Mannnnnnnn I've been an avid reader for many many many days of this thread but still being in a relationship I never had a chance to try.

Well I split up so I went for the plan ;)

It was an old school mate I hadn't seen in years but just happened to bump into them. So anyway got the number and being in the UK with such a huge SMS culture I started txting but then suddenly realised "wait a sec I'm sending txts here and not getting many back" so I took the acting too busy tactic.

Well after a couple of days of that she can't leave me alone and, not to sound over confident, shes eating outta the palm of my hand! I'm saying "jump" shes saying "how high?". I'm now meeting her again this Saturday so lets see how it goes!

hey plan9, ur insane, but i've also found that a great way to start talking to girls if you're not confident enough is to introduce a friend to them, that gets a great convo started. One day I even had a group of 11 (no lie) girls around me and my friend. That night my arm was covered in ink from numbers.

how can you introduce someone to someone you dont know yourself? doesn't make sense "hi, i dont know you, but this is my friend bob"

If your interested just to give you a gauge....

On 1 day I stopped to talk to 5 gals....

2 blatant rejections

3 phone numbers

Out of those 3 one of them has just ignored me a second one still contacts me but she was about a 3 on the scale :S so I am trying to slowly let her down and 3rd whos a strong 7/8 and meeting at the weekend :D

I never knew how easy this game is ... well it is if you know what to do and when to do it! Well you got a huge thanks from me Plan9!

Before you all start circlejerking and starting a cult in celebration, Plan9s guide is more than a little bit similar to the players guide at fastseduction.com .... It's nothing new, nor original, but it still works.

Well whoever the original author is I send my thanks.

If it isn't broke it, why fix it :) I know it sounds weird but he has gave me the confidence to go try it and then it's built on from there.....

There is nothing broke about it, it is all solid advice. Plan9 added meaningful insight, but there are hundreds of similar and good articles at fastseduction.com . I'm glad you have success.

i used some of this advice and it really works i was quite amazed keep up the good advice fellas! thanks

i used some of this advice and it really works i was quite amazed keep up the good advice fellas! thanks

Thats a second to fastseduction.com, the forums/field reports are both funny and useful.

i somehow managed to get myself out of a friend zone (i'd been there for almost a full year) and be with a chick who i go to school with. Pulled some of the shit that was recommended and jesus it works. :)

I know what you mean by that!

I was amazed at how many "friends" wanted to try and be more then friends. All you have to do is give the right signals and they swarm. Although you take the chance of ruining a friendship so tread with care. :S

Well I’m officially back in the friend zone though she said that she’d “have sex with me” if it felt right. Meh, I really don’t think I want that from her but anyway, being buddies with this chick is much easier than not or being more, believe me. She’s got some issues heh.

I've managed to become friends with this chick who has invited me for a threesome (provided I find the other girl to be involved), and has said she'd be keen to occasionally have sex & stuff just for fun. :)

Seems like a pretty cool no strings type situation, and she's also fun to hang out with.

Hey...Plan9...

Awesome post. I must say that this is really valuable information. I can't believe I didn't run into this post earlier. I am quite the player, too. I have been playing the game for a VERY long time. You have put into words just about every tactic that I use. You nailed it right on, man.

For everyone that is not getting any tail. Listen to Plan9, he speaks the truth. His methods are the same ones I use all the time.

You don't have to be an underwear model to land beautiful women. You need some confidence. I have been preaching that for years. I am not the most attractive guy in the world, but I am average.

I have been using these same tactics for years and have gotten more tail than a public toilet. I just never knew how put most of my tactics into words. I was reading Plan9's post and found myself saying, "that is EXACTLY what I do!!"

Keep on preaching Plan9, you have put into words what I couldn't...

Hehe I am familiar with that site, but I actually dont agree with a lot of things they say to do. Thanks for trying to downplay my thread slick ;).

Off topic sorta... I just wanted to say that I see some people posting here that are from all over the world and I WISH to God I could go experience where you live.. experience the women there...and work with you all first hand in achieving everything you ever wanted with them. What I am trying to say is buy me a plane ticket so I can taste the women of your area!!!

I do want to post another lesson... but I am fukin tired. Sorry, time for my beauty sleep. I enjoyed all of your latest conquests though so I am going to bed happy :)

ok, after a year long drought i've picked up twice in one week following this shit. One chick was a 7, the other was an 8. I want to have plan9's babies.

What an amusing thread!

Although I have enjoyed reading some of Plan9's postings, I must admit to being a little shocked by the way he treats the subject of meeting girls and women. When I first began following the thread, I had the feeling that either he was a 14 year old boy on a hormone rush, or possibly a steroid junkie twitching his pecs, or even that he was in the habit of popping a bit of IV cocaine before he posted. I hope that you don't take this as an insult, Plan9, if you are listening: we have all been 14 at one stage or another (except for the younger viewers), and I am certainly in agreement that a shot of coke is a great way to clear the brain, but really, your approach to women leaves a lot to be desired.

I can understand your attraction towards the so-called alpha male profile as a tool for getting laid, but it seems to me that you are taking a tool for analysing the behaviour of gorillas and baboons and simply adapting it for human use. Yes, I admit that your calculated strategies can work, but by omitting the fact that people mostly end up in bed via behaviours which more or less contradict your advice, I think that it would not be unfair to call a 'foul' on most of your advice.

One of my impressions is that you simplify relations as being a game where the man wins if he gets laid. Is that how you really see it? Are your successes in this game the tool by which you have chosen to boost your self-esteem by giving advice to younger, less secure, men? Can you imagine how much you are screwing the world-views (women-views) of the younger men foolish enough to take your advice seriously?

My experience contradicts yours. I don't know why. Perhaps there is something wrong in America. For me, there is no problem in sleeping with my female friends. It happens sometimes. You go out in a group, have an interesting conversation, and end up in bed. If someone doesn't accidentally fall in love, everything continues as normal.

I've never dated anyone really until after we've been to bed, so I don't really understand the American concept of dating.

