squeeeb

i do not like the self check out machines in the grocery store and i refuse to use them. i will wait in line behind the old guy with 30 items writing a check in the 15 item or less lane, before using one.

1) i think they take away jobs. instead of having another cashier they have that.

and B) the store does not pay me to work there, i'm not doing their job for them.

that last line of reasoning got me thinking about self service gas stations. other than new jersey (as far as i know) they don't have full service stations anymore, do they? if they did, i would use the full service and tip the guy the extra buck.

__________________
onward to mayhem!

Cynthetiq

that's why i don't bag my own groceries.

self checkout... if i have 1-5 items I find it easier. Otherwise I'd rather TALK to a cashier to get a better idea as to what kind of place I'm shopping in.

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

DaniGirl

I hate self check out too, I think it does take away jobs, but that is just what our world has come too. Technology is the new age we are in. We just have to get used to it.

Martian

Self checkouts help to reduce the store's overhead, which hypothetically at least means that you get your groceries at lower cost; so, from a certain perspective, one could argue that the store actually is paying you to use them.

I don't know how things work in the world to the south, but here in Canada we actually have value-brand grocery stores. They're the sorts of stores where the customer bags their own groceries and where things like self checkouts were first adopted (along with charging for disposable grocery bags).

EDIT - meant to address the job thing, too. It's an odd bit of obstinance; redundant and unnecessary jobs get eliminated. It's a part of progress. Self-checkouts mean that fewer cashiers are necessary, so fewer get hired.

There are a lot fewer traffic cops than there used to be, but I don't hate stop lights.

__________________
I wake up in the morning more tired than before I slept
I get through cryin' and I'm sadder than before I wept
I get through thinkin' now, and the thoughts have left my head
I get through speakin' and I can't remember, not a word that I said

- Ben Harper, Show Me A Little Shame

Willravel

I'm surprised they haven't been around a lot longer, frankly. I use the self-checkout at Home Depot, but that's simply because most of my experiences with checkouts at Home Depot have been less than satisfactory.

It's not taking away jobs, it's creating new jobs. You don't think someone has to design, program, build, ship, and maintain those things? Comon.

snowy

I love the self-checkout. And the one here does employ people--there are two people supervising the self-checkouts. I would say that that particular store employs the same amount of people now that it did before the self-checkouts were installed; I used to work there and I can't say I've noticed any staffing changes, nor are there any more lanes open than there would have been before those were there.

For someone like me, who used to work as a checker, I find the self-checkout incredibly convenient. I can easily scan and bag my own items as fast or faster than most of the checkers. If I feel like having a conversation while I buy my groceries, I go to the hippie food co-op, but that costs more. As Martian says, the cost savings do get passed on to the consumer at some stores.

__________________
If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

Strange Famous

I am practially opposed to them because they hardly ever work properly.

__________________
"Do not tell lies, and do not do what you hate,
for all things are plain in the sight of Heaven. For nothing
hidden will not become manifest, and nothing covered will remain
without being uncovered."

The Gospel of Thomas

jewels

And you still buy gas?

__________________
We are always more anxious to be distinguished for a talent which we do not possess, than to be praised for the fifteen which we do possess.
Mark Twain

highthief

I love the self-checkout at the Home Despot. Much faster than waiting in line behind buddy and his million and one different washers that all need to be individually scanned.

__________________
Si vis pacem parabellum.

Reese

I disagree. Maybe it is taking a few cashier jobs but the wal-mart around here is always hiring. They're the only ones with self checkout here and they can't find enough people to work there. There's a severe shortage of qualified or non-overqualified people to choose from. I'd prefer to bag my own shit quickly and without having to deal with slow, snobby teenagers and have to call their manager over ever 5 minutes because they fuck something up.

__________________
“It is better to be rich and healthy than poor and sick” - Dave Barry

dlish

if i ran a business, i'd look to cut overheads. if i dont have to pay salaries by implementing a self checkout, then why not? it makes good business sense in every way you look at it.

for those that say that its taking away job, in some instances, if your overheads are too high and you cant stay afloat, then you either need to cut your overheads, or you're going to have to cut some jobs. so it may actually save jobs.

like i said, it makes good business sense. granted that people like to have a personal experience with a live human. i do too. but from a purely business point of view, im all for it

__________________
An injustice anywhere, is an injustice everywhere

I always sign my facebook comments with ()()===========(}. Does that make me gay?
- Filthy

little_tippler

I love them because generally I find most people too slow for me. The cashier, the person ahead of me in the queue packing their bags...I'm very impatient. But then, if you lived here, you might agree. People are very relaxed out here...sometimes too much for me.

