Glory's Sun

So I'm reading this story of a cop who was going 70mph in a 40mph with no lights and sirens and he hits a kid on a bike and kills him. The cop got a whopping one day suspension and no grand jury indictment for killing the kid. How is that even possible? If a civilian had hit the child there would be massive charges, suspension or revocation of license, and massive fines.

Kill a Kid? Take the Day Off : Dispatches from the Culture Wars

CRIME Blog | The Dallas Morning News

I'm really just baffled on how a 1 day suspension seems like enough "punishment" for this guy. I'm sure the cop is upset and all that, but what about the child's family? Does DPD think a nice check is going to console them that their son is dead thanks to a cop not following procedure?? He should have at least had to stand trial for Involuntary Manslaughter..

I just can't wrap my head around this one..

dlish

if i was noodle, i'd say it was population control..but im not

this pisses me right off. there's no diffrenece between a cop and a normal citizen when it comes to the law. irrespective of whether he was on duty or not. if i struck a kid on the way to work, there's no excuses, i'd end up in jail.

i couldnt imagine how the parents feel right now, but if i were the cop, i'd be buying a lottery ticket

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GreyWolf

This is a needless tragedy. There's no doubt about that. I've reported cops for speeding without lights/siren for just that reason.

Cops have privileges that we don't... they carry weapons, their powers of arrest are greater, and they can violate some laws in performance of their duty. It's a very tough job. The vast majority are good, honest guys out there trying to "serve and protect". Then you get guys like this. Maybe, just maybe, he just got careless, or maybe there was a reason for not having lights/sirens. Around here, in the case of a domestic dispute, they don't want to announce their arrival ahead of time, so they will forgo the emergency equipment (that's when I called to report the guy).

But it doesn't matter. With their greater privilege comes a commensurate requirement for greater care. Whatever the reason for the accident, his carelessness cost a young boy his life, and his parents a child, something they will never recover from. His punishment was woefully inadequate, if even just from the point of view of restoring trust. Too many police forces forget what this does to their support in the community.

If you want another real good example, consider the case of Robert Dziekanski, a 40 year-old Polish immigrant to Canada who was killed by being tasered 5 time by RCMP officers within 30 seconds of their arrival on the scene. Their notes and statements accused him of being combative and attacking them. Unfortunately for them, the entire thing was caught on video by a guy watching, and when that tape was made public, the RCMP looked at best inept and dishonest. Rather than go after the 4 officers for lying and attacking this poor man who spoke no English or French, a solid blue wall went up to protect them. The ongoing inquiry into the killing has hurt the RCMP's reputation badly.

If I were a cop, I'd be outraged at the punishment to this guy in Dallas, and the treatment of the RCMP officers. How the hell could I ask people to trust me that I'm going to protect them first if they see that I can get away with murder?

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The_Dunedan

The cop is an Only One*, you must recall. It's life is ever-so-much more important than that of a lowly Pleb such as the unfortunate child, because it protects the rest of us from...umm...speeders and...you know...bad drivers and...stuff.

Get used to it. This sort of thing is hardly unusual, and is becoming more and more common (and more well-known, thanks to the uniquity of cellphone cameras.) Just ask the waitress unfortunate enough to irritate one of "Chicago's Finest" in this tape. BTW, the cop got probation for this unprovoked and potentially lethal beating.





*You know...the Only Ones who can be trusted with guns, authority, etc...despite the fact that cops negligently shoot themselves or others 10x more frequently than non-cops, and routinely abuse their authority in ways that even Kafka would have a hard time imagining.

Plan9

Nah, DK... it was because using his patrol car involved less paperwork than his Glock!

*rimshot*

You guys are killin' me here.

Cops negligently shoot themselves 10 times more, huh? Amazing.

Is that because they carry, handle, and discharge guns 10 times more than Joe Sixpack, maybe? Oh yeah.

If you occupation necessitates a hammer, a few people in your occupation are going to have busted thumbs.

/leaves thread due to suffocation from anti-establishment rhetoric and distorted Wolverines! "facts"

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highthief

That cop should be in jail and lose his job. I'm a big backer of the police - most of the cops I know are pretty good guys - but this is simply corrupt.

Poor little kid.

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The_Dunedan

I'm curious; if this is the case, how often do your Joes negligently shoot themselves or others? What about the Marines? They carry far more powerful weapons, far more frequently and consistently, than do the police, but I have yet to encounter or hear of anything even remotely approaching the rate/level of negligent discharges and injuries encountered among "law enforcement."

Baraka_Guru

How did this go from cop who made a big, stupid mistake while on duty to a clearly distressed and rather drunk off-duty cop beating on a waitress?

Post #4 too.

Why not compare him to the Gestapo and be done with it?

Other than that, I too believe the punishment was too light. I think they were more focused on what he did wrong, not the outcome and consequence of his decision.

