Jephree

I'm thinking of upgrading my surround setup and would like some help from my fellow TFP'ers. I just upgraded to an HDTV and will soon be subscribing to DishNetwork's HD service. Therefore, it might be time to upgrade everything at once. What advice to you guys/gals have for the following components:

1.) Receiver
2.) Subwoofer (2 of them, unless there is 1 kick ass sub)
3.) Center Channel
4.) Front Satellites/Bookshelf
5.) Rears
6.) Other?

Any info would be appreciated. THX TFP'ers.

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brandon11983

First off, there's a lot of good info here. Secondly, glad to hear you went with Dish's HD package!!

Now.. down to the fun stuff.

1. Receiver: get something good. Don't even piss around with the Sony's, JVC's, Pioneers, and the like. Head straight for the Yamaha, Denon, Integra, or Marantz. These receivers give true power ratings from 20-20k. Crappy receivers rate their power at 1k with only 1 channel driven. This is not "real world" power. Well, unless you listen to 1k sine waves from only one speaker all day.... Put in some dynamic material and try to drive all 5 speakers in a home theater setup, and the power out of crappy receivers is usually cut in half.

2. Subwoofer: First, address whether you want it loud as fuck or sonically accurate. Most of the time people just want it loud as fuck. Sometimes both can be had, but it is usually expensive to do so. A few good examples of subs that can do both would be the Klipsch RSW-15 (this thing is a fuckin beast), Definitive SuperCube, or Paradigm Servo 15. These are all extremely accurate subs, and have the capability to be quite loud if asked to do so.

3. Center channel: This is where you should go a bit overboard. It handles about 70% of the total soundtrack. I have found that the first 2 things a person wants to upgrade in his home theater is a better center channel and a bigger sub. Look for something with a solid cabinet, a knock on it should give a "dead" sound. Definitive makes a series of powered center channels that are fucking amazing.

4. Front satellites/bookshelf: This could depend on the music duties that the system will also perform. If you are going to be doing a lot of music listening on your system, then go for a nice set of floorstanders. If you will be doing mostly home theater, your sub will be bringing up the low end, therefore you can get by with a set of satellites or bookshelves here. I am an aspiring audio purist, so I don't like the idea of relying on a sub to bring up my low end, so I have a very nice set of floorstanders with transmission line enclosures (hell yeah, baby!).

5. Rears: this is where you can skimp a bit, if you feel the need or desire to. These will be handling mostly ambient effects, bullets flying by, rainwater, and such.

6. Other: you could add another set of rear speakers and use them as surround back in a 7.1 setup


AND STAY THE FUCK AWAY FROM ANYTHING BOSE!!!

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sailor

All good points. Dont think I could have said it much better...

In regard to the subwoofer, like he said--very loud, sonically accurate, reasonable priced. Pick two.

If you dont plan to listen to a lot of music on the system, loud is probably more important that accurate. That "kick" you want to feel from a movie soundtrack is from the subwoofer. It makes all the difference. If however, you listen to a lot of music, accuracy is very important. You dont want a boomy, nasty sounding sub for that. Think of all those kids with huge subs in their cars that sound so bad--dont be like them. Trust me, my brother is one of them--it sounds like shit.

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Jephree

What's up Stereophonic, nice to see you again. Man, you've been kickin' some real knowledge; on a COUPLE occasions. Anyhow, good shit. In both replies so far, I've collected some useful info. I'm gonna do some research on that Klipsh RSW-15 you mentioned B, but I do have one more question (for anyone). What brand would you(s) get for the satellites/bookshelf/rears?

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sailor

Go and listen to some. What we may love, you may hate. Speakers are a completely personal preference. For example, I dont generally like the Klipsch sound--I dont like the way horn driven speakers sound. Others love it (like Brandon). That isnt to say that either one of us is right, its just a personal preference.

At home, I have some KEF front speakers and Boston rears.

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brandon11983

Stop calling me Stereophonic!! lol

Try to get an earful of an RSW-15... it'll knock you on your ass. The RSW series are the first subs from Klipsch that actually sound good. As for bookshelves or rears, I love Definitive. Check out their C/L/R series, the largest models in the series have built in powered 10's with 150 watt amps!! I'm looking to get one of these babies as my center channel. The benefits of FULL RANGE speakers is awesome, it gives a fuller, more robust overall sound.

whoa, Whoa, WHOA CAMEL!!!! Let's not jump to conclusions here!! I never said anything about liking Klipsch mains. They are much too bright for my tastes. I currently have Definitive BP-10 mains. They are much more balanced, with a very solid (not boomy or overpowering) low end. And they can acutally do strings (unlike Klipsch) Klipsch are awesome for home theater use, because they are an extremely effiecient speaker. I do like their RSW series subs very much. They put out a very clean and controlled note, and can get rip your face off loud if you so desire....

And KEF are fucking boss speakers.. which model do you have?

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Cycler

<p>I concur on the Definite Technolgy speakers. I have a pair of BP-8s with the matching c/l/r 2002 center and really like them. Had them for awhile and they sound good. My rears are some Mirage 6.5 ported with Titanium Tweeters they do they job. I'll put in a vote for Onkyo receivers as well I really like mine. I wish I could switch mine fronts for some of the new Definitive Techs with integrated subs. Good luck and have fun. Let us know how you like the HD satellite.

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powerclown

What's the budget?

(Every level has good/bad)

sailor

I honestly dont know. My dad bought them about 20 years ago. Granted that he payed upwards of $2000 for them then, Id hate to think what theyd cost now They sound *awesome* though, which is why, after 20 years, we still have the same speakers--no need to upgrade.