I have no qualms about showing my feelings to a girl I like. Several times I have been the complete loser in this game only to later find myself wanted on account of my sincerity.

For all of you frustrated geeks - please closely criticise the postings of Plan9. Although within his disgustingly cynical appraisal of man/woman interactions there are some truths, I can't see how their application would healthily feed a relationship.

If you just want to get laid, however, his tricks will work. But how much you will have to lie to yourself?

I'm a decent and honest bloke (not quite a Caring Understanding Nineties Type) and I've slept with most of my female friends and plenty off the streets. In my understanding, Plan9's attitude is a crock of shit. Just be yourself and some girl will find you.

All the best.

Maybe things work different in Russia. :|

Well Woodhead I am not 14, I am 27.. sorry to dissapoint your adolescent fantasy of who I am. Hormonal rush? Well possibly. I am a personal trainer and my priority in life is taking care of my body, so I guess you can say that my testosterone levels might be a tad higher then yours. You live in Russia where the women put ads on the internet to marry us Americans just to get their visa here. I don't know how things work there, but apparantly you Russian men arent doing the job if all the women are wanting to be here ;). All insults aside, I think you might be a tad uninformed on how real life works with women, because I will bet my life that I get more tail then you do following my own advice then being a "decent honest bloke". Thanks for your advice though, I can promise you it wont help anybody on this forum get laid though ;) Your vodka is good, but your advice is shit... gg cya bud ;)

Plan9, My apologies for being overly emotional in my posting. While beer and vodka leave me in a pleasantly conversational mood, I'm pretty sure that it was the sleeping pill that followed that led me to type faster than I could think. Referring to myself as a 'decent and honest bloke' I think is evidence of this, but on the positive side, at least this comment might have given me a clue as to what my brainstem thinks of me.

As far as me being uninformed about how real life works with women - I think that here you have touched the issue that differentiates our attitudes. Maybe it was even my mistake to post on a thread dedicated to 'getting tail', but I was curious about how other people thought about sex, and when I got the gist of what your polylogue was all about, I felt that I had to respond.

I agree that your psychological tools can be used to manipulate a girl into bed, but I am not so happy that you leave the matter at that and simplify sex as only being a game. To be sure, there are games involved, but this is only one element. Or better - to typify (as it seems to me that you do) all sexual relations as being a kind of game that can only be won or lost, leaves a huge hole in the possibilities of how one might interact with women. I understand this rating of women from 1 to 10, but it makes me feel uncomfortable. Why? Because it promotes a kind of blindness which might stop one from meeting a very ordinary girl who could save your life.

This is a thread about getting laid. I have fucked left right and centre while doing the exact opposite of what is recommended here. And also by doing what is recommended here. The only recipie is to go to bed with girls you like and take it like a man when they aren't interested.

PS As far as Russian women are concerned, I can only say that the available petabytes of the internet would only suffice to trivialise any discussion of them.

Having said that, I must ask - which Russian woman are you talking about? Russia per se includes about 200 ethnic groups and the former Soviet Republics adds a big handful more. The only way I can characterise them as a group is by saying that when God made Russian women, he was on a good run. He perfected spiteful vengeful whores as well as transparent selfless angels but gave them all beautiful faces and bodies (well, most of them). And most generously, He gave them all attention spans - something He omitted in the English speakers.

You noted that lots of Russian women want to go west. It's true. As you implied, Russian men fuck up in a big way with their 19th century attitudes and violence and drunkedness, but probably the strongest factor is sheer poverty. Student grants of US$10 per month, pensions of US$50 per month. The law doesn't work. It is easy to buy a judge who gets US$300 per month. Cost of living not much less than in the West. Of course people want to leave.

Enough of that. To put it simply, women don't advertise to come to the US because you are a big stud, but rather because there is a chance that their children won't starve there.

Please excuse me, I have to go out and meet some friends.

Until later,

W.

hahaha!

thats comedy!

Plan9 I can honestly say that not one of your "plans" would work on me or my friends.

All of us would prefer a "decent honest bloke" over a scam anyday.

Being close to your age I think I have pretty much figured out mens games at this point and a lot of the things you described seem pretty transparent to me. Any women with some sense in her head would steer clear.

I agree, but at the same time, a lot of girls do wind up sleeping with people they dont even like I think. Most people can see people games and schemes from the outside, but when you are involved in it its harder, plus - like the song says - "youre tender when youre tired"...

I guess the question for guys is, what do you really want, a few one night stands here and there that the other person winds up regretting, or somehow making a connection.

But I would tell anyone, listen to Plan 9 ahead of me, I havent had a girlfriend in 3 years, so what do I know?

Plan9 is not trying to get a girlfriend though. He is just trying to get a piece of ass.

Well, exactly, and whether his advice is any good depends on if you want what he wants or what I want.

What he wants, and the way he does it works well enough for him. Maybe I might like it if I did it, but I don't think it really is waht i want. if you ust want to sleep with a good looking girl, then it isnt really a problem is 6 people reject you and the last one sleeps with ou and you dont have to ask what's going on, you just do it to do it.

Im not trying to pass judgement in anyone, a lot of men and women may be looking for just that.

while it's true that plan9's lessons are mostly designed just for getting laid, you can change them around a bit to suit your individual needs. if nothing else, it will get your foot in the door with a girl you're interested in. and then you can be yourself. the lessons aren't to be followed exactly, they're just general guidelines on what to do and what not to do. i've asked a few girls that i know fell for this exact shit, and when i told them about some of the lessons, they told me it's bullshit and they'd never fall for it.. but they already have.

personally, i feel more confident just by reading what he wrote. if you have confidence, you dont need to follow these lessons, you're already getting laid because you use them subconciously.

Phew! I just read the entire thread. Took me a few days (broken into chunks, I'm not THAT slow a reader!).

