Windbreaker

I just recently sumbled apon a interview with a man claiming to be a employee of Area 51 at one point or another and was able to aquire a video of a Alien interview conducted by the US government.

It's the most compelling Alien footage I have seen and was wondering the opinions of TFP members. I doubt its authenticity but compared to other so called "alien footage" this is by far the most authentic looking footage I believe can be created. This would have to be done with animal electronics puppet machinery. Do to the fact that kind of equipment and ability would require a large hollywood budget and a very gifted engineer I can't help but wonder.. "What if?".

If you wish to view this video I aquired it with torrentspy.com, it was titled "Area 51 Alien Interview" and suggest any alien enthusiest hop right on over and aquire this interesting video.

Other then what is told in the video I know nothing else about it, possibly old news, possibly already confirmed hoax... Fill me in.

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Church

I think I know the vid you're talking about, and althought I don't think it has been confirmed a hoax, and I really wish it were real, I think that it is fake. Like I said, if its the video I think you're talking about, some analysts have looked over that video and noticed some big continuuity problems in it. One of the more obvious being the clock on the wall beind the interviewing jumping back and forth in time as if it were pieced together wrong or something.

Regardless, I'll check out the video and get back.

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Windbreaker

No clock in this video. Tried a google search for images from the video, found this icon

The interview is in a dark room, mostly can only see alien's face and a silouet of a man to the left (man who communicates via telepathy with the alien, about 2 mins in the alien is in some distress and 3 personel enter the room, 2 doctors and a military advisor. The doctors using a flash light examin the nostrels, mouth, and eyes of the.. aw hell, check out this site, it has a pic + description of the video.


The description on that site tells me do to quality of the video I missed a lot of important minor details (foam at mouth, brewsed head). This leads me to be more convinced that this has a possibility of being real.

Pic from the site of the video

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Church

oh shit, I was thinking of the autopsy video. sorry man. hah

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Zephyr66

http://www.ufocasebook.com/Video/interview.ram
someone linked to this on the discussion board of that site, haven't check it out myself cause its 2:31 AM and I wanna get some sleep sometime tonight, considering shit like this freaks me the fuck out.

Martian

Church - Nice Rage in the sig there.

I haven't seen the video yet, I'll see if I can get my hands on it. But based on the site and the footage in the clip posted above, I'm not in the least convinced. The video footage is too poor quality (dark/grainy) to come to any sort of conclusion and it's really not that hard to fake such a thing. The alien's movement is very jerky and doesn't seem organic in nature. Further to that, the website is the same old conspiracy theory baloney (to be polite about it) with little to no evidence to back it up. The author mentions documents that lend credibility to conspiracy theories about both aliens and JFK, but doesn't make any reference to these documents, quote them or even provide any reference as to the nature of the documents. Are these leaked intelligence briefings, some sort of communiqué's, what? And where did they come from?

Aside from that the supposed source of the video is inconsistent. This Victor fellow (according to the website linked) in one breathe claims that so long as the footage gets o uthe doesn't care if his identity is discovered, as his assassination would lend credeibility to the tape, but then refuses to provide any sort of proof or credentials for fear of government reprisals. That's sort of contradicting himself and seems to expect the viewer to take a lot on trust.

The idea of greys in general seems a bit far fetched to me, they're too anthropomorphic for me to believe they're an alien species; they're much closer to what humanity would dream up, a distorted humanoid form (which we tend to find more disquieting than something totally alien). Further, they seem to be lacking in motive in that it seems to me that a race sufficiently advanced to engage in interstellar travel and clone themselves as a form of reproduction shouldn't really need us in any capacity. Perhaps they're presence here is benign, but I'm not really buying. Further, they're (again, taken from the website) theoretically attempting to create a human/grey hybrid, which should be impossible. Any high school biology student should know that it's impossible to interbreed creatures of seperate genus's.. thus it's feasible to create a lion/cougar hybrid, but not a lion/dog or cat/rabbit (sorry, as much as you may want to believe that your best friend's girlfriend's third cousin has a cabbit, not only do they not exist but they're genetically impossible). A human/grey hybrid would suggest that grey's are actually a form of homo sapiens and thus genetically compatible with us, which sort of contradicts the whole extraterrestrial concept. They're not likely from our own solar system because if they're able to survive in Earth's atmosphere and at Earth's gravity any other planet in our solar system would be just as inhospitable to them as it is to us. So that again points to an interstellar origin, which doesn't bode well for the grey believers.

