:::OshnSoul:::

Let's have a light discussion on what the following saying means to you, in your thoughts and interpretation:
What you believe in becomes your Truth.

Do you think that's true?
How does it apply in life?
In your life?

moonstrucksoul

it means that I make myself unhappy, because I believe it to be so.

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Lebell

If you aren't careful, I think this is true.

The corrollary becomes that what you believe, you defend against all assaults, even the Truth.

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"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience." – C. S. Lewis

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tecoyah

Goes right to the perception is reality theory. I believe this to be true on some level, though mostly in the important aspects of life, personal spirituality and manipulation of emotion. I personally use this in my life quite often, building confidence by "knowing" just how damn good you are. Projecting the image you wish others to believe, and manipulating life and surroundings to create a desired effect.

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Holding onto anger is like grasping a hot coal with the intent of throwing it at someone else; you are the one who gets burned. - Buddha

TheKak

I agree with the statement, but...

Belief has no relevance what so ever to the actual truth. What you believe may effect your life in as much as you think it is the truth, reguardless of weither it is or not. And as Lebell already stated, people defend what they believe agaisnt all odds, including the actual truth.

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Roses are red, violets are blue, I'm a schizophrenic and so am I.

raeanna74

What you believe in becomes your truth.

I don't think this could be completely accurate. There are laws of nature that can't be changed based on whether I believe them or not. If I believe that I can fly and I jump off a building gravity is still going to have an effect on me and I'm not going to actually fly as in the way a bird flies. I WILL fall.

I think that you can control your path though to a much greater amount based on what you believe in. When you believe that you can succeed at something you will perform much better than if you doubt yourself. As a teacher, if I believe that a student can do better and I expect them to they will respond to that belief unconciously at least and reach higher than they would if I believed that they were stupid and couldn't learn.

What you believe affects everything that you do AND the results but it has it's limits.

When speaking of this in a philosophical/religious sense. Religion of any sort is based on faith, one belief. When happens in the end to us - none of us truely KNOW without a doubt. We simply have faith in the religion that makes the most sense to our limited minds. To say that what we believe becomes our truth I could never say for sure.

In relation to my own life - I will believe what serves me best. I believe there is a God and so I will act accordingly. I believe I can help my daughter grow up healthy and strong in mind and in body and I will work towards that end. I believe that I can and will keep our marriage going with my husband's help.

I know that if I believe my husband doesn't love me I will act as though he doesn't draining the love from our marriage. I have seen this. I have seen that when I believe that he does love me then I act in a different way and it cultivates the love in our marriage.

What we believe affects our truth but doesn't actually become truth in every instance.

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"Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama
My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

wilbjammin

What you believe in only becomes your Truth if you apply it universally and then don't question it. Questioning any Truth (note the Capital T) implies for that moment that the veracity of that Truth is up in the air. Additionally, a Truth is something you must declare... we can believe in many things, but to have the force of Truth it must be stated.

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Innominate.

Yakk

Insofar as it is true, it isn't yjsy interesting.

All it does is take two possibly seperate concepts, and says "they are the same".

If I believe that a gun cannot kill me, and someone shoots me, my "Truth" gets walked all over... well, maybe. =)

Now, we do act as if it where a true statement almost by definition. Personally, I attempt to factor in the possiblity that I'm wrong when I use a belief to guild my actions...

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Last edited by JHVH : 10-29-4004 BC at 09:00 PM. Reason: Time for a rest.

CSflim

You know what the best part of it is! You're never wrong! Aren't you a little genius!

Honestly: That is a very naieve philiosophy to apply to life. If I have false beliefs, they are false.

If I go and kill someone and then accidentaly knock my head and get amnesia, undoubtedly I will believe that I am innocent of murder. Doesn't change the facts.

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Rodney

"What you believe in becomes your truth?" Well, sure, _your_ truth. Your approach to life. Which is not necessarily valid for anyone else, or even yourself if you find yourself, say, in a string of divorces or business failures, or if your truth leads to a prediliction to, say, drink heavily then climb in the car and play "chicken" with schoolbuses on crowded highways.