I have to agree pretty much with what Plan9 has said. I don't believe it's so much about getting a piece of ass (although you can use it for that), but it's more about creating an attraction for the woman that she will find irresistable. I subscribe to David DeAngelo's mailing list (it can be found at <a href="http://www.doubleyourdating.com/">http://www.doubleyourdating.com/</a>) which contains tons of success stories of people employing the same techniques that Plan9 espouses. If you have the chance, read DeAngelo's eBook as well, it pretty much agrees with what Plan9 says.

you sir, have more patience than I do, I usually dont go through a thread that is more than 100 posts long

hot dog. i just finished this mountain... its been a great read thanks plan9, i truely think this would make an awesome book.
i think people are getting on the wrong track with what ur trying to say and talking about being yourself and finding your true love, the one that wont fall for these tricks and instead see the real person, maybe its just the angle im looking at this thread from but i dont think thats the goal in which was set. This thread has opened the door for me :)

once again thank plan9 for sharing this

what's an AFC?
also, how does the dialing 67 work?

i've read *most* of this thread but i'm sure i missed some stuff somewhere....

also, i think its good advice, although i've seen much of it in other places. Its like turning it into a game thats actualy fun to play where you dont go home feeling dejected at night cuz your afraid of talking to the HB's. (been there done that)

AFC=Average Frustrated Chump

*67=Blocks caller ID so that you essentially have a "Free" call, aka, she doesn't know it was you, so it doesn't count against the "appropriate" number of calls

As for the debate of true love and the like: this thread definitely wasn't designed for "true love".

I've been in long term relationships for years with women I cared deeply about, and never used these techniques. My "shining personality" has "won them over". However, I've never been on a date with someone that I wasn't going "steady" with, and I haven't dated a new girl since my sophomore or junior year of high school. With my "techniques" (or better put, lack there of), I would have probably spent the last 4 years single, had I not been with my one-time best friend (who I had planned to marry this fall).

My best friend naturally embodies these principles and he gets casual sex often. He's had some relationship troubles because of these attitudes, but had a 3 year relationship that worked very well, and is currently engaged to a wonderful girl that shares most of his feelings on sex and "game".

Just goes to show, you don't need these lessons to get a g/f, but they'll sure help you get a nameless piece of ass. (and for the record, I'm in no way judging...hell, it's been a while, I'm not sure I'd pass up on mindless random sex right now!)

I said it before, and it I believe it bears repeating: "It's not about changing what you're offering, it's about changing how you offer it."

Ok I have been a long time lurker on the boards here, but this thread finally got me to break out of my shell.

Firstly, I totally agree with Plan on everything he says, I do my best to live this stuff everyday. Some of you might describe it as "game playing" but, as pointed out before, dating is all a game of social thrusts and parries. To the girls who say guys play games, yea, well so do women. Guys are tested, whether they realize or not, by women all the time. How far they're willing to let them push their buttons, whether they know when to put their foot down, etc. To be fair, I don't think girls consciously do this sort of thing, like "Hmm, I think I'll see if he puts up with a weird spaz out tonight at dinner."
On the flip side, women can giggle and toss their way out of a problem, flirting is something most have mastered into an art form that they sometimes they use as a means to end. Is this not also game playing?
I believe this advice is about a guy having a gameplan (no pun intended) for himself. Something to show himself that he does actually have a backbone, he can actually have his own opinion, he does not have to follow status quo, and be a man.
Also, why does everyone think this advice is only about one night stands? Plan has repeated himself on the fact that you <i>can</i> pursue something meaningful if you so chose. Its simple, to borrow from his above story for a minute, don't kiss other girls if you want one.

Girls, if you don't like a confident guy who breaks out of the box instead of being the typical mold, fine. We'll move along to the next table. Guys, if you want to hope the sappy love story thing works, well, keep enough money in your wallet for dinner

First off, there is no scam here. Secondly, your post almost seems like an empty threat more then truth. I wish to God I lived near you because I would bet my left testicle that even after everything you know about me on this thread I can guarantee that if I hung out with you and your friends, at least one of you would be interested in me by the end of the evening. Isn't that as fair as you assuming the latter?

Well, that is a bit presumptuous of you to assume. This thread, unbeknownst to you, can help us guys get girlfriends even though you find it hard to believe.

Thanks for your posts anyhow *Nikki*, I honestly hope you are in the Orange County area some day so I can prove them wrong ;).

Woodhead I see you took the time to post a long reply but I don't have the patience to read it because I don't have time for guys with the mentality that you have. I am here to tell you what works, not to convince you chick-flick watching pansies out there to change your ways. Good luck to you though in Russia kiddo ;)

It's one thing to read a technique and think to yourself "how simple this looks" and another altogether to be at a bar and meet a guy that is friendly, funny, and you feel like you are connecting with him on a deeper level. Eventually when you end up having a good time with him, winding up very physical at the end of the night, who just got the girl, and who is that boring honest decent guy in the corner hugging his beer? Any guy that you can see through as "scamming you" or trying to pick you up is just an AFC or a little slow in the head.

If a girl feels comfortable with me, chances are much much lower that she will realize the ways in which she's being "scammed". Making a girl comfortable is easy, especially if you were once a NiceGuy or AFC. Keep in mind that these are only general guidelines and some guys can use all kinds or behaviour directly to their advantage.

Hi, here's my story. All of it predates my reading of plan9's thread, but I think it will support his points.

For almost all of my life, I have been AFC suffering from one-itis every time I happen upon the opportunity. Anyway, when I was visiting grad school, a girl (wow!) walked into the room who was hot, for an engineer. I'd give her a 6.5 on plan9's scale in comparison to normal girls though. :D I think there were about 4 girls and 25 guys in the room.

Anyway, I made eye contact and smiled, so she sat down next to me. Still being AFC, I said nothing to her. A professor introduced us so we chatted awhile.. I was planning to get her contact info by the end of the day, but she had to catch a bus unexpectedly.

Since I remembered her name, I did look up her webpage online which had her phone, IM, etc., but I decided to forget it and not look creepy. A few months later she dropped me an email: She had looked ME up. We talked online a bit (just small talk and grad school BS), and we ended up deciding to get an apartment together. Note: I thought I was workin' it at this point, but few months later when she liked me more she told me she thought I was a dork when we met, so maybe not. ;)

I'll try to cut this short. As we were living together, she would occasionally ask me favors, and I would say no if it were inconvenient, i.e. getting her a drink of water when we were both sitting down. This was the first time ever that I didn't supplicate for a girl. I also never complimented her looks (It would have been out of context, anyway). I never ever bought her anything, or took her anywhere, also a first for me. And we started hooking up in mid-November.

