So, you say you need some home improvements - Tilted Forum Project Discussion Community

ngdawg · 09-01-2004, 06:23 PM

A salesman comes calling last Thursday-we need a new roof. He gives us a price of $8460 after discounts (original est was $11,000). Now, our entire house is less that 1800 sq ft.-it measures 25x29, not including a leanto that holds the pantry. I tell him I can not sign anything-he's the first to give us a price and I would like others. No problem, he says, HOWEVER: 'in order to hold this price, we need you to sign the contract. How long you need to get other estimates?' I say a week. OK, we agree that Sept. 3rd is our date to decide.
Second company-estimate/proposal is for $4400!! Same work, no shortcuts. So, I go with them, of course. Reputation is excellent too. End of story? noooooo....
I call company number 1 and tell the VP of my decision. He asks for a copy of the proposal for the chance to match it. As I read the terms of work to him, he stops me with "Did you know that roofing mfgr was sued in a class action for inferior product? It leaked, fell apart. We stopped using it years ago." I tell him, no, I didn't know, but I will certainly check that out. I googled for the lawsuit-it had been settled in 1998!!!! Funny how he failed to mention that part. But, they weren't done. Salesman calls me to try to steer me their way-I said I don't appreciate being bullshitted and sorry, but no thanks. He calls a 3rd time!!! Tells me we are locked into the contract as we 'passed the date of recindance'!!!!! When I reminded him of our agreement that he had hardsold us into, he suddenly had a change of memory, denied any hardsell and claimed he stated it was only a price guarantee- at which point I said I was calling my lawyer and I hung up.
Then it occurs to me- a possible way out of this mess. The part of the contract that is for cancellation asks for signatures with dates. So we will sign them with the 'correct date'( yesterday's) and send them by FAX.
Is this 'wrong'? Not that what they are trying to do to US is right-we were bamboozled for sure. But, has anyone had this type of thing happen to them? Is there a lawyer in the house? Will we set ourselves up for more legal trouble by signing and dating one day back? And I am writing the credit card company(he insisted on a deposit to 'hold the price') to refuse payment of the charge. He hardsold us with lies and doublespeak. He just didn't think I would figure this out.
NEVER EVER sign anything!!!!! If the salesperson insists, toss him out! We were too nice..now I'm so pissed off and hoping this doesn't turn out to be a drawn-out nightmare of legalities.

Merlocke · 09-01-2004, 11:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ngdawg

A salesman comes calling last Thursday-we need a new roof. He gives us a price of $8460 after discounts (original est was $11,000). Now, our entire house is less that 1800 sq ft.-it measures 25x29, not including a leanto that holds the pantry. I tell him I can not sign anything-he's the first to give us a price and I would like others. No problem, he says, HOWEVER: 'in order to hold this price, we need you to sign the contract. How long you need to get other estimates?' I say a week. OK, we agree that Sept. 3rd is our date to decide.
Second company-estimate/proposal is for $4400!! Same work, no shortcuts. So, I go with them, of course. Reputation is excellent too. End of story? noooooo....
I call company number 1 and tell the VP of my decision. He asks for a copy of the proposal for the chance to match it. As I read the terms of work to him, he stops me with "Did you know that roofing mfgr was sued in a class action for inferior product? It leaked, fell apart. We stopped using it years ago." I tell him, no, I didn't know, but I will certainly check that out. I googled for the lawsuit-it had been settled in 1998!!!! Funny how he failed to mention that part. But, they weren't done. Salesman calls me to try to steer me their way-I said I don't appreciate being bullshitted and sorry, but no thanks. He calls a 3rd time!!! Tells me we are locked into the contract as we 'passed the date of recindance'!!!!! When I reminded him of our agreement that he had hardsold us into, he suddenly had a change of memory, denied any hardsell and claimed he stated it was only a price guarantee- at which point I said I was calling my lawyer and I hung up.
Then it occurs to me- a possible way out of this mess. The part of the contract that is for cancellation asks for signatures with dates. So we will sign them with the 'correct date'( yesterday's) and send them by FAX.
Is this 'wrong'? Not that what they are trying to do to US is right-we were bamboozled for sure. But, has anyone had this type of thing happen to them? Is there a lawyer in the house? Will we set ourselves up for more legal trouble by signing and dating one day back? And I am writing the credit card company(he insisted on a deposit to 'hold the price') to refuse payment of the charge. He hardsold us with lies and doublespeak. He just didn't think I would figure this out.
NEVER EVER sign anything!!!!! If the salesperson insists, toss him out! We were too nice..now I'm so pissed off and hoping this doesn't turn out to be a drawn-out nightmare of legalities.

