Habitual Procrastination and Masochism... - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

saltfish · 10-07-2003, 10:34 AM

Here is a topic that I have been questioning recently.

Is one's habitual procrastination a form of masochism?

Here are some definitions to help clear the air:

1st Definition Sub-Part #3:
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=masochism

1st Definiton:
http://dictionary.reference.com/sear...rocrastination

I'd love to hear your thoughts on this topic.

-SF

mr sticky · 10-07-2003, 04:51 PM

As a life long procrastinator, I can surely tell you that I am not a masochist. Procrastination is an avoidance of the potential for discomfort or pain. Masochism is the quest.

absorbentishe · 10-07-2003, 08:00 PM

Originally posted by mr sticky

Uhmm, what he said. I can put stuff off with the best of them. I would rather avoid a sitution that will cause me grief/pain than face it, and if I have to deal with it, I do it very grugingly(sp?). I don't think the two can be related in any way.

saltfish · 10-07-2003, 08:54 PM

I would have to ask though, if one is miserable about the fact that they are a habitual procrasinator, and the situation arises again to procrastinate or not, why does one choose to procrastinate? Wouldn't you think that you would learn after the first few hundred dozen times?

-SF

MuadDib · 10-07-2003, 09:10 PM

Well let me ask you this: is a cigarette smoker a masochist? The smoker knows he/she is committing prolonged suicide, but continues to smoke anyway. I don't know that the inability to break a negative habit makes you a masochist.

Killconey · 10-08-2003, 12:08 AM

Hmmm...that is a deep and thought provoking question. Normally I'd agree with the other posters here that I procrastinate without suffering, but I'm in a particularly reflective mood tonight.

Sometimes when the pressure is really on in college, I will do everything in my power to put all of my work off until one point. My rational at the time is that I am trying to get all of my suffering done at once, but deep down inside I wonder if I might enjoy working under these conditions. Enjoy the thrill of knowing I might fail, enjoy how everything hangs in the balance and enjoy the way that I have to push myself at that last moment.

Maybe I'm just in need of some sleep, but can anyone else identify with the tremendous feeling that comes when you push yourself to the limits and then succeed?

saltfish · 10-08-2003, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Maybe I'm just in need of some sleep, but can anyone else identify with the tremendous feeling that comes when you push yourself to the limits and then succeed? [/B]

Now, Add this into the above statement.

If you get a great grade on a project in the situation above after procrastinating so long, do you not feel even better knowing that it took so LITTLE effort/time to get it done. ...while at the same time, if you get a mediocre grade on a project that you procrastinated, you justify the grade by saying, "I didn't put any real work into it, so therefore I don't feel so bad."

Mind you, this is never a way to be successful, as I can attest to. Though does this in itself end up being a reward mechanism? Can one become addicted to procrastination, when above all else there is no discernable consequence to their actions?

I just bring this up because this is my current state of affairs. I procrastinate everything to the last minute. I work ever-so-hard, and put demands on myslef that no-one ever should. (Staying awake for 24-36 hours at time, doing 2 weeks worth of work at one time) I think in a way, that I have gotten away with this for too long. I have never really been punished for my actions, b/c I have always succeeded, triumphantly. Though I think it has started to take a mental toll.

I do also want to clear it up a little, I mis-stated my use of masochism. Rather, I wanted to know if it would be a kind of 'subconcious-masochism' as much as the negative is tolerated. Just as a dog that knows he is going to be beaten, will sit an take the beating b/c he knows it will happen irregardless; this, in pack behavior is refered to as the "Omega."

Ok, so I leave you with this mess of though and I am interested to hear your thoughs/feelings.

Oh, and btw, thank you for participating, its good to hear what others think!

-SF

MuadDib · 10-08-2003, 01:18 PM

One of the more convincing theories I have heard is a variation of what SF is talking about. As a matter of efficiency when you put in less work than you're cohort and doe just as well or better the rush of superiority is awesome. But as any psych student will tell you, the search for that kind of superiority masks a fear of inferiority (a complex, if you will) and is really a reflection of a huge fear of failure. The logic being if you procrastinate and succeed you feel superior because you overcame a greater challenge, but if you fail you can always say that you would have done just as well as everyone else if you had put the same time in. By this way of thinking you are never inferior to anyone else but often times superior. Of course, this isn't true and only reflects a kind of neurosis.

