lindalove

On one of the gossip boards I visit, I was led to a blog written by a gay activist (www.blogactive.com) who apparently plans to out (reveal as gay) a closeted, married Republican senator tomorrow. His rationale: to expose what he sees as hypocrisy by someone who votes against the interests of gay people yet engages in gay sex on the down-low (sorry for the inarticulate phrasing; I'm just not sure the way to put it).

I don't know where I stand on this. On one hand, I can only imagine that coming out is such a delicate, wrenching process, I hate to see someone forced out of the closet. On the other hand, though, I can understand the impulse of those in the gay community to expose what they see as hypocrisy on the part of conservative politicians or staffers who consistently vote against gay rights.

What do you think?

Lady Sage

Honestly?

Karma is a bad woman I dont want to mess with. He may have it coming but I tell you one thing. I am glad its not me!

I dont think anyone should be forced to do anything but we all have been at one time or another forced to do something we didnt want to. I think with the events of the past week or so we will see more of this kind of thing.....

Time will tell all things.

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healer

I can understand where this activist is coming from. He wants to expose this Senator as a hypocrite and in so doing, lobby more support for the gay community. Or at least that's what I think. The question is, will it work?

What is the most that can be gained from outing this Senator dude? I understand coming out to be difficult enough without being 'forced out'. I know I wouldn't do it to someone else.

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analog

The idea of intentionally "outing" a gay man or woman who does not wish to be "outed" is terrible.

The only difference I see in this story is more the fact that he's exposing a hypocrite, by showing that he secretly engages in the very behaviors he publicly puts down and votes against. In this respect, I see it as the same thing as exposing a senator who smokes pot all the time but actively participates in anti-drug efforts, or a person who is exposed as an avid gun enthusiast who spends his time in anti-gun efforts in public display.

In my opinion, it's the hypocrisy of the thing that he's exposing, not simply "outing" him to attack him- it just happens that in order to expose the hypocrit, some info would be leaked that he'd rather not be leaked.

Such is the life of a hypocrit, though. Most will eventually be exposed.

SirLance

I think the activist is shooting himself in the foot. He may "out" the senator, but he will absolutely demonstrate that he is hateful, jealous, and vindictive.

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Telluride

First of all, I'd need to know more about what you mean by voting "against the interests of gay people". Just because you can be classified as belonging to some group doesn't mean you have to support anything and everything that benefits that group.

Anyway; I believe that one's sex life is a personal matter providing he or she isn't violating anyone's rights or endangering others. I certainly don't believe in "outing" someone as a politically-motivated "Gotcha!" tactic.

I think the only time I would disclose information about sex between consenting adults to another person would be if I found out someone I knew was cheating on his or her significant other. I wouldn't do this because I'm some nosey moralist. I would do this because the cheater could be risking the health of his or her significant other by possibly bringing home STD's (and the cheater's sexual orientation wouldn't matter to me). What kind of friend would I be if I looked the other way while my friend's life was being put at risk? But even then I would "out" the cheater's behavior in a private way rather than posting it on the internet or taking out an ad in the local paper.

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Elphaba

I agree with both analog and Telluride. "Outing" someone against their wishes to make a point, about *what*, exactly? The behavior of consenting adults is not anyone's business, period. How is it any different for a gay senator to choose privacy in his sexual preferences, and any other senator or public figure? Does anyone have the gall to ask Laura Bush about the privacy of her bedroom? Of course not, and the same privacy should be accorded to all personal issues.

Foley's issues are not about being a closeted homosexual. His attraction to teenagers is the issue.

jorgelito

Outing? Sure why not, after all, others have been outed for getting blow jobs. In that context it is relevant. The guy is cheating on his wife. Doesn;t matter if he's gay or not. If Slick Willie got a hummer from a page boy would it be "outing"?

analog

Forget gall, I don't think anyone has the stomach to touch that subject. (she scares me) lol

Ustwo

I have a gay friend who's partner is one of those obviously gay males that fits about every stereotype in the book.

Last election I get a distraught IM from my friend. It seems they never talked politics and my friend assumed that his partner shared his political viewpoints. Well it turned out his partner was a Republican, and always had been. Now my friend knew I voted republican and that was fine with him, we had some interesting debates and being he was intellectually honest in his viewpoints it was nice having discussions where we could look at issues and not debate facts and twist meanings like is so common as of late, and we had some great debates. He could be my friend even though we had different political view points but he was just shocked about his partner. Now my friend worked for a few democrat senators in D.C., and his partner knew his politics, so there wasn't a shock in that direction. When my friend asked his partner why he never told him, his partner said it was because he didn't want to upset him and it really wasn't something he felt was that important to their relationship in the long run, nothing done on the national/international scale was likely to really effect their relationship together.

I think the message is that you can have overriding reasons for the choices you make, even if it seems to go against your self interest. I am always amused every election when people say 'you need to vote for this party because they will give you more money' (thats not quite what they say, but its what it boils down to) not realizing that once everyone votes only with their wallet and not by what they think is best for the country, we are finished.