__________________
Whether we write or speak or do but look
We are ever unapparent. What we are
Cannot be transfused into word or book.
Our soul from us is infinitely far.
However much we give our thoughts the will
To be our soul and gesture it abroad,
Our hearts are incommunicable still.
In what we show ourselves we are ignored.
The abyss from soul to soul cannot be bridged
By any skill of thought or trick of seeming.
Unto our very selves we are abridged
When we would utter to our thought our being.
We are our dreams of ourselves, souls by gleams,
And each to each other dreams of others' dreams.

Fernando Pessoa, 1918

Baraka_Guru

I don't think self-checkouts are too worthy for taking a moral stand.

They've really come about as a response to consumer demand. As we have already seen, some of us prefer to use them. Generally, I think they act well for "customer runoff" when it's really busy and there are long lines.

Sure the overall appeal (esp. if it's growing) may cost a few jobs, but that's how these things go. There will be grocery store cashiers for a long time, I'm sure. They won't go the way of the milkman, town crier, or lamp lighter anytime soon.

But, as with any change, old jobs may disappear, but new ones pop up. Do you know there are iPod conversion services out there? You can have your entire CD library converted to iTunes for a low, low price.

__________________
Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
—Bhikkhuni Pema Chödrön

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
—From "Burnt Norton," Four Quartets (1936), T. S. Eliot

noodle

man, most of the time I just want to get the holy effin' heck out of there as fast as I can. I wish everywhere had a self-checkout line... but with a mandatory IQ scan before you enter. I can't stand the idiots who can't find the picture of the banana to weigh them and check out.

__________________

braisler

I fall clearly on the side of hating the self-checkouts. I used to work as a cashier at a big grocery chain, so I know what I am doing when I scan things. The self-checkout lanes have their scanners set up to not work correctly, or at least to not work quickly. Like I said, I know how to scan things properly and I have sat there and tried to re-scan the same item 15 times. I'll use them, but only because I'm pretty much forced to when the only other register open is jammed with 4 people with completely full shopping carts.

I also argue that they have cost jobs to cashiers in a big way here. The stores around here that do have self-checkout, now have 1 cashier open and another one 'supervising' 8 self checkout lines. They used to have 4-6 cashiers up there full-time with another 2-3 staff that could come in if they got busy up front. Now if they get busy, they direct people to the self-checkouts.

I don't know the whole story on some of these stores. Another poster raised the valid point that maybe implementing the self-checkout helped the stores stay afloat where they otherwise would have closed. I don't know. They certainly didn't cut prices to compensate me for doing the cashier's job for them. They raised prices on everything during the gas price hikes last year and they've stayed up ever since then.

Another thing that no one has chimed in on is the issue of self-checkout 'shrinkage' as they refer to it in the industry. Not that I do it myself, or endorse doing it, but I have read blog posts from people who wring up all of their produce as 'bananas', which is usually substantially less than say apples or grapes by weight. Or stack 2-3 candy bars on the one that you ring through, etc. I'm sure that stores have run the numbers on this and made their decisions based on the likelihood of losses vs. the cost savings of employing fewer cashiers.

Well, that's my 2 cents.

__________________
---
You do not really understand something unless you can explain it to your grandmother.
- Albert Einstein
---

ratbastid

I want to have rfid chips embedded in every product, and in my credit card. I want everything I'm carrying to be sensed remotely and billed to my card as I walk out the door. Fuck cashiers.

braisler

Ratbastid, I'm sure that RFID is the way that things are heading. Wal-mart already pushes their suppliers to embed RFID tags in more and more of their merchandise. It used to be everything over $50 or so, but I think that it is spreading to more and more items.

I remember reading about something like that where you scanned items as they went into your SmartCart while you shopped, then by the time you got to the front, you already had your total. Pay and go. I don't recall if that was RFID or bar code based though.

__________________
---
You do not really understand something unless you can explain it to your grandmother.
- Albert Einstein
---

telekinetic

The 3 chocolate bars thing wouldn't work at any store I've shopped at...they have the bagging scales gram-calibrated. The banana thing would, but that's a mildly retarded way to break the law if you're interested, but again, the stores I shop at have cameras looking at all the scanning beds which send an image (with what it was rung up as) back to the supervisor pedestal). I'm not saying it's perfect, but it's deterent enough that I wouldn't try to pass off a dozen avacado as banana and not expect a helpful "whoops, looks like you hit the wrong button!" lady to come over.

