So is it HPV Roulette? - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

darkallaround · 03-09-2004, 07:50 PM

Alright, so I just met this chick and chemically we're explosive. we're going to be meeting for a fuck-fest if you will (different cities) in a month or so, and she's been honest with me and let me know that due to a cheating ex boyfriend, she has HPV, which is trying to give her cervical cancer. Now, I'm a smart cookie, so I went to the great knowledge of the internet to find out exactly what this means to me, and this is what I've found so far:
HPV infection can happen, even with condom use.
as long as there are no visible warts, chance of infection is almost nil.
if there are visible warts, its like 60%, even with condoms.

now, she said that when she found out what she had, they treated her and she hasnt had wart symptomology at all, its just mainly wreaking havoc on her internals.

so...my question is, with no symptoms, what are my chances, and do condoms help in the slightest? also, is the chance for oral transmission the same as transmission from penetration?

i really would hate to say 'no sorry all we can do is look at eachother accross the room and masterbate,' but i'm not getting a disease just to have sex...no matter how good it might be.

Holo · 03-09-2004, 08:21 PM

You both have to be very vigilant to keep you safe from it. She should examine herself daily for any signs of outbreak and perhaps you should talk about checking for her in case she may miss something. You have to trust her to tell you and you have to be willing take a small risk in the latent periods. No matter what your decision be as cool about it as possible...remember she has to live with this so if you can't hang then be as nice about it as you can.

darkallaround · 03-09-2004, 08:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Holo
You both have to be very vigilant to keep you safe from it. She should examine herself daily for any signs of outbreak and perhaps you should talk about checking for her in case she may miss something. You have to trust her to tell you and you have to be willing take a small risk in the latent periods. No matter what your decision be as cool about it as possible...remember she has to live with this so if you can't hang then be as nice about it as you can.

Yeah, that's my intention completely, as far as the respect goes. I'm no asshole.
Mainly I'm fishing for advice (thanks for yours), personal experience, and trying to make sure i'm on the right track.

doncalypso · 03-09-2004, 08:28 PM

I'd advise you to be extremely careful. Even though HPV doesn't have any symptoms on men it is still a very dangerous condition, and you have no idea whom you may pass it on to when you finally do settle into a relationship.

Be very careful.

jwells777 · 03-09-2004, 08:36 PM

Let's take a really rough cut at this:

World Population ~6 Billion
Female Population ~3 Billion
Number of those women you might find attractive ~10,000,000
Number of those women who might find you attractive ~100,000 (if you aren't much of a ladies man)
Number of those women who aren't likely carrying highly contagious STD's ~50,000

That is a whole lot of mind blowing sexual opportunities. My advice is that you really don't have much need to play russian roulette with those that have the STD's.

motdakasha · 03-09-2004, 09:19 PM

Woah there...

Just because you don't show signs of warts, does NOT imply "the chance of infection is almost nil" of getting HPV.
Clarification: All genital warts are caused by HPV. NOT ALL HPV are genital warts.

Genital warts are caused by several strains of HPV. Several strains of HPV are implicated as a cause or strong influence of developing cervical cancer. Several strains of HPV cause plantar warts (common skin wart). The two are not one in the same, although you can have multiple strains. HPV is transferred by skin contact, whether or not you are showing symptoms of being "infected," as there are several thousands of invisible, no-symptom strains that affect you in ways other than just warts.

Clarification: If she currently has a strain of HPV that is implicated in cervical cancer, you can catch it, end of story.
There are no visible symptoms of most cancer causing strains except under a microscope. That's why women are supposed to get annual pap smears. You may not get cancer from having this strain, but you can pass it on to other women. You become a carrier.

Also HPV is not a lifelong virus. In some cases, it just goes away on its own because of a healthy immune system and whatnot. They're still trying to figure how and why it goes away in order to create vaccines/cures. (BTW, there is a vaccine on the way for several strains of cancer-causing HPV.)

In most cases, HPV is not life-threatening. It's a lot like Herpes. Simplex Type 1 is common and considered harmless, whereas Type 2 presents a problem. Similarly, the common strains are "harmless," but there are malignant strains, though not as many as the allegedly harmless ones. Statistics have shown that almost 1 in 4 college women have a strain of HPV. There are thousands of strains out there, most of which don't seem to do anything as far as we know. Treatment is only advised when HPV is actually causing bodily harm, which is why most of the 1/4 of women don't get treatment. On top of this, children get HPV, too. The skin wart causing strains of HPV are often contracted from schools, locker rooms, pools, etc. when children walk around barefoot or chew nails, etc.
While I want to say chill out about HPV, it is contagious, so proper prevention needs to occur. But you don't have to think of those of have it like they're diseased filth. They're people, too.

