Shauk

I'll be posting my experience with this lil device here.

So far all I've had the chance to mess with is the Torq software and it's flipping amazing even without a control device. The effects in this program are on part with what you'd find in your standard pioneer, club I was at yesterday has the Pioneer DJM-800 o_O

freaking 1500$ mixer, so far what i'm hearing out of this steal of a deal I got on ebay for 150$ (yes, 1/10th the price and even more functionality) is kicking ass in value.

I'll have more time to mess with it when I get home, right now i'm all ghetto style with it on my desk at work here

Fly

oh man..........have fun with that bro........



bring on the tunage.

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BASTARD

SterlingStudios

Shauk

So the auto beat matcher thing is pretty much by default, garbage. You CAN however, edit the beatpoints for each track on the waveform though.

Maybe not to the average person on a dancefloor, but it needs to be manually adjusted to sync up right in a lot of cases. It analyzes the waveforms for the peaks and assumes those are the beats to match, sometimes it just screws up horribly and says the 140 bpm track, hard trance with a prominent bassline (thus a thicker waveform) is 70bpm.

thats fine though because the guys at m-audio knew this would happen occasionally and built right in to the software is a nice lil double or half bpm feature that will edit the .tqd file that this program generates for each track that it analyzes.


Other than that I'm having too much fun with the built in effects.

my favorite so far are "strobe" and "repeat"

you can set the sample length for the repeat effect, and it will standby to record. push the button and it will snag a sample based on the size you specified. from 2 bars down to 1/128th of a bar (good god, why?)
at this point you have a wet/dry knob which you can assign to either "send" or "insert"

taking a nice lil vocal sample from earlier in the track, setting it to send and wetting the wet/dry mix to 50% produces a nice little "ghost singing in the background" effect, and you can carry it right on in to the next song if you so choose.

Strobe, basically a computer controlled fader cut. You can wet/dry this too, for some fun "woosh" volume effects. again you can assign the frequency/duration to be something from 1/4 up to 1/128

of course it has the regular fixins that seems to come with every fx set too, reverb, flange, delay, phaser.

it's nice.

heres the kicker, I got this for 100$

I picked it up on ebay from henrismusic (out of Wisconsin)

winning bid 150$ but they listed it as the combo pack with the convrol cd/vinyl.

they made a mistake because it was only the control unit, so they refunded me 50$ to go buy my own control vinyl with

Glory's Sun

I hate auto BPM meters.

I'll stick with my DJM-800.. yes it's a beast I'm checking out the DJM-1000.. not too sure about it yet.

I use some M-Audio stuff at work.. it's not bad stuff at all. So for $150 you got a good deal.

Shauk

100$ sir, 100$

Anyways, its not a bpm meter, it just tries to auto sync the peak of the beats with the other peaks (you just push a button) sometimes it's good, but lots of times, not.

edit: have been fixing the phase grids on my tracks. Stuff is like butter now. jesus, takes the fun out of it
not really, now I get more time to play with fx and quickque stuffs, and samples yay

Shauk

allaboutmusic

That thing looks cool. Would you consider it reliable enough for playing out live?

Shauk

it's got safeguards against crashing. The track will still play out to the end if it crashes which gives you time to switch to a normal record/cd and reboot it if it does happen to crash. I've had no issues yet and I'm using it non-stop.

then again, i'm kind of a computer buff so I don't do stupid things with my OS that would introduce too much "chaos" factor to create an unstable system.

even though this thing supports 3rd party vst plugins. That's introducing potential unstability. I'd have to playtest the ever loving crap out of a vst to trust it.

I think these syncroscience guys know what they are doing though. The support forums are full of people who have stupid questions though and probably need to learn a thing or two about basic computer (or midi for that matter) before taking on a system like this.

That being said, the alternative virtual vinyl solutions that have been out for a few years now (Final Scratch/Traktor DJ/Deckadance/Serrato/misc) all have amazing track records as far as stability goes. Again, more than not, it's the computer at fault.

