Tully Mars

Libertarians Sidle Up to Barr?

May 26, 2008 6:54 AM

After six rounds of voting, the more than 650 delegates to the Libertarian Party Convention in Denver picked former Rep. Bob Barr, R-Georgia, as their presidential nominee.

"I'm sure we will emerge here with the strongest ticket in the history of the Libertarian Party," Barr said. "I want everybody to remember that we only have 163 days to win this election. We cannot waste one single day."

Barr was controversial among Libertarians for having voted for the PATRIOT Act and the Defense of Marriage Act, but he told delegates he had changed and would kill the former and tweak the latter.

Another former Republican -- Vegas handicapper Wayne Root -- is Barr's Veep.

Given this guys voting record I'm little surprised by this choice.

Anyone else have thoughts?

Edit: Better Rat?

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ratbastid

Apparently he had a libertarian epiphany after leaving congress. I hope he's this year's Nader.

The font you quoted the story in is nearly unreadable!

seretogis

This is why I've lower-cased my "libertarian" tag.

/sigh

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smoore

His record is decidedly not the voting record of a Libertarian. Hell, I'm registered Libertarian and I can't see myself voting for him. It would take a lot of convincing to make me think he's truly changed his ways.

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Tully Mars

Seems like the party could have come up with someone more in line with the principles of Libertarianism, IMO.

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dc_dux

The Party could have nominated some unknown long-standing libertarian....who would get the typical less than one percent of the vote.

Barr is after the Ron Paul "libertarians" ....his message is Paul's message - end the illegal war in Iraq, revoke the unconstitutional Patriot Act, downsize the government (eliminate Dept of Ed, Energy, Commerce..), etc. His former Republican credentials may also help with those conservatives who just dont trust McCain.

A Rasmussen poll has Barr getting six percent of the vote; his own internal poll has it at seven percent. Anything more than 2-3 percent can swing a state.

I would love to see him in the debates...but that requires 15% in order to be invited.

What will the Paul voters do? That remains to be seen.

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loquitur

My reaction to the news that he's running for Pres as a Libertarian was that I should learn more about him. I have the luxury of living in a state where the outcome is a foregone conclusion (NY), which means my vote matters not one bit -- so i can vote for third parties with a clear conscience, knowing that I can make my statement without it actually affecting anything. That's what I did in 2000. I may do it again in 2008, rather than vote for the brain-dead left or the increasingly incompetent right.

ratbastid

Imagine if Paul dropped out of the race and endorsed Barr??

aceventura3

At one point I was a registered Libertarian. I think Barr will serve as a good option for those who don't support the use of our military to "police" the world, social liberals and fiscal conservatives, but the party will lack credibility even with Barr. The primary reason I am not a Libertarian today is because of the party's position on how our military should be used, I just don't think their position is practical.

Barr will not hurt McCain. I think those who support Barr will generally be a small percentage of well informed voters with strong views on either the war, fiscal policy, or government interference with individual freedoms. Two of those three issues involve people who have very liberal views, ranging from no military presence outside our boarders to legalization of marijuana.

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dc_dux

ace...the profile of Paul supporters (based on exit polls) do no reflect your profile of those voters...most do not have strong liberal views, particularly when it comes to social issues and the role of government.

But who knows...those mostly young, first time voting Paul supporters may decide to sit it out. They bear watching after they make their last stand as Repubs and raise hell at the Repub convention this summer.

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aceventura3

My comment were about Barr not Paul. My comments about the Libertarian Party was based on my knowledge of the party platform, personal interactions with party members - including attending a state convention, I also spent some time as a county party officer. The Libertarian Party is made up of very diverse people, and they are commonly well informed and have very strong views on their favorite issue. They are a fun crowd, but I think the diversity - in some cases quirkiness - is the reason they can not get traction on a national level.

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"Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on lunch."
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions on vegetarianism while the wolf is of a different opinion."
"If you live among wolves you have to act like one."
"A lady screams at the mouse but smiles at the wolf. A gentleman is a wolf who sends flowers."

dc_dux

ace, I understand what you are saying, but the question remains....what will the Paul voters do in November.