If she's fully treated, it's possible that she will no longer have the strain, but you would be taking that risk. In the event that you did contract the strain, the next time you have sex won't guarantee you'll infect your partner. If you want to pursue her, I'd recommend a female condom as it protects skin regions that a male condom won't. It's the skin cells that are "contagious."
To answer your question, yes, it is roulette in a sense. For you, the guesswork has been eliminated. A strain like hers is only going to be "infectious" in the genital region through skin contact only if it's also to a region of yours that would be affected by her strain. (The same can't be said for general strains like the ones that cause skin warts. In which case, any infected skin cell can "infect" you anywhere.) Oral to oral transmission is highly unlikely since that's not the area it affects. Oral-genital contact will also be unlikely to transmit anything. Also, sex toys (preferably with a condom on them) to her genital region are okay as long as you make sure to wash your hands afterwards. A gloved hand to her genital region, that is washed afterward would also be safe. It's the genital-genital contact you need to watch out for.

*Nikki* · 03-10-2004, 05:09 AM

Motdakasha is 100% right.

I have never heard of HPV having any visible symptoms. And a ton of people do have it. It is not the same as other STDs as it can have no external symptoms. Only those found under a microscope. A doctor can remove the section of the uterus that is infected and sometimes the women is cured. Sometimes it comes back.

SabrinaFair · 03-10-2004, 05:57 AM

I'm going to go Jack Sparrow on your ass and quote some Pirates:"The only rules that really matter are these: what a man can do and what a man can't do. "

Can you, or can't you?

I thought I had herpes for a few months. (Simplex 2, that is. Almost everyone has Simplex 1, it's what causes cold sores) I had this horrible fear that because of one sexual mistake (who I loved, by the way) I was never going to find someone who would be willing to take a chance on me. In fact, when I did find out that I didn't have it, I felt like I was returning from the dead or waking up from hibernation. It's a strange thing, having or thinking you have an incurable but non-life threatening STD. Anyways, sorry to ramble. But anyways. If this is a purely sexual encounter, then maybe you'd be wise to protect yourself, and even bow out, although I can't say what I'd do in a similar situation. If you love her, however, and can't get past this, then that really sucks because HPV or not, she's still a person, and presumably a very nice one at that if you're considering a physical relationship with her. Assess the risks, but ask yourself how you would feel if the situation were reverse.

sigma1042 · 03-10-2004, 06:46 AM

put a bunch of saranwrap btw you
maybe that'll keep her warty parts away

agball · 03-10-2004, 08:01 AM

You would be suprised at how may people have HPV, if you are very sexually active, you have probably have had intercourse with someone who has it & didnt know it. Many people who have it dont know it, because they are not symptomatic yet

nanofever · 03-10-2004, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by motdakasha
Woah there...

Just because you don't show signs of warts, does NOT imply "the chance of infection is almost nil" of getting HPV.
Clarification: All genital warts are caused by HPV. NOT ALL HPV are genital warts.

Genital warts are caused by several strains of HPV. Several strains of HPV are implicated as a cause or strong influence of developing cervical cancer. Several strains of HPV cause plantar warts (common skin wart). The two are not one in the same, although you can have multiple strains. HPV is transferred by skin contact, whether or not you are showing symptoms of being "infected," as there are several thousands of invisible, no-symptom strains that affect you in ways other than just warts.

Clarification: If she currently has a strain of HPV that is implicated in cervical cancer, you can catch it, end of story.
There are no visible symptoms of most cancer causing strains except under a microscope. That's why women are supposed to get annual pap smears. You may not get cancer from having this strain, but you can pass it on to other women. You become a carrier.

Also HPV is not a lifelong virus. In some cases, it just goes away on its own because of a healthy immune system and whatnot. They're still trying to figure how and why it goes away in order to create vaccines/cures. (BTW, there is a vaccine on the way for several strains of cancer-causing HPV.)

In most cases, HPV is not life-threatening. It's a lot like Herpes. Simplex Type 1 is common and considered harmless, whereas Type 2 presents a problem. Similarly, the common strains are "harmless," but there are malignant strains, though not as many as the allegedly harmless ones. Statistics have shown that almost 1 in 4 college women have a strain of HPV. There are thousands of strains out there, most of which don't seem to do anything as far as we know. Treatment is only advised when HPV is actually causing bodily harm, which is why most of the 1/4 of women don't get treatment. On top of this, children get HPV, too. The skin wart causing strains of HPV are often contracted from schools, locker rooms, pools, etc. when children walk around barefoot or chew nails, etc.
While I want to say chill out about HPV, it is contagious, so proper prevention needs to occur. But you don't have to think of those of have it like they're diseased filth. They're people, too.

