The Neverending Vista Issue Thread

[Chimera]

Truth be told....I dont have Vista, but its inevitable that this thread be created and I wanna know how bad things are before I "upgrade".

Lets start with the minimum requirements to even run the beast.

The low end one will need a speed of at least 800MHz, 512MB of system memory and a graphics processor that is DirectX 9 capable. The Aero ready one will need a 1GHz 32-bit or 64-bit processor, 1GB of system memory, 128MB of graphics memory, 40GB of hard drive capacity with 15GB free space, a DVD-ROM drive, audio output capabilities and Internet access.


Guess my Kids will have to settle for XP.....hell I might even reformat, and load 98 second edition...heh

[soccerchamp76]

Those aren't that lofty of demands. The only one that might require people to upgrade is in the memory department. Memory is relatively cheap anyways and most people who have under 1gig will be better served having 1+gig anyways, even with XP.

[Elphaba]

Thanks for the thread, Chimera. I nearly started one but really had nothing specific to say except my 70 year-old (!) mother is the first one in my circle of family and friends to have it.

One warning I would offer after setting up her new computer is that compatibility with other devices (her printer) and software (her spyware) are going to be an issue. I wouldn't be in a great hurry to get Vista until it is more broadly compatible across the board.

My 2cents.

[frankx]

I am currently running Vista Ultimate and testing it for my office. So far I have had few problems.

The primary problem seems to be with the print spooler. For some strange reason Vista keeps stopping the print spooler service, and this prevents me from printing to my network. Microsoft has offered no solution to this and it appears to be a common problem.

It also seems to be okay with 1Gb of memory or above, but is rather sluggish with anything less. Of course this may be subjective to the laptop it is installed on.

Some of my colleagues who are developers have tried to run Vista, but always wind up switching back to XP.

[Willravel]

I'm frustrated with the dissapointing security. Most of the cool new security aren't in the Home Premium or Basic editions. The new stuff could easily fit in a simple service pack, and doesn't need to be tauted as this amazing leap forward and require a whole new platform. $200 is a lot to spend on a service pack. Most of the other new software, such as the Gadgets (you mean Widgets?), Vista Explorer (a carbon copy of OS X Finder, which is years old), Windows Calender (the same as the years old iCal, but missing group calendars with WebDAV), and Start Menu Search (still lagging behind Spotlight). I'll bet you all quite a bit that when the next platform of Windows comes out, it will feature applications similar to Leopard's Time Machine, Multiple Desktops, and Spotlight. I'm still a little frustrated that I have to work on a Windows running machine at work. The only real benifits would be the randomizing memory address usage function, or using a USB memory stick as additional RAM.

Meh.

[Bossnass]

Originally Posted by willravel

I'm frustrated with the dissapointing security. Most of the cool new security aren't in the Home Premium or Basic editions. The new stuff could easily fit in a simple service pack, and doesn't need to be tauted as this amazing leap forward and require a whole new platform. $200 is a lot to spend on a service pack. Most of the other new software, such as the Gadgets (you mean Widgets?), Vista Explorer (a carbon copy of OS X Finder, which is years old), Windows Calender (the same as the years old iCal, but missing group calendars with WebDAV), and Start Menu Search (still lagging behind Spotlight). I'll bet you all quite a bit that when the next platform of Windows comes out, it will feature applications similar to Leopard's Time Machine, Multiple Desktops, and Spotlight. I'm still a little frustrated that I have to work on a Windows running machine at work. The only real benifits would be the randomizing memory address usage function, or using a USB memory stick as additional RAM.

Meh.

Ok, you like Macs. I understand. So are you using a Home Premium or Basic editor on your work computer? I'm not sure why a business application wouldn't have spring for a business oriented version. Or are you just doing a little mac-loving-trolling action?

[cyrnel]

Originally Posted by Elphaba

One warning I would offer after setting up her new computer is that compatibility with other devices (her printer) and software (her spyware) are going to be an issue. I wouldn't be in a great hurry to get Vista until it is more broadly compatible across the board.

"Would you like a Vista compatible printer with that $25 USB cable?"