So maybe you are a homosexual and sure you wish the republicans were more 'gay friendly' on things like gay marriage, but if to you this seems like a small and unimportant issue beyond national security or whatever, why stand up for what you see as less important if it means sacrificing what you see as more important?

Now for those interested their relationship survived, but I haven't talked with him in about a year and a half, shame because I'm not sure how to get in touch with him now.

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Pip

Nononono.

What he's doing is - as far as I know - not against any written law. I don't think anyone, not even politicians, should have to follow "their" party politics 100%. That'd be awful. Like Ustwo said, you have to pick the issues that are important to you. Apparently homosexual issues aren't on top of this man's list, so what? What gives the blogger the right to force his priorities onto the politician? Which is what he's going to do with the outing.

highthief

Agreed. This "activist" is neither a rational nor particularly nice person. What someone does or does not do in their bedroom is their own business, whatever their political views. Said activist needs, well, a slap upside the head.

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Charlatan

I completely agree.

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mixedmedia

I think this is pretty hysterical. I'm tired of hysteria.

Not to mention, it's just wrong.

Plus, is he assuming the senator votes against gay issues because he is a republican? Because not all of them do, and a significant segment of the gay male population itself votes republican.

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lindalove

When I used the phrase, I was specifically referring to politicians who vote to ban gay marriage or in favor of constitutional amendments defining marriage as between a man and a woman. I use this reference because that's how the blog active blogger seems to define it (though I admit I took only a cursory look at the blog).

pan6467

I have always believed in showing people for what they are, especially those who live in the public eye, lawmakers especially.

It is my belief that a person living a double life can create serious problems. As I posted elsewhere, I see people everyday that turn to addictions because they lived a double life and put that pressure on themselves. Why? Just be who you are and fuck what anyone else thinks. Why be something or someone you are not and put that added stress into your life.

If you're gay, be gay. Don't get married fuck up someone else's life, your kids lives and other people's lives because you are selfish.

Ok, so say this guy from the OP decides not to out the senator but instead blackmail him into voting certain ways.....

I'm sorry, I live my life open and I point my skeletons out, I don't see a reason not to. And if you are going to be in a position of authority, then you need to expect being watched.

Look at how the GOP loves to point out every misstep a Kennedy has ever made, or a Clinton has made or anyone that can challenge them. If the GOP can do this to the Dems. then the Dems have every right to do it to the GOP.

Noone is perfect, we all have skeletons, but there is a huge difference between having a skeleton 20 yrs old and living a double life.

Yoiu make the choice when you go into public life to know that if you live a double life it may come out. So you either don't go into the public eye or you don't live the double life. If you do both, then it is your own damned fault if you are caught ("outed"). Don't cry how unfair life is, that the other person is hateful, etc. You did it, you face the music.

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I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"

mixedmedia

I understand what you're saying, pan, but I see this as an unfortunate and ugly reality of our society and as such, I want no part of it. I think it's pretty despicable regardless of whose name is being dragged through the mud. There is not only this man's life and privacy at stake, but that of his family's, as well. I'm going to stick to my conviction that the boundaries of a person's private life ought to be respected. Even in the face of all known reality about the way our society treats them.

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Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus
PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

ratbastid

See, right there is why I wouldn't do it. The current administration has shown itself willing to destroy individuals lives to forward their agenda, and if that's ever going to stop, somebody has to stand up against it.

Imagine this gay activist saying publicly, "I have information that a prominent Republican Senator is a closeted homosexual. I do not intend to out this Senator because I refuse to participate in the politics of personal destruction of the kind that the GOP has elevated to such an art form. However, know this: the anti-gay agenda is rife with hypocracy. So-called "morals voters", your representatives are lying to you, and are using you for your vote. They don't share your social agenda. You are being manipulated."

highthief

You know what? Every single human being in the world has personal secrets that he or she has no desire to share with the rest of the world - sexual secrets, family secrets, etc. Some of those personal secrets are of the sort that may disgust or turn off others. But every one has them and everyone is entitled to them.

The more I read about "outing" (of anyone whether in the public eye or not) the more disturbed I am by anyone who would advocate such action. For the most part, my impression of such activists are that they are the like little kids in the school yard who, upon hearing confidential information, start running around singing "I'm gonna tell!"

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jorgelito

I think it makes a big difference if they are married or not. If he's single then it's no big deal, but he's married and on the down low then it should be outed like any other politician gets "outed", like Gary Hart, Clinton etc...

kutulu

It would depend on what his voting record is, what his public comments are, and who he gets money from. If he abstains or votes against anti-gay laws, avoids talking about gays, and does not take money from groups that are obviously anti-gay, then he should be left alone. If the opposite applies, screw him. You don't get to lead that life in secret and them publicly denounce everyone who does.

It's no different than ANY sex scandal. Republicans are only bitching because in this case it primarily affects them. They had NO problem going after Clinton.

highthief

While I don't agree with people cheating on their spouses (and for all anyone knows, this guy might even have an open marriage) it is not the place of anyone to reveal that to the world.

I bet virtually everyone here knows someone who has had an affair or ten. Have you gone to their spouse to tell them, even if you may not agree with the cheating? Most people won't do that, knowing it is really none of our business and knowing the pain we might inflict on a family.