If she's fully treated, it's possible that she will no longer have the strain, but you would be taking that risk. In the event that you did contract the strain, the next time you have sex won't guarantee you'll infect your partner. If you want to pursue her, I'd recommend a female condom as it protects skin regions that a male condom won't. It's the skin cells that are "contagious."
To answer your question, yes, it is roulette in a sense. For you, the guesswork has been eliminated. A strain like hers is only going to be "infectious" in the genital region through skin contact only if it's also to a region of yours that would be affected by her strain. (The same can't be said for general strains like the ones that cause skin warts. In which case, any infected skin cell can "infect" you anywhere.) Oral to oral transmission is highly unlikely since that's not the area it affects. Oral-genital contact will also be unlikely to transmit anything. Also, sex toys (preferably with a condom on them) to her genital region are okay as long as you make sure to wash your hands afterwards. A gloved hand to her genital region, that is washed afterward would also be safe. It's the genital-genital contact you need to watch out for.

I have been wondering this for a while: have you been to some kind of wonderous sexual meccha where you know each and every area of sexuality ? I'm starting to wonder if you majored in something akin to Human Sexuality.

Excellent post !

toxic515 · 03-10-2004, 06:33 PM

I'm rather glad Mot has a great education in the subject. Since mine's in Art and music, she saves me a boatload of additional research! :-)

motdakasha · 03-10-2004, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by nanofever
I have been wondering this for a while: have you been to some kind of wonderous sexual meccha where you know each and every area of sexuality ? I'm starting to wonder if you majored in something akin to Human Sexuality.

Excellent post !

I'm gonna get a BA in Psychology. From there, I was thinking something along the lines of Human Sexuality, Comparative Psychology/Zoology, or Criminology. Still haven't decided.

I also did a research report on HPV for an English Writing class.

Bleed Me Dry · 03-11-2004, 12:20 PM

All I can say is that you both have to be really careful because that disease is the gift that keeps on givin'

darkallaround · 03-13-2004, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by motdakasha
Also HPV is not a lifelong virus. In some cases, it just goes away on its own because of a healthy immune system and whatnot. They're still trying to figure how and why it goes away in order to create vaccines/cures. (BTW, there is a vaccine on the way for several strains of cancer-causing HPV.)

Hi mot,
Do you have a link to some research on this, I would like to read more. Also, the HPV that she has is the cervical-cancer kind...and while I know it will not affect me if i catch it (yes we are going to be as careful as possible), if i do catch it, would it be one of the strains that might go away after a few months/a year?
Thank you for the wealth of information you've already provided

motdakasha · 03-13-2004, 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by darkallaround
Hi mot,
Do you have a link to some research on this, I would like to read more. Also, the HPV that she has is the cervical-cancer kind...and while I know it will not affect me if i catch it (yes we are going to be as careful as possible), if i do catch it, would it be one of the strains that might go away after a few months/a year?
Thank you for the wealth of information you've already provided

My hard drive has experienced several unexpected formats, so I've lost any links I may have bookmarked. However, a copy of my English paper can be found here: http://www.everything2.com/index.pl?...node_id=476247 It's the last write-up on the page. The list of works cited might be useful as a starting point.

As for strains that go away, they don't know which ones do or why, so I really don't think you're going to find an answer to that question. At least not yet.

Wax_off · 03-17-2004, 12:53 AM

To weigh in a little late to this, the last time I went to get checked for STDs the doc told me that the research was pointing more and more towards HPV being a consequence of having sex. In his words "If you have sex then you probably have some strain of HPV, whether you use condoms or not." According to him there's almost no way to prevent transmission short of not having sex at all. The infected skin cells are easily passed around. Think about the number of times you've stripped a condom off your dick and then went to the bathroom to pee. Cells could easily be transfered from your hand (which touched the outside of the condom) to your dick. And that's just one way that cells could be transfered.

Not to say you should stop trying, but be aware.