But then an old problem surfaced. First of all, she was starting to develop feelings for me, I think, and I was beginning to suffer from one-itis. I started doing more favors for her; I started to compliment her; I started to agree with everything she said. She left for winter break in December and when she got back things were different. We've hooked up since, but less often, and I can tell she doesn't like me nearly at the level she did before. All because I started being "thoughtful." Lesson learned.

And with that, any advice? :) She left for home for a week again, so I think if there is a time for me to change my personality back, now would be it. What is a good way to stop doing favors? The transition from "mean" to "nice" is easy to accept, but the other way around might not be so good.

I've also thought about stopping everything period because she IS my suitemate and we are still friends at some level, but it's tough cuz sex is fun.

P.S. All the time I've lived with her guys have sent her fruit baskets, clothes, other random gifts, a round-trip ticket to Florida, etc. The guy who bought her the trip has never gotten any from her. He initiates conversation (mostly online) all the time and tries to set up times to "hang out." I know for a fact she is not interested in him, and I'm sure it's because he is precisely what plan9 tells us not to be. Oh, also, when she was considering the trip to FL, I convinced her to go visit and to take the free ticket. I think that was a good move and gave me a few points, instead of acting all "stay here with me" even though that's what I actually wanted.

Plan9, I'm sorry that you say that you didn't have the patience to read my post, and even sorrier that you did so on the basis of my 'mentality' and seemingly because I am a 'chick-flick watching pansy'.

Nonetheless, thanks for wishing me luck in Russia. It seems to me, through your intolerance of dissent and alternative points of view, that you have a pretty good idea of how things work here.

Myself, I am enjoying the exchange of views, but just in case, I have packed a small suitcase (standing by the front door) should you wish to send me to Lubyanka for 'questioning', or to Siberia to 'change my ways'.

Yours,

W.

I wouldn't say that my post was any kind of threat. It is mearly an observation made by me, as I have heard every line in the book. I have dealt with men many times like yourself. You are not an original as much as you would like to make it seem so. I am not making assumptions as to your intentions with women, those have been clearly stated by you and that is what I based my comments on.
As far as being in Orange County, I don't think that will ever happen. There are already enough men here trying your tactics so I don't think I will have to travel across the country for more of the same.

I guess it's a semantics thing, but i think it's more of a passive vs aggressive/assertive thing, rather than being mean or rude vs nice.

Thesaurus entry for thoughtful:
absorbed, analytical, attentive, brainy, calculating, cerebral, cogitative, deep, deliberative, discerning, earnest, engrossed, far-sighted, grave, intellectual, intent, introspective, keen, level-headed, logical, meditative, melancholy, museful, musing, pensive, philosophic, pondering, preoccupied, rapt, rational, reasonable, reasoning, reflecting, reflective, retrospective, ruminative, serious, sober, studious, subjective, thinking, wise, wistful.

Thoughtfulness is good! :D

Good quote :) btw are you in marketing/advertising?

heh, i would also like to meet the mythical being that is Plan9. I daresay that there is quite a bit of hype to live up too ;) :p
Fortunatley, with shows like this one, i can already experience the majestic beauty of OC :p
Although it'd be good if you could drop into Perth sometime, to taste the women ;) :p

...
I think woodhead makes some valid points as well (along with having impeccable English skillz ;) ), even though they may contradict some of Plan9's points, there's a duality for them. For an analogy, to basketball :D, there's surely many ways of playing the game, not just one.

For instance, logically, people may think you should try to get close to the basket (as a strategy) cause it's easy to score there. However people are also good at shooting from the outside, and can score from there as well :D Some people chose one over the other or even combine both.

However, there's always the underlying need of playing hard] which is required in order to succeed and is immaterial of which ever strategy you want to use. Although this playing hard, in the real world, pretty much equates to a confidence thing, variety and change up. heh, hope there wasn't too many holes in that one :lol: i think i just wanted to create another pointless analogy on the fly :p :D

Very nice post and summarizes all the info needed just gotta follow through and dont act like a idiot/get nervous. Gotta be calm but know what your doing .. and hold the door for the lady on the way out ^^

Definitely. I always thought that was a lame gesture ("um..I can open a door myself, y'know"), until I dated a guy that didn't do it. A small thing, but a big impact.

As for the rest of the thread...well...some of it's good, some just...isn't. Sadly, a lot of it works, with some women. A friend of mine basically lets herself be a doormat.

You are absolutely right: My wording is bad. It was a cop out to act as if nothing is my fault. Akin to the "Woe is me, I am a sincere, kind-hearted person and girls refuse to like me" statements we saw earlier in the thread. I'm embarassed that I said that, but thanks for pointing it out. I leave it unedited in the original post cuz, hey, that's what I said.

There's one other thing to consider, though: In the beginning when I wasn't going out of my way to do any favors, I wasn't quite being passive. I was assertively saying, "No." I certainly thought to compliment her all the time originally, but repressed it. I was being... self-serving, perhaps? Maybe you can find yet a better word. Anyway, seems that approach was more effective. :cool:

Nope, just a college student that has way to much time to come up with clever quotes! :)

Or maybe I just have a knack for reducing twenty years spent observing the world around me into catchy phrases....either way, it's kind of my trademark with those who know me, and it always makes me feel good when one of my friends quotes something I said to them to illustrate a point.

As for your thoughts about "game" being like basketball, I think you're on to something. I however know nothing about basketball, so I'm going to put it into a sport I used to play: a QB sneak and a Hail Mary are different plays, but they're both headed towards the same endzone.

Or, to put it into more logical terms:

I guess not every guy that "plays the game" should be labled a player, but on the same token, just because a guy doesn't "buy into this stuff" doesn't make him a great catch. My best friend might as well have written the rule book, but he's very good to his women, especially his fiancee. I have other friends with NOOOO game that treat their women like an cheap flank steak.

