ironman

So, today Gorge Bush came to Guatemala, i can't begin to tell you what a pain in the ass is that this guy has come. The secret service monkeys have been bothering since last week, the air space has been restricted, many streets have been closed (including the one where my office is), the secret service motherfuckers have shut down all parking lots in a 3 blocks radius from the places the idiot is gonna be in and the houses of people that live near the places the bastard is gonna visit are been checked for bombs and there are checkpoints all over the city. I remember when Clinton came when he was the US president, it was nothing like this, it didn't felt like fucking "Cesar" was coming to check how the farm was doing. I know most of you can't understand how uncomfortable this "visit" makes feel most of the people in Guatemala and in the whole Latin America, but believe me, this is not making the US any more popular around here and little by little Chavez's rhetoric makes more sense in the region. We're getting tired of been treated like the US's backyard and its impositions and threatens, this visit only aggravating that feeling.
Get back to the US already CHIMP!

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spindles

don't worry - it isn't just the president. Dick Cheney visited Australia a few weeks ago and caused traffic chaos , including closing all 8 lanes of the Sydney harbour bridge so he could cross to have dinner with the Prime Minister (whose official residence is north of the harbour). What a pain in the arse!!

I wonder why he didn't take the train - even emptying out an entire train might have caused less disruption

The difference? Clinton didn't invade too many terrorist filled countries, so maybe the security requirement was slightly less.

On a bright note - he won't stay long.

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Destrox

Just dont get the idea that we all like him in the US, I still feel he somehow cheated the US elections....

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politicophile

two characters

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The peculiar evil of silencing the expression of an opinion is, that it is robbing the human race; posterity as well as the existing generation; those who dissent from the opinion, still more than those who hold it. If the opinion is right, they are deprived of the opportunity of exchanging error for truth: if wrong, they lose, what is almost as great a benefit, the clearer perception and livelier impression of truth, produced by its collision with error. ~John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

cyrnel

If I had Bush's approval rating I'd be paranoid too.

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There are a vast number of people who are uninformed and heavily propagandized, but fundamentally decent. The propaganda that inundates them is effective when unchallenged, but much of it goes only skin deep. If they can be brought to raise questions and apply their decent instincts and basic intelligence, many people quickly escape the confines of the doctrinal system and are willing to do something to help others who are really suffering and oppressed." -Manufacturing Consent: Noam Chomsky and the Media, p. 195

ironman

I'd love to see what you're attitude would be if it was our president that was visiting the US and you got your house checked by "guatemalan police", if you got checked in the street by "guatemalan police", you got the airport and main streets shut by the "guatemalan police", and got warned that if you do not obey guatemalan's police orders, they are authorized to shoot you. I don't think you would be dancing around then...

I know you're not all like him, I have very good friends in the US that are good and respectful persons, unfortunately, he's the one that represents the US around the world, and he's doing a lousy job at it.

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snowy

Yep.

I don't remember when, but I recall that VP Cheney came through Oregon a couple of years ago and it snarled everything up from Eugene to Portland. On top of that, imagine the sheer cost of policing, closing down the roads, and securing the airports for the vice-president/president. It seems we spend a lot of money on a man who is not king.

No thanks.

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highthief

Ungrateful little Latin American. How dare you not appreciate the vision and sacrifice of George Augustus Bush, and his personal demolition of Saddam, Osama, The Ayatollah, and the Commies. You should be lined up on your knees in the streets to kiss the tires of his Majestic Motorcade!

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politicophile

two characters

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The peculiar evil of silencing the expression of an opinion is, that it is robbing the human race; posterity as well as the existing generation; those who dissent from the opinion, still more than those who hold it. If the opinion is right, they are deprived of the opportunity of exchanging error for truth: if wrong, they lose, what is almost as great a benefit, the clearer perception and livelier impression of truth, produced by its collision with error. ~John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

mixedmedia

Yes. The most hated man on the planet needs security in line with his status. Not surprised.

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The_Jazz

Other than this being for President Bush, how is this any different from any other time a World Leader visits anyplace? If the Pope goes to Guatamala (or anywhere else), isn't there tight security with streets shut down, etc.? If Chavez or Castro visited, wouldn't there be similar distruptions and inconveniences?

Other than a rant about how the OP was a little inconvenienced and politics, what's this about? Whenever a dignitary comes to Chicago, I have to deal with the same issues, minus the politics. It sucks at times, but the people who occupy certain offices in world have security requirements. If the King of Spain comes to visit, most of the same street closures, etc. would happen. Sorry that you had to take a few minutes out of your day for someone else to make sure that another human being wasn't going to be blown up.

