Ashcroft "I don't want to hear about it, anymore". - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

tecoyah · 04-13-2004, 12:43 PM

During the 9/11 hearings today, I actually heard the director of the F.B.I. say that he told Mr. Ashcroft "The C.I.A. is very concerned about a major terrorist attack within the United States", in at least two different meetings. He stopped telling him about it after Ashcroft told him he didn't want to hear it anymore.Ashcroft actually ignored the information.

I really hope I was hearing things and someone will correct me, this cannot be what I heard.

Can it?

Superbelt · 04-13-2004, 01:04 PM

We found their upcoming sacrificial lamb.

Seaver · 04-13-2004, 03:58 PM

I dont like Ashcroft... he's the main guy who's been on my shitlist in the Bush administration.

But..

Hindsight is 20/20. And lets face it being election year they dont want to find out how to prevent further attacks but a scapegoat so either the dems or reps can throw mud blaming the other party. There's a reason this waited until 04 when the attacked happened in 01.

To both republicans and democrats, read up on Adm. Kimmel... burned at the stake after Pearl... later accepted that even with all the information given he wasnt at fault for the attack.

seretogis · 04-13-2004, 04:07 PM

I wouldn't mind Ashcroft being a scapegoat, as long as he isn't replaced with someone even more crazy.. like Reno.

Paradise Lost · 04-13-2004, 04:18 PM

People have hated Ashcroft for years, why didn't we go after
him full force before!

guthmund · 04-13-2004, 04:41 PM

If your talking about former Director Pickard's statement your ears have no problems

You can find an entire transcript at the Washington Post, but here's the relevant text.

Quote:

BEN-VENISTE: You had some seven or eight meetings with the attorney general?

PICKARD: Somewhere in that number. I have the exact number, but I don't know the total.

BEN-VENISTE: And according to the statement that our staff took from you, you said that you would start each meeting discussing either counterterrorism or counterintelligence. At the same time the threat level was going up and was very high. Mr. Watson had come to you and said that the CIA was very concerned that there would be an attack. You said that you told the attorney general this fact repeatedly in these meetings. Is that correct?

PICKARD: I told him at least on two occasions.

BEN-VENISTE: And you told the staff according to this statement that Mr. Ashcroft told you that he did not want to hear about this anymore. Is that correct?

PICKARD: That is correct.

There's also a Justice Dept. document that cites reducing gun violence and combating drug trafficking as their top priorities. Pickard says earlier that his request for additional counter-terrorism funds was denied, appealed and denied again by Ashcroft.

I think you guys are absolutely right that someone is going to have to be sacrificed. However, why Ashcroft? Why not Ms. Rice?

I would think it would be toss-up between the two.

dimbulb · 04-13-2004, 05:09 PM

interesting thought about scapegoats....

Isn't it true that a ship's captain is responsible for whatever happens on the ship? even if he's sleeping in his cabin when it hits the iceberg.......

too bad that doesn't happen in politics.....

Superbelt · 04-13-2004, 05:35 PM

Ashcroft instead of Rice for several reasons.
Ashcroft is a lightning rod. And the only people who will be upset that his is gone are the way, way far right loonies.

Lose Rice and you lose half the administrations diversity. Reaction to her testimony can be seen as divided.
Finally, there isn't a papertrail behind her quite like there is behind Asscroft. She can weasely around her record, he can't. He has plenty of documentation of not just ignoring terrorism by drastically slashing the budgets for it up to even the week of 9/11. There is nothing in the world that can save him from that record.

Like dimbulb said, and like McCain said earlier today:
Something about a navy boat that ran aground while the captain was asleep. it wasn't the Captains fault but he was the first one tossed off when the axe came down.
Funny how McCain keeps making these statements, it's almost like he not-so-secretly wants to see Bush tossed out on his ear.

nanofever · 04-13-2004, 05:54 PM

On one hand, I despise the Bush admininstration for putting Ashcroft into a position of power. On the other hand, I like the thought that the Bush administration might destroy Ashcroft's present and future political career.