Hey Plan9...

I have a suggestion, and perhaps you could explain this better than I, but for your next lesson, I think the boys would really benefit from some tactics to use to move the girl from phone conversations and brief meetings to the bedroom.

I noticed that you mention alot about how to keep things short on the phone, by only calling once or twice a week and keeping the conversation to a minimum and making plans to meet instead. Also, how to leave a conversation just when it gets good.

Also, you talk about how to be when you finally meet the girl and to keep that short as well.

Now, the biggest question is how do you explain how to move the girl away from just conversation and these short meetings where you are almost dining and dashing within an hour, to getting her into an intimate mood and progressing them to your bed room.

Do you have any theories on this?? When is the right time to dismiss the "one hour" meeting rule, and start getting down to what you really want?

Like I said in an earlier post, I think your ideas are right on and you seem to be able to put inot words what I can't....The boys (I am sure) would surely benefit from a few words on this topic.

Well, folks, here it is. Somewhat proof of Plan9's lessons in action. I myself dont' have a particularly hard time getting girls at all... but I decided I'd give some of the things talked about on here a shot. I met this girl Sondra. She's probably a 7.5-8.0 on the "scale." A very cool and attractive lady. I used techniques described here, and nothing else... low and behold I got laid. We have been together now for 3 weeks. About all of the things discussed on here (at least in the first 4-5 pages) are similar to how I approach women. If I do say so, it works quite well. Anyways, good luck to everyone and their female friends.

i just started goin to a new college, and i'm so much better at talking to people. (in part due to stupid guides like this and in part jsut cause i finally got more mature)

but now i'm totally at a loss when some girl walks up and says "H"i to me, and i'm sure i talked to her before, and i cant remember her name at all. so yea i just play along at that point.

Yo Plan9 congrats on getting 10 000+ views on this thread :thumbsup:

:rolleyes:
Ummkay ;) Whatever young lady ;)

Hey now, be nice :p

alright bumping this thread back to the front
plan9, how do you impress a girl that seems to be very shy/not experienced with relationships?
I don't wanna come on too strong and all, but in the context of "the guide", I could see some of the techniques backfiring on me
ever had a situation like this?

I've been casually reading this thread for a while. Let me first off say that I hate mind games and think they are a waste of time.

Suffice to say, I have looked high and low for women that claim what you just said. No matter how many times they claim exactly what you just claimed, they never ever ever ever^100 mean it.

A girl will sit there with a straight face and tell you that, but in the end, it's this kind of stuff that works anyway. The sad part is, it's probably true that you'd rather go with the average guy or whatever, but you don't. You just think you did. Or you just tell yourself that so you sleep better at night. But odds are, you never even know that you ended up with a guy like that.

I don't pull these kind of games because I hate to wear a bullshit facade, I just be myself. But when I'm not interested in a girl, and these things come out unintentionally, they still fucking work. This is how guys came up with these plans. They tried to be an average chump too many times and it failed. Then when they weren't interested in a girl, and did everything different, all the sudden she's all over him. Bingo, the light goes off.

Despite what you think, guys LIKE to "woo" girls and I think most men would rather try the approach that women CLAIM to like. Men wouldn't be doing these things unless females responded to it better. Rest assured that men do the things THAT WORK BEST to get women. If it didn't work on girls who think they could see through it, then men wouldn't waste thier time on it.

These things get females attention. They've got yours because you're posting in this thread.

Well I guess then the dOOt that you will have to consider me as an exception to what you said in your post. I guess I am an exception to a lot of the typical females in that I thrive in an mostly all male enviroment ( like here) and I freely participate in any discussion not because I am a women, but because I have as much right as anyone else.

If this is what works best on getting females.....well so be it. However the type of females that would fall for games and manipulation are not worth obtaining in the first place.

With that said....good luck guys.

My intention wasn't to offend you, if I did. If you're an exception, you're exception. The "yous" contained in my post should have been "you alls" in reference to women who think like that. You'll have to forgive me for being skeptical, since I've met tons of women who say the same things, act the same way, and then turn out the same.

Yes of course you have a right to post here, that's what makes the discussion worth a shit in the first place. No one said otherwise.


If this is what works best on getting females.....well so be it. However the type of females that would fall for games and manipulation are not worth obtaining in the first place.

I aagree, and that's pretty much why I'm single. If I go after girls and if I realize that I have to use game to persue a relationship (phsyical or not) with them, then I pretty much lose interest. I might keep it going out of boredom or hope that she's not a drama queen game playing bitch like everyone else, but she always turns out to be.

I'd like to point out it's not the man's fault this is what works on women. As I mentioned before, men are going to do whatever works best with the least amount of effort to get women. If THESE actions are what it takes, and they obviously are because they obviously work; then why are men to blame for doing it. If women weren't so god damn superficial deep down, and didn't play mind games; men wouldn't have to either.

Bottom line is men wouldn't do it if women didn't like it. If men are _insert derogatory remark here_ for "manipulation and games" then what are women for letting it work?

And yes, that was a candid question I'm actually asking.

I'm really not bitter :) I just accept how this works. If I feel like getting laid just to get laid, then I use these methods. I refuse to apologize for being an animal with a breeding instinct. Women as a gender, reallllly need to get over that fact. Men want to get laid. Men like beutiful women. Men can not help this. A lion does not apologize for slaying a gazelle for food. Nor will men. Women either need to accept this, or shut the fuck up about it.

If I want a relationship, then I don't use these methods because of precisely what we mentioned earlier. I'd rather meet a girl that didn't let those games work on them. I'm still looking, because either they don't exist, or I haven't found her yet.

Whoa!!

I think that you cannot apply being superficial to just ONE sex!! That is definately a personal thing, not a gender thing!

I don't think that women need to accept anything.

Men need to realize that there are many women who just want a good fuck also.

There is no need for me to accept that a man just wants to fuck me when my intention might also be that I just want to fuck him!

