gdr2004

So I'm off to college and life is great- but since my university offers wireless networking, I've decided, to get a laptop. I want to spend about 2000-2500 for it, but I'm confused as to which direction I should be headed in as far as RAM requirements and processors.

I've done some research, so I've looked around CNet and PC World and read the reviews, but I don't understand why no laptop has a rating that's over 9. So- I've decided to come to the TF for information.

Now, I want your input, the expert computer users of TF

I'll be living in dorm and I'll mostly be using the laptop to do word processing, typing up papers, e-mail, surfing the net- etc. etc. etc.

I'll also want to play some games but I don't need a machine that will blow my mind away or one that will attract a lot of attention.

I want to be able to lug it around campus comfortably without too much trouble. So, which laptops do you recommend?

powerclown

In your price range and for what you'll be doing with it, an Apple Powerbook G4.

Your school might also have discounts on the computer; I know they will on software.

gdr2004

I was really looking to either a HP, Dell, Toshiba or IBM. I don't know, it's just that Apples just don't do it for me.

StormBerlin

IBM and Toshiba are awesome notebooks. So are Sonys if you want a sweet looking laptop. I personally would reccomend something Hyper Threaded, so you can grow into it and the technology isn't outdated in six months. Also, I think you would enjoy something with a DVD burner Where are you going to look to buy? Stores, internet?

__________________
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BigGov

IBM for sure then.

A T40, T41, or even the X series.

With that price range, you can get a real nice, solid, laptop that will last you through your entire education (most likely).

Don't get too caught up in playing games though, you won't be getting top of the line quality graphics with any portable laptop (something like Starcraft, Diablo, etc. will work just fine for most).

__________________
One day an Englishman, a Scotsman, and an Irishman walked into a pub together. They each bought a pint of Guinness. Just as they were about to enjoy their creamy beverage, three flies landed in each of their pints. The Englishman pushed his beer away in disgust. The Scotsman fished the fly out of his beer and continued drinking it, as if nothing had happened. The Irishman, too, picked the fly out of his drink but then held it out over the beer and yelled "SPIT IT OUT, SPIT IT OUT, YOU BASTARD!"

powerclown

Out of the ones you listed, I'd get a Compaq (HP) R3000 series laptop.

gdr2004

What is Hyper Threaded? As for method of purchase, I still dont' know. After I figure out which ones I want, I'll probably visit a few stores and look at them and try them out in person.

How practical would a DVD-burner be? Are they faster than regular CD-Rs? I probably won't be able to utilitize all of the capacity.

sailor

IBM. No contest. Look at the T series.

I have used IBM laptops for around seven years now, and have yet to find a more consistently better built, designed, or implemented laptop. Toshibas are OK, but they dont hold a candle to the IBMs. If you have a friend with one, try it out for an hour or so--youll see what Im talking about. They are a bit more expensive than the competition, but the competition cant hold a candle to them.

I wouldnt buy an IBM desktop, but Ill never buy anything but IBM laptops.

__________________
"Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws."
--Plato

gdr2004

As far as screen size, will the 14.1 inch screen hurt my eyes? The Sony Vaio looks REALLy nice too :-D ooh- I think I'm starting to make up my mind. Sony VAIO® TR3A Notebook
PCG-TR3A

sailor

Whatever you decide on, if possible, go play with it at a store first. Personally I didnt like the Sonys, but then, as you can probably tell, Im a bit of an IBM fanboy.

The 14" screen should be fine--thats the standard size.

__________________
"Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws."
--Plato

gdr2004

Actually, the IBM looks REALLY sweet right now. Ooooh~ I'm looking at the A G or R series. Oy, here I go again, hehe.

Slavakion

Hyper Threaded means the processor has some new technology that runs CPU intensive programs faster. Like... DVD encoding. I think it'll also boost everday things as well.

*waits to be corrected on every line* -_-

ultra_agent9

You should try the pppowerbook. I heard it's a winner

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Trisk

I wouldn't get a compaq or an hp. They're not exactly known for their quality...and I've heard about problems with the cases of compaq's breaking after a few months of normal wear.
Toshibas and dells should be okay. IBMs are on the expensive side and unless you really need a lasting computer, I'd just go with something else.
I found www.notebookforums.com to be very informative and helpful when it came to choosing a laptop.