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Glory's Sun

ok first off.. how the fuck did this turn into a gun thread? take that shit to weaponry or politics.

secondly, I know there are plenty of good cops.. I'm not questioning that. I'm questioning the fact that this guy was found to not be following procedure- hence the reason for suspension- and he still didn't get a grand jury indictment. In cases like these, it shouldn't matter if you were on duty, trying to protect someone else or you were high on doughnut sugar, you fucking killed a child and should at least have the facts presented before a jury of peers to decide your fate.

Had I been so stupid as to go 30 mph over the speed limit and hit and killed a child, I'd be looking at 5-15yrs minimum. A badge shouldn't excuse stupidity and the loss of innocent life. It wasn't a war zone..

Baraka_Guru

__________________
Knowing that death is certain and that the time of death is uncertain, what's the most important thing?
—Bhikkhuni Pema Chödrön

Humankind cannot bear very much reality.
—From "Burnt Norton," Four Quartets (1936), T. S. Eliot

Glory's Sun

I'm reading that as a grand jury in the indictment process..

in other words, a D.A. stands in front of a jury and presents some facts and the grand jury decides whether or not to hand down an indictment. This could easily have been a case of the D.A. not wanting to provide much factual basis surrounding the event so an indictment wouldn't be handed down.

If the D.A. was truthful and wanted the indictment, then the jurors should be ashamed that this man was allowed to walk free after this. I wonder if the grand jury would come to the same conclusion had it been a civilian?

Salem

That's appauling! A 10 year old boy is dead and his killer gets a day off from work? Really? I'm sure he feels horrible, but what about the family? They're never going to get over this. And they'll likely be angry with the justice system for the rest of their lives, because the very people who are supposed to punish the person who killed their son, gave him a day off work because they're on the same side of things. Ridiculous!

samcol

I'm so tired of hearing stories like this. Cops and government employees get so many benefits and perks it's ridiculous. I don't care if the grand jury let him off the hook which guccilvr pointed out smells like bullshit, his own department should suspend him for way longer than one day or even fire him.

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noodle

This guy was not a psycho, in all likelihood.
Therefore it would not be population control by my definition.

Carry on.

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Plan9

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Tully Mars

That's fucked up, the cop should go to jail to await trial. His supervisor who came up with the suspension should be fired.

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Reese

Agreed. I'm pretty sure I've been vocal on this forum before about cops going over the speed limit and it really pisses me off to hear that when someone does actually get hurt by their reckless driving they get off with a slap on the wrist. Look, He either didn't fuck up and it was an accident because he was allowed to drive that fast or he killed someone while breaking the law and he deserves a real punishment. Either way, a 1 day suspension is not the right punishment.

Someone tell me where the protest is going to be and I'll fucking be there.

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lostgirl

This turns my stomach. I haven't the words to express how f*ed up this is.

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Punk.of.Ages

We should kill him...




/obligatory anti-police P.o.A post

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Glory's Sun

Well if there was going to be one, it would be in Dallas.. I haven't heard anything about a protest..maybe some Dallas members are more clued in and can say for sure if there will be one. I'll call some of my friends in Dallas and see if they've heard about it or anything.

I imagine the family won't be there or willing to start one as it only opens the deep wounds left by this accident.

I'm all for cops doing their jobs, but I want them to do it correctly, and to do it by the rules they are enforcing. I know there are some exceptions, but in this case, I cannot see what the exception would be.

timalkin

..

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highthief

Blame rape victims for "asking for it" too, I bet?



It's not who makes up the grand jury - it's how it is presented. So political pressure says the AG has to put it before the jury - but it's pretty easy for him to present such that nothing is ever going to happen to the cop.

They put light bars on the cars for a reason. I don't think anyone would be kicking up a fuss if it had happened with the cherries on.

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Glory's Sun

QFT.

I'm also guessing that the enlightened one who considers those of us who think this is wrong retards, also believes that anyone who is responding to an emergency has full liberty on the road and doesn't have to abide by the laws that us "normal" people have to abide by. I mean the police chief didn't say he wasn't following procedure or anything..

It's quite a stretch to say that the cop would still have hit the child with his lights and sirens on. I mean, they aren't used to tell people to get out of the way or anything

A helmet or reflector on the bike would SURELY protect the child from the car going 30 FUCKING MILES OVER THE SPEED LIMIT WHEN IT HIT HIM.

All D.A.'s are honest and would NEVER EVER manipulate things to keep one of their own from going to jail. That's just preposterous!

all that being said, I think it's easy to see who's being a retard on this subject.

timalkin

..

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Trinity: "What do you need?"

Neo: "Guns. Lots of guns."

-The Matrix

MSD

Law enforcement officials get away with things that would have the general public screaming for blood had it been an ordinary citizen. He was breaking the law and someone died, doing 70 in a 40 at night with no warning to people in your way is dangerous no matter what the reason.