It's maybe easy to talk about when it is some stranger or a "public target" like this guy. Hell, unless someone has video its all just hearsay anyway.

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stevo

As long as the representative votes the way his constituents want what does it matter if he "shares their social agenda?" Its the voting record that counts, not his personal feelings.

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jorgelito

That's exactly it, that's why it's even more hypocritical for people to point out the Kennedy's, Gary Hart, or Clinton. Clinton even got impeached for it. It's either fair game for all or fair game for none. I actually don't see what his orientation has to do with it. It's either ok to expose his cheating etc or it's not.

The_Jazz

Well said.

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mixedmedia

Well, highthief is saying it's not okay. And I agree that it's not. I could care less if it's happened to someone else. It is irrelevant.

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Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus
PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

jorgelito

Sure it's relevant. It's about consistency and double standards.

stevo

THis isn't about who's cheating and who isn't. Its about outing someone because you disagree with their politics. It has nothing at all to do with being a faithful spouse.

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jorgelito

I see. Well, I would think that outing is a private matter. Unless the guy did something like legislate anti-gay measures or what have you there really isn't any reason to out him.

cj2112

Do people really believe the "but he started it" defense is a logical one?

jorgelito

Of course not, I am not defending it. I am pointing out the inconsistencies.

cj2112

I apologize, I should not have picked out your post alone, this really was intended the way I edited it.

mixedmedia

I always thought Bill Clinton's personal life should have been kept personal. If I were to support the outing of this man then I would be perpetuating the double standard.

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Most people go through life dreading they'll have a traumatic experience. Freaks were born with their trauma. They've already passed their test in life. They're aristocrats. - Diane Arbus
PESSIMISM, n. A philosophy forced upon the convictions of the observer by the disheartening prevalence of the optimist with his scarecrow hope and his unsightly smile. - Ambrose Bierce

jorgelito

No need to apologize it's always good to have clarification. Thanks for your input.

*nodding head* Agreed.

ratbastid

You and I think that. Ask the religious right, though. I promise you they wouldn't find it OK that the legislator they voted for has been hiding a secret gay lifestyle, no matter what his voting record is.

Ustwo

Clinton wasn't nailed for cheating on his spouse, and honestly I think he and Hill have a deal, Bill gets to screw around just keep it under wraps, so its not really cheating. It was that Bill was involved in a sexual harassment suite and he committed perjury in relation to Monica.

It was never about bjs or cigars, those were the unfortunate details that came out while investigating the perjury.

I could never figure out what horrified me more. The fact that the president couldn't get a bj from a willing intern, or the fact that the president wasn't able to hide that he got a bj from a willing intern.

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ubertuber

I actually don't agree with you on this. There's not necessarily a contradiction in a gay person supporting the Republican party (or being a member). Just because you think homosexual behavior is OK doesn't mean you want to legalize gay marriage. I've known several middle aged lesbians who were staunch Republicans. It wasn't even that other issues like national security trumped gay rights - they just didn't support gay marriage or gays in the military.

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stevo

But as long as he votes the way they want the religious right can't complain. Would they rather have a straight representative that supports legislation their against? I doubt it.

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"If I am such a genius why am I drunk, lost in the desert, with a bullet in my ass?" -Otto Mannkusser

xxSquirtxx

I've been thinking about this question since I read it today.

This activist isn't "outing" this senator for the good of his family, for the good of the party, or for the common good in general. He's outing him for evil motives. To affect an election. He thinks it will piss off enough Republicans that they will stay home or vote for someone else. He thinks this will scare off the Christian right. What he is doing is vile and vindictive. Is the senator gay, as in "doesn't like women," or is he bi? Is he just sexually attracted to men? And if so, SO WHAT? The only problem I see is if he is having sex outside the marriage if the marriage is not an open one.

It is nobody's damn business what his sexual preferences are. I see all too many narrow-minded, bigoted, vile, and nauseating replies in this thread as well. Something I shouldn't expect to see at a place like TFP, but I continue to be disappointed.

One must be mentally deficient to assume being Republican is synonymous with being religious, anti-gay, or any other stereotypical Republican trait. I know all too many "rightwingers," even "conservative" Republicans, whose sexual practices would curl the toes of the most deviant people here at TFP. They are quite proud of their polyamory, their love of BDSM, their fetishes, and their pro-life stance.

To rip a family up as this activist seems hell-bent on doing is below gutter level. Maybe his wife already knows. Who knows?

Having met so many people online in various places, I really fail to see why people keep tying sexual preference and political stance together. One does not equal the other. I'm a staunch Republican. Does that mean I only like sex in the missionary position? Does that mean I only like men? The fact is, I would consider myself bisexual. But do I partake in other women? No, because I'm married, just like I don't partake in other men. My husband and I do not have an open marriage. He knows I find women extremely attractive, and he knows I've slept with other women before we were married.

The bottom line is that it does not matter which sex this guy is attracted to. And if he is having sex outside of his marriage, whether it's with women or men, his wife WILL find out.

Elphaba

The politician this guy "outed" is Larry Craig of Idaho. I believe he is single, not that I think that or his sexual preference is something the public has a need to know.