03-09-2004, 07:50 PM	#1 (permalink)
darkallaround Tilted	So is it HPV Roulette? Alright, so I just met this chick and chemically we're explosive. we're going to be meeting for a fuck-fest if you will (different cities) in a month or so, and she's been honest with me and let me know that due to a cheating ex boyfriend, she has HPV, which is trying to give her cervical cancer. Now, I'm a smart cookie, so I went to the great knowledge of the internet to find out exactly what this means to me, and this is what I've found so far: HPV infection can happen, even with condom use. as long as there are no visible warts, chance of infection is almost nil. if there are visible warts, its like 60%, even with condoms. now, she said that when she found out what she had, they treated her and she hasnt had wart symptomology at all, its just mainly wreaking havoc on her internals. so...my question is, with no symptoms, what are my chances, and do condoms help in the slightest? also, is the chance for oral transmission the same as transmission from penetration? i really would hate to say 'no sorry all we can do is look at eachother accross the room and masterbate,' but i'm not getting a disease just to have sex...no matter how good it might be. __________________ the darkness it surrounds me, consumes my very soul. within this worthless existence i shall never be made whole.

03-09-2004, 08:21 PM	#2 (permalink)
Holo A Real American	You both have to be very vigilant to keep you safe from it. She should examine herself daily for any signs of outbreak and perhaps you should talk about checking for her in case she may miss something. You have to trust her to tell you and you have to be willing take a small risk in the latent periods. No matter what your decision be as cool about it as possible...remember she has to live with this so if you can't hang then be as nice about it as you can. __________________ I happen to like the words "fuck", "cock", "pussy", "tits", "cunt", "twat", "shit" and even "bitch". As long as I am not using them to describe you, don't go telling me whether or not I can/should use them...that is, if you want me to continue refraining from using them to describe you. ~Prince

03-09-2004, 08:28 PM	#4 (permalink)
doncalypso TFP Mad Scientist Location: Philadelphia, PA	I'd advise you to be extremely careful. Even though HPV doesn't have any symptoms on men it is still a very dangerous condition, and you have no idea whom you may pass it on to when you finally do settle into a relationship. Be very careful. __________________ Doncalypso... the one and only Haitian Sensation

03-09-2004, 09:19 PM	#6 (permalink)
motdakasha Hiya Puddin'! Miss me? Location: Silicon Valley, CA	Woah there... Just because you don't show signs of warts, does NOT imply "the chance of infection is almost nil" of getting HPV. Clarification: All genital warts are caused by HPV. NOT ALL HPV are genital warts. Genital warts are caused by several strains of HPV. Several strains of HPV are implicated as a cause or strong influence of developing cervical cancer. Several strains of HPV cause plantar warts (common skin wart). The two are not one in the same, although you can have multiple strains. HPV is transferred by skin contact, whether or not you are showing symptoms of being "infected," as there are several thousands of invisible, no-symptom strains that affect you in ways other than just warts. Clarification: If she currently has a strain of HPV that is implicated in cervical cancer, you can catch it, end of story. There are no visible symptoms of most cancer causing strains except under a microscope. That's why women are supposed to get annual pap smears. You may not get cancer from having this strain, but you can pass it on to other women. You become a carrier. Also HPV is not a lifelong virus. In some cases, it just goes away on its own because of a healthy immune system and whatnot. They're still trying to figure how and why it goes away in order to create vaccines/cures. (BTW, there is a vaccine on the way for several strains of cancer-causing HPV.) In most cases, HPV is not life-threatening. It's a lot like Herpes. Simplex Type 1 is common and considered harmless, whereas Type 2 presents a problem. Similarly, the common strains are "harmless," but there are malignant strains, though not as many as the allegedly harmless ones. Statistics have shown that almost 1 in 4 college women have a strain of HPV. There are thousands of strains out there, most of which don't seem to do anything as far as we know. Treatment is only advised when HPV is actually causing bodily harm, which is why most of the 1/4 of women don't get treatment. On top of this, children get HPV, too. The skin wart causing strains of HPV are often contracted from schools, locker rooms, pools, etc. when children walk around barefoot or chew nails, etc. While I want to say chill out about HPV, it is contagious, so proper prevention needs to occur. But you don't have to think of those of have it like they're diseased filth. They're people, too. If she's fully treated, it's possible that she will no longer have the strain, but you would be taking that risk. In the event that you did contract the strain, the next time you have sex won't guarantee you'll infect your partner. If you want to pursue her, I'd recommend a female condom as it protects skin regions that a male condom won't. It's the skin cells that are "contagious." To answer your question, yes, it is roulette in a sense. For you, the guesswork has been eliminated. A strain like hers is only going to be "infectious" in the genital region through skin contact only if it's also to a region of yours that would be affected by her strain. (The same can't be said for general strains like the ones that cause skin warts. In which case, any infected skin cell can "infect" you anywhere.) Oral to oral transmission is highly unlikely since that's not the area it affects. Oral-genital contact will also be unlikely to transmit anything. Also, sex toys (preferably with a condom on them) to her genital region are okay as long as you make sure to wash your hands afterwards. A gloved hand to her genital region, that is washed afterward would also be safe. It's the genital-genital contact you need to watch out for. __________________ =^-^= motdakasha =^-^= Just Google It. BA Psychology & Photography (I'm not going psychoanalyze you nor will I let you cry on my shoulder. Have a nice day.) Last edited by motdakasha; 03-09-2004 at 10:17 PM..