I'm going to label this one a draw for Bush.

fuzyfuzer · 04-13-2004, 06:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Seaver

To both republicans and democrats, read up on Adm. Kimmel... burned at the stake after Pearl... later accepted that even with all the information given he wasnt at fault for the attack.

funny thing is i just did a big essay o him in class today

another thing like this was the sinking of the USS indiana (indianapolis not sure which) which was carying the atomic bombs their mission was a secrit so they were not allowed to contact anyone on the radio and they were sunk in shark waters and slowly eaten and at the push of the families that lost sons they charged him with not contacting the navy and sending out an SOS,

he eventually commited suicide because of the way he was blamed

just goes to show you skapegoats are very unfortunae individuals even if they do deserve it

galadrium · 04-13-2004, 06:07 PM

I don't see how Ashcroft can ever live down the fact that he lost an election in 2000 to a guy who was not even alive. How is that for a vote of confidence.

Superbelt · 04-13-2004, 06:09 PM

Well, he sort of fits in with someone who couldn't win the popular vote

OFKU0 · 04-13-2004, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Superbelt
Ashcroft instead of Rice for several reasons.

Lose Rice and you lose half the administrations diversity. Reaction to her testimony can be seen as divided.

I'm not an American but I will tell you one thing. If the 9/11 attacks occured in Canada and if Rice (again if she was Canadian) was called to an enquiry to answer for the governments actions, or misactions, I wouldn't be the only one pissed off at her pompous, arrogant attitude.

With all her smirking and smiling it seemed like she was at a bridal shower, not at a hearing as to why thousands of innocent people were killed. I'm a Canadian and my blood was ready to boil just watching her.

In the news here, Ashcroft is blaming Clinton. Clinton I feel could have done more but really, at least Clinton was diplomatic in his resolve. I was glad to see Bush rather than Gore but Bush is starting to worry the hell out of me with his red neck 'my way or the highway' attitude. I don't think the world is a better place since Bush came into office and I don't think it is getting any better.

tecoyah · 04-13-2004, 07:14 PM

After watching him speak tonight, I gotta say.......the statement made early in 2002 by a Canadian diplomat( who was summarily disciplined) was extremely accurate. Mr Bush is a Moron, and I can actually say that without exagerating.

seretogis · 04-13-2004, 08:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Superbelt
Funny how McCain keeps making these statements, it's almost like he not-so-secretly wants to see Bush tossed out on his ear.

McCain is as left as you can get while calling yourself a Republican. Not that there is much difference between the two parties anymore.

Superbelt · 04-13-2004, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by seretogis
McCain is as left as you can get while calling yourself a Republican. Not that there is much difference between the two parties anymore.

No shit?

Hmm.
McCain's 2002 voting ratings, Kerry's is in ( ) for comparison.

Americans for Democratic Action (liberal): 20 (85)
ACLU: 0 (60)
AFSCME (labor): 29 (88)
LCV (environmental): 41 (94)
Concord (pro-balanced budget): 95 (65)
National Taxpayer's Union (anti-tax): 75 (18)
Chamber of Commerce: 79 (55)
Christian Coalition: 79 (55)

McCain is a principled conservative. His kind is going out, he's along the same mold as Dick Armey and Bush1. "Conservative" leaders today are a hell of a lot different from what they were eight years ago.
I may not agree with most of what either of these men, or the others who used to serve in the legislature with McCain, but I can respect them. I can do that because I know they will always do what they believe is in the best interest of this country. I can get myself behind men like that despite our differences.
I can't say the same for the DeLay's and Bush2, and Santorum's.

Where do you get off saying McCain left? The guy is moderate-conservative. We need more Republicans like him. If there were, I wouldn't have felt the need to register democrat and to work so hard this election cycle to try and put balance back in the legislature.

Mojo_PeiPei · 04-13-2004, 09:18 PM

Ok Superbelt fair enough, but what about the Feinsteins and Daschle's??? If anyting they are just as divisive and bi-partisan as the Delay's and Santorum (who despite being ultra-con in some eyes, is a decent man).

Zeld2.0 · 04-13-2004, 10:03 PM

There ya go with others being decent men... others can as well.

As for scapegoats - yes its unfortunate many get blamed unfairly but in other cases we need that accountability.