Killconey · 10-08-2003, 11:26 PM

Yeah, procrastination definitely makes a nice scapegoat when I fail. That's something that I'm working on and I know many other procrastinators realize; sooner or later we have to grow up and take responsibility for our own actions. The only problem is that sometimes it is easier to live with a pain than to do something to stop it. Maybe that's why this thread started in the first place, because procrastinators would rather inflict pain upon themselves than take the risks or life.

mb99usa · 10-09-2003, 08:23 AM

I agree with a lot of what was said. I think procrastination does not stem from laziness but poor time management and prioritizing. I find I usually procrastinate things I do not find important. These are things that usually need to be done but don't rate high on my list.

This is not done to cause pain or hardship but to allow me to attend to things I either enjoy or consider more important.

little limey · 10-09-2003, 04:36 PM

I think I procrastinate to test my limits. It is a "trying experience" as masochism is. When I come out of it I feel like I have proven something to myself.

As far as cigarette smoking goes: it is true. Smokers are masochists. When I smoked I did it because I wanted to hurt myself and I was fully concious I was killing myself. I have never met any chain smokers who are happy people. Smoking is definately done to hurt oneself.

Killconey · 10-09-2003, 11:37 PM

Just thought I'd drop a note to say that its 2:35 in the morning and I'm about four pages into a ten page paper that's due at 11. I've had almost a month to work on this and have already gotten the prof to move the date back twice. Someone remind me, why the hell am I procrastinating again? And why do I seem to be enjoying watching myself do this? Masochism, yes?

anti fishstick · 10-10-2003, 12:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Killconey
Hmmm...that is a deep and thought provoking question. Normally I'd agree with the other posters here that I procrastinate without suffering, but I'm in a particularly reflective mood tonight.

Sometimes when the pressure is really on in college, I will do everything in my power to put all of my work off until one point. My rational at the time is that I am trying to get all of my suffering done at once, but deep down inside I wonder if I might enjoy working under these conditions. Enjoy the thrill of knowing I might fail, enjoy how everything hangs in the balance and enjoy the way that I have to push myself at that last moment.

Maybe I'm just in need of some sleep, but can anyone else identify with the tremendous feeling that comes when you push yourself to the limits and then succeed?

i can relate. i find that postponing things til the night before gives me more ambition and motivation to -get it done-. i love working under pressure. it keeps me on my toes. kind of exciting. that's why i HAVE to have deadlines. or i'll never get something done. :P
i live in-the-moment. kinda makes me wonder how much better i can do though, if i pulled off an 'A' on an art project i whipped out under 3 hours. :P

as for masochism vs. procrastination, i never put the two together. i don't think they can be related in any way.

lordjeebus · 10-10-2003, 12:35 AM

There was an interesting experimental psychology study done by Baumeister (I think) that looked into the notion that chronic procrastinators work better under pressure. I don't remember the details but the basic idea was that two groups of procrastinators were somehow made to work on tasks with or without some sort of pressure condition. He found that, contrary to common belief, pressure reduced the quality of task output.

I understand that in clinical practice, a common approach is to cognitive-behaviorally produce change by explaining to the procrastinator why working under pressure is a bad thing, and then somehow forcing procrastinators to work on things early and observe the quality of their work (and compare it to how bad they thought it would be without pressure).

Procrastination is also correlated with measures of fear of failure and vulnerability to shame, and the hypothesis is that some people procrastinate because they believe they may do poorly and wish to delay the shame that will result from poor performance.

Of course, the above observations are true only in general, and may not apply to a particular procrastinator. I'm sure that some procrastinators do perform better under pressure and have confidence in their abilities. Procrastination is difficult because so much can go into it.

If you're a student at a college with accessible professors, it can help to schedule a meeting with a prof a week or so before a due date to "go over a rough draft" because it gives you a new deadline to meet (or risk angering your prof by standing him/her up).

anti fishstick · 10-10-2003, 12:58 AM

i can relate to the fear of failure bit. although, its not so much fear of failure persay... i just think i'm too much of a perfectionist for my own good :P what i could possibly produce would be nowhere near as good as how i'd ultimately want it. but i guess i'm my own worse critic.

ok yeah.. so that's basically fear of failure :P

GakFace · 10-10-2003, 01:47 AM

Killconey, its because you've picked it up from me. I believe i'm the SlackMaster.. Oh wait, I know! You're still thinking of a new card for Chez Geek! Yeah, and you're on a verge of breakthru!