Yep, the first few (6) months are best limited to new system purchases, gluttons, and support/development. Drivers will arrive but right now it's ugly. Many older peripherals are to be orphaned. It's up to users to start calling vendors. Make noise. (even if you don't have Vista yet.)

One of my customers bought new boxes this week (didn't ask me) and can't use them with most of their office and field equipment. They're talking about running illegit XP until driver availability improves. I didn't hear that. (Whoops.)

[Willravel]

Originally Posted by Bossnass

Ok, you like Macs. I understand. So are you using a Home Premium or Basic editor on your work computer? I'm not sure why a business application wouldn't have spring for a business oriented version. Or are you just doing a little mac-loving-trolling action?

I'm sorry, I must have missed your issue about Vista, as that is the thread's reason. I'll read your post again in case I missed it.

Edit: I used Home Premium at my friend's house after work. My business doesn't have it in yet.

[spindles]

Originally Posted by soccerchamp76

Those aren't that lofty of demands. The only one that might require people to upgrade is in the memory department. Memory is relatively cheap anyways and most people who have under 1gig will be better served having 1+gig anyways, even with XP.

My understanding is that the graphics requirements are pretty high - part of the reason I got a laptop with a decent graphics card when I upgraded 6 months ago. I really wouldn't try running this on a low end graphics card. Having said all that - a compatible graphics card won't cost too much either.

[guthmund]

I ran Beta 2 and RC1 on a Nvidia 6600GT--less than $100 at newegg--and it ran fine. I'll admit, I didn't play with it too much, but it seemed to run well enough.

[soccerchamp76]

Originally Posted by spindles

My understanding is that the graphics requirements are pretty high - part of the reason I got a laptop with a decent graphics card when I upgraded 6 months ago. I really wouldn't try running this on a low end graphics card. Having said all that - a compatible graphics card won't cost too much either.

It all depends if you use the Aero interface or not. Microsoft made the Vista Basic version for the people who don't want to have to upgrade for a new graphics card.

On the PC side, it isn't that big of a deal to upgrade a graphics card as for PC's there are hundreds of possible choices from $75-$600.

[Jinn]

Been using Vista Ultimate on my desk machine at work, and it's been very nice.

Widgets are very different than Gadgets, and I'm very much in love with the new Gadgets I downloaded on their site. Get off our Windows thread, mac fanboi! :-D

The issues I've had:

* Visual SourceSafe 6.0 wasn't compatible, and failed to install. I installed Visual SourceSafe 2005 with no problems.

* Logging onto an NT domain takes FOREVER. If I log on as local administrator, it takes about 3 seconds. If I log onto the domain, it takes between 2 and 3 minutes. I think this has to do with checking for IPv6 support, but I'm not sure how to disable it.

* VMware Workstation 5.5 is a bit unstable, and on first-boot takes 3-4 minutes to start the VM. The virtual Ethernet is disabled by Vista security, but if you re-create it, Bridged networking is fine.

After loading the first VM, the rest are fine and start immediately.

* A process-tracking system we developed in-house doesn't work at all, but I wasn't expecting it to. The programmer who designed it took about 2 days. I just use a VM with 2000 to run it.

Office 2007 is very nice, and the Outlook integration into my Start > Search is nice.

RDC and WinVNC seem to work fine, as well - in both directions.

A handful of in-house legacy apps also work just fine.

The most exciting parts are the Start Search, the awesome 3D chess game that comes with it (secretaries around the world are cheering), IPv6 support, the new security model, and of course - the gadgets.

[Jinn]

AC3 Filter (common audio codec for DiVX encoded AVIs) doesn't seem to work in Vista. Had to boot up a 2003 VM just to watch a damned movie at work.

[Derwood]

only little problem i've run into (and maybe someone has a solution) is that the Photo Slide Show Screen Saver won't work. I try previewing it and it says "won't run due to an error", and using it for real just results in a blank screen. suggestions?

EDIT: And..... now it works. Random

[bendsley]

I'm messing with Windows Business up at work. I would recommend that anyone planning on deploying Vista at their place of business make sure that they do not use Vista Ultimate. Ultimate does not support VLK and many of the features of Vista Ultimate cannot be controlled via Group Policy.

