edited by Shauk; 08-28-2007 at 02:26 PM.. |
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#42 (permalink) | ||
Tilted Cat Head
Administrator
Location: Manhattan, NY
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__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not. |
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#43 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: In the land of ice and snow.
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That being said, i don't know if anyone here who is currently advocating discretion when it comes to calling the cops would have not called the cops in this particular instance for that particular reason. I don't know, though. Strange, roach, would you guys rather let someone get raped and murdered than call the cops? I imagine not, but you never know. How about another tricky moral question: What if you saw someone breaking into your neighbor's house, called the cops, then found out after your neighbor gets arrested that your neighbor was engaged in some illegal, yet essentially harmless, activity that ended up getting exposed because you "did the right thing?" Your neighbor goes to prison because somebody wanted to steal his/her laptop and you wanted to do the right thing. Was it worth it? Is your neighbor glad that you were looking out for them? I've had my shit stolen before and it sucked, but let me tell you, there are worse things that can happen; some of those things can be the direct result of the involvement of police officers. I'm not saying that calling the cops isn't necessary, or that i wouldn't do it if i saw someone breaking into somebody else's property, because i probably would. All i'm saying is that the decision should not be made without a little thought and that the police aren't always the right answer. |
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#44 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: Ontario, Canada
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What if, what if? But to follow your own analogy: What if a guy breaks into my neighbours house, I call the cops, the neighbour turns out to be Jeffrey Dahmer, boiling up little boys in his crockpot? I guess I'm glad they're both going to jail, aren't you?
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Si vis pacem parabellum. |
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#45 (permalink) |
has all her shots.
Location: Florida
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Well, to be fair, the OP specifically stated that he wasn't talking about violent crime. I'll go out on a limb and assert that the people here saying they wouldn't call the cops were not talking about a violent crime.
__________________
Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce |
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#46 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: In the land of ice and snow.
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The idea is that there isn't a clear moral decision to be made in the context of the question posed by the op if one's morals dictate that one attempt to do right by their neighbor. Is that more clear? The world is not black and white, and the best intentions don't always bring about the best results. The position that the morally superior person will always call the cops when witnessing a crime in progress(as seemingly advanced by some folks in this thread) is naive; the involvement of the police isn't necessarily going to make anything better. Moral absolutes are teh lame. |
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#47 (permalink) |
spudly
Location: Ellay
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Filtherton, I'll bit and say that I'd call the cops, and I wouldn't feel too bad about the neighbor getting busted. It sucks for him and all, but that's part of the risk of breaking the law, even in innocuous ways. We all have our own tolerance level for that risk. Me, I jaywalk like a fiend in NYC because you never get ticketed. Here in LA, I toned it down.
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Cogito ergo spud -- I think, therefore I yam |
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#48 (permalink) |
Junkie
Location: In the land of ice and snow.
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I'd probably do the same thing, uber.
All i'm saying is that prior and/or ensuing notions of moral superiority concerning calling the cops are misplaced. This isn't csi or law and order. There are a lot of cops who can be complete pieces of shit. Calling the cops in the wrong circumstances can make things worse for the wrong people. For instance, in my city, 7 times out of 10 (anecdotally speaking), when the police are involved in a situation concerning a bicyclist and a motorist, regardless of the details, the motorist comes out on top in terms of legal sanctions. Unless there are serious injuries or you are particularly sympathetic to inattentive drivers, you might want to avoid involving the cops. |
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#49 (permalink) |
The sky calls to us ...
Super Moderator
Location: CT
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I'll start off by saying that this thread seems like an attempt to justify past action and nullify guilt, or am attempt to find others who agree with what most you know in person consider a reprehensible action.
