Bisexuality - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Pennington · 07-24-2003, 04:37 AM

Why is it that bisexual men are looked down on. Bisexual women and lesbians are idolized by many men, and gay men have managed to get alot of respect through the 90s. But bisexual men are still looked on as horny guys who would fuck anything that moves or just gay men who don't want to come all the way out of the closet.

Is it that hard to believe that someone can love both sexes?

Here's a poem I heard someplace along time ago. [edit] - now that I think about it, it may have been in the ladies lounge before the crash.

---------------------------
"This Poem Can Be Put Off No Longer"
by Susan Carlton

you don't exist. he used to say it to my face: you don't exist.

you're what? what's that?
oh. can I watch sometime?
yeah, I've heard that that's trendy right now.
you're just trying to be cool.
you're just trying to be politically correct.
you're a fence sitter.
we're all waiting for you to come out come down.
we're all waiting for you. which one are you more, really?
who makes you come the most?
you just take it wherever you can get it, don't you?
we're here to talk about everybody - except you.
We're working for the rights of everybody - except you.
the oppression of everybody - except you has got to end.
don't worry, you'll grow out of it.
but you're one of us.
you can't be one of us and one of those too.
i could never sleep with you.
i could never sleep with one of you.

i might get dumped

i might get thrown over for one of them

i might get AIDS

i might die

i might lose all of my friends.

oh, so is that why you always have such a hard time coming?
yeah, i know that some people feel that way,
but why do you always have to talk about it so much?
you can't ever be monogamous/get married/have kids/ have a stable relationship, can you?

you're just oversexed, horny, desperate, confused.
why, you'd sleep with anyone wouldn't you?

is this your way of telling me that
you want to go to bed with me?

I went through that phase too.
it lasted 2 minutes...
2 months...
6 months...
2 years...
10 years...
but i saw the light eventually.

i feel that way too, but that doesn't make me one of you.

we know that is it very difficult,

we know exactly how you feel.
we can help you.
just step over here to this nice little box we have for you,
that's it, step inside, cozy and tight.
if you breathe real shallowly,
there should be just enough air to live on.....
now doesn't that feel better?

and there is always that morning fourteen in foster city,
i woke up from what was not a dream
in which the two of you had taught me
the meaning of a new word

epilogue:
"we need to have this meeting as this tree ain't ever been planted yet."

------------------------

And bisexuals are NOT the cause of AIDS.

pixelbend · 07-24-2003, 05:24 AM

My wife once asked me why men liked to see two women together. I told her it was because there were no men to get in the way of looking at the women.

Men want a threesome, just not with two guys.

Taliesin · 07-24-2003, 05:33 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pennington
And bisexuals are NOT the cause of AIDS.

People having unprotected sex is the (well, a) cause of AIDS. Straight, gay or bi.

Pennington · 07-24-2003, 05:44 AM

When in high school sex ed, my teacher stated that bisexuals brought aids to america. When asked what a bisexual was, he said that they were people who don't care who they have sex with. I gave him hell for that.

lurkette · 07-24-2003, 05:49 AM

I think anybody who (apologies for the gradschool speak here) occupies a space of liminal identity threatens peoples' desire to categorize and define other people. You see it with people of mixed race, and you see it with bisexuals. Like it or not, what's considered sexually attractive these days is still largely based on heterosexual male desire. Bisexual women have it easier because of the whole girl-on-girl fantasy that's been talked to death around here. That still fits into the largely male-defined repertoire of sexual desire: men can watch and get turned on, even if they don't participate, so it's still all about the hetero male fantasy. Bisexual men threaten that becuase they don't fit into that hetero male fantasy world. You're seen as either a threat or irrelevant. However, over in the ladies lounge there was a thread about whether watching two men was a turn-on for women, and you'd be surprised how many women think it's incredibly sexy.

I don't know if things will ever change - if humans will ever get better at accepting people who are neither here-nor-there, who don't fit into a binary worldview. I hope so. I think a tolerance for ambiguity is one of the hallmarks of higher thinking.

ninety09 · 07-24-2003, 08:06 AM

I must be weird or something. Feels like I'm the only male who doesn't care at all for lesbians, or for having a threesome. Oh well.

As for bisexuality, it seems to be the latest trend. It's very 'cool' to be bi nowadays. If you ask people if they're bi, a lot of people will say yes (mostly women), but if you had asked them the same question 5 years ago.. I'm pretty sure the majority of them would've answered No.

*shrug*
I could be totally wrong, but that's just the way as I see it. It's hip to be bisexual!

