Remixer

Yo,

just read this article: Woman sexually involved with underage teen learns sentence - FOX41.com Louisville News Kentucky Indiana News Weather Sports

Basically, it's about a divorced mother throwing sex parties with boys (ages 15-17), supplied alcohol to them and her 13-year old daughter would occasionally participate by drinking and having sex with the same boys.

Something tells me, if the sexes of the participants were reversed, the sentence would have looked much harsher.

mixedmedia

It depends. It appears she was only charged with having sex with a 15-year-old teen because 16 is the legal age of consent in Indiana. Men who have consensual sex with teen girls close to the legal age of consent often get just a few years, as well.

__________________
Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus
PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

Borla

It blows my mind why adults (and not even young adults) will get involved with kids of that age. There have been 3-4 local stories with teachers being involved with students, and most of them have been female teachers that were at least somewhat physically attractive. You'd assume that someone who made it to that point in life would at least have enough intelligence and reasoning ability to choose better. If you really have a thing for younger guys/girls, why not go for one that is 18 and not a student instead of 16? There's obviously serious mental/emotional issues in play I guess, and you can never assume reasonable decisions when those come into play.

One of the worst things in this story IMO is that she got her 13yr old daughter involved. I'd imagine that poor girl will be a little scarred from being involved in sexual activity like that. I mean, it's one thing to walk in on your parent(s) at that age, it's a totally other and more weird scenario to walk in on them and for them to say "come on, join in". Ugh.

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chinese crested

A nonce is a nonce. What happens with the daughter? Surely she wont be returned to the nonce when it gets its freedom. Vile baggage - like was she pimping her daughter to get the boys round too? I understand the 'mother/daughter combo' is a challenge to some, but with a kid. Were any of the older boys who her kid blew prosecuted for sexual activity with a child?
There was a vile bitch local who posted her paedo pal pics of her fellating a baby. In court she said she didnt enjoy it - guess thats supposed to make it more okay.

ralphie250

thats who i feel sorry for!!

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Lindy

This is sometimes true if the man is also young -like late teens or early twenties with an underage girl. But a fortyish (which this woman at least appears to be) man who did this with a fifteen year old girl would get a much stiffer sentence. Unless the judge takes the Bill Clinton attitude, that oral sex isn't real sex, and doesn't really count.

Or when alcohol comes into play. When alcohol is involved, as it invariably is in these kind of scenarios, good judgement seems to recede into the far back of the mind. One of the things that my dad said (when he was trying to put the brakes on my teenage sexuality) was that "A stiff prick HAS no conscience." Seems like it applies to a drunk and horny mom as well.
I did that when I was about 11 or 12. It's still a very vivid mental picture. The lights were on and my mom was on top. I had a toothache. It was no big deal. My parents, especially my dad, were very open and natural about sex. For them, screwing on Saturday night and going to church on Sunday were the most natural things in the world.

Lindy

ASU2003

I'm going to the wrong parties...

james t kirk

My take on the whole thing is that adults should not be having sex with teenagers - ever. Not because I think that the sex is somehow going to "scar" the teenagers forever, but because adults are in a position of power and control over the teens and should not be using that power to further their own sexual desires.

Truth be told, when I was 15 the ONLY thing on my mind was getting laid (it wouldn't happen till I was 17). Im am 100% sure that if a hot 30 something year old woman had wanted to go to bed with me I would have loved it (because sex with a female was something I really wanted badly).

I've also over the years had relationships with a couple of women who have had sex with their brothers and cousins who were about the same age. Interestingly, neither of them were "scarred" by it and instead viewed it as something that happened when they were young and they were no longer interested in.

Now I am not advocating this kind of behaviour, but I am saying that it is not a black and white issue in terms of damage being done to the teenagers. It's complicated to say the least.

Fremen

You're looking for the Chilean Miners party.

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Ultrabum

I find conversations where people describe teenagers as children a little uncomfortable They're actually young adults. I'd say that a fifteen year old is actually a man just not one that's reached his majority.

I don't like tautologies like 'a nonce is a nonce" either. I'd say there is a very clear difference between someone who preys on primary/elementary school children and one who goes for high school kids. The twisted Victorians gave the world the idea of childhood which didn't exist before. Now it has come to this. I live in the UK and the country is almost getting towards witch hunts with the unhealthy level of paranoia.

mixedmedia

There is a very clear difference. A pedophile by definition has a sexual preference for pre-pubescent children. Not teenagers.