Jin: You can disable IPv6 support in the network properties. Just uncheck the check box and remove it. Do your other machines log in quickly to the domain (those not running vista)? I don't have any problems logging into the domain. It logs in just as quickly as any other machine does.

[Jinn]

Yea I have 20 other machines on the domain that I maintain... they're WinXP Home/Pro, Win 2000 SP4. Win2003 SP1, and they all log on immediately.

[Wunderbar]

You know, I've heard a lot of badmouthing of Windows Vista, but I can't see where this is coming from.

I purchased Vista Home Premium edition, and it's been one of the greatest things I ever put on my computer. It's treated me great thus far, and all I've needed to do is update my sound card drivers, which was a cakewalk.

Maybe I'm just lucky? I don't know, my machine isn't the greatest thing ever built, but it's holding down Vista pretty damn well.

[Prince]

For those of you who are using Vista:
1. Are you happy with it?
2. Does it run at least as fast as XP did on your machine?
3. What are your system specs?

I am very interested in Vista, but I'm picky about performance. So I'm trying to find out about other people's experiences beforehand.

[Jinn]

1. Yes, but I wouldn't spend the money to buy it if I were using it for personal use. It doesn't give me anything I don't have in XP or MCE2005.

2. Although not empirically tested, it appears to run faster. I haven't tested GPU/Video performance specifically, although I can't imagine it being as fast with Aero and the additional RAM usage. I use it at work, so I've not had a chance to try a 3D game or movie.

3. P4 3.2 GHz, 2 GB DDR400 RAM, 64M onboard video

[Stompy]

Just a warning for those using Vista or wanting to experiment with it: unplug all extra hard drives or devices from your machine upon installing Vista.

It may pick a random hard drive or partition to format to use as the MBR and it will NOT warn you or ask your permission.

I just lost an entire drive's worth of data because of Vista's stupid installer. Basically I have my main XP install partition, then on the same drive, an empty 20 gig partition on which I put Vista.

I have a third IDE drive I use as an encrypted trueCrypt volume... and this is what the installer randomly chose to format.

After vista was done installing, I was wondering why my system booted directly into XP with no OS selection menu... lo and behold, when I went to mount my trueCrypt volume, I saw a bunch of boot loader BS. For no reason whatsoever, it picked this volume, formatted it, and tried to put a bootloader on it. WTF?

Needless to say, I'm very fucking pissed that they would program such a thing to randomly format your stuff without asking you.

[bendsley]

Originally Posted by Stompy

Just a warning for those using Vista or wanting to experiment with it: unplug all extra hard drives or devices from your machine upon installing Vista.

It may pick a random hard drive or partition to format to use as the MBR and it will NOT warn you or ask your permission.

I just lost an entire drive's worth of data because of Vista's stupid installer. Basically I have my main XP install partition, then on the same drive, an empty 20 gig partition on which I put Vista.

I have a third IDE drive I use as an encrypted trueCrypt volume... and this is what the installer randomly chose to format.

After vista was done installing, I was wondering why my system booted directly into XP with no OS selection menu... lo and behold, when I went to mount my trueCrypt volume, I saw a bunch of boot loader BS. For no reason whatsoever, it picked this volume, formatted it, and tried to put a bootloader on it. WTF?

Needless to say, I'm very fucking pissed that they would program such a thing to randomly format your stuff without asking you.

Vista does have an area upon install where it asks you where you would like for it to install itself. Were you maybe going too fast that you missed it?

[Stompy]

Originally Posted by bendsley

Vista does have an area upon install where it asks you where you would like for it to install itself. Were you maybe going too fast that you missed it?

No, I saw it. I wanted Vista to install itself so I get the OS selection manual just like any other install... but to the place where it already exists (which is on my main XP partition). I didn't want it to pick a random hard drive and attempt to put it there, which is what it did.

I've done this on 3 other machines with no probs, but then again, the other machines don't have extra hard drives for it to potentially wipe.