Do you have any idea what types of games you'll be playing? Want to name a few? This could make a difference because if you're going for some new-ish games, you'll want about 512 ram (this is a pretty good amount in general) and the best graphics card for laptops right now (I believe this is still the radeon 9700 or something but I'm not sure).
If you're looking for portability, you should try to get a Pentium M processor. Make sure you don't confuse Pentium 4ms with these. They are very different. Dothans are the fastest as of now but a Banias should be just fine for your uses.

Hmm...smaller screens are probably fine but, since they're trying to fit more into less space, they might end up being more expensive.

Personally, I think this computer looks very good:CL56

Oh and you may want to check out abscomputers.com. They've got pretty good prices and I've heard lots of good things about the company.


*edit* Oh and don't get a powerbook or anything apple (with the exception of an ipod) if you ever plan on playing games, transferring documents from school/friends computers to your own computer or if you've mainly worked with windows your entire life. The transition won't be fun and when you see the selection of games available to apples, you'll want to cry
The apples *are* pretty though

gdr2004

I'm thinking about Moto GP 2-3 on max or good settings and then a multiplayer game like Counter-Strike or Halo. So, basically, racing and multi-player shooter games

Currently for desktop I have a 600mhz Pent 4 with 384MB ram and 40 GB and Voodoo 3 graphics card.

I'm happy w/ Graphics right now, but it's just that when I try to play games on high resolution, it'll crap out on me. so I have to take down the details in the graphics and it makes me sad Do I want state of the art top of the line graphics? Hell no! I just want to be able to play games with other people in the dorm w/o worrying about my computer lagging because it can't handle the workload.

Here's another question, where do I find find the balance between the processor speed and the amount of RAM i need?

The Chem-book looks good. Amost too good to be true. What are the drawbacks tot hat laptop? ANyone have nay experience with them?

gdr2004

So I really like the Chem-book but I can't get over the notion that there has to be a catch.

15" SXGA+ (1400 x 1050) Active Matrix Display This is good, right?
2.0 GHz Intel Pentium M Processor (Dothan / 2,048k L2 Cache)Is this some knock-off brand that won't give me as much processing speed as say an IMB Thinkpad T40 with a 1.7Ghz Pent M processor?
128 MB Dedicated Video Ram, Ati Radeon 9700 Pro w/ 4X AGP 3D Graphics Accelerator
60 GB Hard Drive (7200 RPM)
1024 MB DDR333 (PC2700) SDRAM (512 MB x 2)
8X DVD / 24 x 10 x 24 CD-RW Combo Drive w/ Softwares
Internal 56k Modem
Internal 10/100 Ethernet LAN
Internal IntelPRO Wireless Ethernet/Lan (802.11 b+g)
Smart Lithium Ion Battery (4.0+ hours battery life)
S-Video, VGA, 1 IEEE Firewire Port, 3 USB 2.0 Ports
Panasonic Secure Digital (SD) Memory Slot
AC Adapter w/ power cord
Free Deluxe Carry Case
FREE BONUS! Notebook Essentials Software (19 Titles)
MS Windows XP-Home Installed, CD Included (Free Warranty Upgrade!)
2 yr ChemUSA warranty w/ lifetime tech support (free upgrade with OS purchase)

sailor

Specs are specs. It isnt going to be any less powerful. What you are paying for is quality. How well is it built? What is the keyboard layout like (one of the most important questions when buying a laptop--I have seen some crappy keyboards that ruined an otherwise good laptop--think Toshiba).

Dells are OK. I dont know how long they will last as I dont personally have one. They dont feel as solid as an IBM does, but then, not much does.

Get 512MB of RAM. Make sure it is in one stick (not 2x256) so you can upgrade it later if need be. As for processor, go with the Pentium M/Centrino (not Pentium 4 M). The gains in battery life are well worth it.

