Coll Storm

This hasn't happened yet, but I'm expecting that it's going to happen, because of a warning that was given to me on Friday.

My work is in childcare, and we have mandatory meetings that are going to take place over the place of the next month, in preparation for our Summer camp.

I was told on Friday that each of these meetings are going to have a theme. They are as followed....

Monday, June 7th ( Wild, Wild West Theme )

Thursday, June 10th ( Crazy Hat Night Theme )

Monday, June 14th ( Hawaiin Theme )

Saturday, June 19th ( Patriotic Theme )

On these days I was warned, that I "should dress up for the appropriate theme, because if I didn't that I would regret it."

In other words, what they're probably going to do is get the person that doesn't dress up in front of the rest of the staff ( about 100 people or so ) and make fun of them, ridicule them, and just make them feel stupid.

My problem is this. Our motto at my place of employment is as follows...

Honesty, Caring, Kindness, Friendship

My problem with this whole scenario is that they're not following the childcare motto by ripping another person to shreds, just because they didn't dress up in a stupid costume. I also have a problem, because the higher ups are the ones that decided on this process, and will be the ones to provoke it.

How would you feel about this situation, and what would you do?

StormBerlin

To be honest, I think themed meetings for a group of adults is stupid and you shouldn't be forced to dress up. Maybe you're over reacting about what they'll do to you though. Hopefully you're talking about a group of mature adults that aren't out to ruin someones day. If that is your work places motto, I wouldn't worry about it too much.

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Mehoni

I would not dress up.

Isn't that illegal, somwhow? harassment?

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rockzilla

Besides, doesn't a room full of people dressed like cowboys mocking someone dressed normally sound a little... what's the word I'm looking for?

Oh yeah, stupid.

Don't dress up for a meeting. If you want me to take you seriously, you can't be wearing a crazy hat.

Coll Storm

Well, the reason why I'm asking is because it wouldn't be the first time. I'm not over-reacting, because it's happened before, and from a professional point of view, I disagree with it.

I would suspect it's illegal, as it sounds like haassment, but that's why I'm posting it here. I'm not to sure if it qualifies as such. If I don't dress up, can they write me up/terminate me for such a thing?

WarWagon

It is definitely harassment. Anything that makes you feel uncomfortable or singles you out in the work environment is harassment. Just the slightest hint of legal action against them should shut them up permanently. If they want to dress up like a bunch of assholes, thats their business, not yours.

djtestudo

They can't fire you for that.

If they try and do that stuff to you, try and tell them nicely that you don't have to, and you don't want to, and you'll call a lawyer on them if they keep trying. If they do, tell them to fuck off and call that lawyer.

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Esco

Exactly. We have stupid team building exercises all the time. It's stupid.

Cynthetiq

in as much as it may sound and seem like harassment, shoe on the other foot an employee who is not conforming is insubordinate, which is a fireable offense.

I'm not taking sides, just stating from a managerial point of view.

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WarWagon

True, but you also can't fire someone for not conforming to a practice which violates her legal rights.

Cynthetiq

No, but I can find other reasons.

In other words, pick and choose your battles carefully. Pushing back on this issue may not allow you any room for another.

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Rlyss

The meetings are just for the staff, right? Kids won't be there?

I'm in two minds about this. I do agree with everybody who says it's ridiculous, and to threaten legal action if they have a problem with you not dressing up. It's the principle of the thing.

On the other hand, it's just for a bit of fun, isn't it? I admit the warning that you would 'regret it' was far too heavy-handed. Is dressing up at a childcare centre really so ridiculous? Is this a time where you really need to put your foot down? If your colleagues aren't getting into the spirit, there's bound to be a little friction there, just as there might be with someone who never gets into the spirit at office parties.

I hear so often around TFP that you should 'pick your battles' but I guess I'm unsure whether this is one you need to fight.

Then again, like others have pointed out in threads like this, they can't get mad at you for not dressing up now. But they can be less leniant on you about other things, and get you that way.