---------- Post added at 10:58 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:51 AM ----------

Howabout what happened yesterday...a lady with a FULL CART goes up to the '1 to 7 items' self checkout (which has a spot for one bag) and then demands the attendant sit there and reset the weight counter every time she has to take the bag off (six or seven times)

---------- Post added at 10:59 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:58 AM ----------

This is coming, extremely soon. RFID is basically as cheap as barcodes...in bulk they're less than a penny.


Finally, I feel the need to point at the luddite attitudes in the first post. I am morally in favor of any technological advancements that reduce jobs. This is how society progresses.

__________________
twisted no more

Sue

You talk to the cashier?

__________________
Teg yw edrych tuag adref.

LordEden

100% agree. I want to browse the entire store online, pick what I want by walking down virutal "isles" where I can compare prices by weight, brand, and look. Then make a list of everything I want and check out using my debit card. I drive to the store and tell them my name, then someone carries them out to my car and loads it up for me. Even better if I don't have to leave my house. There is where your cashier jobs will go. That will rock.

To the OP, I use them when I have a few items. Like water bottles or some veggies. Otherwise I have a cart full and I go through a line.

__________________
Vice-President of the CinnamonGirl Fan Club - The Meat of the Zombiesquirrel and CinnamonGirl Sandwich

Willravel

Yeah, I always get creeped-out by the "HAHA NICE WEATHER WE'RE HAVING LATER ON TODAY I'M GOIN TO .... DRR!!" folks in line at the grocery store.

Xerxys

I use the self check out counters because I think they are easy to use and I hate cashiers.

I never boycott companies over some sort of moral grounds when they offer merchandise for quality cheap!



But twisted, that means that there'll be less stupid people ... ohh yeah thats right, never mind.

People steal from convenient stores ... *drops voice down to whisper* noooooo

I very much doubt stores will ever feel the pain of shrinkage, ... unless they had piss poor planning.

inBOIL

I think they're a good idea but the only one I've used is so crappy that I hope it never shows up at my grocery store.
Jesus Haploid Christ I hate the checkouts at that store. You can't scan the items at any reasonable pace or the computer gets confused, and then you have to cancel your whole order and start over. You have to scan the item, then wait 2-3 seconds for the unnaturally cheerful voice to tell you to place it in the bagging area, then you have to wait another 2-3 seconds before attempting to scan the next item. If any of those items happen to be heavy, you then have to wait for the absent attendant to come out of hiding to reset the weight sensor. Add to that a chronically miscalibrated touchscreen that makes selecting a payment type in less than 3 tries all but impossible, and you've got a fairly eficcient means of convincing people to get their hardware eslewhere.

But yeah, they are better than waiting in line for the one human cashier.

__________________
And you believe Bush and the liberals and divorced parents and gays and blacks and the Christian right and fossil fuels and Xbox are all to blame, meanwhile you yourselves create an ad where your kid hits you in the head with a baseball and you don't understand the message that the problem is you.

Jinn

I wish all stores had them. I can't think of a better innovation in shopping in my lifetime.

Maybe you guys live in heavily trafficked areas, but I've never had a machine malfunction.

I doubly love it because I don't have to scan my card and wait for the cashier to click "CREDIT" and then sign, and then have them verify my signature.

I usually have scanned my card and signed by the time the computer has finished scanning my last item, and I'm out in under a minute. I don't need personal interaction at a grocery store, not with a cashier at least.

__________________
"I'm typing on a computer of science, which is being sent by science wires to a little science server where you can access it. I'm not typing on a computer of philosophy or religion or whatever other thing you think can be used to understand the universe because they're a poor substitute in the role of understanding the universe which exists independent from ourselves." - Willravel

Charlatan

This is just what I was going write. (minus the Fuck Cashiers... well, I once dated a very cute cashier and she was definitely a good fuck... but I digress).

I can't wait until I can just wheel my groceries out and have it all zapped and charged to my account (or debited from my account). I hate waiting in lines.

I'd use the self checkout more if they worked better. As it is, they are constantly requiring someone to come over and reset it.

__________________
"My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars."
- Old Man Luedecke

cellophanedeity

I'm a little disappointed in the topic. My browser shrinks the title of the thread as "i am morally opposed to self" Much more interesting!

When I find one that actually manages to both weigh my fruit and know when I put an envelope of bay leaves into the bag, I'll start using them. Until then, slow cashier ladies it is!

__________________
who am I to refuse the universe?
-Leonard Cohen, Beautiful Losers

Halanna

I like self check outs. If I only have a handfull of items I can bing bing bing and be out of there. Usually because there is no one at the self check out.

I don't think by my not using them it would save or create jobs.

I haven't seen a full service filling station in I don't know how long. Could you imagine if someone walked out of a gas station now and started washing your windshield? You'd think the guy was nuts. But it used to happen at every fill up.