__________________
"Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws."
--Plato

gdr2004

Ok, so I'm pretty much stuck on the Chem-book, pending further research. How fast should the proessor be to play the games that I want to play? Will Pentium M 1.5 be enough to play a visually intensive game without experiencing lag? WIll I be able to play games at full setting?

nanofever

Tom's hardware did a review of Acer's Ferrari 3200 and it looks like a REALLY nice machine.

http://www6.tomshardware.com/mobile/20040708/index.html






Basically, it is better than the chem book in every techically way, is prettier and has a MUCH, MUCH nicer keyboard.

Spec's for those so who want the nitty-gritty:
Models

Ferrari 3200
SKU# LX.FR206.001
Operating System Microsoft® Windows® XP Professional
Processor Low-power mobile AMD Athlon™ 64 processor 2800+
Memory 512MB (256/256)
Storage 80GB1
Super Multi Write Plus (DVD -RW, +RW, -RAM) drive
4-in-1 card reader
TFT Display 15.0" SXGA+ (1400 x 1050)
Graphics ATI® MOBILITY™ RADEON™ 9700, 128MB DDR
Connectivity 802.11b/g WLAN, Bluetooth™, Gigabit LAN, V.92 modem


Specifications

Installed Operating System
Microsoft® Windows® XP Professional

Processor
Low-power mobile AMD Athlon™ 64 processor 2800+, 1MB L2 cache

Chipset
VIA ProSavage™ K8T800

Memory
512MB DDR 333 SDRAM (256MB installed in each of two memory slots)

User upgradeable up to 1GB (one 512MB memory card in each slot)2 or 2GB (one 1GB memory card in each slot)2 subject to availability of 1GB cards

Storage
80GB1 ATA/100 hard disk drive with Disk Anti-Shock Protection (DASP), 4200 RPM

# Internal variable speed Super Multi Write Plus drive (supports DVD -RW, +RW, -RAM):Read: -4X DVD-R, 4X DVD-RW, 4X DVD+R, 4X DVD+RW, 8X DVD-ROM, 24X CD-ROM, 2X DVD-RAM
# Write: -2.4X DVD+R, 2.4X DVD+RW, 4X DVD-R, 2X DVD-RW, 16X CD-R, 8X CD-RW, 2X DVD-RAM

4-in-1 card reader for optional MultiMediaCard™ (MMC), Secure Digital (SD) card, SmartMedia™ card or Memory Stick®

Video
15.0" SXGA+ (1400 x 1050) TFT LCD, up to 16.7 million colors

ATI® MOBILITY™ RADEON™ 9700 graphics, 128MB video memory, support for AGP8X

VGA, S-video TV out ports

Support for simultaneous display on notebook LCD and external monitor

Audio
Integrated stereo speakers and microphone, microphone/line-in and stereo headphone/ speaker/line-out ports, Microsoft® DirectSound® compatibility

Interface Ports
Four USB 2.0, parallel, DC in, RJ-11 modem, RJ-45 LAN, VGA, S-video TV out, microphone/ line-in, stereo headphone/speaker/line-out, FireWire® (IEEE 1394), FIR (fast infrared)

Card Slots
Type II PC Card slot, 32-bit PC CardBus architecture, Zoomed Video support

4-in-1 card reader for optional MultiMediaCard™ (MMC), Secure Digital (SD) card, SmartMedia™ card or Memory Stick®

Connectivity
V.92 56Kbps3 data/fax modem, PTT (postal, telegraph, telephone) certified in select countries; Acer InviLink wireless LAN network connection 802.11b/g; 10/100 LAN; Bluetooth™ wireless PAN

Included Software
Installed: Acer Launch Manager, Adobe® Acrobat® Reader, CyberLink® PowerDVD,4 Norton AntiVirus®,4 NTI CD-Maker™,4

On CD shipped with the system: Acer System Recovery

User Interface
Acer FineTouch 84-key keyboard with five-degree curve, inverted T cursor layout, embedded numeric keypad, minimum 2.5mm key travel, 18mm spacing

Web browser, e-mail with LED, two user-programmable launch keys

Wireless and Bluetooth™ on/off buttons with LEDs

Touchpad with four-way scroll button

Ferrari USB mouse

Average Dimensions and Weights
13.0" (330.0mm) W x 10.7" (272.0mm) D x 1.2" (31.0mm) H / 6.6 lb. (3.0kg)

Size and weight may vary depending on configuration

Power
90-watt AC adapter

Eight-cell lithium ion battery: up to 3.0 hours life depending on configuration and usage, 4.5 hours recharge time with power on

Security Features
User and administrator BIOS passwords

Limited Warranty5
One-year parts and labor limited warranty5 with concurrent International Traveler's Coverage6
View optional extended service plans

http://www.acer.com/APP/AKC/INTERNET...7?OpenDocument


Price: 2000 USD

__________________
I'm leaving for the University of California: Santa Barbara in 5 hours, give me your best college advice - things I need, good ideas, bad ideas, nooky, ect.