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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - B. Franklin
"There ought to be limits to freedom." - George W. Bush
"We have met the enemy and he is us." - Pogo

Hektore

They can't just show up and do this without the cooperation from the local government right? Somewhere somebody from Guatemala had to give the "ok" to allow this to happen. Instead of ranting only about Bush (believe me, I think he should be ranted about) spread it around a little more as he isn't the only one at fault.

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Carno

People loved Kennedy and he got shot in the head.

You may be the most loved person on Earth, but all it takes is one nutjob and one little chunk of metal.

mixedmedia

Well, yes, this is true. And I wasn't being sarcastic in my statement. I think it is the truth. And I think that assassinations and attempted assassinations of more well thought of leaders in the past probably contributes heartily to the steepened security around our current president.

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Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus
PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

Ourcrazymodern?

Yeah, and what you said before, too.

Why are important people so expensive...

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jorgelito

The UN is notorious for snarling traffic in Manhattan and for parking at will.

Bill O'Rights

No...you're absolutely correct. In fact, I'd be pretty gaddamned pissed off. But, then again, I should think that security details would be handled by local officials, with the visiting dignitary's security personnel directing and overseeing what they would like to see done.

I'm hoping that this is the case in Guatemala? If not...then you have every right to be upset, as that's tantamont to an invasion.

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kurty[B]

Think, if Bush is assassinated Cheney is our new Commander in Chief! I'll take the lesser of two evils and deal with the grotesque display in security everywhere he goes (thankfully I live in a small town where the biggest political figure we'll ever see is the regional commissioner of the state department of transportation).

Just saw Bill's post, and completely agree. Your country's government should be organizing security detail.

jorgelito

Hmmm....that's a tough one. Would you entrust the security of your leader to another country? It seems like a security nightmare.

kurty[B]

Maybe not entrust them entirely, but have them organize blocking off streets, even if they are accompanied with Secret Service to ensure they do their job, but just letting the Secret Service have free reign to run amock doesn't sound right to me.

politicophile

two characters

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The peculiar evil of silencing the expression of an opinion is, that it is robbing the human race; posterity as well as the existing generation; those who dissent from the opinion, still more than those who hold it. If the opinion is right, they are deprived of the opportunity of exchanging error for truth: if wrong, they lose, what is almost as great a benefit, the clearer perception and livelier impression of truth, produced by its collision with error. ~John Stuart Mill, On Liberty

ironman

The Pope was here 2 times and never, ever was such a security operative like this, there were no streets blockages, he air space was not restricted, and specially, the Vatican Police didin't come to tell us what we could and couldn't do. As i said before, when Clinton came back in the 90's, it was nothing like this. I'm working from home today because my office building is next to the hotel qhere Bush spent the night, no parking in the building is allowed for anyone that does not own or rent a parking space and in order to enter the parking lot, you and your car are searched "by secret service agents". I know that whenever a president from other country comes to Guatemala, there are some things that have to be done in order to guarantee the security of our visitors, but what pisses me of, is that is the secret service -a police that in theory has nothing to do with Guatemala and should have no power here- is giving orders and taking over institutions (the airport for one) like if this was a US colony although, deep inside, we all know that that is what we are, and that's the reason why our Police, Army, and sovereignty has been handed over to the SS so easily.

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The_Jazz

The Superbowl closed downtown Detroit for 3 days last year, including the corporate headquarters of Ford.

For a football game. That the President wasn't going to attend.

The point is that things happen and sometimes you're inconvienced. Sorry about that, but in the post-9/11 world security is taken very seriously by most world leaders. I expect that if the Pope were to visit again, security would be a little tighter, as would a visit by any other major world leader.

It sounds like the Secret Service may have had a credible threat against the President. They don't make the kind of effort you've described lightly.

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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - B. Franklin
"There ought to be limits to freedom." - George W. Bush
"We have met the enemy and he is us." - Pogo

Lady Sage

Imagine having to live in the same country with him. It is agonizing sometimes. Personally, I am glad he goes away on occasion and it is my greatest dream that one time he wont come back.

Come on 1/20/09!!! (His last day in office.)

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Ourcrazymodern?

Don't wish our lives away, Lady!

He can survive another one year, ten months and eleven days, as long as his protection keeps their wits about them. (!) So can we, in spite of the embarassment. I mourn for the dead soldiers, and for what it all means...

And for whatever it's worth: Sorry for the inconvenience, former allies!

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snowy

I feel as if I should start planning the party now, just to give me that light at the end of the tunnel.