Though we learn from mistakes and hindsight is 20/20, those in charge shouldn't get a free pass and should be questioned in the very least to see "what the fuck went wrong.'

guthmund · 04-13-2004, 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Superbelt
Ashcroft instead of Rice for several reasons.
Ashcroft is a lightning rod. And the only people who will be upset that his is gone are the way, way far right loonies.

Lose Rice and you lose half the administrations diversity....

Funny how McCain keeps making these statements, it's almost like he not-so-secretly wants to see Bush tossed out on his ear.

I would have thought Ms. Rice would be prime for the block as she doesn't quite fit in, eh? I mean, Ashcroft comes from the same sort as the rest of the administration. Former governor, former member of Congress, very conservative, long history in government so on and so forth. I would have thought that Ms. Rice would be the better choice to cull from the herd so to speak, even if it meant losing diversity.

As for paper trail, well, that doesn't seem to bother most folks as long as a good spin is put on it. One of the big justifications for us not knowing what the hell was going on is the big miscommunication factor between the FBI and the CIA. I would imagine that's a pretty big part of Ms. Rice's job. I certainly could see the administration throwing Ms. Rice to the wolves over that.

Maybe I'm reading the whole thing wrong....

As for McCain, I think a lot of folks would cross the party line to vote for him. I know I would.

nanofever · 04-14-2004, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mojo_PeiPei
Ok Superbelt fair enough, but what about the Feinsteins and Daschle's??? If anyting they are just as divisive and bi-partisan as the Delay's and Santorum (who despite being ultra-con in some eyes, is a decent man).

On the issue of Santorum, I guess we have very different views of what makes a person a "descent man". I think the reason I don't care for him is the thing where he can't keep his damn nose out of OTHER consenting adults' bedrooms.

Reminds me of that Ashcroft guy...

/tying an off-topic rant back into the topic with no one the wiser

pan6467 · 04-14-2004, 03:32 AM

Ashcroft is the sitting duck. It gives Ridge more power and gets rid of a public liability for the party. They'll dump all they can on him and he'll resign. Ridge will gain more power.

As for Rice, Bush needs her diversity to keep the voters. And she put on a good loyal show.

Unfortunately for those over at Bushrice04.org it won't happen ever.

Bill O'Rights · 04-14-2004, 04:49 AM

Well done gentlemen. I've gotta say that was one of the best political threads that I've read in a long time. It stayed on topic, no flaming and facts were presented along with the rhetoric. Congratulations, you guys really can have a civil discussion in politics.

My $.02 is not really required here, as you guys have pretty much covered it, but here it is anyway. Ashcroft is toast. No two ways about it. He was a political liability, for the Bush Administration, since day one. Even conservatives fear him, and that will hamper Bush's re-election possibilities. Rice, on the other hand, is likable. She is benign, and to lose her...well, Teresa Kerry might as well start picking out the new White House drapes.

Someone's head is going to be served up when all of this is said and done. To offer up Ashcroft just kills two birds with one stone. Oh yeah...he's political toast now.

Superbelt · 04-14-2004, 05:35 AM

I am no fan of Daschle. He uses his position as a political crutch. Without his leadership position he would lose his senate seat. He makes decisions and votes according to what protects his seat, not the nation.
My favorite democrat is Nancy Pelosi

I am fine with Feinstein, though I don't always agree with all her positions, especially gun control. I think Feinstein genuinely is concerned with america's welfare. Feinstein doesn't deserve to be lumped in with DeLay. Daschle does though. DeLay is a power hungry ego-maniac. It is one thing to push party loyalty, but DeLay uses tactics and disciplinary measures that have him goose-stepping over anyone who doesn't tow the party line. that's wrong. DeLay is under investigation right now over misappropriation of political donations. So the jury is literally still out on him being a decent man.

Ashcroft can try to spin this record, but the media will flay him alive with all of this.
Among many other things:

-Countering Terrorism dropped from priority #1 effective per Attorney General Reno memo in 1998 to a priority not even in the top 12 per AG Ashcroft memo to budget heads. This is post 9/11 even
-AG Ashcroft rejected FBI request for $57.8 million for more counter-terrorism agents, intelligence researchers and language translators.
-AG Ashcroft in a letter to Budget Chief Daniels on Sept. 10, 2001, outlined AG requests for more funds. Not a single request for add-ons for counter-terrorism, but with a request for a reduction in grants to state and local governments for anti-terrorism.