[jpmck03]

~~

[jvwgtr]

Let me start off by saying I'm a huge Microsoft fan...
I have a new machine for work that came with a Vista Business upgrade...which wasn't too bad, except that it took over 2 hours, and I had to remove many incompatible programs.
Now that I have Vista running - it's neat-looking, but a little hard to get used to. Everything is just a little different, or in a new spot, which will be frustrating for a while.
BUT I'm also finding out (the hard way) that many of the programs I use for work (like an older version of Visual Studio, PGP, ...and random things like my FTP client) no longer function. AT ALL. Every program has a new version (you can purchase) that might work, but it's made my job nearly impossible.
I find myself asking, "Now...why did I do this?"
If you're thinking about moving to Vista, be ready to buy new versions of every program you own.

[thfonz98]

Originally Posted by Prince

For those of you who are using Vista:
1. Are you happy with it?
2. Does it run at least as fast as XP did on your machine?
3. What are your system specs?

1. Yes I am very happy with it. Even more so after podcast explain in some detail some of the security improvements that have been added to vista: http://www.twit.tv/sn83 .

2. Runs about the same on one of my machines(my previous generation computer which lacks a little on the graphics cards for vista). Runs faster on by current main system.

3.
Main system: overclocked slightly 6300 intel core2duo, 1.5gb RAM, geforce 7600gs 512MB, two HDs 500GB.

Slower system: AMD 3200+, 1GB RAM, geforce 6200 128MB,160GB HD

[guthmund]

Originally Posted by Prince

For those of you who are using Vista:
1. Are you happy with it?
2. Does it run at least as fast as XP did on your machine?
3. What are your system specs?

I am very interested in Vista, but I'm picky about performance. So I'm trying to find out about other people's experiences beforehand.

1. I guess.
2. It seems to run just as fast, if not faster.
3. Athlon 64 x2 4200+ with 1Gb of ram (I know...need more) and an Nvidia 7900 GS.

It's pretty and eventually, they'll (or I'll) work all the kinks out like XP, but until then...

I have Home Premium, which is nice and it certainly runs well. I had no problems setting it up. It starts up quick and seems to run just as fast, if not faster in some cases, as my "old" XP install did.

That being said, it's the little things that will annoy you.

A few things have been moved or renamed and there's a ton of redundancy built in (Under the system option in the control panel...two different "tasks" off to the left go to exactly the same dialog box with tabs. ) For some reason, everytime I insert my thumbdrive, Vista wants to format it and every disc I put in gets the "what would you like to do with this?" dialog box no matter how many check boxes or drop down menus I "fix." The UAC is annoying as all get out unless you turn it off, which the OS will then nag the hell out of you until you turn that off. A few of my older programs require work-arounds and quite a few won't work at all.

But all that is fine. I expect to have to update most things when I make the switch; I expect some things to require a little work. The thing is the good isn't really enough to justify the hassle of the whole endeavor. To be honest, if I had not of spent the money and felt obligated to install Vista, I probably would have just stuck with my XP install and waited until I had to upgrade. The eye candy is pretty, but it doesn't compare to Beryl on my Ubuntu install.

Edit..Oops, forgot..

The one thing that really bugs the crap out of me....My "old" photoshop doesn't seem to work with Vista, Adobe's response seems to be "screw you and upgrade, you obsolete ass" So unless I come into some money or run into an unscrupulous ,peg-legged scalywag from the sea who wants to sell me a copy..."cheap," I guess I'll be photoshop-less, which is a shame, because I was just starting to get the hang of it....really.

[Macade]

1. Not really. I can't seem to figure out the point of the OS. The security is a joke in my opinion. The eye candy well is not necessary but I suppose it is nice.
2. Seems to run about the same speed as XP. I have seen benchmarks thought that show it is in fact slower. Makes sense that it would be as it has a lot more its doing.
3. P4 2.6, 1GB RAM, Nvidia 7800.