EDIT: Cynthetiq - I see you wrote that while I was writing this

irseg

I wouldn't work for a company that required me to dress up in a costume for meetings in the first place. I like my dignity.

lurkette

I love that companies call making adults dress up in stupid costumes and isolating those who don't conform "morale building"

But hey, you chose to work for the place. If you otherwise enjoy your job, bite the bullet and play along. But if this is just the straw on the camel's back, I say make a token effort to keep management happy, and shop out your resume to places that treat their employees with some fricking dignity.

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Coll Storm

My stance on the issue, is that I find it stupid that they're going to pull someone up, because they either forgot to come in costume or didn't want to.

Either way they shouldn't hold it against them, when in all seriousness.... these meetings are taking place right after an eight hour work day, and each last 3-4 hours each.

One meeting takes place at 6:15, and we usually get out at 6. Not to mention the fact that they're off site, so travel is involved. If a person forgets their costume in the morning, they're screwed.

I'm all set for the meetings, and know what I'm going to wear, but I find it stupid. There are no kids involved, it's just staff only.

My hope is that one of the higher-ups doesn't dress up, and that way I can call them on it, when they pick one of the newest staff people that just got hired. That way, they can feel what it's like to be ridiculed in front of everyone.

DelayedReaction

If you don't want to wear the costume, don't wear the costume. It was declared to be voluntary, and you won't be considered insubordinate for not doing something voluntary. If a woman can successfully file for harassment because she reads a dirty e-mail over somebody else's shoulder, then you should be within your rights to go to a workplace without being ridiculed for wearing a fucking crazy hat.

I have to deal with this kind of bullshit (to a lesser degree) in a program here in college. If it was a serious problem, I would bring it up (privately) with the person in charge and explain my situation.

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ratbastid

What makes you think that's the plan? I can't imagine that sort of thing happening in a professional workplace. There might be individual-on-individual teasing, but "walk the plank" treatment really shouldn't happen.

That "probably" in there makes me suspicious that we're dealing with you worst fear of what might happen, as opposed to something that might actually happen. What evidence do you have that this is the treatment a non-conformer would get?

Rodney

I'm currently finishing up a student teaching gig toward getting my multi-subject (elementary) teaching credential, and this has included going to the various staff meetings at the school. And just about every one of them involves some kind of little raffle, doing some little group game, or some kind of "stand up and say something nice about the person next to you" exercise. And every time, I say the same thing in my mind (not outloud): "Ladies, are we here for a goddamn BABY SHOWER, or are we here to do some BUSINESS?" I'm pretty sure that most of the (few) male teachers and a fair number of the women feel the same way, but we all keep our mouthes shut.

I am a man with many years' experience in industry, lately retraining as a teacher. And so I can see teaching from a different perspective: as one of the most unprofessional professions that I have ever seen. For all the many standards and rubrics and credentials a teacher must have, when you get to a school and the rubber meets the road, it's all run like some kind of social set, with people who are popular and people who aren't, with the worst sin being not to be "nice." You can be passive-aggressive, burnt-out and weird as all hell as long as you're "nice."

That's a bit of a rant; I do admire most of the teachers and administrators that I work with, some very highly. But I have to shake my head at some of the conventions of the profession. I'm of the philosopy that groups or professions dominated by one sex or the other tend to get out of whack. You need testosterone and estrogen in equal measures to keep things from getting too heartless and cruel (male) or too personal and vicious (female). And frankly, teaching is estrogen-drenched.

So I definitely identify with what Coll Storm is writing about, though it seems much more extreme than what I'm used to. It sounds like her administrators are using this socializing scheme as a control mechanism, or as a way of showing their control. And if she doesn't do it, she's "not nice," and has to be taught a lesson in a supposedly good-natured way that really, underneath, is vicious.