Originally Posted by Norseman on another forum:
"Yeah, the problem with the world is the stupid people are all cocksure of themselves and the intellectuals are full of doubt."

gdr2004

How does the AMD processor compare to Pentium M?

Processor Low-power mobile AMD Athlon™ 64 processor 2800+ or Pentium M 2.0Ghz as would be the case with the Chembook?

Also, the harddrive seems like it would be slow. WOuld it have to be upgraded?

Trisk

I wouldn't get the Acer Ferrari because of the slow harddrive, although I believe it can be easily replaced. The good thing about Acer, though, is that their computers come with a no dead pixel policy. So if there are ANY dead pixels, you can send the computer back.

I've heard that the Pentium M and the AMD 64-bits perform about the same in laptops (although I think I may have heard something about the 64-bits running a bit hot and the battery power might be a bit less).

So I guess it comes down to personal preference.
The paintjob on the Ferrari is nice...but then again, the CL56 can be bought at other resellers painted just the same, if you're into that.

Here is a review for the Acer Ferarri

Review of the CL56

maleficent

Speaking from personal experience -- and how much wear and tear your laptop gets...

Sony Vaio's are sweeeet machines, the display quality is best I 've seen anywhere, the keyboard has a nice touch to it, and it's a lightweight machine.
It's not exactly sturdy - travelling every week, forces me to take my laptop out of it's protective case to go thru airline security, they aren't exactly gentle -- the sony didn't last 5 months.

Compaq - decent machine the keyboard is nice, the display is OK, the wear and tear are a little better than the sony's. But their cusomer service and support are the worst I've ever had, and I've been working in and around tech support for more than 10 years -- compaq service I have nothing positive to say about.

that and the display unit would come lose regularly.

Dell - -customer support is improved, though can be a little frustrating, when my power supply died they thought it was the motherboard, until the tech came on site to replace it then finally agreed with me that it was the power supply.
I love the keyboard, and I love the touch pad mouse, I'm just so used to it. the laptop I have now I've had more than 2 years, it goes thru security every week -- twice a week, has been dropped by security more times than I can count - and it's still going.

For sturdiness I'd go with Dell.

IBMs -- I've only use the laptops with the butterfly keyboards and hated them. They just never felt solid to me.

__________________

VeXteR

Dell Inspiron XPS Notebook

Awesome notebook. Will play DOOM3!!!

http://hardocp.com/article.html?art=NjMx

__________________
If its not broke I'm prolly not done yet.

Stompy

Do NOT get a Compaq!

I'm not just saying that because I'm an irate customer of theirs, but I'm saying that simply because their products are utter shit.

Everyone I know with a Compaq (with the exception of a machine or two) has had it shit out in some manner or another.

Mark my words, if you get a Compaq, you will have problems whether it's within a month when the thing's still under warranty, or a year or two down the road after it's up.

Those machines are cheaper for a reason, and you get what you pay for

__________________
I love lamp.

Key

here's a reply i made to another thread on laptops

with a $2k budget i would definitely shoot for an ibm, you won't be able to be a maxed out one but maybe one with less features.

pretty much anything you're getting in this price range will work fine with the games you mentioned and more, mine plays games better than most desktops (X1000) and owns at LANs. i consider it the IDEAL college computer, but i also spent $500 or so less than you're going to.

if you play counterstrike, it's one of the new ones that support wide-screen. WS counterstrike=totally awesome.

don't forget to keep an eye on your budget for a quality bag. the two i reccommend most are the URL=http://www.booqbags.com/]Booq Bags[/URL] or Waterfield Designs. Waterfield makes custom bags for specific laptops, ensuring a perfect fit.

