bernadette

*cries*

i am sad, i am mad & i don't know what to do next...

this is gonna be kinda long... apologies in advance. i don't expect too many of you to actually read all of this.

so here goes... our kitchen has been ripped up & under construction since the very first of the year. we actually emptied & readied it the end of december.

loads & lots of ongoing issues, migraines & stupidity, but i'll spare you all of that...
anyway, finally it was looking like a kitchen again... until the granite countertop CRACKED! yes.

in the very beginning, our contractor told us that he would be out himself to install the anderson bay window for us because his little subcontractor had never installed one before & it was too big of a job for a rookie.
well, the day comes to install the bay window & the rookie is the one putting it in.

i had originally asked for the underneath support with the stucco, mostly for aesthetic reasons, but the contractor says, "no, we hang them from the cables all the time & just put a finishing board beneath. trust me, we do this all the time. it'll look fine." so, our window was hung without the underneath beam supports.

then the nearly $12,000 worth of beautiful granite gets installed.

then the rookie comes & installs the weight bearing roof, which then stretches the support cables. that caused our windows not to open.
so then... the contractor comes out & says "we'll just jack up the window & put the underneath support & then it can be stuccoed in." (which i repeat was what i wanted in the first place).
i said to the contractor, "now isn't this going to crack our granite??"
contractor says, " no, i assure you, it will not crack your granite. we do this all the time. trust me."
i'm still trying figure out how he thinks granite has the tiniest bit of flexibility, but he says they do this all the time & it'll be just fine. i held my breath.

so rookie guy comes out & jacks up the window. tightens the cables & places the underneath support beams.

next day: i'm on the phone in my kitchen & look at the counter to see the horror. yup, CRACKED!!!

so, the granite people get sent out to see it they can cosmetically make it better. nope. made it even more noticeable.

then the bosses from the granite place come out to look. they determine without my telling them how it all came to be, that the window installation is what has caused the granite to crack. it's obvious since all the other unpainted stucco repairs has been done, but the support area has not been stuccoed that this was indeed an afterthought.

the contractor calls me up yelling at me & asking who told them the window was jacked after the installation? blah blah blah... i reminded him that he assured me that the granite would not crack & that he had said HE would be the one to put in the window, but he sent rookie instead.

he finds out they want seven grand to replace the granite. he is furious & says he will not pay that.

he calls the following day & says he'd talk to several people & concedes that it is indeed his fault & he will replace the granite, but he will not pay the price that the original granite people are asking. he says by law he is entitled to get a 2nd bid.

so a few days later he brings out an independent granite installer (this was last wednesday). he says we'll receive a price from him in a couple of days. today we still have no price or no further contact with the contractor or his granite dude. it's now 5 days later. i know he doesn't want to pay to replace this & he he going to drag this out as long as he can. and that's where my biggest concern is... the longer this is drug out, the more difficult it will be to match the granite. it might even already be too late to match it.

also, we cannot lock our bay window, because when we do we cannot open the window as they both stick in the top corners, BECAUSE the window sill is still NOT LEVEL. i just had this fact confirmed today, because i had the window vendor send out their service people to see if they could adjust the window at all. they cannot without & removing the underneath support & beams to adjust the cables, which is a huge risk to further cracking the granite. that'd be the way to go IF we were indeed getting the granite replaced with a perfect matched stone. if we're not going to be able to match the stone, then it's best to leave the crack & the ill fitted window as is. *sigh* otherwise, the entire kitchen's granite will need to be replaced, which means, some of the cabinetry will have to be removed (not to mention emptied again).

i am just sick to my stomach. i've lost countless hours of sleep over this. i wake up worrying & thinking & then can't go back to sleep.

this is a once in a life time ordeal, which we took out a huge loan to be able to do.
we intend to spend the rest of our lives in this home, so we want to fix it up as best we can. we're doing the major stuff once & only once yknow. such as a complete kitchen remodel.

any suggestions or ideas for what i should do next?
should i get a lwayer involved? we've never had to use a lawyer & would prefer to keep it that way, but...

should i just live with the cracked granite & ill fitted window & move on?

should we report him to the contractors board? what kind of repercussions will we have to face if we do?

what if a matching granite stone cannot be found? do we, should we demand the entire kitchen's granite be replaced?

my head & stomach hurts...

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cj2112

You paid for a professional job, you should DEMAND professional results. Their is no way you have to accept this bullshit. DO NOT let them bully you. I do custom commercial cabinets for a living, and i can tell you that if the job isn't perfect, we are required by law to make it be that way. You should expect no less. If you settle for this shoddy workmanship, everytime that you walk in your kitchen you're going to be disappointed and upset. This is your home, your place of refuge, you deserve this job to be done right. If you have to contact a lawyer, then do so, I would however let the contractor know that when the job is done, all the countertops will match, their will be no cracks in them and that the windows will be 100% functional, and will not leak, and if that you will not settle for anything else. He would not accept this on his own home, he shouldn't expect you to either.

bernadette

thanks cj2112, for reading all of that & replying.

you're right. i didn't pay for shoddy workmanship or a cracked counter or an ill working window.

i'm just so sad that my almost finished kitchen has to be ripped apart again...

my parents suggested small claims court.
gah..... i sure don't wanna go that route... but it's looking like that may be the path i must tread to get the results that we paid for.

and yeah... this contractor has been pretty much <i>bullying</i> me the entire time.
i just didn't step up to him as i should have...

should i report him to the contractors board as well?