Glory's Sun

The only thing here that reeks of paranoia is your claim of how the system supposedly operates. A "dumb" kid that was on the street probably not even on the street riding but perhaps crossing the street to go home gets hit by a fucking cop going 70 miles and hour and yet you seem to think that a bike helmet would have helped in that situation. Gee that's BRILLIANT logic.

I applied a blanket statement over a blanket statement that you made. Deal with it. The fact of the matter is point blank: The chief said he wasn't following procedure, so we can come to the LOGICAL conclusion that it wasn't a call that required lights off or sirens off. No, this cop decided he wanted to race to the call without any sort of regard for public safety and he killed a kid.

Don't even start on the D.A. and police being separate divisions. That's obvious, but it's pretty well known that the Court system runs on cash, and if the cop would have been found guilty in this case, then the amount of cash would have been spent on a large settlement to the family. I mean, District Attorney's have NEVER lied because their career is at stake.. NEVER. Why would anyone have reason to believe that? Oh that's right, it's the weed

So keep on with your parade of logic in blaming the parents in this case. I'd LOVE for you to tell me that you have kids and that you know what's going on in their lives every second of every day. Who knows.. he probably asked to go to little Johnny's house and it was time for him to get home in time for supper, but that was interrupted by a cop not following procedure

Keep on championing those cops who can do whatever they want. I'm sure you'll find them to be more than willing to side with you when one of your own or yourself is damaged by there actions. What was that you said in some other politics thread?? "Don't forget the lube"?

timalkin

..

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Trinity: "What do you need?"

Neo: "Guns. Lots of guns."

-The Matrix

Glory's Sun

Blahblahblah..

Keep on with your child killer cop love. Its very patriotic.

If the cop was following correct procedure for the call he was responding to, then there would be no need for the joke of punishment this guy received.

You say you smell bullshit. Its quite obvious where that smell is coming from and it's wearing a uniform and badge. You keep wanting to pin this as some sort of cop hatred, when in fact it's not. I do not hate cops...at least not the ones who do their jobs the way it should be done.

Now on to the DA bit. Sure the money wouldn't come directly from the DA office..that's obvious..however, I still believe that judges, cops and prosecutors look out for each other..it's one of those unwritten rules. To not see that fact is naïve at best.

Even if the DA presented this case the right and ethical way, I simply cannot fathom how you want to only find fault with the parents and label them as criminals. Let's just hope that you don't have kids and find yourself in a situation like this. I'm sure though that if you did, you would just laugh it off, tell the cop he was only doing his job and give him a pat on the back for his service to the community, and to top it off, you'd ask him to arrest you because it was clearly your fault, and by that fault of yours the child is dead.

Your hardass view of the world is very endearing. You'd make one hell of a cop.

highthief

No, he'd make an awful cop.

I probably know more cops than most anyone here and all the ones I know would be extremely dissapointed by the sentence and would see timalkin as a bit of a wannabe.

Carry on.

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Si vis pacem parabellum.

Punk.of.Ages

How the hell did I end up in politics?!
______

I think we've all gotten away from the point a bit...

Fact: Kid is dead.

Fact: The punishment received by the person who killed him was way too light and reeks of special privilege.

Whether he's a cop or not, this man (not the parents or the child himself) should be held responsible for killing a child just as any normal driver would. It's really quite simple.

__________________
"The fact is that censorship always defeats its own purpose, for it creates, in the end, the kind of society that is incapable of exercising real discretion..." - Henry Steel Commager

"Punk rock music is great music played by really bad, drunk musicians." -Fat Mike

james t kirk

What are the details?

Did the kid ride through a stop sign for example?

What kind of call was the cop responding to?

What is the cop's record?

I know sometimes cops get really really carried away. I recall an incident in Toronto where a cop was engaging in a high speed chase in the city of a stolen minivan and killed a priest on a bike. The mini van was apparently worth 900 bucks. WTF the cop was thinking of is beyond my understanding. I'd be "take the fucking van". I've seen allot of these idiotic cop shows where the cops chase some idiot for having a burnt out tail light. Sometimes cops have a power complex that results in stupid things happening.

I'm sure the cop feels terrible (at least I hope so). Sometimes getting off the hook makes the situation worse for the guy who committed the crime.

hawker rider

I wasn't going to chime in on this subject because I'm a parent too, and I can feel the parents' pain.

That being said, I would love to go on an on about how trustworthy our police force is and that the bad apples are making the basket stink.....

Truth is, i haven't met any of these "good apples" All the cops that I have met are corrupt, and everybody I talk to has gotten out of some traffic ticket just because they knew someone at the force. They are a group (yes, together with the DA's) that protect themselves and each other. Who are we kidding???

The punishment for the officer in question was simply stated insufficient for the crime commited.

Tully Mars

Concur

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