At this point I believe there is an emergence of 64 bit processors in the mobile market, however I feel strongly that the Pentium M processor is what would be best to go with at the current moment.

Key

i hate it when people confuse opinion with fact. "their products are utter shit" is an opinion, not a fact.

Quote:

Everyone I know with a Compaq (with the exception of a machine or two) has had it shit out in some manner or another. Mark my words, if you get a Compaq, you will have problems whether it's within a month when the thing's still under warranty, or a year or two down the road after it's up. Those machines are cheaper for a reason, and you get what you pay for

i've used compaqs for the last 4 years through heavy use at college, and couldn't be happier with my experience. if you want to base it off testimonials, there are entire forums with countless testimonials.

i highly agree that compaq's customer service is incredibly weak, probably the biggest flaw in their business model. however, they do make up for it in certain ways.

if there's a problem within 1 month there's no risk, FedEx comes by and picks up your laptop. You don't pay shipping fees, restocking, etc. Find a dead pixel? Not happy with it? Send it back.

If you're still under warranty they're quite accomodating. When my HDD started to make buzzing noises, I called in and they FedEx'ed me a new hard drive next-day mail with no questions asked. I haven't experienced non-warranty support, but I expect it to be quite a painful process (as with any vendor where you don't have a warranty in place).

nanofever

Actually, he was right. Compaq's are utter shit because they use a bios which is amazingly limited, use bottom dollar components, have propeitary motherboards and generally lack a quality build.

__________________
I'm leaving for the University of California: Santa Barbara in 5 hours, give me your best college advice - things I need, good ideas, bad ideas, nooky, ect.

Originally Posted by Norseman on another forum:
"Yeah, the problem with the world is the stupid people are all cocksure of themselves and the intellectuals are full of doubt."

Stompy

Hm, when did I say it was a fact? I think it's quite obvious that it was an opinion

It's also the majority opinion. Just because a compaq machine works here and there doesn't mean they're any good.

Like nano said above me, the ARE utter shit. Want more detail? BIOS, cheap hardware, and flimsy design. By all means, if you wanna drop $1400 on a laptop and have it crap out in 2 years, be my guest. Don't say I didn't warn ya Generally when I spend that much on something not easily upgradable (like a laptop), I kinda expect it to still be working after 4 years.

Also, desktop vs laptop systems are different. Their desktop systems are crap too, but at least you can upgrade those and replace parts yourself.

[edit]
And you are right, if there's a problem after one month, there's no risk, but it's only a taste of the future problems you'll experience Sure, Sony and IBM probably have their share of problems too, but in every single compaq laptop I've ever come across (or HP for that matter), there's ALWAYS been a problem.

A friend of mine bought an HP and had the power connector bust on him the first time he plugged it in. It actually wasn't covered under warranty (read the agreement) He exchanged it at the store, but the one after that.. he had something else crap out that he sent it in for.

Therefore, it's in my opinion, and pretty much the opinion of reputable people that Compaq is poop!

__________________
I love lamp.

Key

ah, now these are much more facts than opinions.

how is the bios compared to other notebooks? i ask because the only other bios i've played with was a dell from a while ago (not indicative of the recent lines) and i believe a sager, which is considerably more enthusiast based than mainstream.

as for the components, when i was looking it up i found most if not all the components seemed to come from the same source as other vendors. for example, the lcd display on the X1000 series come from the same manufacturer as the Dell displays (can't recall the name, based somewhere in China).

as for the motherboards, i always did hate the lack of portabillity with propeitary components now that you mention it.

Key

blleeehhh, i'd stay away from the desktop machines like the plague. two of my roomates had one, and in all the troubleshooting i've done hps are by far the worst. most of the ones i've seen AREN'T upgradable short of a hard drive or memory. i haven't played with any recent compaqs though (anyone buying a new system now is generally going to go for a dell), but their propriertory components make them hell to upgrade.

Stompy

I really wish laptops would conform to a standard so people could build their own... it's beyond me how and why that hasn't happened yet.