I guess my problem, not with these rule especially, but with the whole concept - is I really dont want to view dating as a game, or a contest; and I don't want to make someone like me through elaborate mind games we play against other. I don't want to go round around grading every girls breasts and legs and compunding a score out of 10 before I decide whether I should approach her or not.

I find the whole concept, where men chase, and women make them chase, to somehow reclaim the power which is lost in a patriarchal society - to me is a little uncomfortable.

I mean, these rules or tactics might well work, and I certainly am not going to come in here and try and tell anyone I know better, because I've been single a while now, so obviously whatever I am doing isnt working...

I just wish it didnt have to be this way, and I have to say I hope and believe it doesnt.

And whether it makes me less manly, I dont know, but to what thedoot said - I don't really want to get laid in the sense of it being my priority, I mean, I wouldnt mind - but it isnt what I really want. I want companionship, and understanding, and partnership and just having someone I can chill with, and feel like Im allright with. Sex is good too, but it isnt everything, or even the most important thing.

If all these rules offer is casual sex with girls who are prettier than you... I guess to be truthful maybe I would like it, but then I would probably feel dissapointed after. If people, male and female people, played less games with each other, I think it would be better.

And likening casual sex to a lion hunting its prey, is to me personally, possibly indicative of an attitude to matters of the heart that I would feel is rather strange. I mean, if all I wanted was to fuck someone, I could go get a hooker, a nice one, and for £60/$100 I'd get all of THAT, without any of the heart ache and fear of rejection...

...
 

I'm not. Men are of course more superficial. But men at least admit it. Women hide it.

There is no need for me to accept that a man just wants to fuck me when my intention might also be that I just want to fuck him!

Yea problem is, the women usually has to have these methods used on them before they want to. You might be different....

But when was the last time you saw a hot guy that was your type, and the hot guy saw you, and you both walked up to eachother and said "lets have sex". Probably never. Women who want to have sex just to have sex still have to woo'ed.

If a women starts hanging out with a guy and it was too easy, the guy is doing all the work, calling her, being a one-itis guy; then she's going to think: "That was too easy, if I can get THIS guy this easy, imagine who I can get if I work at it". So basically you just make the women think she's working at it, and that you're a hard catch because all the other guys she dated were too easy.

I agree with you man.

I'd personally rather have a meaningful relationship than just go out and have sport fucks. Doesn't mean I haven't used these methods to get laid because well, I'm a 22 year old male. I also once thought that using these types of methods to start with could lead to something more. But the times I did that, I became disinterested with the girl after a while because I had done that.

I now no longer pull this kind of shit because it isn't worth it to me. I don't want to have to wear a mask and act fake just to get some action. I don't want to have to put up with someone elses baggage just because I wanted to get laid. I don't want to put myself in a position to get some chick pregnant because I had an urge. And we won't even go into STDs....

All in all, it's a been there done that kind of thing and now I'm actually looking for a girl I can respect.

And likening a lion killing prey to casual sex I mean as an allegory, not a metaphor, so don't take it literaly. I'm just saying a lion has an urge to kill to get it's food. That's called instinct and it's stronger than anything. I could have said the lion also has an instinct to find a mate and fight off everything it can to sucessfully breed with it. Well, same with human males. So don't read into it to much :)

*bump*

haha quoting myself and bumping the thread again...I only hope plan9 comes back around to show me the way.

If you find a girl that doesn't play these games... why don't you just treat her how you want to be treated ?

This threads pretty hip' I'll keep reading, learnign and trying out. Thanks for the advice Plan9

alot of you guys and girls are missing the point.

these techniques are for picking up a chick....and hopefully banging her, in this game, quality is not the determining factor.


you the man plan9.

For all those that are still doubting, this works.

I used to be a huge IW until I was 17, then after discovering the same advice, but not from here, I tended to be more OB and a little more mysoginistic- I went on a 6 week college camp where you stay in a dorm and take a college class or two. With my newfound attitude, I easily hooked up with 2 of the girls there, and could have hooked up with more had I not made mistakes that I now know to avoid.

Plan9, excellent advice, did you get this from Fastseduction.com? And also, www.intellectualwhores.com is a good site with ladder theory that explains the IW/OB friends/fuckers zone.

BTW Plan9, where in the O.C. do you live?

the thing that has always made me laugh is when younger guys lie to girls about their age. why? if a girl likes you, she is going to like you whether your 21 or 25 regardless of her age. don't lie to girls about age, it will come back to haunt you in the long run.

Amazing advice. I finally got around to reading this all the way through, and am looking forward to having fun with these techniques. The main concern I have is to learn not to take myself so damned seriously. That might get me farther than I've ever been...

Thanks, plan9!

WRONG

learn to lie to girls. it helps.

ahem i think we're due for another lesson :)

OK, now that I have finally finished reading this entire thread (it took me a week to read, digest, and re read) I am ready to try your advice plan9. Thank you for your time and effort in putting this massive thread together, and thank you all who have posted here giving your own opinions whether they aggree with plan9 or not. I do have a question of my own for plan9 and anyone else who would like to advise me in my actions. I remember that it was said that relationships at work will not work or rarely work out well; but in my situation there is a girl at work who I rarely talk to and whenever I do it is for short periods of time (I just dont have much to say to her). Now, it has been brought to my attention that this girl wants to fuck my brains out or me fuck her brains out however it goes. She is a decent looking girl that I have NOTHING in common with and would NEVER want a relationship with. Would you advise shacking up with this female co'worker? I believe that doing just this will allow me to get my game back because it's been a while for me, a long while. Though I do not plan on having a relationship with this fellow coworker. I have also been under the impression that all she wants is someone to fill her hole, no relationship attached.

For the past few months I actually have been horribly celibate and I honestly did not care (I used to have a girlfriend, really hot, I realized that every time we had sex it was because I instigated it and I was tired of that so I waited for her to do just that (instigate sex). She never did, we broke up, and I guess I never got out of the rut of not instigating anything (that's pretty much the jist of why I stopped fuking)). Now I need the advice of anyone who thinks they have the answer to my prediciment. I also sincerly hope the MAC who started this thread will pitch in his ideas as well.