Isn't there an ask a lawyer thread? - I'd go ask in there as they'e giving out tons of great advice. Next step - if you're screwed. Simple - screw them back. Invite a local media reporter to listen to your story - and have the company shown for their malpractices on the air. All of a sudden - they'll back down. Just get creative, and make it fun. You can make it hell for a pressured salesman to try that again.

ngdawg · 09-02-2004, 08:50 AM

I contacted a lawyer we know through our car club.
This is a COMMON HOME IMPROVEMENT SCAM, as it turns out. Salesman will show later in the evening, open up his whole life story to make you feel comfortable and, more importantly, extend his stay late into night, knowing you will tire. One-time offer on this great deal, can't make promises after the date we agree on, etc....all part of the ploy.
We were advised to, among other steps, call the county prosecutor and report it. They don't know who they were messing with. I put a plumbing business out of business for the crap they tried to pull!!

mb99usa · 09-02-2004, 08:55 AM

In past dealings with salesmen I have found that their is no thing as a "one-time deal". If they are willing to offer it once they'll be willing to offer it again when you decide not to buy from them at the "new" price.

zandor45w · 09-03-2004, 10:34 AM

No matter what, do not sign it because it would show intent. If it were me I would fax it back to them with a giant rejected stamp across it.

Bill O'Rights · 09-03-2004, 10:58 AM

Sic 'im, ngdawg, sic 'im! Go get 'im girl!

ngdawg · 09-18-2004, 09:53 PM

I sure DID sic'em! After sending letters of complaint detailing the events and sending them to both their credit company and the county comsumer affairs office, I received some good replies. From the Comsumer Affairs, in part: due to the severity and number of complaints regarding this retailer, all files have been forwarded to the NJ Comsumer Protection Agency. From the credit company they use: We take complaints as these very seriously and will investigate. Your balance is paid in full and satisfied.
As a warning to anyone in NJ, PA and MD, do NOT do business with Total Remodeling as they are under investigation for the practices as I have detailed. In addition, they sent the credit company a bill for the amount of $8500, when, in fact, the balance we were to pay would have been $5900, basically trying to get the entire $11,000.
I still have not seen a refund of the $2500 we had put down. If someone who deals with legal financial problems such as this, I would like to know if, since 3 letters stating that the amount has been in dispute and requested to be put on hold, are we still liable should Total Remodeling file bankruptcy?