Mojo_PeiPei · 04-14-2004, 08:10 AM

Is it true that AShcroft tried to get Lady Justice to wear a bra?

Superbelt · 04-14-2004, 08:20 AM

It's more of a Burkah.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/1788845.stm
And they cost $8,650

Superbelt · 04-14-2004, 08:22 AM

JohnnyRock · 04-14-2004, 09:55 AM

Why does Ashcroft need to be a scapegoat. Everything that haas happened the last 3+ years are all Clinton's fault. Just ask Bush, O'Rielly, Hannity or Rush

Sparhawk · 04-14-2004, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JohnnyRock
Why does Ashcroft need to be a scapegoat. Everything that haas happened the last 3+ years are all Clinton's fault. Just ask Bush, O'Rielly, Hannity or Rush

Okay, I think that was sarcasm...

nanofever · 04-14-2004, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JohnnyRock
Why does Ashcroft need to be a scapegoat. Everything that haas happened the last 3+ years are all Clinton's fault. Just ask Bush, O'Rielly, Hannity or Rush

Actually, Jon Steward (Daily Show) had a unique viewpoint that the problems of the current administration go back farther than Clinton. The true cause of the Bush adminstration's problems is the Millard Fillmore adminstration of 1850-1853. That damn Fillmore is the reason for all of the current administrations woes.

DAMN YOU MILLARD FILLMORE !

iccky · 04-15-2004, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Superbelt
No shit?

Hmm.
McCain's 2002 voting ratings, Kerry's is in ( ) for comparison.

Americans for Democratic Action (liberal): 20 (85)
ACLU: 0 (60)
AFSCME (labor): 29 (88)
LCV (environmental): 41 (94)
Concord (pro-balanced budget): 95 (65)
National Taxpayer's Union (anti-tax): 75 (18)
Chamber of Commerce: 79 (55)
Christian Coalition: 79 (55)

McCain is a principled conservative. His kind is going out, he's along the same mold as Dick Armey and Bush1. "Conservative" leaders today are a hell of a lot different from what they were eight years ago.
I may not agree with most of what either of these men, or the others who used to serve in the legislature with McCain, but I can respect them. I can do that because I know they will always do what they believe is in the best interest of this country. I can get myself behind men like that despite our differences.
I can't say the same for the DeLay's and Bush2, and Santorum's.

Where do you get off saying McCain left? The guy is moderate-conservative. We need more Republicans like him. If there were, I wouldn't have felt the need to register democrat and to work so hard this election cycle to try and put balance back in the legislature.

Thanks for pointing this out. This is what I always want to say when people start on the "McCain for VP" or "I'm a liberal Democrat, but I'd vote for McCain" deal. Of course, I'm too lazy to do actual research...

I really respect McCain as a war hero, as an excellent legislator, and as a funny guy (ever see him on Saturday Night Live?). I'd rather have 51 McCains in the Senate then the 51 current republicans. But I'd much rather have 100 liberal democrats .

Lebell · 04-15-2004, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by nanofever
Actually, Jon Steward (Daily Show) had a unique viewpoint that the problems of the current administration go back farther than Clinton. The true cause of the Bush adminstration's problems is the Millard Fillmore adminstration of 1850-1853. That damn Fillmore is the reason for all of the current administrations woes.

DAMN YOU MILLARD FILLMORE !

I always hated that bastard and now I know why!!

(jk!)

mml · 04-15-2004, 12:59 PM

If there is going to be a scapegoat, and I am not sure that the Administration is willing to do that, it most likely will be Ashcroft. As has been said, he is a lightning rod and his political career is over once he is done being AG. Rice has a very nice future ahead of her if she so chooses, and the RNC would like to keep it that way. Highly-intelligent, well-spoken, politically savvy, female, African-American Repbulicans aren;t exactly a dime a dozen. Religious, conservative, white, male, lawyer, Republicans in the last few years of thier political life are a dime a dozen.