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cj2112

I'm assuming he is licensed insured and bonded. I would first try to get him to do right by you, and let him know that you won't accept anything less than professional results. If he fails to complete the job to your satisfaction, then go after his bond, report him to the contractors board, and sue him. Take pictures now....no I mean get up right now and go take pictures. Keep a journal of what has been said, promised, and what has actually happened. Dates and times are important....document everything as thoroughly as possible. A letter form an attorney is generally pretty reasonable (about 75 to 100 bucks here) and can go a long way to insure your satisfaction. Give him the opportunity to fix the mistakes and make it right....if he fails to do so, then get nasty. It does really suck that your kitchen has to be torn apart again, and the risk for damaging the cabinets and the floor in the process is there, but they have to fix this, and any collateral damages also.

bernadette

i sure wish i had kept a date/time journal of goings on along... i had no idea that i would need to!

i have attempted to photograph the countertop & its crack.
it's galaxy black granite which is highly reflective. (but very lovely!)
plus i am a sad little point & snap kind of photographer, so i haven't been able to get a very good documentive photo of the crack.

we are in the processing of allowing him to make it right, but all he has done is visit here last wednesday w/his granite installer & promise us a new price w/in a couple of days. (besides yell & swear at me & try to make me feel like the bad guy.)

i guess i'm gonna hafta sit patience & wait & know that this is going to take some additional time to resolve. *sigh*

yeah, risking damage to the cabinets, stainless steel sink & floors upsets & worries me.

he was suppose to do the floors in his original bid, but i wound up having to get a flooring specialist due to subfloor issues that he later waffled on whether he could do or not. one day yes, next day no, repeat a half dozen times. even tho he was made aware of the subfloor problems BEFORE he took the job. we prodded him to work on the floors BEFORE installing the cabinetry, but again he said "trust me, i know what i am doing." in the end he said we'd have to eat our already purchased pergo & that he had a good tile guy.

our pergo is now installed & not by the contractor in question.

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cj2112

the more you tell me, the more i say you need to contact a lawyer....this guy is incompetent, and I would be hesitant to let him do anymore work at all. If I were in your shoes, I would at least try to find out my rights at this point.

bernadette

yeah. i decided last wednesday (actually 2 days before) that he would not be finishing our kitchen (even though we've paid for it to be finished all but the remaining one thousand) nor doing any other work for us & we have plenty of work left to do he could've had & was aware he could've had. i don't get it.

i am just unsure where to go next... i guess find a lawyer?

thanks again, cj2112.

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ratbastid

Definitely time to bring the law into this.

Hey, here's a thought. See if any of your local TV news stations do a "consumer protection" bit on their news broadcasts, and have somebody come out and do a story on you. Contractors live or die by their reputation. Maybe even just the THREAT of that would be enough to get him off the dime.

Cynthetiq

document document document.

repeat it after me... document document document.

each time you talk to anyone document.
each time they visit document.
each time you are upset over it. document.

why? because the burden of proof is on you to prove that they did wrong. and the burden of proof for them? to disprove what you say.

since the granite is valued at over $12,000 you'll not be able to take this to small claims court. Seeing a lawyer is scary at first. Print out what you wrote here, let him read it. Let him ask you questions. Don't know who to call? Don't just open the phone book, you've already been ripped off by one professional, don't get sucked into it again.

Contact your state's BAR and ask them for a referral. They will refer you to someone who will see you for a small fee and then give you his advice.

good luck.

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I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

ARTelevision

Amazingly, our kitchen remodeling has taken many months and has had many many mix-ups, problems, etc. - very similar deal to yours.

Yes. You have to stand up for your consumer's rights in this area, it seems. Then you have to stay on 'em till things get right.

The threat of small-claims court has in fact worked for us in another deal - with heating contractors.

You can threaten in writing, you can copy a lawyer in your communications, and you can also copy the president of the company. Thise tactics have worked for us.

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bernadette

i found out that this is too large for small claims court. in california it is a $5K max per year.
so... i am seeing a lawyer tomorrow morning to help me compose a letter to the contractor, hopefully it will be sent on the lawyer's stationery with his letterhead.

if push comes to shove, i will send a copy of that letter along with a complaint form to the building contractors board.

it's been a full week now since we last saw or heard from the contractor when he told us he would have his 2nd bid within a couple days for us...

also i have been informed that the granite folks who installed our counters do in fact still have a couple slabs from the same lot. whew! one tiny bit of good news.
however, they will not sell the slabs to the contractor or anyone, because they are a granite fabrication & installation business, not a granite wholesaler.

my kitchen designer called the contractor asking why we haven't received a bid yet from him.
he told her because he needs to find out what the countertops were put down with.
duh... does it take a rocket scientist to figure out to pick up the telephone & call the folks who installed the granite?
as of yesterday the kitchen designer said the contractor was going to pick up a 6" x 6" sample of one of those slabs for ME to run around town to attempt to find a suitable match.
EXCUSE ME! that is NOT <i>my</i> job.

anyway, terribly sorry to hear that you've also experienced a bad time with your remodel, ARTelevision.
i don't understand how these people manage to stay in business. mind boggling.

also thanks, Cynthetiq. we have a lot more remodeling yet to do & you can safely bet it will all be carefully documented every step of the way.
i am now busy pulling together as much documentation as i possibly can for tomorrow's meeting with the lawyer.