Thanks guys

Because these girls are few and far between. Right now you are thinking "Oh, but my girl is different." No she isn't.


If you somehow do find this chick, then yes, no need to play games ,but they are just so rare that you do what you have to.

never thanked ya for this.. it's very enlightening, helping me out i think (im kinda lazy but atleast i know what im supposed to be doing now, and taking steps to get there)

Plan 9

I read your thread a few months ago, and have been studing the Player Guide 'http://www.fastseduction.com/guide/', for awhile now. If I recall you gave a homework assignment early in the thread that said to talk to random girls.

I've been working on this a lot lately, and have recently run into quite a bit of success. You asked us to report back, and so I am, using some of the stuff you said in your post my social life has gotten more fun.

I think most people tend to be shy, it's very difficult to meet new people. If you force yourself to do it though, it's extremely rewarding.

I want to revive this thread and lets start talking about this stuff again.

Here are my tips for meeting girls.

1. Dress nice.
2. Don't be afraid to make the first move, get rid of your fear of rejection now (will go into this more if you guys need help)
3. Talk to everyone, not just girls. You never know who is friends with who. Talking to the creepy old dude at the bar might net you a conversation with the cute waitress that regularly waits on him, and a lot of times a free drink.

Ultimate rule is have some confidence and don't be afraid to try.

OK guys, this has nothing to do with my last post. Tonight, OOh tonigh, well last night really, like I has stated before I am a waiter and last night I waited on this extremely beautiful girl and her mom and aunt or some other relative (maybe older friend but that is beside the point). I went over and started converstation talking to the whole group and not focousing on the beauty. Well, I ended up getting her number and called it that night because she was only in town for a few days, she didn't pick up. I called again today, she didn't pick up. I thought 'oh well fuck it she was only in town for a few days anyway, but damn she was hot'. I had today off but my boss called me in to work. I worked all evening and at the end of the night some of my fellow servers were talking about this gorgeous girl that was sitting at table five, I was ready to go home so I didn't check. I ended up cleaning my tables and I heard my name in the air. I looked around and saw that SHE WAS BACK SITTING AT TABLE 5 (sorry trying to hold back my excitement). I went over and spoke to her and her friend made small talk and eventually they envited me to a party at their hotel. now I'm back at home to get a shower but I really wanted to tell you guys about this awesome situation that I just pretty much fell into, I am not a player or that great with girls but I will definately try to use everything that I have learned on this post. THANK YOU PLAN9 if it wasn't for you I would have no idea of what to do you are great!
excuse me for the rant type of writing style but I am extrememly excited about tonight, needed to let some of it out before I went tonight. Wish me luck guys, I'll post how I faire later

it is now later ;)

Yeah, it turned out that this girl was seventeen (not a good thing unless you enjoy being put behind bars) but there was a stimulating conversation that was had. This converstion lasted for five, almost six, hours. She ended up being a fun girl that I would definately would like to hang out with some other time but sadly she lives three or four hours away (probably not worth it). Alas that is how things ended, oh and she told me to call her but I don't see the point.

shes gotta turn 18 sometime.

wow, just read the whole thing- thanks a lot plan9, i'll be sure to be trying these tips out!

hey, it'd be cool if this thread became a sticky already....any mods feeling friendly :D
plan, i'm gonna send you a pm since you don't like to reply here so much anymore, but your awesome thread could use a little more attention.....heh
oh and yeah, I still haven't gotten any, but maybe it's just cause I haven't been trying hard enough
rest assured, hopefully everything will work out

Getting the The Intellegent Girl
 

I have read all of Plan9's posts on this thread that are "lessons" etc. and have loved every one of them. Although I haven't applied any of techniques, this thread has inspired me, because now I know there is hope for me! :D. I have used some of the advice in general with girls I know, and it works so well. I am not getting any from them but I keep their attention for much longer.

First a little about myself: I am 5'9" and 270 lbs.! I have pretty much been fat all my life and so getting in shape, working out, etc. were just completely foreign to me until about a year ago when I tried (unsuccessfully) to lose weight. So needless to say, I just don't have much confidence when it comes to girls. I am a guy who likes to joke around a lot. I am the type of guy who can make people laugh with just a little twist of my face or one word. Most people would describe me as goofy.

My serious problem is always becoming friends with girls that I am attracted to. It ALWAYS happens. I am a "nice guy" and have been taught to respect women from a very early age. I see guys doing the stuff described in this thread and think, why the hell are girls going for this stuff. I guess I really just didn't want to be another one of "those" guys. Of course I end becoming another friend.

My girl to guy friend ratio is about 10:1, which probably says a lot. The problem is that I just don't like hanging out with guys. I am really interested in stuff like classical music and art. Most guys don't want to go to concerts and stuff.

So here is my question.

There is a girl in one of my classes who is really smart and a girl who studies a lot. She basically DOESNT date. I thought she was really boring until I got to know her a little better. She actually is pretty attractive though, and lately I have been trying to knock down her no dating walls. I am good friends with her roommate and she basically told me that "she just doesn't think of guys that way". But here is the thing: I think I can, with the right approach, get her interested.

This is the type of girl I usually go for. Maybe I am just getting myself into a corner, but I just don't find the dolled up girls attractive. There is way more I could post.

So how do you get those girls who are really smart and make it a point not to date?

I know deep down she wants someone, but I just need to make her see that.

Edit: My last girlfriend was similar, but I think that all happened by accident and by me being insanely persistant.

Edit: She isn't gay.

It kinda sounds like the roomate was trying to tell you that the girl you like is gay?

elgar40

There are two things that could be going on here...

One is that your roommate is trying to politely tell you that you're already out of the race (not a big deal, she doesn't even know you yet right)

The other is that this girl has had some horribly strict upbringing and doesn't date, or there is something else wrong with her (emotional problems and stuff).