Coll, based on my limited experience, the kind of manipulation that you're describing is a little extreme even for elementary schools. And you sound pretty sensitive to what's going on. You sure you want to stay there?

tiberry

Sounds pretty corny to me...its a good psychological tactic though - the military has used it for years. You degrade, embarrass or otherwise demoralize the "group" using some common theme...something that effectively makes them equally miserable. In this way - you can easily "control" them as you've stripped their sense of vanity away.

Hope this isn't too far out for you...just a thought - What's the big deal about dressing up? Do you truly feel strongly that it is somehow compromising your values, morals, or integrity? If so, then simply don't do it. But I wouldn't try to make more of it than it really is.

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raeanna74

I'd suggest going along then file a complaint later with the one in charge of the thing. Write a letter explaining how you find the practice degrading and demoralizing. That you feel it's not good for employee/boss relations. Then give then some viable options for getting the group working together on something. Something that excourages teamwork - not just acting like sheep.

That might help express your displeasure and your desire for a healthy workplace.

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:::OshnSoul:::

i could care less if they made fun of me and ridicule me. If they want to play immiture that's fine. Dressing up is okay, it's fun to me, but making it mandatory and saying that they will tease you if you don't would be stopping pretty low. I wouldn't go to their level just to make them happy, I would do it if I felt like it, regardless of what they would say.

Coll Storm

My evidence that it has happened in the past, but usually without warning. This time I was warned about it, but the way the warning came is what got me thinking how wrong this process is.

Coll Storm

I have no problems with dressing up....

My problem is with the fact that they're...

1 - Not giving you a choice, because if you don't, you'll be punished in a way.

2 - In making fun of other people for not dressing up, they are going against the official motto that they have stapled up all over the place, not to mention in their employee handbook.

3 - I'm going to feel badly, when some of my co-workers don't dress up, and are put up on stage for everyone to see. I know one co-worker that is beyond shy, and this will put her into tears if they force her up there.

Really, what it all comes down to is # 2. I have strong moral code that you should treat people the same way you want to be treated.

Coll Storm

I'll post what the flyer says....

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mandatory Camp Orientation Dates are as follows:

Some nights have a particular theme. Please come prepared in "costume"! You won't want to be the only one NOT dressed up!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
It then tells you the dates, and themes. I've already posted those.

thespian86

CollStorm, I remember your first post about your work and I must say, I'm proud that you stuck with it, it seemed you were at the point of breaking. My suggestion would be to disobey on purpose... Like on hawaiin day show up dressed as a native american or for Wild West day show up as a tin man... I'd laugh

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Rlyss

I admit I'm still having a little trouble seeing what the big deal is. To me that flyer doesn't threaten anything, it just begs people to not spoil the party. I know it's a meeting but if everything gets done in the meeting (and I assume they're effective meetings, otherwise they wouldn't keep happening) then what's the harm in dressing up?

You say you don't have a problem in dressing up, but that it shouldn't be required. For the meeting, then, dress up as much or as little as you want. When they start roasting people who didn't dress up, then's the time to stand up and (not aggressively) point out that it's against this key value the centre claims to hold dearly.

Coll Storm

No, this doesn't threaten me, but the verbal warning that I got from my boss about the meeting does.

I wish, but can't, convey the tone of her voice as she was telling this.

macmanmike6100

I would talk about it face-to-face with your boss, since it seems that your boss, rather than upper management, is saying that you <i>must</i> dress up. Let us know and good luck!

Prince

I think dressing up can be fun. But when you make it mandatory, the fun goes out the window.

I'll attend any in-service meeting at my workplace, but I won't dress up if I am threatened or coerced to do so.

It's not insubordination. It's having self-respect.

Dress up if you feel like dressing up. If you are not in the mood, don't bother with it. Either way, don't dress up just to please others, and don't decide against dressing up just to make a point.