EDIT - deeper reading of the website reveals more pseudo-scinece along with a (very inconsistent) theory that postulates that greys are descended from or somehow otherwise related to dolphins. However, it's past my bedtime, so if anyone's interested I'll post a rebuttal to that aspect either tomorrow or sometime next weekend (as I'm out of town all next week).

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I wake up in the morning more tired than before I slept
I get through cryin' and I'm sadder than before I wept
I get through thinkin' now, and the thoughts have left my head
I get through speakin' and I can't remember, not a word that I said

- Ben Harper, Show Me A Little Shame

Windbreaker

I agree with you on some points but along with my doubt I also believe it has a chance of being legit. The quality appears poor however the actual footage is decent quality, they were able to see some details like foam from the mouth that suggest there is some version floating about that has better quality then the one I watched wich I add is better looking than the picture above.

Vector is a very weird character, he fears being identified but claims in the video that in the case of him disapearing there will be more information released etcetc... So he is afraid of dieing but believe his death would bring more merit to his footage.

As far as how aliens would possibly look or be biologicly I can add anything. There is simply no way to claim its a genetic impossibility yet. Vector from what he knows makes the assumption the aliens are from another plane of existence and possibly have religions. Apparently from the interview processthey were able to get answers to some questions. The alien said the body is a vessel for the spirit and the spirit will have many vessels. Vector is full of interesting information.

I say watch the video with the interview.. If you watch any alien related nonsense, atleast let it be this. In my opinion and opinion of some friends I showed it to it is the most compelling video to date.

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ObieX

To expand a bit on this, did anyone ever stop to consider that these creatures are, quite possibly, from earth to begin with? Or are even *actually* human beings? possibly from millions of years into our distant future, that have found a way to travel through time and "study" "themselves"? Afterall, look at all the technological marvels that we have created over the past 100 years. we've gone from toiling in the soil to sailing through the black of space. Who's to say, in a few million years, we wont eventually discover a method of time travel? Afterall, a million years is a LONG time.. if we can advance so far in just 100 years, imagine how far we will be a million years from now.

So yes, they very well may be genetically compatible with us, because they may *be* "us". That is.. if they even exist at all.

Edit: small word change

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Zeraph

I find it unlikely that it is real. Mostly for lack of supporting evidence. If youre going to be working on top secret type stuff, the military will have a psych profile on you and along with previous experiences with that person, they will know who to put on the job. Also, I think if this guy were to supposedly risk his life, he would first find better evidence and if he's not risking his life, he shouldn't mind coming forward. Again, if he were the rational, smart type (because he would need these traits to pull it off) he would have realized something like this footage wouldn't matter much in the scheme of things. It doesn't prove anything.

Of course the other possibility that if it is true, then the government likely released it on purpose, to further de sensitize our minds. So if that were the case, this guy is either a pawn, or working for them. Either way we still get no conclusive evidence and that's really all that matters.

Church

Bob Lazar did the same thing. According to their thinking, if they say that if they die, then it will be because they were telling the truth and were silenced, however if they are not, then you can take what they are saying however you'd like, but the gov't is trying to make them look like a whackjob who doesn't know what hes talking about.

On another note, I believe the footage is real, mostly because I want to, and also for reasons which I don't want to discuss right now. Maybe in the future when I'm more comfortable with this place (and I've been here for a while, but I don't even talk about it with my closest friends).

But yeah, I think the footage is real, my .02.

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Windbreaker

Just a little snip of info that to me makes me have some faith in the authenticity of this is the story on how the government retrieved the ETs...

From what I gather in 1980's a craft crashed in south africa. Shortly after the US government was all over the area, according to leaked sources there were 2 living ETs both in really bad shape. African residents who whitness the crash and some who actually whitness the ETs gave a eye whitness description. Keepi in mind the people were africans with no connection to western culture and no way to know anything about our reported "greys". With no link to knowing our cultural beliefs on ETs they were able to give a description matching the ET in the video. Small things like this within the video are what spark my hopes. Like Crush I want to believe.