I'd use this out in the open,the safeguard is good enough for me, I have real records too

PulpMind

My roommate just got that softer along with their Xponent controller (http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_u...nent-main.html .... $600 new. $500 refurb)

All in all, pretty great. I have not used a lot of the bells and whistles. So far, just only used the play/cue/pause, shift, pitch, and level sliders on the hardware. The software has worked great for scanning tracks, and I find the ability to adjust "measure" lines intuitive and easy. Similar issue with the BPM thing, but it only takes one click to fix.

yadda ya... I like it. It's easy to use, looks nice, and we could even use it last weekend when the edges of the screen started melting into the bunny fur coming out of the speakers.
The only downfall with it, and all similar software, is that with their popularity comes more DJs playing fucking goddamned MP3s on my sound system or one of the other awesome systems that we have in Seattle.
This would be great if more DJs used this software to play full quality audio files (which most have the ability to do), but the reality is different =/
Great for house parties, clubs, and JBL systems. Not so good for anything where people actually care about how the music sounds at volumes that bring out the details.

Glory's Sun

I'm sorry, but if you call yourself a dj and throw down with an mp3.. you should be beaten to death with vinyl.

Shauk

oh I've GOT to hear your reasons for this.

Glory's Sun

because I'm old school.

I'm sorry.. (not really) I just think that if you walk into a club and you "DJ" with a computer and an ipod or two.. you suck.

Shauk

from a showmanship perspective I may agree, theres just something more tangible there. Which is why I never adopted CD's or straight up laptop DJ'ing

Do you still hold the same opinion about time coded vinyl solutions like Final Scratch/Traktor/Serato/Torq?

Now I'm sure you know the EDM scene reeks of elitism as it is. Ever try to preach new technology to a Technics fanboy? (hell for all I know, you're one of THEM hehe)

It's like a fucking mac vs PC argument.

You can sit there and smack them in the face with the features, the ability to do things that you can't do with your current limitations and they just have their eyes glaze over as they stopped caring the minute they heard you drop a brand name that wasn't technics.

Don't be one of those guys. I'll quote a few choice things that push forward my belief in digital audio....

John "00" Fleming

Some article on about.com

then there are the di's who take their mp3/laptop integration to this level





i'd much rather watch a dj do that than the typical "hey I played this one track beginning to end and mixed it to another track"

Glory's Sun

yeah I'm a technics fanboy.. teehee.. guess it's obvious..

and fuck trance.. god.. that shit.. uugh. So throwing names like BT, and Van Dyk out there don't do much for me.

I don't want to watch a dj that just mixes one track with another either. That's boring..and in most cases not what the good dj's do. I've only heard one or two that actually go more than 1:30 into a track before it's starts getting cut up and mashed or whatever else they feel like doing.

Sickest thing ever is watching Hype do a set while spinning his own light shows with his dvd decks..

The only time I want to see software and laptops are in the studio when new tracks are being created to be pressed onto vinyl.

Hell I still even hate the CDJ's.

If it's all about the music, then I don't need all those fancy bells and whistles that come with the software packages. I want the pure, unfucked with track. Cut it up and slap me in the face with it.. don't fuck it up with stupid shit.

And yeah, if you are using a laptop.. use an uncompressed format.. anyone that is into music ought to know how shitty mp3's and other lossy formats are.

Shauk

well then I guess our conversation is over since you've made your stance quite clear.

now back to the topic at hand.

funydjane

I agree that anything other than FLACs and WAVs sound shit on a proper soundsystem but oldskool turntabalism fanatics really ought to be embracing amazing tools like Live, CDJs and Traktor because of the news ways they allow DJs to manipulate music.

And yes, Van Dyke is gash.

Glory's Sun

ok..so I'm game..

tell me why I should embrace the new skool.

I'll be honest and open minded.. I swear.

Shauk

I'm not arguing that you should embrace it, but being a fanatic about something as expressive and versatile as music seems kind of elitist. Last I checked, being open minded leads to progression, breakthroughs, new ideas, etc.

