queedo

Michael Moore is a lop of shit as far as I am concerned.

Here is the proof

http://slate.msn.com/id/2102723/

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matteo101

I guess than don't go watch????lol..thanks for stiring shit up, I think im gonna go catch the movie to see what the big deal is about...

queedo

You do that and be sure to heckel our troops as well.

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Halx

I won't go see the movie.
Moore IS a big gross pile of crap.
I can hate Bush enough on my own without putting money in his pockets.

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dragon2fire

since when is being anti war the same as being anti troops

pan6467

Since Neo-Cons have decided to try to bully and call people names if they don't agree with The Fuhrer...I mean Bush.

I agree with Hal, I hate Bush enough, don't need Good Ol' Mikey Moore telling me why as I line his pockets so he can tell me how bad off we are. If the man truly cared and believed in what he said he'd offer up his movies and books at cost. He wouldn't be about the money.

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Seaver

FYI, I havent seen the movie but I've seen the men in uniform and read their descriptions of being anti-war.... but they can expect reprisals for their actions.

Being in uniform they *officially* hold the opinion of their superior commander.. the Commander in Chief. Under the UCMJ you are allowed to state publicly any opinion about anything you want... outside of uniform. But while in uniform, or publicly stating you are a member of the services, you are only allowed to state the official opinion of the Navy.

Court Marshalled? no. Passed up for promotion? most likely.

queedo

Very mature, you must be a Kerry supporter

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queedo

I didnt say he was anti troops, he just seemed like the type that would do that, so does Moore.

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queedo

I respect your opinion, I don't hate Bush but at least you are smart enought to make up your own mind.

Michael Moore thinks he should make up every bodies minds for them, and he will lie, cheat, and steal to make sure of it.

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Zeld2.0

I'd be careful with your attitude or this won't be going far.

matteo101

Who said anything about "our troops"..They are your troops, I live in a country with a government smart enough not to invade somone elses country for reasons that god only knows..

And if I did meet any of your troops, I would not heckle them, I would salute them, they are risking (and GIVING) their lives for George Dub and his administrations lies...

BigGov

Can we just get a close please? This can only lead to a good ol' bon fire.

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oktjabr

To be honest, it's usually pretty lame to make analogues with your political opponents and nazis. Unless, they of course are in a fact national socialists.

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apeman

yes, der Führer had a moustache

no, i agree with you there, jus' kiddin

i agree with Halx and pan who said the Moore is a bit of a tosspot, and it's not difficult to find your own reasons to disagree with Bush. Moore pisses me off for some reason, maybe it's because he's so self-righteous...

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ARTelevision

Impugning the maturity of a member in the course of argumentation is not a way to proceed here.

The thread will continue as a single error isn't it's full measure.

Raise the level of your dialog.

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tecoyah

Reading this thread has given a rare opportunity to show how flamebait works.

Queedo, please refrain from the one liners, and attempts at trolling. Fortunately the replys have kept this thread from degrading too far, but if you continue it is likely to be shut down.
The only result of such blatant negative statements is thread failure, and a loss of respect on your part.
Everyone has opinions, we can respect them all without attacking the individual.

Now: the thread topic.

Much of the Movie is "Hollywood Truth", in that Moore embelishes the facts to get an emotional reaction. To call them lies would be, in my opinion, incorrect. To call this a documentary of truth would be equally incorrect. It was quite entertaining, and enlightening though.

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Bookman

True...yet I believe it HAD to be in this cinematic format because Americans in GENERAL don't get to the independent sources for information. If not a movie it would have had to be a HIP HOP video or something, the mass of Americans are too brainwashed and this is the medium (cinema) they (we, embarrassed) flock to.
Funny, look how quiet this weekend was about the movie in the press....

iamtheone

I went and seen this movie this weekend. I really enjoyed it. I can't honestly say I am big into politics but I don't like how Bush does things and presents himself in such a way that he appears to be a freakin idiot. The movie is an eye opener that is for sure. Bad tatics? Not sure, maybe just one side of the story. We all know the government controls what we hear/see. Even if ONE thing from that movie is true then people need to stand up and question just what the hell he is trying to acomplish.

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Bill O'Rights

Well...Art is being a little more benevolent than I would've been. I'd have locked this troll fest as unredeemable. However...I do see that the topic is beginning to go back on course. Let's keep the discourse civil, and the conversation fresh. Okay?

As far as Michael Moore goes...I have no use for him, or his ilk. In my opinion, he gives Liberalism as bad a name as Ashcroft to Conservatism. Either side can be carried too far. That said, I probably will go see it. Only because you almost have to, in order to hold any sort of intelligent dialouge about it.

Bookman, I hope to hell that you are wrong. I fear, however..., that you are not. So sad for us.

And another thing. Yes. You absolutely can be anti-Bush, and even anti-war, and still support the troops. They are not intrinsically connected.

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silent_jay

Why is it that people who go and see the movie haven't made up their own minds? I'm not the biggest fan of Dubya but I still intend to see the movie. How can you say everything he says is lies without actually seeing the movie?