I'd hate to say I like having to go thru that rush, but doing it so many times... maybe I do. But yeah I don't think I make it a personal quest to wait for the last possible minute... I just keep doing a bunch of nothings until then.. heh

10-07-2003, 10:34 AM	#1 (permalink)
saltfish !?!No hay pantalones!?! Location: Indian-no-place	Habitual Procrastination and Masochism... Here is a topic that I have been questioning recently. Is one's habitual procrastination a form of masochism? Here are some definitions to help clear the air: 1st Definition Sub-Part #3: http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=masochism 1st Definiton: http://dictionary.reference.com/sear...rocrastination I'd love to hear your thoughts on this topic. -SF

10-07-2003, 04:51 PM	#2 (permalink)
mr sticky Psycho Location: NC	As a life long procrastinator, I can surely tell you that I am not a masochist. Procrastination is an avoidance of the potential for discomfort or pain. Masochism is the quest. __________________ The sad thing is... as you get older you come to realize that you don't so much pilot your life, as you just try to hold on, in a screaming, defiant ball of white-knuckle anxious fury

10-07-2003, 09:10 PM	#5 (permalink)
MuadDib Psycho	Well let me ask you this: is a cigarette smoker a masochist? The smoker knows he/she is committing prolonged suicide, but continues to smoke anyway. I don't know that the inability to break a negative habit makes you a masochist. __________________ "The courts that first rode the warhorse of virtual representation into battle on the res judicata front invested their steed with near-magical properties." ~27 F.3d 751

10-08-2003, 12:08 AM	#6 (permalink)
Killconey Crazy Location: Various places in the Midwest, all depending on when I'm posting.	Hmmm...that is a deep and thought provoking question. Normally I'd agree with the other posters here that I procrastinate without suffering, but I'm in a particularly reflective mood tonight. Sometimes when the pressure is really on in college, I will do everything in my power to put all of my work off until one point. My rational at the time is that I am trying to get all of my suffering done at once, but deep down inside I wonder if I might enjoy working under these conditions. Enjoy the thrill of knowing I might fail, enjoy how everything hangs in the balance and enjoy the way that I have to push myself at that last moment. Maybe I'm just in need of some sleep, but can anyone else identify with the tremendous feeling that comes when you push yourself to the limits and then succeed? __________________ Look out for numbers two and up and they'll look out for you.

10-08-2003, 01:18 PM	#8 (permalink)
MuadDib Psycho	One of the more convincing theories I have heard is a variation of what SF is talking about. As a matter of efficiency when you put in less work than you're cohort and doe just as well or better the rush of superiority is awesome. But as any psych student will tell you, the search for that kind of superiority masks a fear of inferiority (a complex, if you will) and is really a reflection of a huge fear of failure. The logic being if you procrastinate and succeed you feel superior because you overcame a greater challenge, but if you fail you can always say that you would have done just as well as everyone else if you had put the same time in. By this way of thinking you are never inferior to anyone else but often times superior. Of course, this isn't true and only reflects a kind of neurosis. __________________ "The courts that first rode the warhorse of virtual representation into battle on the res judicata front invested their steed with near-magical properties." ~27 F.3d 751

10-07-2003, 08:00 PM	#3 (permalink)
absorbentishe Boy am I horny today Location: T O L E D O, Toledo!!	Originally posted by mr sticky Uhmm, what he said. I can put stuff off with the best of them. I would rather avoid a sitution that will cause me grief/pain than face it, and if I have to deal with it, I do it very grugingly(sp?). I don't think the two can be related in any way.

10-07-2003, 08:54 PM	#4 (permalink)
saltfish !?!No hay pantalones!?! Location: Indian-no-place	I would have to ask though, if one is miserable about the fact that they are a habitual procrasinator, and the situation arises again to procrastinate or not, why does one choose to procrastinate? Wouldn't you think that you would learn after the first few hundred dozen times? -SF

10-08-2003, 11:26 PM	#9 (permalink)
Killconey Crazy Location: Various places in the Midwest, all depending on when I'm posting.	Yeah, procrastination definitely makes a nice scapegoat when I fail. That's something that I'm working on and I know many other procrastinators realize; sooner or later we have to grow up and take responsibility for our own actions. The only problem is that sometimes it is easier to live with a pain than to do something to stop it. Maybe that's why this thread started in the first place, because procrastinators would rather inflict pain upon themselves than take the risks or life. __________________ Look out for numbers two and up and they'll look out for you.

