Skinny, Average, Fat, Obese - Page 2 - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

Toaster126 · 08-23-2006, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JinnKai

I find it interesting that a solution such as "eat less food" is an effective way to end obesity, but "thinking happy thoughts" is not an effective way to end depression. Why do you think this is?

Controlling your thoughts is much harder than controlling your actions.

Ustwo · 08-23-2006, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sultana

For what it's worth, my trainer told me that to seriously re-shape your body, you must plan on a MINIMUM ONE HOUR A DAY, FIVE DAYS A WEEK, of aerobic, fat burning activity. That does not include the weight lifting. So when I started my "fitness frenzy", as the hubby calls it, I dedicated 2 hours a day to my fitness plan. Oh, and of course that means changing my eating habits as well. Fortunately maintenance does not require quite so much effort, and I lived for the day when I'd be maintaning rather than losing.

While I think its a good program if you can do it, I think the time and effort is a lot for some people and you can do quite well for a lot less time. My wife has been doing body for life, and shes had a tremendous improvement. That is about 40 mins a day, including weightlifting + diet changes. Shes pretty much a hottie now

Interesting enough it was a photo that really got her going, so you are right on the money there. The only thing worse than an ugly brides maid dress is looking fat in an ugly brides maid dress.

Sultana · 08-23-2006, 11:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ustwo

*snip* you are right on the money there. *snip*

I am printing this, and framing it.

raeanna74 · 08-23-2006, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by highthief

It can be that when you eat too little, your body will store body fat against what it perceives as starvation. Generally, you will still lose weight on a very low cal diet, but your Body Fat percentage can actually go up you shed muscle and hoard fat. I prefer a more moderate diet combined with higher levels of exercise to shed weight.

I was afraid of that too. That's what totally shocked me when my Dr told me to eat less even though I had told him what I was already doing.

I've tried eating more and even when I'm VERY careful to eat the vitamin and mineral laden foods it makes no difference. It's hard to keep it up after several weeks of such careful eating and no progress.

I am only 5'5" but my bones are very large and I'm somewhat muscular for a woman. It's hard for me to know exactly how much and what I should eat because so many calorie charts seem to be designed for tiny women with no muscle and thin bones.

Sage · 08-23-2006, 04:13 PM

I like the ideas that are presented by some guru/spiritual guide/dharma/belief/idea that I've seen floating around Asheville- it's the idea of mindful eating. Have a scale of hunger, 0 is totally starving, 10 is stuffed to the point of exploding. Never let your hunger get below 3 or above 6.

raeanna- have you thought about going to a nutritionist? Someone who's field of study is the stuff that people eat? I'd image they'd know a lot more than your regular doctor about what to eat and what's best for you.

raeanna74 · 08-23-2006, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sage

I like the ideas that are presented by some guru/spiritual guide/dharma/belief/idea that I've seen floating around Asheville- it's the idea of mindful eating. Have a scale of hunger, 0 is totally starving, 10 is stuffed to the point of exploding. Never let your hunger get below 3 or above 6.

raeanna- have you thought about going to a nutritionist? Someone who's field of study is the stuff that people eat? I'd image they'd know a lot more than your regular doctor about what to eat and what's best for you.

I had asked that doctor that I previously mentioned to recommend one for me. He poo-pooed the idea and wouldn't help. (I have since heard that he gave pain medication to a man who ultimately had cancer but this Dr never checked for it. The man is dead now.) It's Doctors like this that are making it harder for obese people to loose ANY way or other people to fear going to the Dr altogether.

I have since managed to loose about 10 lbs. I still want to loose more but unless I can't continue at least SOME weightloss in the next couple months I won't worry about seeing one.

I miss my regular Dr - She and her husband went overseas to work as Doctors in some 3rd world country. She would have helped I'm sure.

Sage · 08-23-2006, 07:18 PM

Can't you find another doctor? It's not healthy for you to be going to a totally incompitent doctor!

ngdawg · 08-23-2006, 07:55 PM

On a recent episode of Celebrity Fit Club, one of the participants gave that 'excuse', that his whole family was 'bigboned', so Dr. Ian Smith gave him a challenge; get x-rayed. He got xrays of his ribs and pelvis. Then Dr. Smith had his own x-rayed-there was no difference, despite the participant weighing over 400lbs and Smith being thin. That's not to say there aren't differences in bone size, but unless it's tested specifically, it's hard to tell when you're fighting a weight battle.
My best friend is an inch taller than I, but 90 lbs heavier, but I wear a larger ring size and have a smaller frame. And she doesn't look 90 lbs heavier when we're side by side.
The best way to see where your frame lies in scale to your weight is to have a doctor measure it. Many times what's 'bigboned' is muscle; a BMI can be taken as well.

highthief · 08-24-2006, 03:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raeanna74

I am only 5'5" but my bones are very large and I'm somewhat muscular for a woman. It's hard for me to know exactly how much and what I should eat because so many calorie charts seem to be designed for tiny women with no muscle and thin bones.