09-01-2004, 06:23 PM	#1 (permalink)
ngdawg peekaboo Location: on the back, bitch	So, you say you need some home improvements A salesman comes calling last Thursday-we need a new roof. He gives us a price of $8460 after discounts (original est was $11,000). Now, our entire house is less that 1800 sq ft.-it measures 25x29, not including a leanto that holds the pantry. I tell him I can not sign anything-he's the first to give us a price and I would like others. No problem, he says, HOWEVER: 'in order to hold this price, we need you to sign the contract. How long you need to get other estimates?' I say a week. OK, we agree that Sept. 3rd is our date to decide. Second company-estimate/proposal is for $4400!! Same work, no shortcuts. So, I go with them, of course. Reputation is excellent too. End of story? noooooo.... I call company number 1 and tell the VP of my decision. He asks for a copy of the proposal for the chance to match it. As I read the terms of work to him, he stops me with "Did you know that roofing mfgr was sued in a class action for inferior product? It leaked, fell apart. We stopped using it years ago." I tell him, no, I didn't know, but I will certainly check that out. I googled for the lawsuit-it had been settled in 1998!!!! Funny how he failed to mention that part. But, they weren't done. Salesman calls me to try to steer me their way-I said I don't appreciate being bullshitted and sorry, but no thanks. He calls a 3rd time!!! Tells me we are locked into the contract as we 'passed the date of recindance'!!!!! When I reminded him of our agreement that he had hardsold us into, he suddenly had a change of memory, denied any hardsell and claimed he stated it was only a price guarantee- at which point I said I was calling my lawyer and I hung up. Then it occurs to me- a possible way out of this mess. The part of the contract that is for cancellation asks for signatures with dates. So we will sign them with the 'correct date'( yesterday's) and send them by FAX. Is this 'wrong'? Not that what they are trying to do to US is right-we were bamboozled for sure. But, has anyone had this type of thing happen to them? Is there a lawyer in the house? Will we set ourselves up for more legal trouble by signing and dating one day back? And I am writing the credit card company(he insisted on a deposit to 'hold the price') to refuse payment of the charge. He hardsold us with lies and doublespeak. He just didn't think I would figure this out. NEVER EVER sign anything!!!!! If the salesperson insists, toss him out! We were too nice..now I'm so pissed off and hoping this doesn't turn out to be a drawn-out nightmare of legalities. Last edited by ngdawg; 09-01-2004 at 06:28 PM..

09-02-2004, 08:55 AM	#4 (permalink)
mb99usa Keep on rolling. It only hurts for a little while. Location: wherever I am	In past dealings with salesmen I have found that their is no thing as a "one-time deal". If they are willing to offer it once they'll be willing to offer it again when you decide not to buy from them at the "new" price. __________________ So, what's your point? It's not an attitude, it's a way of life.

09-03-2004, 10:58 AM	#6 (permalink)
Bill O'Rights will always be an Alyson Hanniganite Location: In the dust of the archives	Sic 'im, ngdawg, sic 'im! Go get 'im girl! __________________ "I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires." - Susan B. Anthony "Hedonism with rules isn't hedonism at all, it's the Republican party." - JumpinJesus It is indisputable that true beauty lies within...but a nice rack sure doesn't hurt.

09-02-2004, 08:50 AM	#3 (permalink)
ngdawg peekaboo Location: on the back, bitch	I contacted a lawyer we know through our car club. This is a COMMON HOME IMPROVEMENT SCAM, as it turns out. Salesman will show later in the evening, open up his whole life story to make you feel comfortable and, more importantly, extend his stay late into night, knowing you will tire. One-time offer on this great deal, can't make promises after the date we agree on, etc....all part of the ploy. We were advised to, among other steps, call the county prosecutor and report it. They don't know who they were messing with. I put a plumbing business out of business for the crap they tried to pull!!

09-03-2004, 10:34 AM	#5 (permalink)
zandor45w Upright	No matter what, do not sign it because it would show intent. If it were me I would fax it back to them with a giant rejected stamp across it.

09-18-2004, 09:53 PM	#7 (permalink)
ngdawg peekaboo Location: on the back, bitch	I sure DID sic'em! After sending letters of complaint detailing the events and sending them to both their credit company and the county comsumer affairs office, I received some good replies. From the Comsumer Affairs, in part: due to the severity and number of complaints regarding this retailer, all files have been forwarded to the NJ Comsumer Protection Agency. From the credit company they use: We take complaints as these very seriously and will investigate. Your balance is paid in full and satisfied. As a warning to anyone in NJ, PA and MD, do NOT do business with Total Remodeling as they are under investigation for the practices as I have detailed. In addition, they sent the credit company a bill for the amount of $8500, when, in fact, the balance we were to pay would have been $5900, basically trying to get the entire $11,000. I still have not seen a refund of the $2500 we had put down. If someone who deals with legal financial problems such as this, I would like to know if, since 3 letters stating that the amount has been in dispute and requested to be put on hold, are we still liable should Total Remodeling file bankruptcy?