wwcd101

Hey.

I'm sure this has been discussed at length here in tfpmotorland however with the search not up and running and me needing input asap, here you go.

What's with the difference in projected used car prices?

Edmunds and Kelley seem close. NADA seems to be $1000 to $2000 lower (a lot on a $8000 car).

Given I saw a link to Edmunds on a dealers used car page, I'm guessing they are way high on pricing. If so though, why do so many seem to be praising their virtues?

I need a quick education.

Thanks for listening.

Cynthetiq

each one has it's own criteria and it varies from city to city.

remember what NADA stands for NATIONAL AUTOMOBILE DEALERS ASSOCIATION...

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Peryn

i prefer Kelly, Edmunds, and a general idea of Autotrader.com prices to find out if im getting a decent deal when buying, or setting a selling price. Its good to know what they SHOULD sell for, and how much they ARE selling for.

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offrapel

I spent a lot of time with all three when buying a Honda Accord lately. They all seemed to be low because the Hondas are popular. This was good when getting the car licensed because I could show a lower price and reduce the taxes. Edmunds was my favorite for ease of use and how you can quickly change the configuration and arrive at different prices/values. This may be why the car dealers like them.

Moonduck

Edmunds - Never used it much. Always too high for realistic values, and not tight enough sampling for my tastes.

Kelly - WAY too high. Kelly is the value people hope they can get for their cars from someone wealthy, drunk, and blind. Kelly, as far as I can tell, is about as accurate as the MSRP listed on a new car window sticker on a new car lot. You know, the one that no one pays.

Black Book - Auction values, very local and very accurate, but only for wholesale. If someone presents you with Black book as basis for their selling price, snap it up, it's very likely to be an obscene price. If someone makes a buy offer based on black book, ignore them, unless your trading it in, then you should probably still ignore thm.

NADA - Very accurate, within reason. Your local area market will always drive the prices on its' own, but NADA has shown to be more in line with reality than the rest. It helps that NADA is a very popular resource for people looking to find what to sell their cars for.

The bottom line is to ask what you want for your car. If it is a reasonable price, someone will buy it. If not, you know it's too high. The market will bear what the market will bear. Personally, I set prices around NADA when I sell, and I do my research locally to make sure the prices are good. Then I show how the car is a good deal. I've made good money selling cars in my spare time and have never screwed anyone on price.

As an aside, I sold cars for about a year before becoming an insurance adjuster and dealing with auto value on a daily basis. I've used just about every tool that you can imagine for value research, and a few you've probably never heard of. In most cases, you think your car is worth, on average, 10-15% (or more if you're really clueless) than it actually is.

As a second aside, accuracy of the various guides changes based on region. The info I'm putting out here is based off of my location Mid-Atlantic Seaboard in Virginia. Your Mileage May vary.

Oh, and here, almost every dealer uses NADA. Kelly books are usually on site, but only if they want to rip someone off.

wwcd101

Thanks everyone. This has been exactly the help I needed.

Thanks for listening.

KeyserSoze

I have yet to work at a dealer that uses NADA to get a value on a car, but maybe thats just here in Lost Angeles.

We usually use KBB and we use it just as a GUIDE...because thats what it is. KBB does not buy and sell cars.

We take their wholesale number and take $1000.00 off the top, then we start to devalue your trade even more, paint work, tires,frame, etc. Now some cars we hit even harder just because their resale value is for shit.

When I appraise a car I use Manheim Online, it gives me the prices of what that particular vehicle is doing at all the auctions in the US.

Now if you want to know the price that you should sell your car to a private party, just look in the paper and see what most people and dealerships are asking in your area. If someone calls and they have a middle eastern accent ...HANG UP....they will waste your time and offer you shit for your car.

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Moonduck

Yup, the NADA is a guide, goes without saying. NADA was used to help figure out the prices we'd pay wholesalers and get ideas on where to set prices on used cars. Black Book was used to figure out how much we'd pay for trade-ins, and for wholesale pieces from wholesalers not in favor with the management. Lots of politics there.

I really think accuracy of the various books is strongly regionally based.

phaedrus

Nada is used primarly on the east coast and somewhat in the south. Kelly is used on the west coast. Edmonds is a website not used by dealers, it was probably a Saturn dealership that linked to edmonds (am I right?). They are all full of shit. Nada and Kelly have value in that they are used by the banks to determine what they will lend on a particular car (between 50-150% of wholesale book depending on credit and program, most banks will only lend up to 130%). Edmonds tends to be high on both trade value for your car and selling price on the car you are trying to buy. All three get their values based on survays, kelly and nada survay dealerships by asking "what would you pay for the car?" and "what would you sell the car for?" I'm not quite sure who edmonds survays (be it the consumer, dealer or both).

Black book is gold, because that will tell you what cars exactly like the one you are looking at goes for in the local auctions to dealers. If you can get these figures, add an appropriate amount for reconditioning (one dealership I worked at averaged $1200 a car, another $500) and add an appropriate amount for profit ($500-1500 depending how in demand the car is, unless it is super hot like a 2000 civic si, then you basically pay what you need pay to get the car). I'm not sure if they allow non-dealers access to black book, I've never tried looking.

KeyserSoze

Hey if you want to know the value of a car at auction in your area just let me know the information on the car.

I will give you the Manheim Auction info in your area.

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phaedrus

It's not important, I'm just curious what my car would go for.
2003 honda civic black ex coupe 5-speed 10k miles everything stock in the sf bay area
my guess is between 11 and 12k

KeyserSoze

If its clean and had no paint:


Wholesale Book:

$13,950

Retail Book:

$16,250

You get an add for miles of $175 but that doesn't really mean anything.

If you took it to a dealer they should give you and you should not accept less then $12,500 that's $1450 back of book and Hondas hold their VALUE...don't let them BS you.

Manheim Golden gate Auction they're are selling for $12,000 to $12,600 with a little more miles.

Retail to a private party you will get $13,500 to $14,000 all day long. But advertise it for $14,499 so you have room for the grinders

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phaedrus

Thanks, so I wasn't that far off in my guess.