03-10-2004, 05:57 AM	#8 (permalink)
SabrinaFair Junkie Location: Louisville, KY	I'm going to go Jack Sparrow on your ass and quote some Pirates:"The only rules that really matter are these: what a man can do and what a man can't do. " Can you, or can't you? I thought I had herpes for a few months. (Simplex 2, that is. Almost everyone has Simplex 1, it's what causes cold sores) I had this horrible fear that because of one sexual mistake (who I loved, by the way) I was never going to find someone who would be willing to take a chance on me. In fact, when I did find out that I didn't have it, I felt like I was returning from the dead or waking up from hibernation. It's a strange thing, having or thinking you have an incurable but non-life threatening STD. Anyways, sorry to ramble. But anyways. If this is a purely sexual encounter, then maybe you'd be wise to protect yourself, and even bow out, although I can't say what I'd do in a similar situation. If you love her, however, and can't get past this, then that really sucks because HPV or not, she's still a person, and presumably a very nice one at that if you're considering a physical relationship with her. Assess the risks, but ask yourself how you would feel if the situation were reverse. __________________ "With all its sham, drudgery, and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world. Be cheerful. Strive to be happy." -Desiderata

03-09-2004, 08:36 PM	#5 (permalink)
jwells777 Tilted	Let's take a really rough cut at this: World Population ~6 Billion Female Population ~3 Billion Number of those women you might find attractive ~10,000,000 Number of those women who might find you attractive ~100,000 (if you aren't much of a ladies man) Number of those women who aren't likely carrying highly contagious STD's ~50,000 That is a whole lot of mind blowing sexual opportunities. My advice is that you really don't have much need to play russian roulette with those that have the STD's.

03-10-2004, 05:09 AM	#7 (permalink)
Nikki ~~~~~~~ Location: Charleston, SC	Motdakasha is 100% right. I have never heard of HPV having any visible symptoms. And a ton of people do have it. It is not the same as other STDs as it can have no external symptoms. Only those found under a microscope. A doctor can remove the section of the uterus that is infected and sometimes the women is cured. Sometimes it comes back.

03-10-2004, 06:46 AM	#9 (permalink)
sigma1042 Crazy	put a bunch of saranwrap btw you maybe that'll keep her warty parts away __________________ [Arthur] HA HA HA HA, It's a little joke![/Arthur]

03-10-2004, 08:01 AM	#10 (permalink)
agball Insane Location: Long Island	HPV You would be suprised at how may people have HPV, if you are very sexually active, you have probably have had intercourse with someone who has it & didnt know it. Many people who have it dont know it, because they are not symptomatic yet

03-10-2004, 06:33 PM	#12 (permalink)
toxic515 Addict Location: Texas	I'm rather glad Mot has a great education in the subject. Since mine's in Art and music, she saves me a boatload of additional research! :-) __________________ Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana.

03-11-2004, 12:20 PM	#14 (permalink)
Bleed Me Dry Insane Location: Hell	All I can say is that you both have to be really careful because that disease is the gift that keeps on givin' __________________ Bite Me... But Only If Invited

03-17-2004, 12:53 AM	#17 (permalink)
Wax_off No Avatar, No Sig.	To weigh in a little late to this, the last time I went to get checked for STDs the doc told me that the research was pointing more and more towards HPV being a consequence of having sex. In his words "If you have sex then you probably have some strain of HPV, whether you use condoms or not." According to him there's almost no way to prevent transmission short of not having sex at all. The infected skin cells are easily passed around. Think about the number of times you've stripped a condom off your dick and then went to the bathroom to pee. Cells could easily be transfered from your hand (which touched the outside of the condom) to your dick. And that's just one way that cells could be transfered. Not to say you should stop trying, but be aware.