Would you argue that someone with the tools of the new school have more or less control over the music than one of the old school? I mean hey, you may not care to express or manipulate the music beyond what you're already used to, thats fine, but theres no reason to snub people with the whole "you should beaten to death with vinyl, you suck" kind of stuff (not that it bothers me, you get a thick skin pretty fast in the music biz)

Pick out some easy black/white true/false fact/lie arguments when it comes to old school vs new school and I'd be sure to jump into the discussion with my viewpoint.

As it stands now though. I've pretty much said what I feel. You don't have to like trance, I know lots of people don't. It's not the genre that matters at all here, it's a moot topic. These people are making their bread and butter, this is their career, not only dj'ing but production. Apparently enough people disagree with you that they're putting money in the wallets of those DJ's.

I don't like rap but I'm not going to attack the delivery method of the music just because some hip hop DJ decided to use some new school technique. Thats retarded.

so back to the topic at hand. Vinyl is heavy, You got Jet Setters touring the world seeing the sights on someone elses dime and really, whats the point of carrying around 1000$ worth of records weighing 25-50 lbs, risking it getting lost at the airport, being damaged by handlers, having wear and tear put on it by playing it out again and again, when you just carry 10 times that amount on a 4.5lb laptop as carryon and be sure to toss in some regular backups to some external locations periodically (myself I have 2 external drives, one in an enclosure, one in the closet.)

then you know, there is the whole thing where you might not be able to find that song you want on vinyl. Yes, it's the most awesome feeling in the world to find it in some corner record shop for a regular price of 10$, it's also a slightly less awesome feeling to find the record you want on an online retailer, fuss with shipping costs, delays, or stock issues. Or to find it on gemm, get screwed by a ridiculous conversion rate,and wait 2 months for it to get shipped from the middle of nowhere (fucking south america what?) by MULE or something (it smelled like it)

Personally since i've been entertaining the idea of digital delivery, i'm satisified, I suffer no hinderance from shipping delays, if I want fresh music for a set I have do to tonight, I don't have to wait, instant delivery, and because it's digital, infinite stock.

It's not going to get lost in the mail, or signed for by some dick neighbor who then goes and drops it off to be shipped back, nor do you have ups tell you to expect it the same day you have a set, only to result in you going through a high speed pursuit chasing ups trucks to their secret base of operations in whatever city you have to be located in (true story)

Yes, everything i've used as an example has happened to me.


on the subject of elitism, I have this to say.

allaboutmusic

So you don't like music once you find out I like it? Pffffft.

Shauk

yeah I love that shirt, it just defines elitism.

PulpMind

If it's truly All About The Music (TM), then it doesn't really matter what format you're using, so long as it is the highest fidelity you can achieve, and isn't train wrecked. I would even go so far as to say that it doesn't need to be beat matched, so long as it flows well. If this is what ruled the scene, then we'd see a lot more Goa Gil's out there playing 24/96 DATs. Oh man that was a good fucking party.
But lots of people like showmanship. People like a DJ that jumps around and twiddles knobs not attached to anything. They want to believe they are connected to the music in a greater way at a party then when they're playing the same tracks at home.
None of this is to be confused with turntablism, which is, at it's best, music production.
Of course, some of the best turntablists are using vinyl emulating CDJs (like the Pioneer 1000's) and Serato now.

/end ramble

I like my roommates toy.
He will be using it at this party in Portland, Oregon, this Saturday:
http://www.nwtekno.org/vb/showthread...hreadid=122902

It'll be great fun.
I'll probably use it as soon as I get a hard drive big enough to save all my music at full quality.

Shauk

hey whats your nwtekno name? i'm on there too

edit: shit, nevermind, you're like the 2nd post on that thread with the same name

allaboutmusic

What do you guys think of DJs playing music instruments, using loopers, singing, etc? Is that considered controversial?