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ibis

1. Don't dress up.
2. Get harassed.
3. Sue.
4. ???
5. Profit!

denim

4. Win

Coll Storm

Well, tonight was the night. We were suppose to dress up as Cowboys for this event. Most of co-workers, and myself had jeans on ( usually that's against dress code, but the boss said it was okay ).

She then asked each of us, why don't have a cowboy hat? I should have given her a smart-ass answer like, because I don't live in Texas!!! :P

I asked her if she got my a cowboy hat, because she told me that she would look around for one, and she told me no. I then informed her that I would not be going up in front of everyone and be made a fool out of.

Anyhow... she was peeved at everyone, because all the higher-ups had cowboy hats, and had dressed the part. Meanwhile the lower end employees that get paid shit didn't dress up.

In the end, they didn't pull anyone up, because 95% of the employees didn't dress up.

Employees 1
Bosses 0

Round two is on Thursday for "Crazy Hat Theme", but I'll just create something for that. Not to worried about it, except for the meetings are pointless, and don't bring anything to the table.

Mephisto2

Dress up as an elf every night.

Then point at them and laugh.


Mr Mephisto

G5_Todd

honestly i dont know how someone could work in that situation....were i work we are all friends...yes we rib each other but we dont do it infront of the public only in secure areas......


LOL and i just noticed Mr. Mephisto's comment

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Coll Storm

The whole situation with the place is beyond tolerable at this point, and yet I tolerate it, just for the sake of my paycheck every, other Friday.

This week we had a meeting at 9am on a Saturday morning. This was one of those mandatory meetings mentioned above. Me being a full-time employee didn't get paid for it, but I'm forced to take time off.

Unfortunately, our boss wasn't using her better judgement, when she decided to schedule a Luau for our families on Friday night from 7pm to 10pm. So, most of us decided to do the Luau and then about three weeks later we're told about the meeting. None of us were happy about it.

On top of this my boss hasn't been in for most of the week, and I'm second in command. One of the parents ( who, in my opinion has her head stuck so far up her ass, that she can taste her own shit ) walks in and notices that none of the employees are smiling.

She then asks why weren't we excited about going. I explained to her about the meeting the day after our family event. She then said in a mocking tone of voice " Oh Boo Hoo.... I have such a hard life... I get to play with kids all day long ".

This pissed me off to no end. Anyone that's in childcare / teaching would feel the same way. Not just me, but anyone. My duties go far beyond just "playing with the children". Not only do I work in the after-school program, but I work as a Kindergarten teacher in the morning.

I then told my boss about it, thinking that she would be kind of shocked about what she said, and that she would understand, but instead she agreed with the parent. Being that she is from the same background as the rest of us, I thought she would understand how that was meant as an insult, but instead she agreed with her.

My boss - Former friend - Doesn't know what she's done.

This year their Kindergarten went from having only 3 kids, to 10, because of word of mouth from my parents, because of what the kids were coming home with education wise. They told this to other parents, because of this, my classroom grew...

but I only play with kids.

My five year olds know every letter in American Sign, and can talk to each other, without their parents knowing it...

but I only play with kids.

My five year olds know Greek/Roman Mythology...

but I only play with kids.

This on top of the basic education that they get from us. Other stuff is there, but to numerous to mention.

In the afterschool program...

I move heavytables around, wheel out bookcases filled with games/books/toys/art supplies, I get out every piece of paper that needs to be signed, set up every billboard, bring out all the first aid supplies, I take down all the phone calls, messages, make & serve snack, clean up by picking up scraps, washing tables, sweeping.

I also have to plan out any field trip, and make sure that all parents sign permission slips. I also have to llisten when every child has a problem, along with their parents. I also have to plan out every activity, and make sure that we have the supplies that are needed....

but I only play with kids!!!!

Next year my boss is going to be opening two new sites, and I'm going to be running our site, but they refuse to give me the raise or title that I deserve. She also wants me to run my Kindergarten program.

She has no idea. My boss and the company that I work for can take a flying leap. I'll find a job, where they know my value and realize that I don't just play with kids.