JESUS & PAUL- The World and the Witness - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

04-05-2004, 11:57 AM

Tonight at 8pm pst on ABC there will be an very interesting documentary show w/ Peter Jennings on the beginnings of Christianity.

http://abcnews.go.com/sections/WNT/W...l_promo-1.html

The first of three pages:

Quote:

Two men sacrificed everything for the belief that God had chosen them to change the world. And they did change the world.

In a special three-hour broadcast, Peter Jennings tells the story of Jesus of Nazareth, Paul the Apostle and Christianity in its first decades — a tiny movement that against the odds survived and then triumphed over all the gods and goddesses of the Roman Empire.

Peter Jennings Reporting: Jesus and Paul — The Word and the Witness will air Monday, April 5 from 8-11 p.m. ET on the ABC Television Network.

The first century was barely 30 years old. Rome ruled the world from Europe to the heart of the Middle East. The Caesars were gods and most people knew nothing about a young Jewish peasant named Jesus of Nazareth who was preaching along the Sea of Gallilee, at the edge of the Empire.

When Jesus died on the cross, he left behind a small and frightened group of followers struggling to make sense of his humiliating end. Most Jews either rejected his message or ignored it.

"The idea of a crucified god really did not make sense in the first century," says Ben Witherington, a scholar of the New Testament, in Jennings' report. "It's not a message you make up if you're going to start a religion in the first century A.D."

Yet within a few decades, against all odds, the tiny Jesus movement began to spread, and in spite of ridicule, suspicion and persecution it would ultimately displace the Caesars and remains the dominant religion of the West over 2000 years later.

Many historians and New Testament scholars argue that Paul did more than anyone to make that happen, even though he never knew Jesus. After Jesus' death and resurrection, Paul becomes the main character in the Bible story about the birth of Christianity.

TheKak · 04-06-2004, 09:26 AM

""The idea of a crucified god really did not make sense in the first century," says Ben Witherington, a scholar of the New Testament, in Jennings' report. "It's not a message you make up if you're going to start a religion in the first century A.D."

Still doesn't make sense if you ask me! There are plenty of religions still being made that make absolutely no sense, and they still thrive in some places (hell look at Scientology).

I did see bits and pieces of the show while I worked, pretty informative and it actually made challenges to some parts of the story. Worth a watch even if you aren't Christian (I'm not and I enjoyed what I saw of it).

Paradise Lost · 04-06-2004, 01:47 PM

I always figured Constantine made a larger impact in Christianity when he decided that Rome should adopt it as it's main religion. Sure, no one really was forced to convert over, but it most likely made it easier for such a large group, many still "Pagans" at the time of conversion to well, convert. I'm sure it also made it easier when Clovis decided to make the Merovingians a Christian based Empire.

Not to say Paul didn't do a good job early on spreading the Word, but whether or not his spreading changed alot of people's minds is for me to find out sometime. :P I'm really more of a fan of John.

Thagrastay · 04-07-2004, 08:45 AM

The show once again certainly demonstrated Peter Jennings' personal agenda.

Johnny Rotten · 04-07-2004, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by TheKak

Still doesn't make sense if you ask me! There are plenty of religions still being made that make absolutely no sense, and they still thrive in some places (hell look at Scientology).

As it turns out, the Sacrificial Hero is a theme common to many concurrent, pre-dating, and independently evolved mythologies. (Not to say that the crucifixion is a myth, only that the story draws from a common theological pool).

xx emo x · 04-18-2004, 01:06 PM

I think that Paul was instrumental in spreading the gospel of Christianity. True, Paul did not personally know Jesus, and yet his impact was profound, and it is still felt to a degree today. To the same token, look at any prominent (in the wordly sense of the word) follower of Christ. Take Billy Grahm (apologies for spelling errors in this post) for example. He did not see Jesus die on the cross, nor did he touch his wounds, but he spread the news to many people, and through televangelism he brought the gospel to many, just as Paul spread the news of Jesus through letters and word of mouth.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that to spread the gospel, you didn't have to see Jesus. All you need is a strong relationship with Him, where He is in control. And I know others will say "Well if the disciples didn't see Him die, we would have no account.", but I say because that has already happened so long ago, we can spread Jesus like Paul, or Billy Grahm. I will stop here because I'm doubting whether I am ranting mindlessly now or actually making sense. Thanks.

copenhagen · 04-24-2004, 10:40 PM

I have to agree with xx emo x. Belief is the only thing a Christian has to go on. Nobody in the present time saw the crucifixion but Christians believe in it. Spreading the word and letting others know or getting others to believe is what it’s all about.