If I were you, I'd find an 'in' with the roommate. Play a game in their room, or something innocent where she would want to get involved, and then turn it playfully flirty. If you can do that, it will give you room to work, and it sounds like that's all you need brother.

edit: Also don't get 'one-itis' she is not the only attractive intelligent girl out there.

Finally, take the kid gloves off. Smart girls appreciate a smart guy who isn't afraid to call them out, and butt heads with them. A lot of the girls I've dated (or lucked into dating) was because I'm a stubborn asshole who doesn't let them state positions without backing them up with facts. Always remember friends ladder.

Well, we hang out sometimes. There are even sometimes when it is just me and her doing homework together. And believe me, I flirt with her, probably more than she has ever been flirted with. But she is just general unresponsive, with some exceptions. I was just wondering if there were any success stories with this sort of thing.

Yeah, this girl sounds like a hard nut to crack.

Do some homework and find out what her interests are too, and develop the same interests, like a cheesy 80s movie.

Also, have you tried just asking her out. This usually sucks and 90% of the time it doesn't work, but if you feel like you're not getting anywhere anyway, it couldn't hurt. Maybe she's the one in a million girl who won't take perverse pleasure stomping on the nice guys heart.

Also, if you do try to ask her out, be very aggressive, remember, you should never feel bad about asking a girl out, she's at your level or lower.

you really dont know the first thing about getting a girl

Plan9 you are my new hero.

i dont know when this thread was started.. but i just spent the last 3 - 4 hours reading the whole thing (i just signed up today) ..

im totaly joining a gym and dressing better, and following these tips!

here comes the new me!!!!

great thread. i just got over a long term relationship and some fun is just what the doctor ordered. i got to try this out. it's so simple i cant believe it. just got to get the confidence and the time.
thanks

For people who don't want to read the whole thing, here is a link from another post in the thread that has all the important parts.
http://iceberg5.dyndns.org/gg101.pdf

getting girls is easy.
1. Be attracted to them
2. Be somewhat forward
3. Ask

thanks plan9, a lot of useful stuff, keep posting, a lot of us appreciate your posts!!!! :)

bump ...

I'm fascinated by this thread. There's so much here, but also so much I've heard elsewhere. I'm going to take my time to digest it.

Well: I still can't get a girl, but its not that easy when you are fat, depressive, have no confidence or self esteem, no money, no car, are getting evicted from your apartment, dont have any real friends anymore... I think I need a whole other level of techniques.

is this thread still alive? well, bump anyways.

i have this problem where i can't seem to initiate any type of contact with these girls, i just never have the right thing to start of a good conversation or the right idea to get something going. i end up being the one who waits for them to talk to me so that i've been sort of "pushed into the water" and am in the thick of it, where i can just start improvising what i say, and usually i relax after that.

the problem with me is i am too much of a thinker, i analyze when would be the best time to do this, when would be the best time to meet her, and then i never have a plan as to what to do.

as for the 1st lesson in this post i'm doing everything i can in that department, so my self-esteem should be good enough to give me confidence to approach them, but i have this inferiority complex when it comes to girls that i don't deserve any of them...they are just so superior.

lol, just read lesson 10, thanks.

:eek: Damn, nice job ;)

funny stuff. reminds me of the whole "respect the cock, tame the cunt" thing from Magnolia. Sadly this stuff works, but then your stuck with someone that would actually fall for it. The trick is to find a woman that transcends the rules. At least for me anyway. Of course i'm not in my early 20's anymore.

Best quote. Ever.

I'm beginning to think that "someone that would actually fall for it" is almost redundant -- the "it" is ANY technique that will work on your desired target. And, more important, are there really women who "transcend" the game? I don't think so -- they're just so good at it you don't notice.

Their first criterion, is that they don't illuminate their criteria. Their second, is that they retain the right to change their criteria. Their third, is that they prefer a man who plays, over a man who doesn't. But he has to "play" in the "right way." How can there be a woman who "transcends" that?

Alright, since this has just been updated, I'll give you my experience. I'm a terrible person to initiate contacts. Lack of confidence is my problem, but it's getting more and more apparent I'm a stud so that's starting to go away. :) Anyway, I just met this girl last Sunday. She works with my sister, and when she first saw me she had been bugging my sister on a daily basis to introduce me to her.

We go out and have a great time. I just strike up normal conversation with her and we talk about all sorts of stuff. I pick on her about some things in a joking manner, and she eats it up. What's really nice is there was no real awkward silence because it was a group get together. I brought her back to her car when the date was over and she asked if I wanted her number. I got hers and she took mine. I gave her a kiss (not a serious one) and a hug and was on my way.

I talked to my sister the next day and she said everyone at work was talking about me, cause this girl was saying how great I am and how she likes me. So my sister told me to call her that next day (which is against everything I've read before), but I did and it was great. We talked for like five minutes tops and I asked her what her schedule looked like for the upcoming week. She told me she had Saturday and then the following Wednesday off, so I asked her out for Wednesday, and she was like, "what about Saturday?" I work early Saturday mornings, so I didn't want to take any chances and have a shitty time being so tired. I told her about work and she was okay with Wednesday.

Anyway, I kept thinking about how I probably should see her for a little bit on Saturday at the least, just so she doesn't forget about me, so I called her yesterday (Wednesday) and talked for like fifteen minutes, ending with the proposal of lunch on Saturday after I get out of work. She was all for it and so I'm set to see her both days (After I asked her about Saturday she was like, "So what are we doing Wednesday?").

So that's where I stand right now. This isn't the typical way to pick up girls cause I had someone else help me out, but in my way of handling the dates and stuff, that's been explained here. So far everything has worked, although one thing I'm dealing with is over analyzing the situation. Man, it SUCKS when you have too much time to think about things, cause you end up killing your confidence. I'm building it back up to where it was so I *should* be okay, but we'll see. I'll know for sure Saturday if I want to keep things going with this girl.

Anyway, just decided to post up an "experience" for you guys to see. This players guide is a great tool to build off of, and not just because of confidence. Women play games just as much as guys do, so learn how to play it right if you want to be successful dating. Good luck.

I agree.