Donkeypuncher · 07-24-2003, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ninety09
[B]I must be weird or something. Feels like I'm the only male who doesn't care at all for lesbians, or for having a threesome.

Nah; I know more than a few guys who are ambivalent about or just plain don't even like it. To each his own... Do what's comfortable for you.

Quote:

It's hip to be bisexual!

I've noticed it since the early 90's, but that's when I started exploring my own sexuality so maybe it was there and I just didn't notice it til then. Maybe that's just the cycle for most of us...

Men are taught to fear gay men. I've never cared one way or the other, but I've seen it my whole life and the repercussions are evident in a lot of ways, not the least of which is this current topic.

I've had threesomes with two women and with two men. Big whoop - everyone had a good time and that was the point anyway. What really gets me is how many guys wouldn't even consider the latter - somehow, being naked in the same room with another man makes you "gay" and that's abhorrent. Feh. You know... it's possible to accomplish that without sucking someone's dick, if that's not your thing... Narrow thinking based on fears makes my skin crawl. If you're just not into it, great, do what works for you... but when you see people reacting from irrational fears... what a waste.

Besides, like Woody Allen said, "bisexuality doubles your chances for a date on Saturday night."

lurkette · 07-24-2003, 11:25 AM

I don't know about this whole "hip to be 'bi'" thing - maybe it's more acceptable, but it's certainly not easy, especially if you're out about it, and I can't see someone saying it lightly if they were serious. It brings up a whole host of complications with relationships, straight people think you're a poser and gay people think you're a wuss. Maybe some people say it without really meaning it, or just for attention/to be provocative, but most of the people I know who are bi are genuinely attracted to both sexes.

Spinach_Indeed · 07-24-2003, 01:32 PM

I was actually talking to someone in #tfp someytime ago about Bisexuality. He stated that Bisexuals can never be happy in Monogomous relationships, because they can't find perfection in either Sex. I'd have to disagree. Bisexuality is the abilty to find perfection in both genders.

While Bisexuality is hip in some places, there are still some places where Homosexuality and Bisexuality are treated with just as much violence and negatisivim as always. I grew up in Southern Virginia where Any trace of homosexuality or Racial Dating was met with threats.

EleqTrizi'T · 07-24-2003, 01:38 PM

Men are not taught to fear gay men. They are taught to taunt, torture, punch, kick, stomp, etc gay men. Now people learning to be more accepting, but it's going to be hard to swing so far in the other direction.

I would just say, give it time. People certainly haven't stopped being racist. People DEFINETELY haven't stopped stereotyping. The gay movement is relatively new. It'll be 50 or so years before their will be significant gains in attitude (the law will move more quickly).

07-24-2003, 04:37 AM	#1 (permalink)
Pennington Banned Location: Autonomous Zone	Bisexuality Why is it that bisexual men are looked down on. Bisexual women and lesbians are idolized by many men, and gay men have managed to get alot of respect through the 90s. But bisexual men are still looked on as horny guys who would fuck anything that moves or just gay men who don't want to come all the way out of the closet. Is it that hard to believe that someone can love both sexes? Here's a poem I heard someplace along time ago. [edit] - now that I think about it, it may have been in the ladies lounge before the crash. --------------------------- "This Poem Can Be Put Off No Longer" by Susan Carlton you don't exist. he used to say it to my face: you don't exist. you're what? what's that? oh. can I watch sometime? yeah, I've heard that that's trendy right now. you're just trying to be cool. you're just trying to be politically correct. you're a fence sitter. we're all waiting for you to come out come down. we're all waiting for you. which one are you more, really? who makes you come the most? you just take it wherever you can get it, don't you? we're here to talk about everybody - except you. We're working for the rights of everybody - except you. the oppression of everybody - except you has got to end. don't worry, you'll grow out of it. but you're one of us. you can't be one of us and one of those too. i could never sleep with you. i could never sleep with one of you. i might get dumped i might get thrown over for one of them i might get AIDS i might die i might lose all of my friends. oh, so is that why you always have such a hard time coming? yeah, i know that some people feel that way, but why do you always have to talk about it so much? you can't ever be monogamous/get married/have kids/ have a stable relationship, can you? you're just oversexed, horny, desperate, confused. why, you'd sleep with anyone wouldn't you? is this your way of telling me that you want to go to bed with me? I went through that phase too. it lasted 2 minutes... 2 months... 6 months... 2 years... 10 years... but i saw the light eventually. i feel that way too, but that doesn't make me one of you. we know that is it very difficult, we know exactly how you feel. we can help you. just step over here to this nice little box we have for you, that's it, step inside, cozy and tight. if you breathe real shallowly, there should be just enough air to live on..... now doesn't that feel better? and there is always that morning fourteen in foster city, i woke up from what was not a dream in which the two of you had taught me the meaning of a new word epilogue: "we need to have this meeting as this tree ain't ever been planted yet." ------------------------ And bisexuals are NOT the cause of AIDS. Last edited by Pennington; 08-18-2003 at 01:28 PM..