Redlemon

My grocery store has hand-held scanners. I can pack my groceries in the appropriate bags as I'm going through the store. When I get to the checkout, I just scan the barcode at the checkout, and my whole order is transferred in. Not quite Ratbastid's ideal, but getting closer.

__________________
I can't read your signature. Sorry.

DaniGirl

The other day when I went to use self checkout there was this stupid bitch with a cart full of shit. If you have alot of shit, don't use self check out, its annoying.

Martian

There are two full service stations in my town that I'm aware of.

My mother still hasn't learned how to pump her own gas, and it doesn't seem likely she ever will at this point. The increasing rarity of full service gas stations causes her much distress. There have been times in the past when she's given me her car specifically so that I could fill it up for her.

Admission:

Self-service checkouts stymie me. It's a bit of an embarrassment; I'm normally very technically adept, and to date there have been very few pieces of technology that I haven't been able to figure out given a few minutes of play time. Self-service checkouts remain to this day one of the very few exceptions to this. I just can't seem to get them to work properly.

Plus, I like talking to the cashiers. They're often female, and frequently young and cute. It gives me a chance to be Charming, and I revel in such opportunities. I'm conceited that way.

__________________
I wake up in the morning more tired than before I slept
I get through cryin' and I'm sadder than before I wept
I get through thinkin' now, and the thoughts have left my head
I get through speakin' and I can't remember, not a word that I said

- Ben Harper, Show Me A Little Shame

LoganSnake

I prefer to use the self check out and seek them out in every store I shop in. I use them whenever I can.

__________________
Maturity is knowing you were an idiot in the past. Wisdom is knowing that you'll be an idiot in the future. Common sense is knowing that you should try not to be an idiot now. - J. Jacques

fresnelly

I go where the line is fastest.
I can usually pick out the problem cashiers (slow, inattentive) or problem customers (confused about prices/specials) and avoid thm and the stress they inspire. If, as Martian says, the cashier is cute then that's a bonus.

I like the personal interaction but if the self checkout is the way to go, then so be it.

__________________
Building an artificial intelligence that appreciates Mozart is easy. Building an A.I. that appreciates a theme restaurant is the real challenge - Kit Roebuck - Nine Planets Without Intelligent Life

Sue

I just get annoyed by those people. I think in my head, "Please shut the hell up already, pay for your groceries and leave so I can pay for mine and leave!" I'm not there to make pleasantries with people. I'm there to get my shit and get out.

That reminds me of this clip BTW:


You'll have to click on it. Embedding is disabled (oooooOOoooo).

From 0:00-1:46

__________________
Teg yw edrych tuag adref.

Charlatan

I so want this at my store... sounds awesome.

__________________
"My hands are on fire. Hands are on fire. Ain't got no more time for all you charlatans and liars."
- Old Man Luedecke

Redjake

The self-checkout doing away with jobs is not valid, as the companies required to create and maintain self-checkout systems created tons of jobs. One company in my college's town was started by an entrepreneur doing POS self-checkout systems (Point Of Sale) and the company is now massive and worth millions.

As to whether you are losing some value by having to "do the job yourself," I guess it depends on whether you are paying for that service or not. I don't see it as you paying for the service of being checked out. I would much rather do it myself.

__________________
Off the record, on the q.t., and very hush-hush.

Zeraph

Eh I don't know. I love the convenience when I only have a few items. And sometimes jobs need to be lost for efficiency's sake. Also keep in mind, while we "lose" the cashier's jobs we also gain jobs too. Those machines, their software, etc. don't come out of thin air. I'd wager more jobs go into making them than the jobs we lose. Also, I noticed they hire someone specifically to watch the self-checkouts and help people input coupons and such.

The only thing I don't get is why people aren't using them to shoplift more. I've never had my bags checked, and I easily could have stolen half my items or "forget" to scan an expensive one.

Baraka_Guru

This assumes that for every cashier job eliminated, one POS self-checkout system job is created. I'm not so sure this would ultimately be the case.

__________________
Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
—Bhikkhuni Pema Chödrön

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
—From "Burnt Norton," Four Quartets (1936), T. S. Eliot

telekinetic

The bags are on scales, each item has a known gram weight associated with it, and the it will flag the attendant and stop the checkout process if something goes in the bag that hasn't been scanned.

__________________
twisted no more

StephanieH

I use them at Wal Mart because I hate the way the cashier bags my stuff. My bread is always squashed, raw meat once got bagged with toiletries and the package broke and beef blood was on everything! What a pain LOL!
Anyway, I do it just to bag my own stuff. I'd rather do the work myself and get home with all the things I paid for in tact.