Thank god for that, the smartest thing our government did, and yes all the soldiers coalition, Iraqi, anybody fighting in this unjust war deserve a debt of gratitude.

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assilem

IMHO.

Most everyone on this thread either did not read the article posted or is blatantly ignoring it. The man writing this story is no conservative and is not beholden to the right. He is simply stating facts. Facts that so many liberals typically choose to ignore. I cannot say that I love George Bush. I voted for him and regret my choice sometimes on a few levels (Stem cell research, This FCC nonsense). But at least he chooses not to ignore the facts and makes unpopular decisions based upon them. As unpopular as they may be he at least has taken some action to protect us. I do not know if Gore or Kerry would make such choices. They seem to be indebted to popular opinion and in times like this it takes a braver man to be seen as unpopular for the sake of the people’s safety.

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Kadath

Why not see the movie, form your opinions, THEN read the thoughts of others? I try to avoid reading reviews of a movie before seeing it because I find myself conditioned to look for the things the reviewer did. This is true for movies as unimportant as Harry Potter -- I intend to stick with it for a film that's actually about real life, in whatever degree.

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Bookman

Respect, but how can you really state that he is protecting us, even now when all that is under scrutiny? We have yet to see the 'WHY' he is making the moves he has.

Lebell

I'm with BOR and I would have locked this sucker after I read the third nasty comment.

But if you guys can redeem this thread, go ahead.

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DelayedReaction

See? Even in the pits of the darkest trollfest, redemption can be found.

I haven't seen F9/11, and I'm not sure I want to. If the remainder of the movie is anything like the trailers, I expect to see a lot of well-cut edits that overemphasize relatively minor points. For example, the whole "now watch this drive" clip. You ask the President a question while he's golfing, and you get mad when he continues what he's doing?

I had similar problem with Columbine; Moore seems to emphasize a lot of individually minor events or points to bring about a major opinion.

Then again, maybe those are the exact reasons why I should see it.

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Locobot

It doesn't anger me that he's golfing, as lame as I personally think that sport is. It angers me that the nation was facing a crisis, Bush was telling us that we were in a crisis, yet he was still out golfing. BTW the press doesn't get to follow the President on to a golf course unless the President wants them there.

Personally I can't wait to see this movie. It's opening here on Friday. I'm sure I'll have to pre-buy tickets. The chain theaters here passed on the movie but there's a city-owned theater that will benefit from their mistake. They'll probably make their year's budget on this one film.

kutulu

The conservative response to this film has been truly sick and disgusting. For some reason it's fine for them to sit back and make attacks at Clinton, devote book after book to bashing Liberals, and sit on talk radio show after talk radio show bashing liberals but when someone has a different opinion they do everyhing they can to stop it.

First Disney doesn't want to distribute it, then the cons try to bully theaters away from showing it, then there's con groups trying to say it violates election law (it never once mentions any candidate running against him), and then there's all these articles that try to bring Moore down.

The conservative response to this movie has been immature and un-American.

wonderwench

You are neglecting to note the difference. The criticisms about Clinton are true. Moore is fabrication lies.

queedo

I agree this movie is more Hollywood than fact.

And yes I agree we all are entitled to our oppions as long as they are factual I have no problem with them. So lets try to keep them that way guys, and you too Moore!

Sorry if I was trolling a bit.

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kutulu

Moore had extensive fact checking done on the movie. The article at the top doesn't show any "lies" made by Moore.

What he says is true. It's completly his view of the truth, but he does not lie in the movie. Read the rebuttal piece shown earlier in the thread.

queedo

Can you imagin the stress of being the President of the U.S.?

Even Clinton messed around during crisis, he just did it with interns.

But seriously, I can't think of a job that needs to have stress relief more than the President of the U.S. or any other country. Let me ask you this did his golfing change the situation in any way shape or form? No it didn't!

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queedo

I went to see a movie last night (no not that one ) and they had to have police there because the people who saw this film were getting into fights right after it at alarming rates. This kind of film tears at the very fabric of the U.S. If you don't like the President fine, then don't vote for him, but don't go out and make movies that exagerate Bush's true stances on things so you can influence people to your side. Why does't Mooore Rrun against him this year? For all of Moore's talk about how others should do it, he would be a terrible president based on the facts to date.

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queedo

You got it my man!

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onetime2

Hee hee, gotta love these Moore love/hate fests. Truly an entertaining thread. Thanks.

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queedo

He is even more fun to hate than Clinton in my opinion

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kutulu

Stress relief is one thing. Becoming a virtual telecommuter is another thing.

from the rebuttal piece:
As far as this "Hollywood Truth" stuff is concerned, name a talk show host that doesn't try to distort the issue to show his arguement. Maybe the Right is just pissed because someone is finally beating them at their own games.

kutulu

Some rebuttals to acusations made against the movie from the michael moore website:
http://www.michaelmoore.com/words/latestnews/f911facts/

Charlatan

Asking questions like Moore does... is it any surprise that many want to see him drink hemlock?

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