If I were to witness a crime that is clearly harmful to people other than the perpetrator (robbery has a victim, not turning in a wad of cash you found under a bush that will just go into the state coffers if turned in does not; selling harmful substances to children has a victim, selling to responsible adults and using drugs in the privacy of your own home does not,) I would immediately inform law enforcement. In your scenario, I would do the following, in this order: 1: make sure that everyone in the house is safe and inform them that the neighbor is being robbed, then arm myself and others in the house for a worst-case scenario (home invasion,) instruct others in the house to move to a safe, easily-defensible area until I shout an all-clear code phrase or ask for help. Ask them to use cell phones to call neighbors and tell them to secure their houses and inform them of the situation. If they have the cell phone number of the neighbor who's being burglarized, call them and tell them it's not safe to come home at the moment. 2: secure my house (if it isn't already done,) to minimize the possibility of a home invasion: lock and bar doors and windows, and turn on motion-detector lights. 3: call the police, convey as much information as possible, and ask if 911 or another number should be used if I observe anything else that could help them. Inform them that I will watch from a safe part of my house, that I will inform neighbors, that I have secured my house but am armed in case of a home invasion, and that if the police need to contact me that they should park in my driveway with red/blue lights on, ring the doorbell, and wait for me to call the dispatcher to confirm that they have sent someone to my door, at which point I will secure any weapons and invite them in to the common area of the house. 4: get binoculars, a directional microphone, headphones, and a camera or video camera to record as much evidence as possible 5: observe and document the crime from a dark room through an open window that is far enough off the ground that someone cannot easily reach it and get in. Call police at the number they specified if I observe anything else that can help them apprehend the criminal more efficiently or safely. 6: if police come to my house: call the dispatcher to verify that they sent officers to my house, invite the officers into the common area of the house (living room and bathroom,) thank them for the quick response (average police response time in Fairfield: 1:45) put on a pot of coffee, provide them with any evidence I collected, provide any information they need related to the crime I witnessed, tell them how to contact me if they need further assistance, and get names, badge numbers, and business cards for each of them. 7: secure all doors and windows after police leave, turn on all outside lights, call neighbors to inform them of whether or not the suspect was caught, ask everyone to keep an eye out for anything suspicious for the next few weeks, especially if the suspect was not caught. 8: make a statement to be submitted to the court if necessary, testify in court if necessary, write a letter to the police chief expressing my satisfaction or dissatisfaction with how the incident was handled. |
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#50 (permalink) |
Super Moderator
Location: essex ma
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look, folks, if you read my posts above you'll find that i said pretty clearly where the line is for me between what i would report and what i would not.
the relevant sentences are those that begin with community norms being violated. i said i would report a burglary or other violations, particularly of persons. i indicated that i might be ambivalent about it as well. so i made another post that explained why i might be ambivalent. here's a summary of that one: i was burglarized in philadelphia and i lost a computer and backup that cost me two fucking years worth of work. two fucking years. a nearly complete book. something that could have had a significant impact on my professional life. something i devoted an ENORMOUS amount of time and effort to doing (this last bit i didnt put in). gone. gone because i went to dinner at the wrong time. furthermore i said that the cops, which i called, did nothing. fuck all. and THAT explains the ambivalence. [[btw: i dont talk about this much. apparently i still get angry about it.]] the other side of the line--and i made this quite clear as well if you read the post----is the police in their explicitly political functions. in that area, i would never turn in anyone to the cops. now within this, there are obviously separations that i would make, but i didnt talk about them. so if you want to debate with me, try again.
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a gramophone its corrugated trumpet silver handle spinning dog. such faithfulness it hear it make you sick. -kamau brathwaite Last edited by roachboy; 08-28-2007 at 07:28 PM.. |
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#51 (permalink) | |
Mulletproof
Location: Some nucking fut house.
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Don't always trust the opinions of experts. |
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#52 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: Ontario, Canada
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Calling the cops when you witness a crime (and let's say a crime of a serious nature, the type for which you will do time, not jaywalking or smoking a joint but burglary certainly qualifies) is ALWAYS the correct course of action, ethically and legally.
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Si vis pacem parabellum. |
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#53 (permalink) | ||
Junkie
Location: In the land of ice and snow.
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What i'm trying to say is that, not only are there many different cases where involving the police could make the situation worse for everyone involved, there are also people for whom a very legitimate distrust of the police requires them to handle things without them. These people aren't cowards, as you seemed to try to imply earlier, they just have a different perspective than you. Here's an anecdote: A good friend of mine was disciplining his daughter on a sidewalk the other day and he said something she didn't want to hear so she took off. Right towards the street. So he grabbed her, in the way that you grab someone who's running into a busy street. It probably didn't look very comfortable, and he probably started loudly telling her what a bad idea running into the street was. Some lady walking by decided that he was in he process of physically and mentally abusing her. The lady got involved, repeatedly asked him if he watched dr. phil, and whether he knew that children need to be heard. My friend essentially told the lady to fuck off, mind her own business, so she called the cops. To her, it had gotten to the point where it was "serious" enough, that her commitment to ethical and legal behavior required her to call the police. Thankfully, the cop who showed up wasn't a complete tool, because he recognized the situation for what it was. Another possible outcome is that a cop shows up, takes the lady's side, initiates social services intervention, and my friend has to go to court for disciplining his daughter in front of someone who watches dr. phil. So, by all means, call the cops when you think you should, most people do. Just don't delude yourself that you're always doing anybody a favor. |
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#54 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: Ontario, Canada
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As to what people should consider serious, I think that any crime for which the prepetrator would receive jail time is serious. Ergo, smoking a joint, littering, or driving without a seatbelt aren't serious and probably the majority of people would go along with that. Any form of theft or assault is serious.