Personal truths are very darwinian -- they evolve to meet conditions, or they die. And sometimes take you with them.

WarWagon

No, because I've had the belief where I thought something was going to happen, and it didn't.

:::OshnSoul:::

I came up with this saying yesterday as I observed a Christian couple speaking to teenagers about Jesus and getting saved. They were very passionate about it. They mentioned that what if Jesus were to come to earth tomorrow and you weren't saved/asked for forgiveness that you would be sent to hell. Now, that is not how I see it, but I have total respect for those who live passionately through their hearts.
Let me explain my saying in two ways.
1- what you tell yourself to be true, if you keep telling yourself that, it appears to be really true, as you made the choice to think that is true. (i.e. you will go to hell, you are a happy person, you are not a good singer, you will get that job, etc.) You create those thoughts, and out of those thoughts you create your reality- your Truth.
2- There is no ONE Truth, per say. Yes, there is "knowing all" and in the human perception, we don't/can't know all until we pass, unless you believe you will never know....Each individual person chooses what they believe in, thus becoming their own Truth. We walk our own paths, we have our own opinions, we make our own choices, we hav our own views. No one is exactly the same. Each person has their own Truth, not one better or more right than another.


But as you notice, the saying has given all different responses, none which are more right or better- just different. That is Your Truth.

sexymama

What you believe in becomes your Truth --

It is difficult to be light about this. In my former marriage I found that my ex and I looked at things that occurred in our lives in two completely different ways. I remembered B and he remembered A or vise versa. These memories, which were our personal truths, determined how we reacted to each other in the future and ultimately led to the end of the marriage. (Well, that and a lot more!) But, what it came down to, for me, is that his truth, although he believed it whole-heartedly, was much too "bent" for me to be able to buy into. In other words, he lied to himself so much that he began to believe it as truth.

That said, I do believe that our truth becomes our reality. I think we just have to be careful as to what that truth is and how we react to it. Personally, I think it is vital to stay open to new ideas and personal growth.

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If you can go deeply into lovemaking, the ego disappears. That is the beauty of lovemaking, that it is another source of a glimpse of god

It's not about being perfect; it's about developing some skill at managing imperfection.

archpaladin

Speaking on an individual level, I think that the statement is accurate - what you believe becomes true for you. People rationalize things to make them agree with what they believe as a person, and ultimately try to manipulate the world around them to fit their beliefs - their truths. It's when people are no longer capable of beneficially manipulating their environment that they are forced to wonder if what they believe is actually Truth, or if it was just a perception. Staying open to new ideas can help to catch false perceptions before they cause damage.

On a broader level, I agree with those others who have spoken about there being absolutes and an actual Truth regardless of one's perception. I would extend this to all areas of life - from basic observations to morality and philosophy - though I realize that not everyone shares my opinion on that. Perhaps that is just my truth - or perhaps it is actual Truth.

Case in point, I suppose.

irateplatypus

i disagree with this maxim at the most fundamental level.

truth must be external... how can you know if something is true except to measure it against something outside yourself? if all truth resides within your own mind, then it would seem that everything becomes an opinion with varying degrees of certainty.

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If you will not fight when your victory will be sure and not too costly, you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all the odds against you and only a precarious chance for survival. There may even be a worse case. You may have to fight when there is no hope of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves.

~ Winston Churchill

NoSoup

"What you believe in becomes your Truth."


To be honest, that is pretty much my personal mantra.

Certainly, there are absolutes that are unwaivering in the world, it won't effect things like gravity, ect, but socially, it is key.

Perception is by far the most amazing of human capabilities, and I wholeheartedly live by that phrase.

If you project a specific image, both to yourself and others, you will in time become that person. I personally can say that believing in "my truths" have lead me to where I am today, which is a pretty damn fine place.

:::OshnSoul:::

Basically my intention of the saying was on a personal level. We all have our own truths, nothing to be ashamed of or hide. We are all individuals with our own beliefs- thus becoming our own Truth.

irateplatypus

:::OshnSoul:::

Thanks for bringing this up. I truly believe that the way we approach this question has far reaching implications for who are are as a society. There can be nothing more helpful or detrimental to our conversations with eachother than our idea of the nature of truth.

