Bossnass

...little long explination. thanks for reading it...

I bought an apartment condo at the end of August, got possesion the first week in september. The furnace and
hot water heater are in-suite.

The first week we were here, we ran out of hot water, but the water heater was running non stop... therefore no natural gas.
I phoned and complained and was told that they had opened my account, they just hadn't opened the gas. The developer had all the gas meters turned on for testing, etc, and then the gas company came in and turned them off and locked them. They are supposed to unlock and turn on the valve as soon as I signed up, which I did at the end of august.

So I was told a service man would come turn it on and check the furnace and hot water heater. The guy doesn't come by friday afternoon when they said he would. I have to leave town for the weekend, and get back sunday, hoping for hot water and have none. There is a note from 'atco' saying "Friday 1120 PM, Sorry we missed you". I go to the parcade/basement and they have unlocked the valve, just not opened it. I had a wrench and I wanted hot water, so I turned on the gas.

Since I have gas, I light the fireplace pilot light, the furnace and water heater both have hot point ignition, meaning no pilot light. I don't want to sit on hold and I don't bother phoning the gas company.

October comes, as does the phone bill and the electric bill. No gas bill. I think, well they'll catch it next time the meter guy comes.

Its now December 17th. no bill yet. I like free gas. I have no moral issues ripping off the gas company- I live in Alberta, and we had our utilites degregulated a few years back, but as far as the economy goes it was a poor move (at least so far, in the short term) and the residential consumer has really gotten a bad deal out of it.

My girlfriend, who I live with, is getting insistent that I phone them and get things straightend up. My Dad says let it ride, as do my friends. I'm getting nervous, but I don't want to make a phone call that will cost me.

What is the time frame of limitation on this? I did "sign up" by phone, so I haven't actually signed anything. And it isn't as though I broke off the lock, there is really no way for anyone to say that I turned on that valve. Then again, I have been a customer of the gas company for the last couple years, so they do have most any details they need, I don't think I had a credit card back in the day.

Suggestions? Opinions?

Thanks.

irseg

If it was me, I'd just let it slide, but keep some money aside for the possibility of a massive gas bill if the meter reader ever oes show up.

Journeyman

If you tell them, they'll probably bill you retroactively.

If you don't tell them, the most that can happen is they might figure out their numbers are off, figure out where they're losing gas, and start billing.

So don't tell them.

sipsake

I wouldn't count on it.

It is very likely that once they've discovered the "error", they will submit a bill to you for the entire amount, retroactive to the time you phoned in to sign up.

It can be a rude suprise getting a gas bill for 4 months of service. And if it's not paid by the due date, they will shut you off.

Best thing to do is call them and work it out. Best case they just start billing you, worst case they bill you for past service. However, most utility companies will work with customers to set up a payment plan, especially during critical months (gas in winter, electricity in summer.)

__________________
When life hands you a lemon, say "Oh yeah, I like lemons. What else you got?"

Henry Rollins

Bill O'Rights

Tough call...hmmmmm...I suppose the right thing to do would be to let the gas company know their error. Otherwise, while it's cool to think that you're getting one over on "the system"...personal experience has tought me that these things usually come back to bite me in the ass later on down the road.

Still...free gas...

__________________
"I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires." - Susan B. Anthony

"Hedonism with rules isn't hedonism at all, it's the Republican party." - JumpinJesus

It is indisputable that true beauty lies within...but a nice rack sure doesn't hurt.

Journeyman

Sipsake: I had considered that and figured that if they're losing gas in one spot, they ought to have at least one other spot in the same system, and thus could not attribute specific numbers to one or the other. But I dunno gas company systems that well.

Cynthetiq

put the money that you think it would cost normally to the side. keep it off ot the side for at least 1 year. If they havent figured it out in one year, they aren't going to figure it out.

but be ready in case they do.. nothing would suck more than to read a thread next year that read: "This Sucks Gas Company Wants me to pay $2,000 bill"

do what's fair, not what cheats the system

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

tooth

While free things are good. And getting things for free when you're not suppossed to can be even better. I would go ahead and tell them.

You are setting yourself up for a big ole whopper of a bill when they find out. And considering that its winter and all, makes it even worse. I'd call them up and work something out. Sooner than later.

rockzilla

When a utility realizes that you're getting a free ride, they come after you with a vengeance. It would save you a lot of financial grief to bring this to thier attention now, because as has been said here before, as soon as they find out, chances are they'll want every penny, and they won't cut you any slack if they send you a huge bill that's due 3 days before you got it.

shakran

ok, so far I'm seeing a lot of "you should tell them because you'll get caught."

How about: You should tell them because you're STEALING GAS.

Dammit.

analog

Don't steal. Call them and straighten it out.

"Sticking it to the man" is drinking or smoking underage, or smoking pot (or doing some other locally illegal drug).

"Sticking it to the man" is a victimless crime, but this is not. Get it taken care of.

sillygirl

How would you feel if someone was slowly taking money out of your bank account? Just a small enough amount each time that you realize something is up, but you figure it's probably an error you made? That's kinda what you're doing to them. Wouldn't you want your money back?

__________________

Anyone can be passionate, but it takes real lovers to be silly-Rose Franken
....absence makes me miss him more...

Manic_Skafe

Things usually go 36o - if you're manage to get away with it now I'll bet in one way or another you'll pay for it in the future.