What's more, pedophile is a very distinct psychiatric disorder. Many people who have sex with children are not pedophiles. People may not think the distinction matters, but not recognizing this actually makes it harder for the justice system to protect society from its most dangerous offenders.

__________________
Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus
PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

Ultrabum

Actually that's what I think. You put it much better than I could. In the UK these days, I don't know about the rest of the western world, people are increasingly using the word paedophile in relation to people who unwisely sleep with someone who's past puberty but under 16.

16 is pretty arbitrary anyway. We all mature at different rates from each other. Some people are sexually mature before that age. I will admit I was older than that before I was mature enough.

I actually think British and US people tend to treat teenagers like children. A bit too much in some places. A stark comparison would be Denmark where they empower their youth. Who then go on to behave much more responsibly. I don't know any stats on the subject but I'd bet that Denmark has a better system for dealing with sex offenders as a result. But I don't know for sure.

AbelG

That's so immoral.

mixedmedia

I agree. I certainly don't think its appropriate or wise for adults to have sex w. teenagers, but it is not indicative of pedophilia by a long shot. And in many cases, it doesn't pose any more threat to a teen than does sex with one of their peers. Where the danger lies is in the development of sexual relationships with skewed power balances that leave the more vulnerable partner in a psychologically tenuous position. Of course, this can happen in adult/adult relationships, too.

__________________
Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus
PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

chinese crested

A fifteen year old girl and a sixteen year old boy is a lot different to a fifteen year old girl and a fifty year old man, dont you think?

mixedmedia

It depends. If it is a one time thing, I don't think there is much difference. If it is an ongoing thing where the older partner is exploiting vulnerabilities in the younger partner to control or manipulate them emotionally, that's where the greater chance of long-term damage lies. In my estimation, anyway.

And you could also look at it this way - what is potentially more damaging to a young person? A one night stand with an adult? Or an ongoing emotionally abusive relationship with someone their own age?

Most psychologists believe we are remiss to assume that the damage in cases of sexual abuse comes primarily from the sexual acts themselves. Certainly trauma can be associated with sex as a result but, the real lasting emotional damage stems from the abuse of power and loss of trust.

__________________
Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus
PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

chinese crested

I think perhaps a start would be in instilling in the girls a sense of self worth, a belief that a special boy who wants you, who thinks he loves you will value you all the more if you make yourselves wait a while, that the first time you jump out of a plane, bungee jump or even have sex, it should be a time so special you will both remember it. Teach them that any boy will go with any girl who has dropped them, and the queue is not one of respect, and she is worth far more. I think with daughters its good if they know their dads love them and value them, and it gives them an idea maybe of the sort of man they would want to spend their lives with - or maybe sadly sometimes - not.

MM - what if its a first time thing? A man in their grandads peer group? Wouldnt that seem too close to a certain type of tourist to Thailand?

mixedmedia

I'm not sure what you're asking. Are you referring to the prostitution of virgins? That is totally different from what I am talking about. I am talking about consensual teen sex with adults of their choice. How old the adult is or whether the child is a virgin isn't really all that relevant in practical, everyday, non-Thai brothel, consensual sex terms.

And, of course, now that old men and virgins have been brought into it, I feel like I have to repeat that I am not endorsing teen/adult sexual activity. In fact, I don't endorse teen sexual activity at all, for what it's worth (which = not much). Just saying that it isn't necessarily a life-altering event from which the teen will never recover. And that's good. We should always steer people away from the feeling of perpetual victimhood when possible.

__________________
Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus
PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

Ultrabum

What is immoral?

chinese crested

Are you referring to the prostitution of virgins?

- I think you are confusing self worth with financial value - the two are not even neighbours. I think that you dont just teach about willies and vaginas, sex and other relationships also involve head and heart - or I think they should do. It is a young person as a whole - dont we teach them how to make decisions and take responsibility in other parts of their lives - we should at least equip them as we can with knowledge - and with a sense of self worth and knowledge that they are loved.

match000

So does this imply incest is more commonplace than reported or that you just happened to meet some really messed up families?