I think I'm with you in the spirit of your post, but I would like to make a clear distinction between belief and truth. My understanding leads me to believe that we all harbor a belief of what we think the truth actually is, but the actual truth resides outside of our notions (in the sense that it would exist if our notions did not exist, not that our notions are devoid of truth). All have their own perception of real truth, but because human perception varies in so many ways... our belief of the truth seldom approaches actual truth.

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If you will not fight when your victory will be sure and not too costly, you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all the odds against you and only a precarious chance for survival. There may even be a worse case. You may have to fight when there is no hope of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves.

~ Winston Churchill

:::OshnSoul:::

Right. I agree with you as well, except for the "outside" part. All knowingness, all wisdom, all answers lie within each and every one of us.
But as far as our thoughts and perception- that which you beleive to be true IS true to you. That's your Truth. It's just simply becomes our reality.

I like the flow of this thread and the reactions, becuase you all are seeing it on 2 levels- personal/individual and the larger picture, as well.

wilbjammin

Is it really possible that everything we know is really just an aspect of some inner-knowledge? I think the vast majority of information, ideas, and theories that we have are based on our interaction with our environment. Our understandings are widely influenced by the outside world. Knowledge is a construct, mutually created and maintained by society.

If you shut yourself off to the idea that your beliefs are influenced and/or manufactured by what you've been exposed to (externally), and that there is a possibility that your beliefs have ingenuine parts or your ideas that aren't fully thought out, then "Truth" becomes a subject of parallactic indifference. I am open to thinking that my ideas aren't truly my own. I am open to finding out that I'm wrong. My truths are tenuous at best existing in this post-modern world; existing in defiance to the absurdity of existence.

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Innominate.

:::OshnSoul:::

True. I hear ya.
Yes, we are influenced by the external, but how we decide who we are through those experiences defines us- thus, being Our Own Truth. But we cannot do anything with out the will of choosing to do it. The human experience requires that which isn't you in order to define who you are. Gotta have those polarities, or else how would we compare and decide, define and seperate? To learn by our choices? My point is, there is the iternal that is influenced by the external, although not all of the external is what defines you, you internally are able to make conscious notes and choices and definitions of yourself. We are the tool of experience, and the external events/experiences do resonate internally and will then bounce back out (reflecting) externally. They feed off of each other so that we can experience every choice there is to make in order to eventually realizing who we are. Some people don't get that far, others do. The external, then, is our tool. It's a matter of how we use that tool, with their being so many different choices we can make.

Fireshiru1

you must undersand that ultimately, your "truth" may not be the ultimate and "correct" truth. i might say, and believe that 2+2=5. now i coult say that i believe this is right, and lets pretend i do belive this is right, and in turn truth. in reality we know that 2+2=4 and i an ultimately wrong.

all in all, i guess what you indocrinate as belief within yourself becomes truth because you choose not to see it any other way. much like religion, although it's somewhat changing now a days with 'tolerance' and such.

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No matter how hard you try, you can't baptize a cat.

tiberry

We, or more specifically - our minds do not "perceive" reality, but instead create reality. Its sometimes difficult to grasp, but it only makes sense...follow this:

1. We experience some situation
2. Our minds interpret the situation based on "who we are"
3. We summarize the situation and attach a "feeling" to it. (here is the trick - as we can associate any feeling we want; happy, good, bad, sad, whatever - not in explicit, logical terms - but how we "feel" about the situation...we're free to make whatever feeling we want".
4. What we feel, our emotions are the deepest truths...these are our reality.

So many people miss the forrest for the trees...its so easy to NOT understand this. Its so easy to attack this reasoning with cold, calculating logic - yet so hard to accept it for the simple truth that it implys - we create our own reality every moment of every day. It's just way to scary to accept for some people - that they're responsible for where they find themselves...

If everyone could just let go...stop struggling and searching for answers where there are no questions. The real truths are inherent, they're in plain sight - not hidden, there is no mystery...just accept what you already know.