What do you weigh and what is your exercise regimen? I can tell you how many calories to eat. That would be only a baseline average, however, based on what other people of your size and activity level find useful.

I think it is more useful, especially when starting out, not to get too attached to the scale - the scale can lie on a number of levels: cheap scales are inaccurate and if you start an exercise regimen it is common to gain weight in the first few weeks as muscle mass increases. Go by how your clothes fit, how many notches on your belt you use, and, if you are brave, take measurements of all your bits and pieces - if they go down, you are on the right track regardless of what the scale says.

hagatha · 08-24-2006, 04:29 AM

I've often wondered if food has become a substitute for love and comfort. As people become more remote from one another and real time social networks grow increasingly more difficult to form and people rarely have time to listen to one another and show real compassion, maybe stuffing a donut in your mouth lessens the pain of existence.
When I was a kid, if you were well fed it meant you were loved. If you had a problem mom gave you a cookie-- she didn't tell you to go for a walk and make it better. The things we learn as children stay with us as adults (for the good or the bad) and if comfort is what we need and no one is there to say "its going to be alright", a cookie will do.
I gave up cookies for cigarettes. The psychological need remains.

Ustwo · 08-24-2006, 07:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hagatha

I've often wondered if food has become a substitute for love and comfort. As people become more remote from one another and real time social networks grow increasingly more difficult to form and people rarely have time to listen to one another and show real compassion, maybe stuffing a donut in your mouth lessens the pain of existence.
When I was a kid, if you were well fed it meant you were loved. If you had a problem mom gave you a cookie-- she didn't tell you to go for a walk and make it better. The things we learn as children stay with us as adults (for the good or the bad) and if comfort is what we need and no one is there to say "its going to be alright", a cookie will do.
I gave up cookies for cigarettes. The psychological need remains.

Or rather than finding a profound and deep reason for people getting fatter, it could be less exercise, eating much more refined sugar, and air conditioning (yes this is a big change allowing people to be comfortable and fat in a hot climate) causing the problem.

snowy · 08-24-2006, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hagatha

I've often wondered if food has become a substitute for love and comfort. As people become more remote from one another and real time social networks grow increasingly more difficult to form and people rarely have time to listen to one another and show real compassion, maybe stuffing a donut in your mouth lessens the pain of existence.
When I was a kid, if you were well fed it meant you were loved. If you had a problem mom gave you a cookie-- she didn't tell you to go for a walk and make it better. The things we learn as children stay with us as adults (for the good or the bad) and if comfort is what we need and no one is there to say "its going to be alright", a cookie will do.
I gave up cookies for cigarettes. The psychological need remains.

I think this is true for women. Women tend to be emotional eaters. I know my eating patterns fluctuate wildly over the course of my cycle simply because of the different levels of hormones in my system. Some days all you want is to go home and eat a giant bowl of mashed potatoes.

That is one thing I have been working on--thinking about my motivation to eat. Exercising isn't a problem, though I need to do more of it more often, and usually neither is controlling my eating. But there are some days where I just want to EAT and I don't care WHAT or else I'm craving something. And I'm trying to discover what the root cause of those cravings and compulsions is.

Confederate · 08-27-2006, 10:14 PM

right now, I am 6 feet tall and 180 pounds. according to some lists I am considered fat. I have a 33 inch waist, I can run over 5 kilometers and I move furniture as a job right now. I consider myself average to "in shape." I may have love handles and what-not. I think it is all subjective. Granted anyone can consider a 300 pound man with a 50 inch waist fat, but as long as you are in shape, any weight can be considered in shape, average, or fat.

Toaster126 · 08-28-2006, 01:08 PM

I don't know of any lists that have 6 feet tall and 180 as fat. What list(s) say that?

I do know that the BMI has issues with saying really physically fit people are fat...

Ch'i · 09-03-2006, 08:14 PM

I thought you guys might like this article I found.

Quote:

Although the cause of these cognitive impairments is still unknown, UF researchers suspect the metabolic disturbances obesity causes could be taking a toll on young brains, which are still developing and not fully protected, they write in an article published in the Journal of Pediatrics this month.