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MSD

The accounts from Africa are the kind of thing that make me wonder about stories like this. The same kind of thing happened with the stories of "dinosaurs" in Africa and South America. When shown a picture of a brontosaurus, they started shouting "Mokele Mbembe!" which is the name their tribe gave to the alleged modern dinosaur that supposedly still lives in remote areas. It's just enough to make me stop short of throwing stories like this in the conspiracy nut pile.

edit: I'm not saying that I believe the video is real, just that the stories of alien crashes might have some sort of truth to them.

Martian

There's a saying that extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof.

I've watched the full video (obtained by *ahem* alternative means) and I'm less convinced now than I was prior. I noticed a trend in the series of experts. The media and animatronics/puppeteering experts professed doubt and believed it to be a hoax, albeit a well done one, while the ufologists were all convinced. The flaw here is that ufologists are biased, in that this is there proclaimed field of study even though the existence of extraterrestrial beings and craft has not yet been proven and therefore predisposed to believe this sort of evidence.

Further, leaked intelligence briefings and documents are cited in the video, however no sources are cited for said documents. How did these documents get out into the public? There's not even an anonymous source cited; rather, they seem to have just appeared one day. With the proliferation of the internet, it's possible for me to type up some 'intelligence briefings' in word, 'leak' these out to the public, proclaim myself a ufologist (rather than being an actual scientific field, ufologists assume the title themselves) and begin spreading information that I know is fake with a high probability that at least part of the public will believe it to be true. If done well enough it's quite possible that I'll even fool some of these so-called experts. It's worth remembering that for every seemingly authentic document there are a thousand obvious fakes out there and therefore it must all be taken with a grain of salt.

It's very difficult to prove or disprove this entirely simply because there isn't enough evidence provided to draw any sort of conclusion. But going back to the statement I made at the beginning and considering a lot of inconsistancies and improbabilities provided here it doesn't seem likely that this isn't anything more than a well-orchestrated hoax. That this Victor character required financial reimbursement for the tape and interviews he provided simply lends credence to that conclusion, which he himself acknowledged. If the source of this information is himself acknowedging that it's not very credible, how are we as the thinking public expected to believe it?

Looking into the posts above, I see a lot of admitions that people believe it because they want to. That's fine and I'm not going to deny you that, but consider that if your primary reason for crediting this evidence is your own personal desire for it to be true rather than any solid analysis, how likely is it that it is? I may want to believe that I'm wealthy beyond imagination, but my bank statements say otherwise. Sure it's possible that I have some Swiss bank account started in my name by someone behind my back that contains unbelievable riches and I dearly want to believe it, but I'm not going to until I have hard proof of it.

ObieX, as valid a theory as any I suppose, when discussing this sort of thing. The only problem I have is that these greys are so far different from us and it makes me wonder what sort of evolutionary pressures would cause the adaptations seen. Physiologically the greys are very like us, but differ in some small but crucial ways. Their necks, as noted in the video are anchored at the center of their skulls rather than the back, they're skin shows either no pigmentation or one totally alien to ours, they seem to have trouble with our atmosphere (though interestingly enough, it doesn't seem entirely toxic to them) their eyes are much larger and very dark, which along with their supposed preference for dark rooms seems to suggest that they exist in a low light environment and their noses and ears are vestigial. Given our way as a species of adapting our environment to us rather than adapting to our environment, I can't help but wonder what would cause such radical changes. So, possible, yes. The whole thing is possible, as is the idea that they come from planet X on the edge of our own solar system. It's all possible, which is why some people will insist on beliving it to be irrefutable. The question you need to ask is not whether it's possible or not but rather how plausible it is.

And the dolphin rebuttal, because I promised I would.