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My life's work is to bridge the gap between that which is perceived by the mind and that which is quantifiable by words and numbers.

tiberry

Clearly, you truly believe that you WILL fall. Until you accept completely that you certainly WILL NOT fall, you will. If ye have but the faith of a mustard seed, you can move mountains...

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My life's work is to bridge the gap between that which is perceived by the mind and that which is quantifiable by words and numbers.

tiberry

:::OshnSoul:::

I don't want to jack your thread here or anything, but I think you'll understand what I'm saying here:

Do you see the correlation between this and the illusion of disunity? "If you eat of the tree of knowledge of good and evil you will surely die". That is - if you believe that there is anything that is NOT god, you will fall away. [ I know its a far stretch, but I think you can follow where I'm going]

Start another thread on this if you want to go further...

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My life's work is to bridge the gap between that which is perceived by the mind and that which is quantifiable by words and numbers.

vdublover

I think it depends on what you are believing in. If you believe you can fly, and you jump off of a building, will you fly? For a few seconds, maybe (but I am not sure if falling fits into the category of flying.) If we are talking about God, or whoever, then I think that what you believe can be your truth, because we have no proof either way. Which is why we can explain the existence of so many religions in our world. And so many people willing to fight and die for what they believe. If we look around, especially at this moment in time, we can see that there's a plethora of people in the world that live in the world which they believe is true.

Sorry if I get off topic, I'm new at this.

:::OshnSoul:::

No, that totally fits here and I do get what you are saying. That is correct. If one person believes that there is evil and bad- that they will produce a method of judgement, comparison, and evensometimes ridicule or even hatred to that which is "evil" or "bad". This can turn into a whole other subject, but I will try to stay on topic here.
But once you've heard or read something, you choose to beleive it or not. If you believe in it strongly enough, it will become your Truth- i.e. your reality- and that is the way you will perceive it. That is, unless, some other source tells you something else that contradicts or claims the opposite. You can then choose to beleive that or not to. People's opinions and thoughts on issues and ideas change all of the time- Individually and as a majority of the whole. And one country could have one belief system, while another has a completely different one. So how can we truly tell- or for that matter KNOW what is evil or bad?
So, to clarify what I am saying, on an individual level, take your beliefs and know them. If you feel strongly and passionately about them, cool. That is your personal Truth in which you live by, therefore making it your reality.
The phrase I posted was meant to say that we all are different, we all have different beliefs- and to stop searching for that ONE TRUTH, but instead follow your feelings, your passion- and that is your Truth. And that Truth is yours, and it is okay. That is Who You Are. BE Who You Are. That defines You. Because, afterall you are One of a Kind.
Now, some people may beleive that they are cursed, some people beleive that they are no good, some people feel that there is no joy in life. That is a beleif that they have held onto, planted in their head, and those thoughts manifested in their everyday life, making it their reality. It's what they perceive and what they experience. That's their Truth. But that truth can change if they choose to change it. We have so many options, so many paths we can take, so many experiences we can have, all depending on what we believe and perceive.
Now, again with the thought of their being things that are not "of God", then that is what you create in your reality. This life is a stage, we're the directors, we create the scenes with our thoughts. I do not see anything outside of "God", yet I see an infinite number of choices that can be made, and depending on those choices, it will lead you to some sort of outcome of the choice you make. It's all fair play, because we have the free will to make any choice we wish, and to beleive anything we want.
I will end it here for now, because I don't want to steer this off track. But I enjoyed what you said. If I feel the need to elaborate later, I will.

tiberry

Incredible...

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My life's work is to bridge the gap between that which is perceived by the mind and that which is quantifiable by words and numbers.

Xell101

Not believing in an oncoming train will not help, reality is there, and you are in it, but you do have the option of lying to yourself. That's my view on how belief relates to existence.

bouray

I think that Lebell hit the nail on the head....the problem is not that what you believe is the truth, it when what you believe is so strong that you refuse to see the truth and are willing to give everything up and fight to the end even against the actual TRUTH!!!