“It’s well-known that obesity is associated with a number of other medical problems, such as diabetes, hypertension and elevated cholesterol,” said Dr. Daniel J. Driscoll, a UF professor of molecular genetics and microbiology in the College of Medicine and the lead author of the study. “Now, we’re postulating that early-onset morbid obesity and these metabolic, biochemical problems can also lead to cognitive impairment.”

Researchers compared 18 children and adults with early-onset morbid obesity, which means they weighed at least 150 percent of their ideal body weight before they were 4, with 19 children and adults with Prader-Willi syndrome, and with 24 of their normal-weight siblings. Researchers chose lean siblings as a control group “because they share a socioeconomic group and genetic background,” Driscoll said.

The links between cognitive impairments and Prader-Willi syndrome, a genetic disorder that causes people to eat nonstop and become morbidly obese at a very young age if not supervised, are well-established. But researchers were surprised to find that children and adults who had become obese as toddlers for no known genetic reason fared almost as poorly on IQ and achievement tests as Prader-Willi patients. Prader-Willi patients had an average IQ of 63 and patients with early-onset morbid obesity had an average of 78. The control group of siblings had an average IQ of 106, which falls within the range of what is considered normal intelligence.

“It was surprising to find that they had an average IQ score of 78, whereas their control siblings were 106,” Driscoll said. “We feel this may be another complication of obesity that may not be reversible, so it’s very important to watch what children eat even from a very young age. It’s not just setting them up for problems later on, it could affect their learning potential now.”

While performing head MRI scans of subjects, researchers also discovered white-matter lesions on the brains of many of the Prader-Willi and early-onset morbidly obese patients. White-matter lesions are typically found on the brains of adults who have developed Alzheimer’s disease or in children with untreated phenylketonuria, the researchers wrote.

These lesions could be affecting food-seeking centers of the brain, causing the children to feel hungrier. But they are most likely a result of metabolic changes that damage the young, developing brain, Driscoll said.

More studies are needed to understand what is causing these cognitive impairments, said Dr. Merlin Butler, a professor of pediatrics at the University of Missouri and chief of genetics and molecular medicine at Children’s Mercy Hospital and Clinics.

“This could be a really significant observation,” Butler said. “It’s an interesting concept. It’s a whole new area of investigation.”

The findings are preliminary and additional studies are planned, Driscoll said. Dr. Jennifer Miller, a UF assistant professor of pediatric endocrinology and the first author of the study, and other researchers from UF, All Children’s Hospital in St. Petersburg, Fla., and Baylor College of Medicine also took part in the research.

Although there is no known genetic cause for early-onset morbid obesity, Driscoll said there are likely genetic and hormonal factors at play that researchers have yet to discover, particularly since these children are becoming obese at a time when their parents still control what they eat. The researchers studied several sets of fraternal twins where one twin was lean and the other morbidly obese, yet their parents reported that each ate the same amount of food. In one case, the obese child actually ate less, Driscoll said.

Driscoll is also careful to point out that adults or children who become obese later in childhood are not at-risk for these cognitive impairments because their brains are sufficiently developed to fend off damage from obesity.

“We’re all mindful that this is an obese society,” he said. “We all need to be more careful with respect to what we eat, but in particular, that’s very important for children under 4.”

With this and our current problem with education in America, it looks like we'll have a nice BIG bunch of people who lack the ability to think in a few decades.

Source: www.physorg.com

magictoy · 09-03-2006, 10:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willravel

Count yourself lucky that you haven't experienced real addiction.
Maybe my experience with heroin can help. Okay, I am in a waking dream all night, feeling empty and cold. I've been sober a day or two, and it's hurting badly. Imagine a headache with a purpous....driving you to use again. I wake up at 7 am finally, and have some breakfast. My apetite is kinda wierd, so my stomach hurts. All I can think about is how sober I am. I go to work or school and can't concentrate. Every waking moment there is an emptyness that overshadows whatever you think or do. It's not weakness. It's victimization, if anything. I've seen people stronger than I am succumb to addiction. Strength of will really has little to do with it. In my mind, luck and help are what really get you out of the hole. I don't know if I could have gotten out myself. It took the death of my best friend and the help of friends to get me out.

Whever I hear people suggest addiction is a lack of self control/willpower or lazyness, I chuckle to myself. It's like having a painting described to you by a blind man. The best explaination of the painting has to come from the artist.