Shauk

hell no, theres a local here in Seattle by the name of flave, he'll whip out a sax and go to town, or he'll sample the sound of duct tape and make a song out of it right there live. He's good.

When a DJ can cross over into the realm of production or live remixing right there, he's already raising the bar as a "performer" vs the other guys who just play other people's music.

funydjane

Because digital software and hardware can do more within the old skool ethos than just Technics 1210s by themselves.

Glory's Sun

I wasn't really trying to start a "this genre is better" argument. It's no secret that I hate trance. What I was merely stating is that by mentioning names like Van Dyk and BT who are in my opinion shitty dj's (yes I've seen them live) it didn't do much to sway me toward the new skool. I'm a DnB, Jungle kid. Now I will grant you that I've been out of the scene for a little while now, but I can't imagine seeing a DnB dj showing up with a laptop. For me it's about the music and about the showmanship. I'd much rather see a dj that can rip up the vinyl than just play a track that he produced. Van Dyk and BT are great at production but they seriously lack in the DJ (i.e. showmanship) side of things. Since you're a trance head (shauk), take Oakie for example.. he's a hell of a live dj.. but he's shit at production. I have no idea what he's using but I'm sure that he's got plenty of the new toys that are "revolutionizing" the scene.

Now carrying around a case full of vinyl is annoying. But for me, it was always like a badge of honor. It was like saying "yes I'm a dj, and yes I'm better than you". Stupid I know, but that's how it was.

Another reason that I hate the digital progression is it just seems to take the flavor out of things. When you're tossing up vinyl (if you're any good anyway) you had to be completely in tune with the music.. with the surroundings and what the fuck was going on. Now I don't know much about the new skool stuff so I'm not going to even comment on which one allows more manipulation of the music although I'm sure it's the new skool that gives more "functionality".

So, for me, I'll take all the fancy toys in the production booth but for now, it just feels more right to me to place the magic fingers on the vinyl and rip it up. If the new skool works for you then that's great.. although I'll never budge on the fact that the format does matter. Lossless > lossy any fucking day.. and don't even try to say you can't tell a difference..

allaboutmusic

Thought you might find this interesting.

Shauk

aye.

good stuff.

Shauk

my posting on this thread is going to be on hold until they release the new version of the software and I get my timecoded vinyl

I haven't found a suitable place to order any from online yet and I've decided against the "plain jane" black slabs in favor of something a little more visually appealing.

allaboutmusic

Timecoded vinyl looks like a cool concept - I had a chance to play with some that belonged to someone I was doing a workshop with, and they seem like a cool way to learn to mix without ruining lots of vinyl.

funydjane

I don't see any significant benefit over half-decent CDJs or a MIDI controller.

allaboutmusic

Other than the look and feel, you mean? I haven't really played with CDJs or DJ MIDI controllers.

Shauk

my current setup

I hope to god this forum has an auto resizer enabled.
2x

Martian

That'd be a big no.

__________________
I wake up in the morning more tired than before I slept
I get through cryin' and I'm sadder than before I wept
I get through thinkin' now, and the thoughts have left my head
I get through speakin' and I can't remember, not a word that I said

- Ben Harper, Show Me A Little Shame

Shauk

shall i be stubborn and make the coders here patch it in? ;p lets all ask nicely!

funydjane

That is the insignificant benefit.

Of course, there are many obvious benefits in the other direction.

PulpMind

In Seattle, our version of this guy is KJ Sawka.
He is kind of fucking awesome. He plays beats that go above and beyond drum and bass, and into the kind of stuff that computers were made to do to surpass human playing ability. Like glitch stutters.
No frills, straight up drumming: All the electronic chunk:
Yeah, I dunno, this jojo mayer guy sounds pretty good.. but he's just playing straight up beats. my metal-head ex-roommate could probably play his techstep if he'd stop whining about how electronic music sucks.
Also, if I were less of a person, I would want to punch that honkey ass dreaded guy in the face. Douche.

Shauk

I moved into a fun place haha.

I saw this video a few months back, didn't know he was from seattle.