__________________
I love lamp.

Key

i've always thought the same thing. i always figured it's purposely done- they make a crapload more money selling a fully functioning system than allowing a consumer to buy parts.

on top of that its the only way i suppose to cram all the pieces in smaller and smaller. a build-your-own-laptop configuration would be nice but you wouldn't get a nice 1" height 5lb laptop from it.

sailor

Exactly. Sure, they could do that, but then everyone would be complaining about the huge laptops they had to build. When you are trying to minimize size and put as much power as possible into the smallest space possible, there is no way there is going to be a standard--especially given that size and portability are a selling point, leading to competition to make the best, smallest design.

__________________
"Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws."
--Plato

Stompy

Why would it have to be bulky and heavy? Someone else mentioned this to me when I said something about making laptops standard. I must be missing something.

Why not just make standard hardware thin so it'd be slim? All ya gotta do is specify "mobos will be this dimension, cases will be .5" tall. HDs will fit in the back, yadda yadda".

The result is whatever you make the standard to be. If they can make mini (or was it micro?) atx cases for the PVR PCs and have them fit into slim cases while maintaining full functionality as a PC, then there's no reason to make it shorter and wider for a laptop.

__________________
I love lamp.

sailor

Because it then locks manufacturers into a certain size. If a manufacturer finds a way of making a mobo smaller, they can then no longer do it--they have to produce it at the same size anyways to fit the standard.

The PVR cases fit to an existing standard, micro ATX. Even though it is small, it is still nothing compared to the sizes and tolerances needed for laptops.

__________________
"Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws."
--Plato

zero2

Get the Dell XPS.

Things to look for when getting a laptop:

hdd size: between 40-80gb.

Ram: 512MB - 2 GB

OS: Windows 2000 Pro/Windows XP Pro/Linux

VideoCard: Radeon 128MB or more/Comparable Nvidia Card

Screen size: 15"

Processor: Avoid Celeron. Also look into some benchmark tests instead of deciding between AMD and Intel or 2.0Ghz or 3.0Ghz.

Tech Support & Warranty: make sure to get this, things can always go wrong, make sure that your investment is protected.

Opt for a OS cd, instead of recovery disk
.
Finally make sure the manufacture your buying from has a good reputation.

nanofever

The Compaq bios I had on my 1998 desktop (starter computer) was basically limited to changing the IRQ's and boot order. This means no overclocking, no tweaking, no setting shut off temp, no ect...

__________________
I'm leaving for the University of California: Santa Barbara in 5 hours, give me your best college advice - things I need, good ideas, bad ideas, nooky, ect.

Originally Posted by Norseman on another forum:
"Yeah, the problem with the world is the stupid people are all cocksure of themselves and the intellectuals are full of doubt."

sailor

Ive never seen a laptop with a bios that would let you OC it.

The rest of the stuff is good to have though

__________________
"Good people do not need laws to tell them to act responsibly, while bad people will find a way around the laws."
--Plato

Puttz2004

I would have to go for a Dell 8100, or are they up to 8200 now, anyway there are the BEST as far as support goes which is really a good thing to have when your off at college. Belive me last year, freshman year for me, i droped my 8100 down 2 flights of cement stairs which left with little more than a crumpled ball of placstic. I swept it into a box told the dell folks that it use to be a 8100 and low an behold less than a week later i had another brand new one and only for the price of shiping the broken one back. Sweet right?


As for Hyper Threading, don't bother, so few apps handle it well or even utillies it at all your just throwing money away. don't get me wrong it certainly woun't slow down your machine it just you aren't gonna notice any diffrence. the technology is a great idea but more hype than anything. Ive worked with several servers running dual 3.06 ghz chips with HT and there was no real proformace gain unless you were running one of two programs designed for it and those are both Oracle server side apps so i don't know what these folks are running that utillies it so well but please fill me in.


One last bit of advice and that would be, make sure you get a good video card on your laptop NOT one with shared memory b/c that will bring that 512 of ram you payed for down to 384 or less in a hurry.


oh ya and don't get an AMD unless you like scorching your peepee through your pants!

__________________
~Friends will help you move mountains, best friends...bodies

~I have my good days when i feel truly happy....and then there are the days I wear pants.

gdr2004

Guys, thank you so much for the information! :-D now with a solid background, I will begin the process of visiting stores and checking out the goods. :-D Expect more questions to be heading your way ;-)