With heroin's well-known effect of physical addiction, it's not hard to understand how tough it is to shake. It's difficult to put food into that category, though.

What would really be nice to hear, if it's not too personal, is what caused you to decide to use it that first time. Did you (not joking here) have a bad day, and have a friend push it on you in a weak moment? With all respect, I have trouble understanding why someone would ever think taking their first dose of heroin was a good idea. I feel the same way about cigarettes, if that takes any sting out of my question.

Thanks for your honesty.

08-23-2006, 04:13 PM	#45 (permalink)
Sage hoarding all the big girl panties since 2005 Location: North side	I like the ideas that are presented by some guru/spiritual guide/dharma/belief/idea that I've seen floating around Asheville- it's the idea of mindful eating. Have a scale of hunger, 0 is totally starving, 10 is stuffed to the point of exploding. Never let your hunger get below 3 or above 6. raeanna- have you thought about going to a nutritionist? Someone who's field of study is the stuff that people eat? I'd image they'd know a lot more than your regular doctor about what to eat and what's best for you. __________________ Sage knows our mythic history, King Arthur's and Sir Caradoc's She answers hard acrostics, has a pretty taste for paradox She quotes in elegiacs all the crimes of Heliogabalus In conics she can floor peculiarities parabolous -C'hi

08-23-2006, 07:18 PM	#47 (permalink)
Sage hoarding all the big girl panties since 2005 Location: North side	Can't you find another doctor? It's not healthy for you to be going to a totally incompitent doctor! __________________ Sage knows our mythic history, King Arthur's and Sir Caradoc's She answers hard acrostics, has a pretty taste for paradox She quotes in elegiacs all the crimes of Heliogabalus In conics she can floor peculiarities parabolous -C'hi

08-23-2006, 07:55 PM	#48 (permalink)
ngdawg peekaboo Location: on the back, bitch	On a recent episode of Celebrity Fit Club, one of the participants gave that 'excuse', that his whole family was 'bigboned', so Dr. Ian Smith gave him a challenge; get x-rayed. He got xrays of his ribs and pelvis. Then Dr. Smith had his own x-rayed-there was no difference, despite the participant weighing over 400lbs and Smith being thin. That's not to say there aren't differences in bone size, but unless it's tested specifically, it's hard to tell when you're fighting a weight battle. My best friend is an inch taller than I, but 90 lbs heavier, but I wear a larger ring size and have a smaller frame. And she doesn't look 90 lbs heavier when we're side by side. The best way to see where your frame lies in scale to your weight is to have a doctor measure it. Many times what's 'bigboned' is muscle; a BMI can be taken as well. __________________ Don't blame me. I didn't vote for either of'em.

08-24-2006, 04:29 AM	#50 (permalink)
hagatha Addict	I've often wondered if food has become a substitute for love and comfort. As people become more remote from one another and real time social networks grow increasingly more difficult to form and people rarely have time to listen to one another and show real compassion, maybe stuffing a donut in your mouth lessens the pain of existence. When I was a kid, if you were well fed it meant you were loved. If you had a problem mom gave you a cookie-- she didn't tell you to go for a walk and make it better. The things we learn as children stay with us as adults (for the good or the bad) and if comfort is what we need and no one is there to say "its going to be alright", a cookie will do. I gave up cookies for cigarettes. The psychological need remains. __________________ Thats the last time I trust the strangest people I ever met....H. Simpson

08-28-2006, 01:08 PM	#54 (permalink)
Toaster126 Extreme moderation Location: Kansas City, yo.	I don't know of any lists that have 6 feet tall and 180 as fat. What list(s) say that? I do know that the BMI has issues with saying really physically fit people are fat... __________________ "The question isn't who is going to let me, it's who is going to stop me." (Ayn Rand) "The truth is that our finest moments are most likely to occur when we are feeling deeply uncomfortable, unhappy, or unfulfilled. For it is only in such moments, propelled by our discomfort, that we are likely to step out of our ruts and start searching for different ways or truer answers." (M. Scott Peck)

08-27-2006, 10:14 PM	#53 (permalink)
Confederate Death Leprechaun Location: College Station, TX	right now, I am 6 feet tall and 180 pounds. according to some lists I am considered fat. I have a 33 inch waist, I can run over 5 kilometers and I move furniture as a job right now. I consider myself average to "in shape." I may have love handles and what-not. I think it is all subjective. Granted anyone can consider a 300 pound man with a 50 inch waist fat, but as long as you are in shape, any weight can be considered in shape, average, or fat.