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Jephree

Being a reasonable spender, I prefer to not to crush my account in the process of this upgrade. If I set out a $3000 budget, could I set up a *high-end system?

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brandon11983

Hell yeah. Pick up a Yamaha RX-V1400 (110w x7 ch, 20-20k, all channels driven) for $799, Klipsch RF-25 mains for $799, Klipsch RC-25 center for $279, Klipsch RS-25 surrounds for $399, and a RSW-10 for $999. A little over your budget, but you could probably get the dealer to cut you a package discount. That would make for a very pleasing home theater system that will be quite enjoyable for music listening too.

[sick excess]
But why just cap it off at $3000 when you could go with a set of RF-7's up front, an RC-7 center, RS-7 surrounds, and dual RSW-15 subs?? [/sick excess]

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jujueye

The best way to achieve that seamless feel with home theater is to use the same brand all around. Every speaker manufacturere has a "house sound" and will design all of their models to sound that way, and will often use the same driver (speaker) in different models to achieve it. So brandon's idea of getting all those Klipsch units together has a mad scheme to it. I have heard systems with unmatched speakers sound OK, but there were "holes" in the transition between speakers. It bothered me and pointed it out to my ears.

As for receivers, I have nothing to add to brandon.

Remember that systems will sound one way in a showroom, and another way in your home. Make sure you keep your room dimensions in mind. If you demo systems in a room smaller than your own, you just might find you don't have enough power to make it sound as crazy as it did at the store.

Finally, I'm all for sick excess. But the best way to achieve it is to continually look for ways to upgrade. If you start at the middle of a speaker line, look for the road upwards in quality in their lines.

Jephree

To be honest with you, EVERY home theatre system I've heard at friends/family has been a mismatched set (except for the *home theater in-a-box systems). And out of those mismatched setups, alot of them sounded really good. I do understand the logic and reasoning behind your advice juju, but don't some companies specialize in certain products. Klipsch, for example. I've heard a lot more about their speakers than their receivers.

??

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jujueye

I should have been more clear. I meant to refer to speaker products. Matching speaker products will help achieve the seamless surround we all so crave. Of course, when I said same brand all around, I really meant just speakers. But hey, glad you picked up on it. I think I can chalk up my lack of clarity to a long day at work.

(otherwise, file this under "oops")

miko

I agree. Best to match speakers. Except the sub...that tends not to matter as much. Just try to match the frequency response so the sub is not reproducing frequencies that the satellites are already producing.

Cycler

I wold like to go seemless with all Definitive Tech. stuff but so far not to be. I have been pleased with my set up as I said before my rears are Mirage 6.5 ported with Ti tweeters. I think if you go quality all around will compensate for the mismatched aspects, my opinion. <p>In the same vein I woul like to see what some Def. Tech. di-polar rears woud sound like.

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brandon11983

Good point jujueye, it's called timbre matching. Each speaker in the series will have the same basic sound.


This is because Klipsch does not make receivers.

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Jephree

that's a valid reason

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Jephree

On the topic of Klipsch, but off the topic of *home theatre: I ordered a set of the Klipsch ProMedia 4.1 PC speakers.

Just wondering if anyone has a set of these? Satisfied?

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yodapaul

If you want an a "High end" system than why not let a custom design/installation firm handle the details. Besides, Most custom firms have access to products that Best Buy doesn't carry, Like the Sony ES series recievers. These recievers are very good and are much better than that crap that you can pick up at Best Buy. Just an idea.

ps. I use Best Buy only as an example of a type of electronics store.

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WarWagon

I'm definitely biased towards Denon for the receiver, as well as Marantz. I won't waste my time with anything else any more.

If you're willing to do some minor assembly as far as subs go, take a look at the Titanic sub kit from Dayton, available at www.partsexpress.com I put one together for a friend, and it was amazingly tight and deep, rivaling subs in a much higher price range.

For satellites/bookshelfs, don't count out Mirage. I use Mirage speakers (floorstanders) all the way around, but I suggested the Denon/Mirage package to my sister, and it sounded pretty impressive for such a small package.

In any case, don't forget not to skimp on the cables and interconnects. Nothing can kill sound quality like a junk set of RCA cables.

Cycler

<p>Good to see someone else has had good luck with Mirage speakers I really like mine.

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shakran

That's not even close to sick excess. Sick excess would be my local stereo shop that just set up a bass furnace for a client. $30,000 for the subwoofer essentially.

brandon11983

Ok. I see how you want to play.

[sick excess]
How bout starting out at $250,000 for full acoustical room treatment?
[/sick excess]


Sony ES = expensive shit.

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yodapaul

Sony ES = Quality shit

I like mine.

Well I didn't say it would be cheap, but if your looking for a quality system than why not spend that extra cash? (if you have it that is)

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brandon11983

Whatever blows your hair back, I suppose.

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jujueye

ES line = Elevated Standard.

Not necessarily expensive shit! The DVP-S9000ES SACD player was, and still is, a good player. It was only $1500 new (cheaper online), contained most of the parts in the upscale versions, and is highly modifiable. It will beat the crap out of many multi-format pieces in its range, and has great video to boot. If you're in to SACD, it does that, too.

Of course, this is only one example of their line, and, of course, there's no guarantee for the rest. Sony obviously recognized the need to create pieces for high-end audio buyers.

Mate one of these with a tube preamplifier, and its magical.