On reading the site linked in the original post, it's put forth and becomes evident that the author believes these greys to share a common ancestor with dolphins. However, the author seems to go back and forth. He suggests first that it's possible that they share a cetacean ancestor and simply never returned to the sea, then goes on to point out aspects of their physiology that they share with dolphins. However it's worth remembering that many of the dolphin's adaptations came after they re-entered the sea and thus wouldn't be shared with another cetacean descendent unless that descendent also returned to the sea and branched off at a later date. Of particular note is the melon, present on dolphins and which the author claims is capable of emitting large bursts of ultrasound as a form of attack or defense (it's worth noting that I was incapable of finding independent verification of this technique). This adaptation would be nearly useless on land, simply because air doesn't carry sound nearly as effectively as water. Where a dolphin could use such an attack to stun and disorient underwater, the greys would need a much larger burst to accomplish the same effect, which would likely necessitate a larger area of the brain devoted to it and a very pronounced bulge in the anterior region of the skull. That bulge simply isn't present on any representation of these creatures I've ever seen and doesn't seem especially likely, as it's relatively ineffective and wouldn't develop in the first place. Dolphins likely developed this after developing sonar as a form of navigation, which further is likely to have occured after they returned to the sea, where light levels are much lower and visual navigation isn't very reliable.

Which provides a nice segueway into the eyes. The author of that site also notes that the grey's eyes appear similar to those of a dolphin, in that they're large and black and (apparently) have a protective cover. This is further in contradiction to the theory that greys branched off from ceteceans prior to their return to the sea, as a dolphins eyes are well-suted to the low light underwater environment in which they live. In the brightly lit world above ground, large dark eyes are much less needed and may well prove to be a detriment. The greys don't appear to have any sort of iris to control the amount of light that enters their eyes, which in bright daylight would cause them to be overstimulated and essentially blinded.

And then there's the skin. Again this is an underwater development; living underwater is much colder than above land, therefore a dolphin's skin is adapted to it. A dolphin has very little pigment in it's skin, as it's unnecessary where there's no light; we developed it to protect ourselves from the intense light of the sun. A dolphin's skin is also nonporous, which leads to them being hairless. This prevents some moisture exchange, which can cause heat loss. These adaptations give a dolphin's skin it's unique colour and texture, noted as similar to a grey's and wholly unnecessary (and again, even detrimental) on land.

Thus, in summary, the author is self-contradicting. He states in one breath that dolphins and greys likely share a common ancestor than goes on to enumerate similarites greys show to dolphins as evidence, even though the similarites were all developed after the dolphins and greys parted ways on the evolutionary tree. And aside from all that, cetacean and homo sapeins DNA is incompatible, as cetacean DNA contains a different number of chromosomes.

__________________
I wake up in the morning more tired than before I slept
I get through cryin' and I'm sadder than before I wept
I get through thinkin' now, and the thoughts have left my head
I get through speakin' and I can't remember, not a word that I said

- Ben Harper, Show Me A Little Shame

Menoman

To the guy talking about how it is "Impossible" for the aliens and humans to be crossbred somehow...

There is a theory, which most ufologists know about, and believe to be true, and it's called "Panspermia".

The theory is about how life on earth, was implanted here, from an alien planet via meteor, or other such things coming from outter space.

The rock comes into earth, lands in the ocean (most likely) is eroded apart, and the building blocks of life are planted, 1 celled organisms appear, etc, etc, evolution takes places... bam.. life on earth.

So, technically, in this theory, WE are aliens... and if any other beings live out there, it's highly likely that their planet is where this rock would have come from. Making it highly likely that we could somehow be related to this alien race.


(all the "highly likely's" in my post, are only "highly likely" if panspermia were proven true)

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ObieX

Actually that is partly how life is theorized to have formed on the earth (by means of meteor impact) from "nothing". Amino acids forming in the early days were smashed into by meteors which (through proven scientific means) created peptides. This later morphed into life as we know it in the primordial soup.

Slightly different from your method but very similar in that life was formed by means of impacts of space rocks. Amino acids are pretty easy for nature to create, and there's lots of rocks floating around out there to smash into planets. So if this process i mentioned happened here, there's every possibility that it could happen anywhere else in the universe (within reason.. not on a star etc ) And that life would, in the basics, be similar to other life on our planet since it was formed through similar means with similar chemical compounds.