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maleficent

Reporting him to the Better Business Bureau too might not be a bad idea, if for no other reason, to hopefully prevent this nightmare from happening to someone else.

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BCD

I am an attorney and regularly represent both homeowners and contractors in disputes like this. Make sure your lawyer sends the letter on his letterhead. It sounds like this contractor has been running right over you from the beginning, so a nasty letter sent by you isn't going to have the same impact. You need to show him that you are serious about this. Good luck!

bernadette

yes, maleficient! someone else has already suggested this, but i will wait until our situation is satisfactorily resolved.

when i asked the the kitchen designer if she could recommend a good lawyer, she said she could, but couldn't, because it would be a conflict of interest as this contractor is currently doing work for this lawyer. she added that the lawyer is also having much diffculty with this contractor. that made me laugh in the way that what kind of retard jacks around working for a lawyer?!! criminey... loser.

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BCD

BTW, let me also respond to this:

While I think contacting the local bar association for a referral is certainly better than looking in the yellow pages, you are best served by asking your friends and family members if they have a GOOD attorney. Then, when you contact that attorney, ask him or her what type of practice they have and how regularly they handle matters such as yours. If your matter is complex or a bit out of the ordinary and the attorney does not have a lot of experience in the area, ask him or her for the names of some other attorneys who actually specialize in this area. Otherwise, I would use the attorney referred to you by your friend or family member.

My problem with referrals from local bar associations is that they typically only make referrals to attorneys who pay a fee to participate in their referral program. The bar association does not refer you to a lawyer that they think is particularly good, but, instead, simply refer you to any lawyer who has paid the fee, agreed to take cases of a certain type and is next on their list. Also, good lawyers typically have enough business that they don't need to pay for this type of referral program. With a referral from friends and family members, you are at least getting the name of an attorney who someone thinks is particularly good.

bernadette

: )

i did just exactly what you said BCD.

yesterday i called a very savvy intellectual well-to-do particular to details kind of friend.
while she & her husband have indeed dealt with many lawyers, they had not dealt with this particular sort of lawyer herself; however, she knows someone who had a good reference. so good, that she in fact had his telephone number memorized. so i'm crossing my fingers...

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Cynthetiq

wonderful...

my experience for my legal woes required me to use the BAR. I'm glad that you were able to find someone via personal experience. Some people like myself were not so lucky.

In fact, thank you for the reminder BCD, because I did have an issue with the referral lawyer, not the true referral but the lawyer who stepped in because the "referrer" was busy and he stepped in. Long short, the guy who stepped in was disbarred for many reasons including dropping the ball on our case, which the "referrer" made good on for us. At the time, I didn't have any lawyer friends, now I have many.

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raeanna74

I'm glad you got a name of a lawyer and I hope you are able to get this straightened out.

My Dad is a contractor and does work in remodeling, building, and everything except for plumbing. He has actually gone into the hole on a job to fix a mistake he's made. This man should be willing to do the same. He's obviously not concerned about his reputation. I would pull all the materials he may have at the job site. Keep them in a safe area where he cannot get them back. (At least recovering a portion of your out of pocket). Do not use him for anything else. Not even to fix this. A week dely to fix his own mistake - he's not going to fix it and may not even show up again. Find you a new contractor. A good way to assure that they are doing a good job is to stick around. Just leave the premises while they are working - at least to begin with - so you can see how careful they are. If they say that something is ok they don't need to do it this way or that - it doesn't matter. Unless they can give you a good reason why not to do a certain thing (it's a weaker contruction - for example) they tell them you want it done your way. It's your house and your choice. My dad has actually given people a good reason for not doing it their way because it was weaker that way. When they insisted he did it their way. Unfortunately they have sometimes been unhappy with the results but since he documents almost every decision that is made he's been ok.

My dad did have to go to small claims once even though the amount he wanted was greater than their limit. He just simply asked for the limit - in your case $5000. It was cheaper to go to small claims so in the end he came out about even. I'm not sure how it works now (this was quite a few years ago) or even how it works in your state. That you'll have to ask your lawyer.

Contractors like this make me so angry because they are giving contractors a bad name - including my dad. I hope he cooperates soon.

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bernadette

raeanna74, i wish your dad was doing our work!
he's sounds like a man who takes pride in his work, which seems like that may be a rare trait in this field.

what happened today makes me feel some relief & have hope that we're on the verge of being on the path to resolution, but being that this is a public board, i will refrain from saying exactly what transpired today until once this is all no more than a bad memory.

thank you all for your input. greatly appreciated.

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