I am not sure if I would consider myself a power user or not, I do like to get into the corners and look around. The people who know me consider me a power user but what do they know. Anyway, I HATE UAC. UAC is the most annoying feature Vista has and so it is the first thing I disable. For those who do not know, UAC is User Account Control. If you have seen the latest get a Mac ad with the security guy in the background saying "Allow or Deny?" then you have seen UAC. That ad is so spot on that it I find it hilarious. UAC basically grays out your desktop and gives you a dialog asking you to allow something to do something. In some ways it may be nice if you don't use a computer that much or don't understand how to use one securely because it will stop a program from hijacking your browser or from screwing up your system. I think it goes too far though. I tried to create a folder in my own user directory and it brought up that dialog asking me if I was sure I knew what I was doing. I then wanted to rename it and once again I get the UAC prompt. I then wanted to move it somewhere else...Yep I once again got that damn prompt.

The other thing that drives me nuts about Vista is that it appears to me that they completely screwed up the security. I needed to modify my host file. I was logged in as the administrator. I went to modify it but it would not allow me to. After doing some searches online I found out that I had to go find the editor exe file (in this case, notepad) and right click on it and tell Windows to run notepad as administrator. This just seems absolutely asinine to me. Now I admit I may not fully understand the reasoning behind this move, perhaps there is some great reason for it but it does not make any sense to me that I would have to do this.

Anyway, you may chose to disregard all of this, because Friday of next week I will be getting my first Mac. I ordered a MacPro after using my friends MacBook for a while. Loved it. I will still use Windows..have to as I am a programmer and my job requires me to. But for my main use, I am switching. Besides I have been wanting to play a little more with Linux/BSD (Mac OS X is built on BSD), so now I have to.

Other than the two issues above, Vista seems OK...possibly even nice I guess. But it does not seem like "That" big of a jump from XP unless you count the eye candy. Some things I do like about it are the improved Windows Explorer, I love the ability to see favorite links without having to click on anything....yeah its the little things. I also like the start up time, it boots fast. The jury is still out on the start button for me...Not sure I like the way it works now...you can revert it back to the old style though. It doe shave some nice things.

OK so this post has been way too long. Sorry for boring all of you. Just my 2 cents.

One last thing. I absolutely love Microsoft Office 2007. Microsoft did an incredible job on it. Just wish the same team could have done Vista.

Macade

[Halx]

I'm in no hurry to switch to Vista. I want to actually be able to run all my programs and games.

[Dilbert1234567]

i have a client who just got vista on his new system, there were no XP systems available... he's mostly blind and deaf and vista SUCKS for him, we're reverting to XP asap.

if you increase the font sizes the start menu does not compensate for them, if they are to big, they wont display and you cannot scroll

[newjunkorama]

What's up fellas,

I'm new here, and was looking around the forum and figured I chime in with my two cents regarding Vista. I recently was able to get a copy of Vista Business through the University I'm at, and figured I'd try it to see what it was like. (I was planning a fresh nuke & install on my laptop anyway so it seemed like an okay idea) Anyway, it installed just fine without any problems, and the visual effects seemed to be working okay considering it was a couple year old laptop.

To answer Prince's question
1. It's not the worst OS on earth, but it definitely has its fair share of bugs, quirks, and compatibility issues. All in all I wasn't too thrilled about it and have since reverted back to a Ubuntu/WinXP Pro dual boot situation. (Which I was planning on doing anyway)

2. It definitely ran slower than XP did, however that was to be expected since I had all the Aero bells and whistles running at the highest resolution plus all those widgets running. I'm not saying that it was so slow that it reduced productivity that much, but it was definitely noticable.

3. My laptops specs are P4 1.7 GHz, 512 MB ram with 256 MB ATI video card.

If you are unsure about installing Vista or not a big fan of MS in general, I would suggest staying away from Vista for awhile. WinXP is more stable and is in general way easier to use. If you enjoy having all those fancy visual effects, but don't want to buy a Mac, and aren't afraid if Linux, I suggest you look into running Beryl on Ubuntu.

[SecretMethod70]

This sums up my experience with Vista:

[snicka]

I have upgraded to Vista on a couple of my boxes and I have no real complaints. Once you disable user account control it is a really nice OS. Including Media Center with the Home Premium and Ultimate configurations is a nice touch as all I needed to do was toss home premium on my media center box and I was good to go. (BTW Vista Media Center is much nicer than XP MCE 2005)