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If I am not better, at least I am different. --Jean-Jacques Rousseau

roachboy

its all part of the neocolonialism show.

obviously, for the Dear Leader of the Hegemon to grace guatemala with His Presence is no small action: it must be accompanied by a more general show of that unique combination of obliviousness and contempt that makes the Dear Leader and the particular Country for which he stands so well loved the whole world round. no doubt the security details were concerned about the Dear Leader being injured by the flowers that will be strewn at his feet. that was a real problem in iraq, too. obviously, the Dear Leader is taking no chances this time. and folk think that George W. Bush does not learn from previous mistakes. pshaw, i say. pshaw.

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Menoman

Your government is the one who is allowing him to use US police, they are the ones who gave the US police to shoot you if you do not obey.

We wouldn't be there if your government would have said no, we don't want you here.

I'm no bush lover, but it ain't all the US you should be rantin about

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Willravel

Hey, we don't want him. He can go out to international waters and make the fish look smart.

Astrocloud

No, it all the Liberal Media's fault.

smooth

Detroit wasn't closed down by Italian police, however.
Are you not catching that he is emphasizing the foreign police element?
Or does it not matter to you? Or...?
Because it sounds from your post that it wouldn't matter to you who is doing the policing, whereas for him it's a different context when one's own police are doing the policing. Yet, when it's a foreign police force, it feels like one's sovereignty is being usurped. Very frustrating.

On top of that, "a post-9/11 world" is a US construct. The rest of the developed world has already been acutely aware of modern terrorism for decades. We've been slow to the table, but certainly latin america and the Pope aren't acting all differently now that "9/11" happened. That point seems really unaware of things that have been happening in and around those countries for a very long time?

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Menoman

On the first part, we didn't just come in and do this, we talked with their government, said what we wanted to be able to do, they said we were allowed to police ourselves and shut down what was necessary. Blame the guat government not ours, for allowing us to do this.

Second part, Just because they were unaware, and by unaware, I mean lucky it wasn't about them, and apathetic because of that fact. Doesn't mean that it has nothing to do with them. Simply because murder is happening just down the block, doesn't give you the right to pretend ignorance of it.

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The_Jazz

Neocolonialism or a reassertion of the Monroe Doctrine, which seems to happen about every 15 or 20 years. Let's see, Panama was about 1990, so we're due.

I'm not ignoring the foriegn element, I'm just not assigning as much importance to it as you apparently are. Whenever any foreign leader visits anywhere, their security detail is in charge. That's the case here and everywhere else. Local authorities cooperate. That's the way diplomatic security works and is the reason why I was interviewed by British authorities a couple of years ago. I coached their consul's kids in fencing. The Americans never paid me a visit.

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"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - B. Franklin
"There ought to be limits to freedom." - George W. Bush
"We have met the enemy and he is us." - Pogo

Ourcrazymodern?

It MUST be.

DAMNIT!!!

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BE JUST AND FEAR NOT

Charlatan

I lived in Ottawa for six years. We were visited by world leaders on a regular basis. The ONLY time we had any real interference was when Bush Sr. came to town. They closed down highways and welded manhole covers and had helicopters hovering all over the place.

The same here in Singapore. The only time we had any serious crackdown was when we had the IMF here for a week or so and when Bush came before the big meeting in Saigon last fall.

There are world leaders popping in and out of Singapore and nobody but Bush Jr. causes this sort of commotion.


Do the rest of the world a favour and make your president stay home.

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Ourcrazymodern?

If you please, sir, I want more soup.

That infamous smirking precludes making it do anything.

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Cynthetiq

The Clintons came to NYC regularly, sometimes to take in a show on Broadway.

I have had to go through secret service check in before. Annoying.

Imelda Marcos had that same kind of crap. Annoying.

I've even had to do it for a funeral that Corey Aquino attended. Equally Annoying.

My Icelandic friend gave me tales about the foreign nationals that would come to the US Embassy.

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Ourcrazymodern?

Can the secret service service anybody except those requiring secrets?
If not, what good are they?

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highthief

Do you have any idea how much terrorism there has been in the rest of the world, including Latin America, long before 9/11 was a twinkle in Osama's eye? Much of the rest of the world has been dealing with terrorism - some inspired by US administrations, it should be noted - for decades prior to 9/11.

I wonder who pretended ignorance of what for all those decades?

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snowy

Imagine that a city you visit frequently had riots while a major organization such as the IMF was visiting. Then you can truly enjoy the fruits of paranoia. Post-WTO riots, Seattle has never been the same. One spring break a few years ago we went to visit some friends there, and the police were out in full force, in riot gear. The Japanese tourists in front of the art museum were taking pictures of the police, posing in front of the lines of cops in full gear.

It was at once humorous and horrifying, to think that three years after the Battle of Seattle the police are still so paranoid of what happened during the riots that they come out in full force any time there is an inkling of civil unrest.

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