10-09-2003, 08:23 AM	#10 (permalink)
mb99usa Keep on rolling. It only hurts for a little while. Location: wherever I am	I agree with a lot of what was said. I think procrastination does not stem from laziness but poor time management and prioritizing. I find I usually procrastinate things I do not find important. These are things that usually need to be done but don't rate high on my list. This is not done to cause pain or hardship but to allow me to attend to things I either enjoy or consider more important. __________________ So, what's your point? It's not an attitude, it's a way of life.

10-09-2003, 04:36 PM	#11 (permalink)
little limey Psycho Location: Room Nineteen	I think I procrastinate to test my limits. It is a "trying experience" as masochism is. When I come out of it I feel like I have proven something to myself. As far as cigarette smoking goes: it is true. Smokers are masochists. When I smoked I did it because I wanted to hurt myself and I was fully concious I was killing myself. I have never met any chain smokers who are happy people. Smoking is definately done to hurt oneself.

10-09-2003, 11:37 PM	#12 (permalink)
Killconey Crazy Location: Various places in the Midwest, all depending on when I'm posting.	Just thought I'd drop a note to say that its 2:35 in the morning and I'm about four pages into a ten page paper that's due at 11. I've had almost a month to work on this and have already gotten the prof to move the date back twice. Someone remind me, why the hell am I procrastinating again? And why do I seem to be enjoying watching myself do this? Masochism, yes? __________________ Look out for numbers two and up and they'll look out for you.

10-10-2003, 12:35 AM	#14 (permalink)
lordjeebus ‚±‚Ìˆó˜U‚ª–Ú‚É“ü‚ç‚Ê‚© Location: College	There was an interesting experimental psychology study done by Baumeister (I think) that looked into the notion that chronic procrastinators work better under pressure. I don't remember the details but the basic idea was that two groups of procrastinators were somehow made to work on tasks with or without some sort of pressure condition. He found that, contrary to common belief, pressure reduced the quality of task output. I understand that in clinical practice, a common approach is to cognitive-behaviorally produce change by explaining to the procrastinator why working under pressure is a bad thing, and then somehow forcing procrastinators to work on things early and observe the quality of their work (and compare it to how bad they thought it would be without pressure). Procrastination is also correlated with measures of fear of failure and vulnerability to shame, and the hypothesis is that some people procrastinate because they believe they may do poorly and wish to delay the shame that will result from poor performance. Of course, the above observations are true only in general, and may not apply to a particular procrastinator. I'm sure that some procrastinators do perform better under pressure and have confidence in their abilities. Procrastination is difficult because so much can go into it. If you're a student at a college with accessible professors, it can help to schedule a meeting with a prof a week or so before a due date to "go over a rough draft" because it gives you a new deadline to meet (or risk angering your prof by standing him/her up).

10-10-2003, 12:58 AM	#15 (permalink)
anti fishstick Post-modernism meets Individualism AKA the Clash Location: oregon	i can relate to the fear of failure bit. although, its not so much fear of failure persay... i just think i'm too much of a perfectionist for my own good :P what i could possibly produce would be nowhere near as good as how i'd ultimately want it. but i guess i'm my own worse critic. ok yeah.. so that's basically fear of failure :P __________________ And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom. ~Anais Nin

10-10-2003, 01:47 AM	#16 (permalink)
GakFace Go Ninja, Go Ninja Go!! Location: IN, USA	Killconey, its because you've picked it up from me. I believe i'm the SlackMaster.. Oh wait, I know! You're still thinking of a new card for Chez Geek! Yeah, and you're on a verge of breakthru! I'd hate to say I like having to go thru that rush, but doing it so many times... maybe I do. But yeah I don't think I make it a personal quest to wait for the last possible minute... I just keep doing a bunch of nothings until then.. heh __________________ RoboBlaster: Welcome to the club! Not that I'm in the club. And there really isn'a a club in the first place. But if there was a club and if I was in it, I would definitely welcome you to it.