07-24-2003, 05:24 AM	#2 (permalink)
pixelbend Too hot in the hot tub!	My wife once asked me why men liked to see two women together. I told her it was because there were no men to get in the way of looking at the women. Men want a threesome, just not with two guys. __________________ But I don't want ANY Spam!

07-24-2003, 05:49 AM	#5 (permalink)
lurkette My future is coming on Moderator Emeritus Location: east of the sun and west of the moon	I think anybody who (apologies for the gradschool speak here) occupies a space of liminal identity threatens peoples' desire to categorize and define other people. You see it with people of mixed race, and you see it with bisexuals. Like it or not, what's considered sexually attractive these days is still largely based on heterosexual male desire. Bisexual women have it easier because of the whole girl-on-girl fantasy that's been talked to death around here. That still fits into the largely male-defined repertoire of sexual desire: men can watch and get turned on, even if they don't participate, so it's still all about the hetero male fantasy. Bisexual men threaten that becuase they don't fit into that hetero male fantasy world. You're seen as either a threat or irrelevant. However, over in the ladies lounge there was a thread about whether watching two men was a turn-on for women, and you'd be surprised how many women think it's incredibly sexy. I don't know if things will ever change - if humans will ever get better at accepting people who are neither here-nor-there, who don't fit into a binary worldview. I hope so. I think a tolerance for ambiguity is one of the hallmarks of higher thinking. __________________ "If ten million people believe a foolish thing, it is still a foolish thing." - Anatole France

07-24-2003, 11:25 AM	#8 (permalink)
lurkette My future is coming on Moderator Emeritus Location: east of the sun and west of the moon	I don't know about this whole "hip to be 'bi'" thing - maybe it's more acceptable, but it's certainly not easy, especially if you're out about it, and I can't see someone saying it lightly if they were serious. It brings up a whole host of complications with relationships, straight people think you're a poser and gay people think you're a wuss. Maybe some people say it without really meaning it, or just for attention/to be provocative, but most of the people I know who are bi are genuinely attracted to both sexes. __________________ "If ten million people believe a foolish thing, it is still a foolish thing." - Anatole France

07-24-2003, 01:32 PM	#9 (permalink)
Spinach_Indeed Banned? Location: Artic Tundra	I was actually talking to someone in #tfp someytime ago about Bisexuality. He stated that Bisexuals can never be happy in Monogomous relationships, because they can't find perfection in either Sex. I'd have to disagree. Bisexuality is the abilty to find perfection in both genders. While Bisexuality is hip in some places, there are still some places where Homosexuality and Bisexuality are treated with just as much violence and negatisivim as always. I grew up in Southern Virginia where Any trace of homosexuality or Racial Dating was met with threats. __________________ Spinach in Need is Spinach Indeed

07-24-2003, 05:44 AM	#4 (permalink)
Pennington Banned Location: Autonomous Zone	When in high school sex ed, my teacher stated that bisexuals brought aids to america. When asked what a bisexual was, he said that they were people who don't care who they have sex with. I gave him hell for that.

07-24-2003, 08:06 AM	#6 (permalink)
ninety09 Flavour of the Weak Location: Canada	I must be weird or something. Feels like I'm the only male who doesn't care at all for lesbians, or for having a threesome. Oh well. As for bisexuality, it seems to be the latest trend. It's very 'cool' to be bi nowadays. If you ask people if they're bi, a lot of people will say yes (mostly women), but if you had asked them the same question 5 years ago.. I'm pretty sure the majority of them would've answered No. shrug I could be totally wrong, but that's just the way as I see it. It's hip to be bisexual!

07-24-2003, 01:38 PM	#10 (permalink)
EleqTrizi'T Insane	Men are not taught to fear gay men. They are taught to taunt, torture, punch, kick, stomp, etc gay men. Now people learning to be more accepting, but it's going to be hard to swing so far in the other direction. I would just say, give it time. People certainly haven't stopped being racist. People DEFINETELY haven't stopped stereotyping. The gay movement is relatively new. It'll be 50 or so years before their will be significant gains in attitude (the law will move more quickly).