However, don't rule out Mr. Tennant or Mr.Mueller as sacraficial lamb.

iccky · 04-15-2004, 05:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mml
However, don't rule out Mr. Tennant or Mr.Mueller as sacraficial lamb.

Tennant, afterall, was a Clinton appointee.

Come to think of it, how does he still have his job?

Superbelt · 04-15-2004, 07:49 PM

Tenet never was on board with Bush. I think he has something on them and they know it. I see no other reason that they would leave him in that high position, not a clinton appointee. There were probrably a hundred people Bush and Cheney would rather see there.

Hell, because Tenet wouldn't go along with the lead up to Iraq War II Cheney had to set up his own special intelligence task force in the Pentagon to collect and distribute "evidence" they used.

Tenet has military records, arrest records, some kind of pictures or financial documents relating to either Bush or Cheney.

I don't think they can slime or set up Tenet. If they do he will retaliate. The CIA director is the last person you really want to piss off. Questionable history or otherwise.

04-13-2004, 12:43 PM	#1 (permalink)
tecoyah Illusionary	Ashcroft "I don't want to hear about it, anymore". During the 9/11 hearings today, I actually heard the director of the F.B.I. say that he told Mr. Ashcroft "The C.I.A. is very concerned about a major terrorist attack within the United States", in at least two different meetings. He stopped telling him about it after Ashcroft told him he didn't want to hear it anymore.Ashcroft actually ignored the information. I really hope I was hearing things and someone will correct me, this cannot be what I heard. Can it? __________________ Holding onto anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned. - Buddha

04-13-2004, 04:07 PM	#4 (permalink)
seretogis Huggles, sir? Location: Seattle	I wouldn't mind Ashcroft being a scapegoat, as long as he isn't replaced with someone even more crazy.. like Reno. __________________ seretogis - sieg heil perfect little dream the kind that hurts the most, forgot how it feels well almost no one to blame always the same, open my eyes wake up in flames

04-13-2004, 04:18 PM	#5 (permalink)
Paradise Lost "Afternoon everybody." "NORM!" Location: Poland, Ohio // Clarion University of PA.	People have hated Ashcroft for years, why didn't we go after him full force before! __________________ "Marino could do it."

04-13-2004, 05:54 PM	#9 (permalink)
nanofever Huzzah for Welcome Week, Much beer shall I imbibe. Location: UCSB	On one hand, I despise the Bush admininstration for putting Ashcroft into a position of power. On the other hand, I like the thought that the Bush administration might destroy Ashcroft's present and future political career. I'm going to label this one a draw for Bush. __________________ I'm leaving for the University of California: Santa Barbara in 5 hours, give me your best college advice - things I need, good ideas, bad ideas, nooky, ect. Originally Posted by Norseman on another forum: "Yeah, the problem with the world is the stupid people are all cocksure of themselves and the intellectuals are full of doubt."

04-13-2004, 06:07 PM	#11 (permalink)
galadrium Upright	I don't see how Ashcroft can ever live down the fact that he lost an election in 2000 to a guy who was not even alive. How is that for a vote of confidence. __________________ Leading the Way

04-13-2004, 01:04 PM	#2 (permalink)
Superbelt This vexes me. I am terribly vexed. Location: Grantville, Pa	We found their upcoming sacrificial lamb.

04-13-2004, 03:58 PM	#3 (permalink)
Seaver Junkie Location: Fort Worth, TX	I dont like Ashcroft... he's the main guy who's been on my shitlist in the Bush administration. But.. Hindsight is 20/20. And lets face it being election year they dont want to find out how to prevent further attacks but a scapegoat so either the dems or reps can throw mud blaming the other party. There's a reason this waited until 04 when the attacked happened in 01. To both republicans and democrats, read up on Adm. Kimmel... burned at the stake after Pearl... later accepted that even with all the information given he wasnt at fault for the attack.

04-13-2004, 05:09 PM	#7 (permalink)
dimbulb Riiiiight........	interesting thought about scapegoats.... Isn't it true that a ship's captain is responsible for whatever happens on the ship? even if he's sleeping in his cabin when it hits the iceberg....... too bad that doesn't happen in politics.....