They represent a formidable, albeit small block (4-10%) of the voters in Republican primaries. Its hard to imagine they will vote for McCain.

The question for me is if they sit out or vote for Barr (not necessarily joining the Libertarian party)...few are likely to vote for Obama (based on exit polls of Repub primaries) and their mantra of small government (abolish IRS and numerous other agencies/regulations).

Bob Barr's message:

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aceventura3

What does Paul want his supporters to do? If his supporters are Republicans that means they are not Libertarian. If they were not involved in politics prior to supporting Paul, I think they are still finding their political identity. My guess is that Libertarians will support Barr and Paul supporters will either not vote, vote Democratic because of the war issue, or vote McCain because they may think he will be more fiscally conservative. Either way, I don't see many of them supporting Barr and becoming Libertarian if they were not already.

In the 1980 Presidential campaign, I was in college, I supported John Anderson, as did many of my friends and many young people in college. After he lost the nomination to Reagan, Anderson ran as a third party candidate. If he had not run as a third party candidate, I would not have voted. I knew Carter was bad for the country, and I thought Regan was going to be too socially conservative. I think Paul supporters will face a similar problem if Paul decides not to run as a third-party candidate. Anderson, like Paul had a special appeal to his supporters, it was an "in the moment" kind of thing. As Paul fades, so will his support.

__________________
"Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on lunch."
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions on vegetarianism while the wolf is of a different opinion."
"If you live among wolves you have to act like one."
"A lady screams at the mouse but smiles at the wolf. A gentleman is a wolf who sends flowers."

dc_dux

From everything I have read, most Paul supporters are self-identified Independents. They voted in the Republican primary because that was the only way to vote for Paul

I do find it curious that you think they will choose every alternative (not vote, vote for Obama - for his war position, despite his big government record and agenda or vote for McCain - for his fiscal conservatism(?) despite his pro-war, pro-Patriot Act hardline positions) except the one that most represents their views.....Barr's anti-war, small government.

I guess we will just have to wait and see.

I dont expect Paul to endorse Barr, but I dont expect he will encourage his supporters to vote for McCain either.

Many Republican strategist believe Barr's candidacy poses one more hurdle for McCain that they had hoped would not materialize.

The question circulating in Republican circles is....."Will Barr gore McCain"

You have to give kudos to whoever came up with that, whether you agree with it or not.

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aceventura3

I tried to relate it to my personal experience. John Anderson was a socially liberal Republican, some called him a Rockefeller Republican. He created a buzz among young voters, despite his age and look he was like a rock star on campus. His appeal went beyond politics, many supported the man, "the movement" and political positions were secondary. I see similarities with Paul. Barr is not going to generate the interest Paul has generated. Most Paul supporters will gravitate to one of the two major parties or go back to campus parties passing on the election. After Anderson lost in the general, some of us thought we could keep the "movement" alive, the passion passed quickly after the election. I don't know how old you are, but ask you mom or dad about Anderson if they were in college in 1980. We were a bunch of business school, MBA wanna be, radicals back in the day. The 60's had nothing on us.

McCain is too old, too liberal, too inconsistent, too angry, too much a "maverick", to win the general on his own merits. The only way he can win is by some major mis-steps by either Obama or Clinton. An outside chance that he could get my vote is if he chose Rice or Powell as his running mate - that won't happen. In the general, I would vote for Clinton before I would vote for McCain because Clinton is a known quantity - I know what she wants to do and she would motive Republicans to fight in Congress.

__________________
"Democracy is two wolves and a sheep voting on lunch."
"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions on vegetarianism while the wolf is of a different opinion."
"If you live among wolves you have to act like one."
"A lady screams at the mouse but smiles at the wolf. A gentleman is a wolf who sends flowers."

ASU2003

I'm not going to be voting against anybody this time, but I'm not sure who I'm voting for yet. I will have to see where Barr stands on a few issues.