Jay Francis · 04-25-2004, 05:16 AM

I've noticed that whenever ABC does one of these shows, they try too hard to be balanced, even if the facts indicate that there isn't a need. There's a real fear of offending listeners who are Christian. Two books by Randel Helms do a superb job of analyzing the early days of Christianity:

Gospel Fictions

Who Wrote the Gospels

Highly recommended.

04-06-2004, 09:26 AM	#2 (permalink)
TheKak Insane Location: Virginia	""The idea of a crucified god really did not make sense in the first century," says Ben Witherington, a scholar of the New Testament, in Jennings' report. "It's not a message you make up if you're going to start a religion in the first century A.D." Still doesn't make sense if you ask me! There are plenty of religions still being made that make absolutely no sense, and they still thrive in some places (hell look at Scientology). I did see bits and pieces of the show while I worked, pretty informative and it actually made challenges to some parts of the story. Worth a watch even if you aren't Christian (I'm not and I enjoyed what I saw of it). __________________ Roses are red, violets are blue, I'm a schizophrenic and so am I.

04-06-2004, 01:47 PM	#3 (permalink)
Paradise Lost "Afternoon everybody." "NORM!" Location: Poland, Ohio // Clarion University of PA.	I always figured Constantine made a larger impact in Christianity when he decided that Rome should adopt it as it's main religion. Sure, no one really was forced to convert over, but it most likely made it easier for such a large group, many still "Pagans" at the time of conversion to well, convert. I'm sure it also made it easier when Clovis decided to make the Merovingians a Christian based Empire. Not to say Paul didn't do a good job early on spreading the Word, but whether or not his spreading changed alot of people's minds is for me to find out sometime. :P I'm really more of a fan of John. __________________ "Marino could do it."

04-07-2004, 08:45 AM	#4 (permalink)
Thagrastay Crazy Location: Handrail, Montana	The show once again certainly demonstrated Peter Jennings' personal agenda. __________________ "That's it! They've got the cuffs on him, he's IN the car!"

04-18-2004, 01:06 PM	#6 (permalink)
xx emo x Upright Location: under a dark light	I think that Paul was instrumental in spreading the gospel of Christianity. True, Paul did not personally know Jesus, and yet his impact was profound, and it is still felt to a degree today. To the same token, look at any prominent (in the wordly sense of the word) follower of Christ. Take Billy Grahm (apologies for spelling errors in this post) for example. He did not see Jesus die on the cross, nor did he touch his wounds, but he spread the news to many people, and through televangelism he brought the gospel to many, just as Paul spread the news of Jesus through letters and word of mouth. I guess what I'm trying to say is that to spread the gospel, you didn't have to see Jesus. All you need is a strong relationship with Him, where He is in control. And I know others will say "Well if the disciples didn't see Him die, we would have no account.", but I say because that has already happened so long ago, we can spread Jesus like Paul, or Billy Grahm. I will stop here because I'm doubting whether I am ranting mindlessly now or actually making sense. Thanks. __________________ hurting people hurt people.

04-25-2004, 05:16 AM	#8 (permalink)
Jay Francis Psycho Location: Houston, Texas	ABC Has To Soften Their Reports I've noticed that whenever ABC does one of these shows, they try too hard to be balanced, even if the facts indicate that there isn't a need. There's a real fear of offending listeners who are Christian. Two books by Randel Helms do a superb job of analyzing the early days of Christianity: Gospel Fictions Who Wrote the Gospels Highly recommended.

04-24-2004, 10:40 PM	#7 (permalink)
copenhagen Insane Location: Johnson City, TN	I have to agree with xx emo x. Belief is the only thing a Christian has to go on. Nobody in the present time saw the crucifixion but Christians believe in it. Spreading the word and letting others know or getting others to believe is what it’s all about.