While it wouldn't explain why greys look so much like us it would help to show that life out there could be extremely common.

The simple fact is, we don't know at all if other life was around in our solar system on other planets cuz we just haven't gotten a good look yet. There very well may have ben life on mars 1million+ years ago before the water was locked away in the soil and poles or lost to space. Water oceans under the ice of europa could be swarming with life but we wont know till we go. The surface of titan could have life forms completely different from ours *shrugs* just because the recent probe didnt spot any on the way down doesn't mean it isnt there (it was only alive on the surface for like 30mins-a couple hours tops, and it didnt move around to look, it just sat in it's ditch). There may be water volcanos on titan (water instead of lava) which makes you wonder what could be in that slush.

Even here on earth there's microbes that gather enough energy to reproduce only 1 time in thousands of years. Plants and animals that live at the mouth of volcanic vents on the ocean floor in the scalding/boiling water. Who's to say it can't be on another planet?

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Martian

According to the theory of evolution if we trace back far enough, all land based animals share a common ancestor. That still doesn't mean I can interbreed cats and rabbits.

...I want my cabbit, dammit.

To elaborate, it all has to do with genetic makeup, specifically chromosomes. Creatures of the same genus, such as lions and tigers (both panthera) are able to cross breed, even though they're different species (Panthera leo and Panthera tigris, respectively). They're classified as the same genus because they have the same number of chromosomes, which is what makes their genetic material compatible. Dogs and wolves are the same species,canus lupis and thus interbreed easily (and are able to have viable (fertile) offspring) and are also able to mate with coyotes or jackals (which are the same genus but different species), although in that case, as in most interspecies breeding, the offspring are not likely to be viable.

And that's where we run into problems with the idea of interbreeding humans and greys. In order for that to work the greys would need to be of the genus homo, of which homo sapiens are the only known surviving species (more specifically the subspecies homo sapiens sapiens, which is of course what you and I are). This is highly unlikely if they evolved apart from us; their genetic material would simply not be compatible with ours and if an attempt were made to interbreed it, the zygote would shortly die. It would be getting conflicting instructions from the two disparate genetic strains which would make it unable to divide and form into a foetus as it's meant to. In order for this to occur, one would theoretically need an understanding of genetics strong enough to decode the two seperate genomes and then resquence them to be compatible, at which point the resultant creature would no longer be related to either human or grey, but be something else entirely. If that's even possible, which it may well not be; I don't profess to be a biology major and when we get into the nitty gritty of microbiology I tend to get lost.

So there's your crash course on genetics that in my mind at least disproves the human/grey interbreeding theory. Take it or leave it, I'm still not convinced the damn things even exist.

EDIT - For Menoman - Saying those things are highly likely, even in the context of that theory, is a bit of a stretch. They are a possibility and I'm certainly not denying that life can and probably has developed on other planets. The universe, hell, even our specific galaxy is huge beyond comprehension and amino acids are relatively simply formed from a chemical perspective. It's very possible for them to have formed and combined in sequences that create life. It's also possible that said amino acids hitched an interstellar ride on a space rock and didn't actually form terrestrially. It's worth noting, however, that life developed and evolved here on Earth. We are terrestrial, we are not aliens in any sense, technical or otherwise. We evolved and adapted due to the unique evolutionary pressures on our planet all the way up from the single celled organisms in the so-called primordial soup. That's what makes us of this Earth, regardless of where the first building blocks came from. Further to that, saying that we could be related to aliens is true in only the most remote and unimportant sense. We're also related to Komodo dragons and lemurs, but that doesn't make us the same as them at all.

__________________
I wake up in the morning more tired than before I slept
I get through cryin' and I'm sadder than before I wept
I get through thinkin' now, and the thoughts have left my head
I get through speakin' and I can't remember, not a word that I said

- Ben Harper, Show Me A Little Shame

Menoman

If you go by the theory ObieX posted, about how the "smash" itself was what sparked the creation of life, then yer right, we aren't aliens.

But if what I posted about, Panspermia, we are indeed all aliens to earth.

If an alien comes here, has kids for 1000 years, he's still an alien of this world.

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