04-13-2004, 05:35 PM	#8 (permalink)
Superbelt This vexes me. I am terribly vexed. Location: Grantville, Pa	Ashcroft instead of Rice for several reasons. Ashcroft is a lightning rod. And the only people who will be upset that his is gone are the way, way far right loonies. Lose Rice and you lose half the administrations diversity. Reaction to her testimony can be seen as divided. Finally, there isn't a papertrail behind her quite like there is behind Asscroft. She can weasely around her record, he can't. He has plenty of documentation of not just ignoring terrorism by drastically slashing the budgets for it up to even the week of 9/11. There is nothing in the world that can save him from that record. Like dimbulb said, and like McCain said earlier today: Something about a navy boat that ran aground while the captain was asleep. it wasn't the Captains fault but he was the first one tossed off when the axe came down. Funny how McCain keeps making these statements, it's almost like he not-so-secretly wants to see Bush tossed out on his ear.

04-13-2004, 06:09 PM	#12 (permalink)
Superbelt This vexes me. I am terribly vexed. Location: Grantville, Pa	Well, he sort of fits in with someone who couldn't win the popular vote

04-13-2004, 07:14 PM	#14 (permalink)
tecoyah Illusionary	After watching him speak tonight, I gotta say.......the statement made early in 2002 by a Canadian diplomat( who was summarily disciplined) was extremely accurate. Mr Bush is a Moron, and I can actually say that without exagerating. __________________ Holding onto anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned. - Buddha

04-13-2004, 09:18 PM	#17 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	Ok Superbelt fair enough, but what about the Feinsteins and Daschle's??? If anyting they are just as divisive and bi-partisan as the Delay's and Santorum (who despite being ultra-con in some eyes, is a decent man). __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition. Last edited by Mojo_PeiPei; 04-13-2004 at 09:24 PM..

04-13-2004, 10:03 PM	#18 (permalink)
Zeld2.0 Cherry-pickin' devil's advocate Location: Los Angeles	There ya go with others being decent men... others can as well. As for scapegoats - yes its unfortunate many get blamed unfairly but in other cases we need that accountability. Though we learn from mistakes and hindsight is 20/20, those in charge shouldn't get a free pass and should be questioned in the very least to see "what the fuck went wrong.'

04-14-2004, 03:32 AM	#21 (permalink)
pan6467 Lennonite Priest Location: Mansfield, Ohio USA	Ashcroft is the sitting duck. It gives Ridge more power and gets rid of a public liability for the party. They'll dump all they can on him and he'll resign. Ridge will gain more power. As for Rice, Bush needs her diversity to keep the voters. And she put on a good loyal show. Unfortunately for those over at Bushrice04.org it won't happen ever. __________________ I just love people who use the excuse "I use/do this because I LOVE the feeling/joy/happiness it brings me" and expect you to be ok with that as you watch them destroy their life blindly following. My response is, "I like to put forks in an eletrical socket, just LOVE that feeling, can't ever get enough of it, so will you let me put this copper fork in that electric socket?"

04-14-2004, 04:49 AM	#22 (permalink)
Bill O'Rights will always be an Alyson Hanniganite Location: In the dust of the archives	Well done gentlemen. I've gotta say that was one of the best political threads that I've read in a long time. It stayed on topic, no flaming and facts were presented along with the rhetoric. Congratulations, you guys really can have a civil discussion in politics. My $.02 is not really required here, as you guys have pretty much covered it, but here it is anyway. Ashcroft is toast. No two ways about it. He was a political liability, for the Bush Administration, since day one. Even conservatives fear him, and that will hamper Bush's re-election possibilities. Rice, on the other hand, is likable. She is benign, and to lose her...well, Teresa Kerry might as well start picking out the new White House drapes. Someone's head is going to be served up when all of this is said and done. To offer up Ashcroft just kills two birds with one stone. Oh yeah...he's political toast now. __________________ "I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires." - Susan B. Anthony "Hedonism with rules isn't hedonism at all, it's the Republican party." - JumpinJesus It is indisputable that true beauty lies within...but a nice rack sure doesn't hurt.