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Si vis pacem parabellum. |
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#55 (permalink) | ||
Junkie
Location: In the land of ice and snow.
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#56 (permalink) | ||
Junkie
Location: Ontario, Canada
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Si vis pacem parabellum. |
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#57 (permalink) | ||
Junkie
Location: In the land of ice and snow.
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Certainly there are a lot of people who do commit crimes like burglary who are scumbags, but the fact that they have broken into a house isn't what makes them so, unless you're aiming to include b&e in the definition of scumbag. This would be novel. Quote:
I don't want to get into a semantical discussion here, so if that's where you're planning on taking this, don't bother. If you can't see where i'm coming from that's fine. I can accept that. On this particular subject you see things in black and white, and all i'm trying to point out is that one can't make credible absolute proclamations from a subjective perspective. Especially when you can't even admit that your perspective is subjective. |
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#58 (permalink) |
Wise-ass Latino
Location: Pretoria (Tshwane), RSA
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I think it's all based on location. In some places, talking with the police, even if you're just an uninvolved witness does put your life in jeopardy. This is one of the contributing factors to cities like Newark having a high homicide rate and a low conviction rate. Witness intimidation is bad enough that the district attorney won't prosecute a suspect if their case has only one witness because they always retract their statement at the trial, resulting in an acquittal.
With Witnesses At Risk, Murder Suspects Go Free click to show This 'no snitch' campaign is alive and well, and is a serious problem.
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Cameron originally envisioned the Terminator as a small, unremarkable man, giving it the ability to blend in more easily. As a result, his first choice for the part was Lance Henriksen. O. J. Simpson was on the shortlist but Cameron did not think that such a nice guy could be a ruthless killer. -From the Collector's Edition DVD of The Terminator |
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#59 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: Ontario, Canada
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But whatever, quite obviously the overwhelming majority of the poll respondents are sure of their morals and ethics and what is right and what is wrong. And that is great to see, even if a few people adhere stubbornly to straddling the fence.
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Si vis pacem parabellum. |
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#60 (permalink) | |
Junkie
Location: In the land of ice and snow.
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#61 (permalink) |
Addict
Location: Portland, OR
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The scenario in the OP is a little strange to me. If I was aware there was a crime going on, I'd report it right then. When the police came to me they'd likely already know who I was because of my report, and I'd be glad to answer any related questions that they had.
I don't know why anybody would tell the police nothing. Unless the police were being total assholes (which I've never seen happen when they're gathering information after an actual crime has occurred) there is no reason to stay quiet. Unfortunately there are many instances when the police might be questioning people before they fully understand what's going on. In those cases most police are rude and intrusive, presumably because you're a potential criminal and they just don't care to be friendly. It's too bad that those situations exist, but they do. I don't cooperate in any way if police are out of line and don't care to listen to reason. |
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#62 (permalink) | |
Transfer Agent
Location: NYC
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__________________
I've yet to dephile myself... |
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#63 (permalink) | |
Insane
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I've had my house broken into...but that wasnt nearly as exciting as living with a theif for about a decade growing up. there's nothing quite like having countless things that you worked hard for go missing...(step brother) this guy would steal whatever he could get his hands on (his father's wedding ring, grandparents stuff, my stuff, his real brothers stuff, strangers stuff)...anyway I presume he blew alot of it on drugs, or whatever. I have somewhat of a "special" hatred for people who make their living by stealing. anyway, I saw him make his bed as he was growing up, and no matter what bullshit revelation he claimed to have (jesus, whatever)...he just went back to being the same old crook. he's been in the state pen for the last decade. some people just dont change...and dont have a right to exist in society. |
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police, talking, views |
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