Also, if the meter is still reading that you're using the gas, regardless of whether or not you're using the gas with their permission they'll probably charge you for whatever the meter reads.

You're a pretty brave guy - if I had a house I wouldn't turn on the gas myself out of the fear of blowing up my house.

__________________
"Porn is a zoo of exotic animals that becomes boring upon ownership." -Nersesian

raeanna74

I'd go ahead and call them. Then if they start pitching a fit about wanting retroactive pay you can pitch your own fit because they were going to leave you without hot water and heat for more than 3 days. They should have called to come back and start things up and they would have found out that things were on. It's their fault and neglegence that gives you this situation. They can't be pricks about getting the money right away. But if you don't call them the fight would be harder and the potential costs to you more. Get it taken care of. Hey until they found out you'd be wondering/ worrying when you are going to get the monumental bill. If you tell them now then it's solved. That said I personally would find it so hard to tell someone that they're giving me something for free even though I know I should tell them. I just might not be free in the end though so get it straightened out now.

__________________
"Always learn the rules so that you can break them properly." Dalai Lama
My Karma just ran over your Dogma.

yournamehere

They'll eventually figure it out, and bill you for the amount you've used. Count on it.

I moved into an apartment once, and had the phone service scheduled to be turned on the following Monday. Over the weekend we had a housewarming party, and someone asked if they could use the phone. I told them it wasn't connected yet, but they had to see for themselves, and - sure enough - there was a dial tone.
We figured it was still connected under the previous tenants, so, like idiots, we all made a bunch of long distance calls to everyone we knew out of state.

My first phone bill that month was for $200.

They'll get you, too.

__________________
If you want to avoid 95% of internet spelling errors:
"If your ridiculous pants are too loose, you're definitely going to lose them. Tell your two loser friends over there that they're going to lose theirs, too."
It won't hurt your fashion sense, either.

skysooner

Yes, I agree with all of the above. Utilities will be very liberal in their favor if they retroactively bill you. You could be caught paying for all of what we term the error factor in the master meter that controls distribution for the area. It is better to go ahead and get it straightened out now. If they do try to stick it to you for something higher than you think you have used, pitch a fit, and it will usually force them to back down. If you can't get satisfaction from someone you call on the phone, ask to speak to a customer service supervisor.

Cynthetiq

actually most states limit the public utilities ability to penalize you for missing bills and discrepancies like this... if it takes them 6 months to figure it out the law at least in NYC is that they have to give you at least 6 months to pay them.

still do the right thing...

__________________
I don't care if you are black, white, purple, green, Chinese, Japanese, Korean, hippie, cop, bum, admin, user, English, Irish, French, Catholic, Protestant, Jewish, Buddhist, Muslim, indian, cowboy, tall, short, fat, skinny, emo, punk, mod, rocker, straight, gay, lesbian, jock, nerd, geek, Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, driver, pedestrian, or bicyclist, either you're an asshole or you're not.

Bossnass

Well I made the call and let them know.

So after spending 15 minutes on hold so I could explain things, then getting transfered to a supervisor, etc etc, I was informed that I "must be available from 8 am to 8 pm on December 26th or the 28th, we will let me know by 5pm of the 24th", and was then transfered once again without another chance to speak.

I told the person setting up the appointment flat out that I would not be in town from the 23rd till the 27th, and was really casual and cooperative. He inquired why he had been told to double book me, and I explained the situation. His read on the situation, as a long time employee of the company was that it was good that I phoned because they can go back up to a year with retroactive billing. It was implied that he didn't dissapprove of the fact I was getting free gas.

Incidently, I still have no moral qualms about it. I'm not about to mug an old woman's purse or anything, but I am of the opinion that this is a much greyer area. Certainly I understand why some people would think that any 'theft' is absolutly wrong and we have an entire politics forum to debate that.

The company in question is a former government owned and operated corperation and after deregulation is a virtual monopoly. Natural gas prices are literally five times what they were ten years ago (or so I'm told, I wasn't paying bills ten years ago). Now I understand basic principles of economics, but supply and demand doesn't account for econimic disparity gaps. That is to say that larger busineses are willing to pay whatever it takes, as are the oilmen and untill this last year, the cattlemen. As a somewhat less wealthy university student, I find the prices to be unfair. Enough gas to heat a small apartment from a hugely profitable and non-socially concious corperation is allright by me.

The future potential bill wasn't though, and that is why I phoned.

sipsake

I'm glad things worked out for you.

I agree with your sentiments about the utility, monopoly status is pretty common in most areas, well, in all the areas I've lived. And I'm not looking forward to the gas bills this winter. Here in Memphis, they're already talking of raising rates and few of us will forget the outrageous natural gas prices of a couple of years ago. Our gas bills almost tripled in some cases.

However, I still think you did the right thing. It's been my experience that even the corporate behemoths are much more likely to take a kinder view if you initiate the process instead of waiting for them to realize the mistake.

I'm particularly pleased that you were able to talk with someone who was actually understanding and helpful. This can be a rare occurence when dealing with "the man."

Thanks for the update on your situation.

__________________
When life hands you a lemon, say "Oh yeah, I like lemons. What else you got?"

Henry Rollins

skysooner

You've shown a reasonable effort. If they screw this one up, you are protected now.