04-14-2004, 05:35 AM	#23 (permalink)
Superbelt This vexes me. I am terribly vexed. Location: Grantville, Pa	I am no fan of Daschle. He uses his position as a political crutch. Without his leadership position he would lose his senate seat. He makes decisions and votes according to what protects his seat, not the nation. My favorite democrat is Nancy Pelosi I am fine with Feinstein, though I don't always agree with all her positions, especially gun control. I think Feinstein genuinely is concerned with america's welfare. Feinstein doesn't deserve to be lumped in with DeLay. Daschle does though. DeLay is a power hungry ego-maniac. It is one thing to push party loyalty, but DeLay uses tactics and disciplinary measures that have him goose-stepping over anyone who doesn't tow the party line. that's wrong. DeLay is under investigation right now over misappropriation of political donations. So the jury is literally still out on him being a decent man. Ashcroft can try to spin this record, but the media will flay him alive with all of this. Among many other things: -Countering Terrorism dropped from priority #1 effective per Attorney General Reno memo in 1998 to a priority not even in the top 12 per AG Ashcroft memo to budget heads. This is post 9/11 even -AG Ashcroft rejected FBI request for $57.8 million for more counter-terrorism agents, intelligence researchers and language translators. -AG Ashcroft in a letter to Budget Chief Daniels on Sept. 10, 2001, outlined AG requests for more funds. Not a single request for add-ons for counter-terrorism, but with a request for a reduction in grants to state and local governments for anti-terrorism. Last edited by Superbelt; 04-14-2004 at 05:37 AM..

04-14-2004, 08:10 AM	#24 (permalink)
Mojo_PeiPei Kiss of Death Location: Perpetual wind and sorrow	Is it true that AShcroft tried to get Lady Justice to wear a bra? __________________ To win a war you must serve no master but your ambition.

04-14-2004, 08:20 AM	#25 (permalink)
Superbelt This vexes me. I am terribly vexed. Location: Grantville, Pa	It's more of a Burkah. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/1788845.stm And they cost $8,650 Last edited by Superbelt; 04-14-2004 at 08:28 AM..

04-14-2004, 08:22 AM	#26 (permalink)
Superbelt This vexes me. I am terribly vexed. Location: Grantville, Pa	nm. Last edited by Superbelt; 04-14-2004 at 08:28 AM..

04-14-2004, 09:55 AM	#27 (permalink)
JohnnyRock Addict Location: Taxachussetts	Why does Ashcroft need to be a scapegoat. Everything that haas happened the last 3+ years are all Clinton's fault. Just ask Bush, O'Rielly, Hannity or Rush __________________ Not only do I not know the answer...I don't even know what the question is!!!

04-15-2004, 12:59 PM	#32 (permalink)
mml Adrift Location: Wandering in the Desert of Life	If there is going to be a scapegoat, and I am not sure that the Administration is willing to do that, it most likely will be Ashcroft. As has been said, he is a lightning rod and his political career is over once he is done being AG. Rice has a very nice future ahead of her if she so chooses, and the RNC would like to keep it that way. Highly-intelligent, well-spoken, politically savvy, female, African-American Repbulicans aren;t exactly a dime a dozen. Religious, conservative, white, male, lawyer, Republicans in the last few years of thier political life are a dime a dozen. However, don't rule out Mr. Tennant or Mr.Mueller as sacraficial lamb. __________________ Human beings, who are almost unique in having the ability to learn from the experience of others, are also remarkable for their apparent disinclination to do so." -Douglas Adams

04-15-2004, 07:49 PM	#34 (permalink)
Superbelt This vexes me. I am terribly vexed. Location: Grantville, Pa	Tenet never was on board with Bush. I think he has something on them and they know it. I see no other reason that they would leave him in that high position, not a clinton appointee. There were probrably a hundred people Bush and Cheney would rather see there. Hell, because Tenet wouldn't go along with the lead up to Iraq War II Cheney had to set up his own special intelligence task force in the Pentagon to collect and distribute "evidence" they used. Tenet has military records, arrest records, some kind of pictures or financial documents relating to either Bush or Cheney. I don't think they can slime or set up Tenet. If they do he will retaliate. The CIA director is the last person you really want to piss off. Questionable history or otherwise.